What the weed prohibition people are really afraid of.

[gulliver]

They are afraid CA will legalize weed for recreational use, and a couple years later we'll all notice there was no Apocalypse. In fact, maybe there will be fewer heroin users, because kids won't be buying weed from people who also have heroin. Maybe there will be fewer deaths due to alcohol, because some people switched to weed. The anti-weed people will look around and see that zombies are not trudging through the streets, the sky remains overhead, and they have one less relatively harmless (not harmless) vice to live in fear of. Loads of money will have been saved, loads of tax revenue collected.

[CaliforniaPeggy]

1. They're afraid that somebody, somewhere...

Might actually be having fun! :scared:

Omigod. Who will think of the children???


:P

[Zephie]

4. Who will think of the children you say? Pro-lifers, of course!

At least until they're born. Then they're on their own. :shrug:

[Wednesdays]

110. Not entirely on their own...

gotta teach 'em not to drink, to smoke, to swear, to have sex--EVER, and memorize every verse in the Bible...

[AlbertCat]

136. gotta teach 'em not to drink, to smoke, to swear, to have sex--EVER,

and memorize every verse in the Bible...

Even though they themselves drink, smoke, swear, have sex-- and only know specially selected verses in the Bible...

[happygoluckytoyou]

138. i had sex once... highly overrated... weed is better

[ProudDad]

150. Well, considering the Long Emergency

they should be taught NOT to have sex for procreation! :)

[relayerbob]

158. At least

there would only be one generation of them, if they teach them complete abstinence

[Taverner]

15. Yup

[texastoast]

2. And people don't have hangovers and make it to work the next day

What a concept.

[tridim]

145. And a good night's sleep if you smoke a good indica.

Not knock-out type sleep that comes in a bottle @ $10.00 per pill.

[GodlessBiker]

3. This country has always feared too much pleasure.

[JuniperLea]

5. I find it hilarious that they are using memes we debunked decades ago...

And that's all they have... still... to this day. The Weed is so benign when compared to The Booze.

Personally, I think when one is high on The Weed, one is less likely to be swayed by propaganda and lies, and lying propaganda:)

[Grown2Hate]

108. AH, and therein lies the rub. Being high on marijuana tends to strip the fake "top layer" off of

things like TV, making propaganda far less persuasive (or at least so I've been "told"). :evilgrin: I've always felt that THAT was the real reason for the prohibition.

[obxhead]

120. This is the biggest harms of the anti pot laws.

The kids try pot, find that 99% of what they heard about it was a lie.

What are then supposed to assume about what they heard about all the other drugs then?

[Duer 157099]

6. And the pharmas will make much less money, too

People will realize that pot can replace some of those dangerous anti- drugs (anti-anxiety, anti-depressants, etc) and suddenly the pharmas aren't raking in as much dough.

[paparush]

99. DING! DING! DING! We have a winner.

The pharmas, the tobacco industry, the alcohol/brewing industries do NOT want a natural, readily available, cheaper alternative to their oh so profitable products.

Grow your own? At home? And not pay us ANYTHING? Oh my god.....NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!

[TBF]

117. Yeah, they fight it now -

but you know they will try to corner the market on it when it's legalized :D

[ProudDad]

153. And they CAN'T!!!

That's why they hate the idea so much..........

:rofl:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i87BedMtIuk

Big PhRMA must DIE!

--------------------------

Not only that, goodbye Mexican Cartels if the idea caught on in the USAmerican Empire. Most of their profit comes from pot...

[AlbertCat]

141. Grow your own? At home?

But y'know, it's not THAT easy to grow...a decent crop. It's like growing anything else. It likes certain conditions. Some people will be VERY good at it and their crop will be in demand....and then we have the free market these companies and the RW loves so much. And you know that most people won't grow it because it take time and effort. Like there are many folks who grow their own veggies, but most don't. You can make beer and wine at home.... and even grow some tobacco.... but how many do?


All the objections to legalizing pot are just excuses.

[Arugula Latte]

119. And the private prison racket, as well.

:nopity:

[Myrina]

125. +1000 ... and all the rest of the 0's I can fit ...

Therein is the BIGGEST OBSTACLE to legalization. It used to be the liquor lobby - who didn't want the competition. Now it's Pharma. Once they figure out how to patent and copyright cannabis, they'll push like hell for it to be available OTC, though.

[Crazy Dave]

7. The owners of "Profit Prisons" are very afraid

Just a guess but I'll bet the percentage of current inmates serving for drug convictions is probably around 30% or higher for marijuana.

[kath]

89. Yep, the fokkin' Prison-Industrial Complex *hates* the prospect of legalization.

Who the fokkity-fok-fok thought it was a good idea to have Prisons-for-Profit?

[Name removed]

8. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Vickers]

12. Wow.

Just...wow.

[SammyWinstonJack]

26. No kidding.

:wow:
:silly:


Pot=gateway drug=:rofl:

[ProudDad]

154. Aw, darn. Missed that post...

Can you paraphrase it (within the strict DU rules)?


(I HATE censorship! It's offensive to be treated like some sensitive potted plant ) :grr:

[Vickers]

169. I'll try to paraphrase:

"They should never legalize pot, you bunch of smelly fucking hippies, one puff of weed in the morning and you'll be mainlining heroin that afternoon, I would never touch the stuff because I'm perfect" etc. etc. etc.

[ProudDad]

172. Gee, I can handle that...

:rofl: :hi:

Thanks....

[Leftist Agitator]

13. Your post is bad and you should feel bad.

"Pathetic drug users."

Pathetic prohibitionists.

Yeah, while we're on the "gateway drug" thing, how is it that marijuana is a "gateway drug" but caffeine is not?

You disgust me.

[madokie]

29. And pisses me off

what a piece

[kestrel91316]

14. Marijuana is not a gateway drug. Please cite legitimate controlled studies showing that it is.

Oh, wait, you can't because there are none. Alcohol IS a gateway drug.

I smoked a fair bit of weed in college, managed to get admitted to the country's best vet school on the first try, and graduated with my doctorate after 8 years of college with pretty damned good grades. Marijuana never once made me consider other drugs. I was always clear that I wouldn't do ANYTHING else, not cocaine or ANYTHING. Never did, either - not even once.

Take your RW talking points elsewhere.

[arcane1]

18. If the mythical "gateway drug" exists...

it would be alcohol.

[texastoast]

84. Or as we used to say

Mother's milk.

[RaleighNCDUer]

19. Gee, how many strawmen can you fit into one paragraph?

1) Not everybody who drinks is an alcoholic.
2) Of course, nobody is saying alcoholics will switch.
3) The OP posited that as people use alternatives to alcohol, fewer people will become alcoholics, because;
4) weed is not addictive.
5) Nor is weed a gateway drug.
6) Currently users of weed must obtain it from illegal sources, including those who also handle heroin, thereby exposing them to heroin.
7) The statement is, that when you can pick up a pack or a bag of weed at the local weed shop, you won't be exposed to the illegal drug, heroin, thus reducing heroin use - but you say that it 'magically turns them off heroin', something which was NOT suggested.

Seven strawman arguments in a three sentence paragraph. Now that takes talent.

[BakedAtAMileHigh]

20. I think we can all pretty much smell where the tripe is located

and who is most pathetic around these parts. It isn't the OP.

Rock on, brave Drug Warrior. :eyes:

[WillyT]

33. Smells Like Projection To Me...

You know the type...

Paraphrasing Cheech & Chong... "I used to be all fucked up on drugs, then I found God. Now I'm all fucked up on God!"

:shrug:

:hi:

[Le Taz Hot]

118. ROFLMAO!!!!!

:ROFL: I'd totally forgotten about that line! OMG, if you've ever worked with substance abusers you know the danger of "God cured me of my addiction" addicts. They're a lot like "God cured me of The Gay" believers.

[smiley]

23. Pathetic name caller

if your so smart, why not back up your childish name calling with some facts, because this whole gateway drug argument died a long time ago with Nancy Reagan's just say no slogan.

Go back to sleep please. Your wasting oxygen.

[JonLP24]

24. Wow

If you're calling it a gateway drug you are seriously misinformed.

[Zephie]

25. I have not, nor ever will, touch a single "drug" that doesn't come directly from mother earth.

Nor do I want to, and have never even considered it once. How does that strike you? =)

[kurtzapril4]

160. Lots and lots of drugs come directly from "mother earth."

Licit and illicit: Digitalis, opium, coca and psylocibin(sp) being a few of them.

Just because it comes from mother earth doesn't make it harmless. Some of these can cause death if over-imbibed. I'm not picking on you, Zephie, just the idea that because it's from mother earth, it's harmless. Cyanide is produced by plants.

I'm pro-pot, for medicinal and recreational use.

[texastoast]

163. And Mother Earthy people generally know that

And I trust the abilities of those people to know how to use those plant properties far more than I trust the FDA.

[RaleighNCDUer]

27. BTW, changing 'substance abuse' to 'substance use' does not make

your statement any more palatable or honest.

[ohheckyeah]

28. Don't let facts get in your way

Marijuana is not a “gateway” drug that predicts or eventually leads to substance abuse, suggests a 12-year University of Pittsburgh study. Moreover, the study’s findings call into question the long-held belief that has shaped prevention efforts and governmental policy for six decades and caused many a parent to panic upon discovering a bag of pot in their child’s bedroom.
http://scienceblog.com/12116/study-says-marijuana-no-gateway-drug/

[WillyT]

30. The Only Thing "Gateway" About Marijuana, Is That...

because it is illegal, it is a gateway to the black market.

And once one has decided to do business with the smugglers in the black market, one can get Marijuana, Heroin, C4 Plastic Explosives, a rocket launcher...

Take the black market aspect out of the loop, make it legal, regulate it and tax it.

Win (Reality)/Win (Reality)

:shrug:

[jmowreader]

34. If marijuana is a gateway drug to anything, it's a gateway to basil

People who smoke weed also seem to like having a pizza after their joint, so...

Seriously, guys, the effects of marijuana (a mild hallucinogen) are so radically different from that of cocaine (a stimulant) or opiates, benzos or barbiturates (all CNS depressants) there's no way pot could really be considered a gateway to anything. Now...beer, on the other hand...because the effect of vodka is more pronounced than the effect of beer, due to concentration of the active ingredient, but it's the same effect (someone who slams shots of bourbon gets drunker and faster than someone who drinks beer, but drunk is drunk) so there's a gateway effect witb beer. But pot? No.

[JDPriestly]

93. Two problems with marijuana -- it could worsen our obesity problem

and marijuana makes some, maybe even many, people lazier than they would be without it.

Still, a marijuana habit v. alcoholism. Marijuana wins, hands down. Marijuana makes people lazy and fat, but not violent and addicted. Marijuana can become a detrimental habit, but I understand that, technically, it is not physically addictive.

[tridim]

146. 20 years experience, still at my ideal healthy weight.

In fact I weigh the same as I did the day I graduated HS.

How does that happen? I should be gigantic!

[JDPriestly]

147. You must not be having as much fun as you should be.

[walldude]

35. LMFAO..

Well, what an ignorant fuck you are, really... just fucking clueless. There is no point in even trying to explain the benefits of certain drug use to a mindless sheep such as yourself.
Tell you what though, if you are so dead set against drug use, then dump all your music and stop going to the movies, because your money is supporting a fucking LEGION of "pathetic drug users"...

Oh and one more thing.. a "gateway drug"? BWHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!

[scorpiogirl]

37. Why are you so angry and judgmental?

Perhaps you should share since you feel the need to call others disgusting and pathetic. I personally think it's pathetic to judge others for things that are none of your business.

[devilgrrl]

40. "Pathetic drug users."

Speak for yourself darling. :puke:

[wildbilln864]

41. so should we all assume...

you never touch alcohol or anything? :popcorn:

[frylock]

46. the gateway drug marijuana..

booze is the gateway drug. try and get your facts straight before you spew your crap.

[ProudDad]

155. Actually the gateway drug is mother's milk (or formula)

The Universal Gateway Drug...

[Lord Magus]

47. Somebody who thinks there's such a thing as a "gateway drug"...

...has no business calling anybody else's argument (about anything, not just drugs) "a fat load of tripe". The "gateway drug" nonsense is one of the fattest loads of tripe ever invented.

[JuniperLea]

49. Weird...

Cuz if it really is a gateway drug, I know a hell of a lot of people who never made it past the gate.

Pathetic drug users? Really? Isn't that rather harsh? What do you think about drinkers? I'm not talking alcoholics here, because it's widely known that pot is not addictive like alcohol. Don't you think there are people who drink who aren't addicted?

Wow... I'm just trying to wrap my mind around this... I haven't heard anything even close to this rant since my great-grandfather died.

[JonLP24]

55. I really don't think

alcoholics are pathetic drug users either. They are suffering from the disease which takes more than simple willpower to overcome. Also genetics and environments play a very large role in people becoming addicts whether that is coke or booze.

[JuniperLea]

56. I agree...

I was just giving the OP an opportunity to step in his/her own doo doo.

:D

[Occulus]

50. Exactly wrong. Everyone I know has stated to me they would drink less.

*I* would drink less.

You FAIL.

Oh, and... nice drive-by.

[JuniperLea]

57. I certainly would!

Oh, yes indeed!

[superduperfarleft]

53. Huh huh. Huh huh.

[DirkGently]

68. !

:spray:

[nashville_brook]

69. as a matter of fact...

that's what i shoot for. always.

[nadinbrzezinski]

54. You like your cafeine?

There are days...

[fascisthunter]

59. "pathetic drug users"

Why so angry and nasty?

also: there is no "gateway" drug.

[Starbucks Anarchist]

60. We can't all get high on sanctimony.

[nashville_brook]

63. blahahaha!

good one -- :evilgrin:

[Warren DeMontague]

64. There's been a steady societal trend towards letting consenting adults make their own decisions

for the members of the authoritarian, prune-faced, joyless buzzkill brigade, this is an EXTREMELY frustrating development.

[bettyellen]

65. well said!

[KurtNYC]

76. Ding !

[Warren DeMontague]

62. What's pathetic is the continued rationalization for prohibition and other control freak behaviors.

From legislating who can put what in their bodies, to censoring pictures of consenting adults fucking, there's just no end to the fun that can be had by making endless lists of idiotic rules for other people to follow, is there?

Yes, GOD FUCKING FORBID people should be free to make their own god-damn decisions about things, including whether or not to smoke a plant that was described by a DEA Judge as "the most benign pharmaceutical agent known to man". And that "gateway drug" crap is tired, old, roundly disproven bullshit.

I'll sum it up for you: PROHIBITION DOESN'T WORK, and it CAUSES MORE PROBLEMS THAN IT COULD EVER SOLVE.

And there's even worse news: You are condemned to spend the rest of your life on a planet full of people who, no matter how much you stomp around making idiotic rules, are NOT GOING TO BEHAVE TO YOUR EXACT MORAL SPECIFICATIONS.

Waaaaaaaaaaaah!

[JNelson6563]

66. Do you drink alcohol?

Just curious.

[A HERETIC I AM]

70. Yeah! Right on!! Pickles are evil too! Pickles are a gateway foodstuff.

Pickles Are Evil

Pickles will kill you! Every pickle you eat brings you closer to death. It
is amazing that the modern thinking man has failed to grasp the significance
of the term "in a pickle." Although leading horticulturists have long known
that Cucumis Sativus possesses indecent pep, the pickle industry continues
to expand. Pickles are associated with all of the major tragedies of the
body. Eating them breeds wars and Communism. They can also be related to
most airline tragedies. Auto accidents are caused by pickles. There exists
a positive relationship between crime waves and consumption of this fruit of
the cucumber family.

For example:

1. Nearly all sick people have eaten pickles. The effects are obviously
cumulative.

2. 99.9% of all people who die from cancer have eaten pickles.

3. 100% of all soldiers have eaten pickles.

4. 96.8% of all Red sympathizers have eaten pickles.

5. 99.7% of the people involved in air and auto accidents ate pickles
within fourteen days preceding the accident.

6. 93.1% of juvenile delinquents come from homes where pickles are served
frequently.

Evidence points to the long term effects of pickle eating:

Of the people born in 1839 who later dined on pickles, there has been 100%
mortality.

All pickle eaters born between 1869 and 1879 have wrinkled skin, have most
of their teeth, have brittle bones and failing eyesight - if the eating of
pickles have not already caused their death.

Even more convincing is the report of a noted team of medical specialists.
Rats force-fed with 20 pounds of pickles per day for thirty days developed
bulging abdomens. Their appetites for wholesome food were destroyed.

The only way to avoid the deleterious effects of pickle eating is to change
our eating habits. Eat orchid petal soup. Practically no one has had a
problems from eating orchid petal soup.

[alittlelark]

73. You support "unfettered abortion rights" (profile)

Which is in all honesty a bit extreme - I know no one that supports non-necessary (ie life of mother, deformity) abortion past the 2nd trimester......


Yet you are railing against POT!!!!

WTF?

WOW.

[Warren DeMontague]

82. For some people, "Me being able to control my own body" is sacrosanct

and right after that, for some people, comes "Me being able to control YOUR body, too!"

[Wednesdays]

112. That poster has "disruptor" written all over them

Judging by that disjunct alone.

[meow mix]

74. lol hahaha

howd this guy slip past the gate

[mitchum]

81. You are full of shit

[bemildred]

9. Think of all the resources in the criminal justice system that will be freed up

to go after corporate fraud.

[kestrel91316]

10. B-I-N-G-O

[ThomCat]

11. The prison industry will also lose a FUCK-TON of money.

And no industry will every willingly allow themselves to lose money. Oh No! Deploy the army of lobbyists to keep all those people headed to prison on schedule!

We need every possible bed in every prison filled. We need more prisons! Create more laws! Create more criminals! :sarcasm:

It seems, more and more, that the job of the police isn't to catch criminals. Nor is it to prevent crime.

Their job is to CREATE criminals. Their job is to create enticement and entrapment situations to make sure that a steady stream of people are sent to jail on drug charges just because the police noticed them and decided that they should go to jail on drug charges.

Convince them to accept those drugs so that they go to jail. If that doesn't work, slip those drugs into their bag, or jacket, or car, or home. Give their name and address to an informant and tell that informant to repeat it back to you, so now you have a reason to on a no-knock raid with absolutely no real evidence. You can just bring some along, just in case.

If it wasn't for the police deliberately criminalizing people who aren't criminals, the prison industry would be out a hell of a lot of money, and police would have a hard time justifying their military hardware, tactics, and bullying attitudes.

[Nevernose]

38. Is "fuck ton" metric or English?

:)

[ThomCat]

43. I think an English Fuck-Ton is larger.

:P

[JNelson6563]

67. 1 English Fuck-ton = 1.5 American Fuck-ton

Glad to help. ;-)

[A HERETIC I AM]

71. But a Metric Fuck-ton would be 1000 kilos of fuck...

and at 2.2 lbs to the kilo, that works out to be a metric fuck-ton.

[JNelson6563]

75. That's like 10 Shit-loads of Fuck-ton!

[yodermon]

116. That would be a Gross metric shit-load.

[myrna minx]

114. I frakken love DU.

:rofl:

[Uncle Joe]

16. Along with fewer people in prison for ludicrous reasons and fewer families destroyed because

their primary breadwinners are behind bars.

I believe having more intact families will lead to a decrease in juvenile crime as not having your father/mother figure be a prisoner makes it easier to set your own sights higher.

I also believe the people or things that will become most pissed off should cannabis be legalized will be the for profit prison corporations; that believe making a profit from imprisoning the American People to be a wise, moral or just endeavor.

Thanks for the thread, gulliver.

[LiberalLovinLug]

17. and another reason....

They are secretly jealous of those who have and do smoke it. Because they made a decision a while ago to not "do drugs" (except of course alcohol, caffeine, artificial sweeteners, MSG, and other food additives, and prescription pain killers). They were restrained from trying it out of fear of the unknown, with religious leaders jihads against marijuana serving as a handy support system. As the years go by, they get even more entrenched in their fears and jealousy of those that can enjoy things "out of the norm".

Basically it has to be their kind of fun or recreation, or none at all.

[bvar22]

21. What they REALLY fear:

A decrease in the consumption of High Priced pharmaceuticals, both prescription & Over-the-Counter.

[IDemo]

22. There will be a critical shortage of snack food as well..

[Greyhound]

31. The pizza delivery traffic jams on the 101 will be epic! n/t

[Mopar151]

32. Only temporarily

Once the rookies get a handle on things, they'll make better choices - like homemade oatmeal rasin 'stead of Twinkies

[backscatter712]

36. The racists will lose a powerful weapon to go after brown people!

The redneck demographic can't allow that to happen...

[Rebubula]

102. What a horseshit post

Why inject race in where it does not need to be?

Rednecks (most are not racist, just hard working- blue collar people) smoke as much weed as anyone and they go to jail for these offenses as much as anyone.

But...why lose an opportunity to inject race where it does not belong??

[backscatter712]

109. The War on Drugs has always been about race!

Black people and Latinos have always been hit with a disproportionate amount of the prosecutions, the jail time, the police harassment, because marijuana was perceived to be a "n****r drug".

That's how the power-elites use the War on Drugs - as an excuse to attack non-whites while pretending they're not racist.

[BakedAtAMileHigh]

140. the war on drugs is racist at its core: you are either ignorant or misinformed

Your response only demonstrates your ignorance of history. The word "marijuana" was used to ignite racist fears against Mexicans and African-Americans using "loco weed" -- when most Americans already used cannabis as medicine!

Here is a good place to begin to lose your ignorance and arrogance:
http://www.pasadenastarnews.com/crime/ci_16410089

"PASADENA - With about two weeks left before voters in the state decide whether to legalize marijuana, the NAACP's California chapter Friday released a report showing sharp racial disparities among people arrested for possessing pot.

"Arresting Blacks for Marijuana in California: Possession Arrests in 25 Cities," utilized California Department of Justice crime figures to show that while whites use marijuana at higher rates than blacks, African Americans are arrested far more often than whites for possessing pot.

"The report, which looks at three years of data ... indicates that this is not an anomaly but a consistent pattern, where African Americans are being arrested at two, four, 10, even 12 times the rates of whites" for marijuana possession, said Stephen Gutwillig, state director of the pro-Proposition 19 Drug Policy Alliance.

The study looked at marijuana arrest statistics for the 25 California cities where nearly half the state's 1 million African Americans live, finding sharp racial disparities among pot arrestees even in cities with large black populations.

In Pasadena, for instance, police arrested blacks for marijuana possession at 12.5 times the rate of whites. While blacks make up 11 percent of Pasadena's population, African Americans accounted for 49 percent of the people arrested for marijuana possession between 2006-09, the report showed."


....aaaand here is a bit more that might serve as education:
http://www.drugpolicy.org/about/position/race_paper_crim.cfm

he rate of drug admissions to state prison for black men are thirteen times greater than the rate for white men. A recent report by Human Rights Watch found that while drug use is consistent across all racial groups, Blacks and Latinos are far more likely to be arrested and prosecuted and given long sentences for drug offenses. Blacks constitute 13 percent of all drug users, but 35 percent of those arrested for drug possession, 55 percent of persons convicted, and 74 percent of people sent to prison.(1) Nationally, Latinos comprise almost half of those arrested for marijuana offenses(2) and Native Americans comprise almost 2/3 of those prosecuted for criminal offenses in federal courts.(3)

The racial bias of the drug war is exemplified by the 100 to 1 disparity in prison sentences for crack versus powder cocaine. As scientists and courts alike have declared, there is no rational basis for distinguishing between crack cocaine and powder cocaine. Nonetheless, in 1994, 90 percent of persons convicted of federal crack cocaine offenses were Black, six percent Latino, and less than four percent White. Federal powder cocaine offenders were 30 percent Black, 43 percent Latino, and 26 percent White.(4)

[devilgrrl]

39. They're afraid that crime rates will drop. Where will the Prison Industry get all that cheap labor?

eom

[Bobbieo]

42. Guess no one takes the Mexican drug cartels as seriously

as they do, themselves. They are already controlling Mexico and squatting on the border.

[Greyhound]

52. And taking the profit out of it hurts them Bonus benefit! n/t

[4lbs]

44. Weed is legal in much of Europe, yet I don't recall that continent ceasing to function.

In fact, Europe emerged from the recession much better than we did.

I guess the people weren't too stoned to solve their own financial problems, were they?

[RainDog]

51. oh, don't be sensible.

how can people walk around with their panties in a twist if people note that there are nations in which drug laws have been modified to deal with harm reduction rather than punishment and those nations have shown such policies actually reduce drug usage?

you can't use rational thinking and actual scientific and sociological evidence because then people can't support their hysterical beliefs when others try to deal with fact.

[4lbs]

85. Sorry. Going into chicken little mode now.

;)

[liberation]

95. Well, it depends where in Europe you go...

some places are still reeling from the recession.


Regarding drugs, the poster child is Portugal, which I believe decriminalized drug possession all across the board with a refocusing of drug policy towards education/treatment rather than prosecution. The end result, believe it or not... was actually lower drug usage rates. From the article:

"Portuguese government in 2001 tried a new tack to get a handle on the problem—it decriminalized the use and possession of heroin, cocaine, marijuana, LSD and other illicit street drugs. The theory: focusing on treatment and prevention instead of jailing users would decrease the number of deaths and infections.

Five years later, the number of deaths from street drug overdoses dropped from around 400 to 290 annually, and the number of new HIV cases caused by using dirty needles to inject heroin, cocaine and other illegal substances plummeted from nearly 1,400 in 2000 to about 400 in 2006"

http://www.scientificamerican.com/article.cfm?id=portugal-drug-decriminalization

Amazing what happens when you apply common sense to a problem.

[jody]

45. "really afraid of"???? Corporatist that control our government know that if weed is removed as a

divisive, polarizing issue like Heller vs DC did for the right to keep and bear arms then voters might begin to concentrate on truly important issues like the economy, education, health, etc.

[Drale]

48. I used to be against it for who knows what reason

now I could care less either way, it doesn't harm me if it stays illegal or becomes legal.

[Codeine]

58. I'm voting yes on legalization,

but Jebus I hope I don't have to smell that vile shit everywhere I go. :puke:

[Rebubula]

103. I am more worried...

...about the smell of Patchouli - after years on the road with the Dead, Phish and moe. - I despise that smell. Nothing nauseates me more than patchouli. I guess the main reason is that on tour, it is used to cover up the smell of ass-funk (technical term for smell emanating from unwashed wookies).

[krabigirl]

124. I prefer even patchouli over nasty perfume..i get migraines from it.

Especially since people put on way too much.

[krabigirl]

123. Well, i have to smell nasty perfume on women...should it be banned?

Also, you don't have to smoke it. I don't..i sometimes have a brownie though. However, i like the smell.

[Codeine]

128. I said I was voting yes, so obviously it shouldn't be banned IMO.

That said, it's an instant headache for me. Foul stuff.

Is it possible to be allergic to it? :shrug:

[fascisthunter]

61. prisons will lose profits... I expect them to be lobbying Congress

to put a stop on legalizing weed.

[bluesmail]

72. IMO Pot has the POTential to cure many diseases, hemp can replace synthetics

Hemp can Heal. Hemp can Clothe. Hemp can Feed. That's not all that Hemp Can do.

[wildbilln864]

79. Hey that's a lot more than....

just your opinion. It's fact!

:hi:

[maryf]

77. and maybe they'll discover that it makes a great biodiesel...

and the oil profiteers will really be scared...

[LostInAnomie]

78. I don't really people put that much thought into it.

They've just accepted the line that "weed is bad", and they probably know a few people in their personal lives that use weed and are total pieces of crap. So, instead of thinking the people they know are pieces of crap that use weed, they think the people are pieces of crap because they use weed.

It's really not much more than a gut feeling for most people.

[jmondine]

80. And here I thought you were going to say, "The Dirty F***in' Hippies"

[felix_numinous]

83. Weed prohibition people don't like anyone having any pleasure

whatsoever.

Cannabis is not an herb that goes well with mindless institutionalization, like caffeine and nicotine that keep people agitated enough to keep working. Alcohol is tolerated since it just numbs the mind, and helps people stay suitably aggressive. I really think this is a big reason it has been suppressed, along with other mind expanding plants.

[asdjrocky]

86. Think of the children.

Seriously, think of the kids. Have you ever been able to stand being around them without being at least a <5>?

[Life Long Dem]

87. I don't think people feel weed is bad.

I think anti-weed people feel it is illegal so they stay at a distance in a negative it's illegal way.

The gateway can come from a drug dealer telling you he has only heroin. Caffeine is not a gateway because it is a legal drug.

[EconomicsIsGod]

88. Anyone who wants to keep pot illegal

is plain and simple, retarded. Id rather have my kids smoke pot than tobacco.

Plus, legalizing it and opening up grow areas here in the US will cut out about 90% of the illegal drug trade and all the problems it brings.

[slackmaster]

90. I'm giving this a Rec even though I disagree

The prohibitionists haven't thought things through that far.

[Cid_B]

91. Personally, I'm concerned about a bunch of stoned idiots...

... on the road, serving my meals etc.. etc.. with no standard and obvious way to ensure they aren't baked out of their gourd.

[Life Long Dem]

92. let me know if you even notice a difference.

Doubt you'd even see a difference.

[Warren DeMontague]

94. "serving my meals"... that's one of the funniest things I've EVER read here.

I'm guessing you've never worked in a restaurant. :rofl:

[BakedAtAMileHigh]

105. I love the smell of clueless in the morning

Wow....just, wow. Some people......

[liberation]

96. Yeah... because the first thing stoners want to do when baked...

is to go around driving so that we can fulfill their dream of being lucky enough to be in the position of serving you a meal.

[Daphne08]

97. While in college I worked as a "server" at a VERY high-end

prime rib establishment.

Believe me, it isn't the servers you should fear.

It's what goes on behind closed doors in the kitchen, etc. :rofl:

I've rarely eaten out since.

[Occulus]

101. Did someone read "Fight Club"?

:rofl:

[superduperfarleft]

106. Clearly you've never worked in a kitchen.

When I was a dishwasher, I'd say 90% of the staff was stoned at any particular time.

And still, the worst thing you had to worry about was the roaches and the cook with a cold sneezing into the soup. I promise we didn't get any filthy pot germs into your food.

[HughBeaumont]

111. Everyone Involved In Pizza's Preparation, Delivery, Purchase Extremely High

http://www.theonion.com/articles/everyone-involved-in-pizzas-preparation-delivery-p,504/

AUSTIN, TX–Everyone involved in the preparation, delivery, purchase and consumption of a pizza from Tony's New York-Style Pizzeria was thoroughly baked off his ass, it was reported Monday.

"From its creation at the hands of a stoned-out-of-his-mind pizzeria employee to its eventual consumption by a group of guys so unbelievably high they didn't even realize they had mistakenly given the delivery driver a $20 tip, this pizza spent its entire existence in a dense cloud of marijuana fumes," said pizza-industry watchdog Roger Dernier, who has been monitoring the link between pizza production and illegal drug use since 1991. "In the brief time this pizza spent on Earth, at no point did it come into contact with a single non-stoned human being."

:rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

[dem mba]

133. this cracks me up every time i read it

http://www.craigslist.org/about/best/aaa/425529349.html

To The Stoner Who Works At Cottage Inn Pizza

Date: 2007-09-18, 11:30AM EDT

You: the guy who answers the phone at cottage inn pizza
Me: Hungry and stoned out of my gourd

I called you from my cell phone but had completely forgot who I was calling by the time you answered the phone. Of course, you were also baked to bajeezus and forgot to tell me that I had called Cottage Inn.

When you answered and said, "Whatsup?" I thought about it, and after a 20 second pause I told you that was hungry. You suggested I try a pizza, and I agreed that it was probably a good idea.

Then I asked you if you sold pizza and you said that you could make me one. I said I wanted anchovies and something else on my pizza. You asked me what that something else was.

We spent five minutes listing toppings until we figured out that I was trying to remember how to say: "Sun dried Tomatoes." When you said: "We'll bake that right up for you," we both started laughing uncontrollably.

It was the best pizza I ever had; I just wanted to thank you for helping me out.

[EOTE]

139. Stoners are the most courteous people you'll ever find :) NT

[krabigirl]

122. Idiots? Hello? You do realize people smoke it now, and still will regardless? Also

I guess you are fine with the hordes of sheep driving on oxy, Xanax, and so on. Not to mention cell phones.

Btw, legalizing cannabis does not legalize driving under the influence.

[Moostache]

127. But you're NOT worried about their drunken equivalents now?

Nice double standard brewing there...and yes, the horrible pun IS intended.

[Cid_B]

134. I really don't get this...

The argument that something is just as bad doesn't make any god damn sense. The logical conclusion is that something should be done about alcohol consumption and not that we should add more impaired drivers to the roadways.

This is the reason pot isn't legal. The burnouts always use the wrong arguments.

[EOTE]

142. That, and the ignorant (m)asses have a really bad comprehension problem.

You know, comparing the bulk of law abiding citizens to burnouts and all.

[Chan790]

156. Here's the right argument.

People under the influence of the reefer drive better than people who are sober. In survey after survey, drivers high on THC consistently drove slower, drove more conservatively, obeyed more traffic controls and were more conscientious to other drivers on the road.

Do your part for reducing road fatalities, ban non-high driving. :D

[texastoast]

162. +100 n/t

[texastoast]

161. "Just as bad"

There's really no comparison between pot and booze. Have you ever been high?

[Cid_B]

168. It seems to depend which pothead I am talking to....

It's either

a) Nah man... Its just as bad as alcohol so we should totally legalize

b) Nah man... Its a totally different high than alcohol and we should totally legalize

Part of the gut reaction that potheads are facing is that the general public has a hard time consciously voting for something that will make the general populace dumber and lazier than they are. All some people see in their mind is dirtbags sitting on their couch smoking their official government weed and collecting their unemployment.

[texastoast]

170. What makes you think you get dumber and lazier?

What makes you say that it's the pot doing it? How do you know that those individuals wouldn't have been dumb and lazy anyway?

I'm asking you this based on my observance of people who have gotten high for 40 years, who still maintain highly visual, high-level, high-responsibility jobs, who are as healthly as their non-smoking counterparts, who've successfully raised functional families, and who've had a great deal of fun recreationally and medicinally using pot.

I've also known the same type of people who've done the same thing without pot.

I'd like to hear how pot can be blamed for dumb and lazy. Sounds like character problems to me, the kind that will manifest whether sober, high, or drunk. Blaming pot is just stereotyping based on unsubstantiated claims.

[EOTE]

137. Must be nice to have such petty concerns. NT

[N_E_1 for Tennis]

98. "They" are afraid .....

Conservatives will smoke their way to being liberal.

[janet118]

100. Because it's a free high . . .

anybody can grow their own.

Stock tip: If they legalize dope, buy IBC. Twinkie sales will soar.

[lib2DaBone]

104. Big Liquor, Big Tobacco, Big Prison, Big Attorneys, DEA Salary....

all of the above. Big PROFIT keeps harmless weed illegal.

[DefenseLawyer]

132. I have to take issue.

NORML was founded by criminal defense lawyers and the NORML Legal Committee is still a major component of the organization. The National Association of Criminal Defense Lawyers has also always supported ending the war on drugs. It may be against our "business" interests, but you won't find a pro-legalization movement in this country that hasn't been supported by the defense bar.

[mkultra]

107. they are afraid it will become popular and they will be an outsider

because "its stinky"

[droidamus2]

113. Gateway

It is agreed that there is nothing in the chemical makeup of marijuana that leads you to want to do other drugs or otherwise the 'gateway' syndrome. The real 'gateway' is prohibition. Yes, I started with pot (well actually alcohol) and later did lots of other experimenting with other drugs. Was it the pot that 'made' me do it, no. What happened was in acquiring my pot supply I was exposed to people who also sold other drugs (speed, cocaine, mescaline, shrooms, lsd)and since my experience with pot wasn't anything like the government made me think it would be I was curious about what doing the other drugs would be like.

[lonestarnot]

115. No really it's the implossion of their anti-weed economy they fear.

[CoffeeCat]

121. Same thing with gay marriage...

I live in Iowa and I clearly remember the right-wing's "The sky will fall" campaign against
gay marriage. They screamed from the rafters that gay marriage would destroy the sanctity of
marriage, erode societal morals and cause power outages in the rural areas. ;)

None of it happened.

The right wing runs on fear-based lies. Their hair is always on fire about the horrible, catastrophic
events that will happen "if liberals get their way!".

It is all lies. They know it too. The best they can do is terrorize people into voting against
everything, so their lies are never exposed.

In Iowa, their lies are exposed. Gay marriage is legal. Heterosexual marriages are still intact and life
goes on for everyone.

[DissedByBush]

126. Freedom. n/t

[AllyCat]

129. You'd think they'd want to save money. But in bizarro conservative think

that is not progress.

[DefenseLawyer]

130. The CCPOA is the biggest lobbying group in California.

That's the California Correctional Peace Officers Association if you're scoring at home.

[DirkGently]

131. Heard a report today the initiative is losing ground. All those ad dollars must be working.

[JuniperLea]

135. Pft... yeah, and I keep hearing a lot of things...

Mostly projection and fear. I can't imagine this NOT passing in CA.

[RoccoR5955]

143. They will notice that their "war on drugs" has failed.

And they will have to, realistically cut the Police/Industrial Complex.

[Marnie]

144. The same "fear" as with cigarettes

And the same pressures to keep pot out of public places will come to bear as it did with cigarettes. For the same reasons
There are real health issues that indoor smoke or the concentrated smoke of say a domed football stadium have for people with asthma, especially children, and on other's with breathing and respiratory problems.

There is the legal question of whether one person can force others against their will to inhale a mood altering substance.

There is the very real issue of what long term effects inhaling toxic gases, and organic particles present in anykind of smoke have on the health of the smoker but of also those who are continually exposed to second hand smoke.

Pot stinks and it's scent clings, pretty much like cigarettes.

Now that most public buildings and business have see the advantages in their fire insurance, of not allowing smoking, I doubt they will go back to the old days of smoke filled rooms, and higher fire premiums.

I don't care if people can show it has medicinal value, then it can go through all the trials and testings of any medication, to prove it. Then it's medicine ingredient can be available just like any other medicine.

[Loricat33]

149. Marijuana

Have any of the marijuana proponents read the Rand study or are they too zonked out to do so?

[SOS]

171. Have you read the 1944 Laguardia report?

Sociological findings:

The practice of smoking marijuana does not lead to addiction in the medical sense of the word.
The sale and distribution of marijuana is not under the control of any single organized group.
The use of marijuana does not lead to morphine or heroin or cocaine addiction and no effort is made to create a market for these narcotics by stimulating the practice of marijuana smoking.
Marijuana is not the determining factor in the commission of major crimes.
Marijuana smoking is not widespread among school children.
Juvenile delinquency is not associated with the practice of smoking marijuana.
The publicity concerning the catastrophic effects of marijuana smoking in New York City is unfounded.

[ProudDad]

152. Strawman!

You don't really think that they will allow public indoor pot smoking in California...

It's relatively harmless FUN for a lot of people!

What the fuck do you Calvinist assholes have against FUN!

As for its medicinal use, like many other natural medicines its benefits are historically well known, its safety not in question and its complexity requires that it be smoked in toto since the chemical corporations are CLUELESS about how to turn it into a pill. So, again, fail!

[texastoast]

175. +100 n/t

[texastoast]

174. Who's saying anything about public use?

Does it matter at all that pot has been used medicinally for centuries with great success?

Sort of like food?

Do we need to prove that food works on humans, granted some better than others?



:eyes:

[MX96391]

148. weed is not a good thing

I don't support it being legalized, except for medical use. Illegal drugs such as weed are disgusting.

[ProudDad]

151. Uh, if it were decriminalized

as it should be...

It would no longer be an "illegal drug"...

And therefore, by your definition, it would no longer be "disgusting"...

And you wouldn't object to it any longer...

Right? :eyes:

[Chan790]

157. Such a deep and well-reasoned post.

I don't support the continued legality of Pepsi, except for medical use. Illegal soft-drinks such as Pepsi are disgusting.

[texastoast]

164. You are entitled to your opinion and value judgments

We differ.

[krabigirl]

167. Lol. Ok whatever. Anyway, even if 19 fails, it will be decriminalized as of Jan 1 anywy in ca.

Sorry.

[Scruffy1]

159. And I'm afraid of the stoner Hypocrites

They get high and play video games while the world burns. Long term marijuana use can lead to psychological problems.
Having said that I'm for legalization of all drugs. It's not a criminal problem, its a public health problem. And that old BS against other addicts drugs of choice is just that BS. So they think its ok to put a poor crack or heroin addict in prison, but because their drug is ok they can walk around free. I've never seen a heroin addict die from lung cancer like my brother did from smoking dope.

[texastoast]

165. Stereotype much?

I know a lot of stoners who are high-level, Type A men and women who don't have psychological problems. Healthy marriages. Healthy children who go on to do well also.

I'm sorry to hear about your brother. I've never known anyone who got cancer from just smoking weed. But I've known several people who smoke (legal) cigarettes along with weed who did.

[ProudDad]

173. With all the toxics surrounding us

as little gifts from the capitalist masters...

in our air, water, food, AIR...

to generate profit...

I really doubt that your brother died from smoking dope...

unless he sucked up 10 joints a day for decades...

and had a genetic pre-disposition...


Uh, you didn't mention if he had smoked tobacco...

[Dreamer Tatum]

166. Just don't smoke and drive. nt