"Training Iraqi forces"... am I missing something?

[arcane1]

Since that is one of the stated reasons for us keeping troops there. Maybe I'm missing a basic fact or two, or maybe I'm totally wrong about a basic fact or two, but here's how I see it:

To the best of my knowledge, Iraq already had an army and a police force before we invaded.

For the sake of argument, let's suppose that we somehow killed every soldier and every cop in that godforsaken country when we invaded, and began to recruit guys who had never been either of these.

Why does it take eight fucking years, and then some, to "train" these people?

Did we not send tens of thousands of our own soldiers there who did not need eight fucking years of training?

Does it take eight fucking years to train to be a cop in the United States?

Did it take eight fucking years to train Pat Tillman to be an army ranger?

I suspect that behind the phrase "train Iraqi forces" lies a huge stinking pile of horse shit.

[EnlightenedOne]

1. You should have watched Rachel Maddow in Iraq

Its a whole seachange mentality in the training of their police force - from corrupt/working FOR Saddam (the government) to working for the people. I found it impressive and uplifting, if it can be carried forward and last.

[arcane1]

2. But aren't they still working for the government?

They had to catch burglars and thieves and murderers and muggers, etc, when Saddam was in power, too. I have a hard time believing it takes over eight years just to teach them to follow someone else's orders.

[EnlightenedOne]

3. Yes, they still work for the government

but you have to remember - the first 7/8 years of this war was a total waste under Bush - what our troops mostly did was guard the oil wells and the "intent" of helping was not there (in my opinion). Their only concern was with the oil. My nephew is there and he does seem to be very much in a "training" capacity.

[blindpig]

4. Ah, the soldiers and cops of our puppet regime won't be corrupt...

and will work for the people. Yes, of course. Mebbe get School of the Americas training too, eh? Cause our puppets and clients are a bunch of sweethearts.

Naive much?

[EnlightenedOne]

7. Negative much?

People can change, things can change. If they want it to.

[blindpig]

11. Of course people can change...

but we've seen this movie too many times. History is on my side in this argument and all you've got is 'hope', a poor thing indeed.

[EnlightenedOne]

14. I never underestimate the power of good intention

whether it will work or not, is another story. But certainly these people are tired of war now - the various tribes were intermarrying before Bush started the war, they were making good livings, and becoming very well educated - maybe they will find a way to make that happen again. And yes, I am very hopeful for their sakes.

What you are intent upon is where your energy is focused and where you focus your energy is where you will see the results.

[blindpig]

17. If wishes were horses then beggars would ride..

What a crock, with Capital standing firmly on their necks the vast majority of Iraq's people are and will continue to be in worse shape than during the Ba'athist regime.

[maryf]

28. If wishes were horses...

we'd find that "huge stinking pile of horse shit." wishes being false capitalist promises...

[babylonsister]

25. Bet you never expected this either, but it's happening, ye of

little faith. I think this is what part of the training was about. The Iraqis are attempting to be self-sufficient finally.

Kurdish forces are being trained by Iraqi Army instructors

Iraq border concerns spur effort to integrate Kurdish and Iraqi Army forces

http://www.csmonitor.com/World/Middle-East/2010/0823/Iraq-border-concerns-spur-effort-to-integrate-Kurdish-and-Iraqi-Army-forces

[EFerrari]

6. I missed that. So, how is this police force working for "the people"

while they're working for our puppet?

[EnlightenedOne]

9. You could go to the Rachel Maddow show

and watch Friday nights show if you want to know more.

[EFerrari]

13. I love Rachel but she's not a news source for me. Thanks, though. n/t

[dflprincess]

27. "from corrupt/working FOR Saddam "

to corrupt/working for the puppet government we put in place.

Really, not that much of a change.

[EFerrari]

5. Shhh!

[DemocracyInaction]

8. Because we know...

...the whole place will go to hell in a civil war handbasket the minute they figure out there are no Americans around anymore!! Of course, we have known that for like a zillion years........

[Greyhound]

10. You haven't missed anything. We've been "training" Iraqi forces for

almost a decade now. One of the problems is that when they matriculate, they run off with their uniform and weapons and join an insurgent force.

It's really depressing to see the cognitive dissonance that resounds when Obama does the same thing IFB did, but we're expected to cheer it.

[EnlightenedOne]

12. I honestly don't think the intention was there

and I'm hoping it is now. I will continue to be hopeful until I don't see the changes that I expect to see. We have destroyed the place, its on us to fix it now. Or try to.

[Greyhound]

26. I would love to be wrong as well.

[izquierdista]

15. If they didn't have any oil...

...the official line would be "can't you read a fuckin' book or something?" (Just ask any Haitian.)

[KG]

16. how motivated is the populace to join the forces of their occupiers and oppressors?

my wild guess would be 'not very'.

[quinnox]

18. They are evidently very slow learners

Yea, we have been over there for 7 years now, but I have a feeling this "training" will last at least another decade.
Heck, its "only" 50,000 troops over there, a very small force indeed, its not as if its more people that are stationed in Iraq than live in several towns in America...

[TheKentuckian]

19. What we need is a secular Sunni strongman over there to counter-balance Iran

and maintain order.

In the end Iraq will be annexed by Iran, be a fucking mess for years to come, or we'll have to put it back the way we found it.

[arcane1]

20. +1 n/t

[onethatcares]

21. too bad the Shah is dead,

he'd fit right in and.................................he didn't have a mustache.:wtf:

8 years, trillions of dollars, 4000+ dead American service people, 1,000,000,000 more or less Iraqis dead and we still haven't found Osama Bin Laden.

I think we got screwn on this one.:banghead: :banghead: :banghead:

[bvar22]

23. Exactly!

The Sunni have been either exterminated, or exiled the Western desert or Syria.
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/20546328/site/38524696

http://www.newser.com/story/85087/uniformed-men-execute-24-sunnis-in-baghdad.html


The Shiite (Iran) now dominate Baghdad & the Puppet Government, and KNOW they only have to lay low and appear to help the US Occupiers while soaking up the $BILLIONS being poured into Iraq.
Thus, the "appearance" of progress in Iraq.

The WINNERS in Iraq (Iran) will quite gladly maintain the appearance of "progress" as long as the BILLIONS keep flowing.

[Dragonfli]

22. You are missing nothing, 70,000 Mercenaries and 50,000 soldiers do not a training force make

The brand of shit however is Bull rather than horse, they only use the horse shit as a filler.
We are just expected to be too stupid to recognize a re branding of the same product.
Hell perhaps they are correct, I have seen many fall for the shit around here with no reason for belief other than the "dreamy eyes" of a lying leader.

[bvar22]

24. Why is it taking so long to train the Iraqis?

Did you ever see the movie The Bridge Over The River Kwai?

Do you remember in the beginning how difficult it was for the occupying Japanese Military to build that bridge using British POWs?

The same dynamic is at work here.