John McCain: " TORTURE DIDN'T LEAD US to Bin Laden "

[Segami]

:smoke: :smoke: :smoke:


In a Washington Post op-ed on Thursday, McCain pushed back powerfully against those on the right, such as former Bush administration Attorney General Michael Mukasey, who suggest that information obtained through torture helped American forces to pinpoint bin Laden.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/bin-ladens-death-and-the-debate-over-torture/2011/05/11/AFd1mdsG_story.html



McCain writes:


I asked CIA Director Leon Panetta for the facts, and he told me the following: The trail to bin Laden did not begin with a disclosure from Khalid Sheik Mohammed, who was waterboarded 183 times. The first mention of Abu Ahmed al-Kuwaiti -- the nickname of the al-Qaeda courier who ultimately led us to bin Laden -- as well as a description of him as an important member of al-Qaeda, came from a detainee held in another country, who we believe was not tortured. None of the three detainees who were waterboarded provided Abu Ahmed’s real name, his whereabouts or an accurate description of his role in al-Qaeda. In fact, the use of “enhanced interrogation techniques” on Khalid Sheik Mohammed produced false and misleading information.


He goes on to make a more personal point:


I know from personal experience that the abuse of prisoners ... often produces bad intelligence because under torture a person will say anything he thinks his captors want to hear -- true or false -- if he believes it will relieve his suffering. Often, information provided to stop the torture is deliberately misleading.



cont'





http://www.salon.com/news/john_mccain/index.html?story=/politics/war_room/2011/05/12/mccain_torture_washington_post

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[Blue Owl]

1. McCain needed some time off from yelling at clouds to flip flop

Wasn't he all pro-torture and pro-Bu$hCo in 2008?

[DFab420]

2. Maybe he missed his daily dose of crazy juice they hand out each morning..

His brain looks like it started working..

[Leopolds Ghost]

8. Y'all should be rating it up and not taking away from the message.

Don't forget, McCain was tortured. That's how he got into politics, as a POW.

[tblue37]

15. Of course, because the old whore would have said anything to

get his turn at being the Republican presidential nominee, and the primary voters in that party think Thou shalt torture is one of the Ten Commandments!

[JonLP24]

20. I don't recall him being pro-torture

One of the positive things I can say is he has spoken out against the issue before.

[FLPanhandle]

27. McCain was never pro-torture.

He may have been off base on many topics, but he's been consistently against torture.

I guess being a victim of torture himself, he knows how bad it is.

[Johnny2X2X]

31. McCain has been anti

I will give him credit, he has not wavered on torture. He has gone against his party consistently on torture. He has been tortured and has seen it first hand. He knows it doesn't work.

[Guy Whitey Corngood]

3. Usually never kick or rec. any threads with McCain's name on it but..... nt

[KansDem]

39. Yeah, I know what you mean...

I 'recc-ed,' but it felt like the mouse was pushing back on my finger as I was pushing down...

[Guy Whitey Corngood]

40. Haahaa!

:)

[jillan]

4. Typical politician playing politics. He chose to be someone else when he ran for President.

All that gained him was alot more people that dislike him.


"To your own self be true".

[Kolesar]

6. He's "mavrick-y" ... eom

[Uncle Joe]

5. Kicked and recommended.

Thanks for the thread, Segami.

[nilram]

7. ditto

[SpiralHawk]

9. "Republicon Torture Freaks are degrading the US of A." - Honorable Americans

"For once McCain has it right. Republicons are doing something Absolutely Evil, pointlessly cruel, unAmerican, and unChristian with their sick torture fetish."

- Honorable Americans

[alfredo]

10. From what I remember, the aim of the torture was to coerce

a confession of a link between OBL and Saddam. It had nothing to do with making us safe. It was about constructing a rationale for invading Iraq.

[Blue Owl]

11. anyone see Glee last night

When DDS Sue Sylvester was deploying GOP torture tactics on that glee club member?

"John McCain would be rolling in his grave if he saw you..."

:rofl:

[Wounded Bear]

12. Kudos John-boy.....I still won't vote for you, though...

You're on the right side of this one, finally.

183? You'd think they would have realized that they weren't getting anything after the first couple of dozen tries. Hard to quit when you're having so much fun, I guess. :puke:

[Pisces]

13. He's trying to get his reputation back after Palin.

[markpkessinger]

23. He did a pretty good job wrecking his reputation even without Sarah Palin! n/t

[Omaha Steve]

14. K&R!

[eridani]

16. Well, score one for McCain

Maybe actually being tortured personally is the only way Repubs can get a clue. All advocates for sanity owe him a big one.

[JI7]

17. good for him for saying this

[Hubert Flottz]

18. Oh My Gawd...

He skipped his Jim Jones Fool-Aid...Sarah the shrill will be sooo disappointed in him.

[chrisa]

19. I hold no resentment against McCain, and he has always been against torture (I think)

He is pretty sane compared to the nuts in his party. I think his own experience has ensured that he will never support torture. I'm sure it still haunts him to this date.

[BadtotheboneBob]

21. He's said this before...

I don't believe McCain has ever been on the 'torture' bandwagon and has previously spoken out against it. Kudos for his stand then and now.

[markpkessinger]

24. You're right . . .

. . . On this particular issue, at least (if not on any others), McCain has held consistently to his stand against torture. The only principle that seems to guide his pronouncements on nearly every other issue, however, seems to be the question of which way the political wind is blowing. Still, I will commend him for making this statement, and point out that, at least when it comes to this issue, he is more qualified to speak than most.

[meow2u3]

25. McCain had been the victim of torture. That's how come he opposes it

Most conservatives favor, or at least condone, unfair or repressive policies unless they or one of theirs has been affected by them.

[cstanleytech]

22. "TORTURE DIDN'T LEAD US to Bin Laden" Well no doh!!

While I'm glad to see him say this I wont be voting for him if he ever tries to run for president again, not because he is a republican but because of two main reasons one being the embrace over so many of the Bush policies but the main one being his choice of Palin.

[YellowRubberDuckie]

29. Clearly none of us are voting for him...

...but I don't disagree with him. Good for him for learning something and speaking out against torture. You'd think a guy who went through what he did would realize that torture is wrong no matter what and isn't at all helpful and yields no serious intel. I'm glad he's come out and said this. Cheney, of course, has a hard on for torture, and it's good that McCain is contradicting that evil fucker.

[dotymed]

26. I do not like Mccain or his politics.

If I knew the guy as a regular person, I might, though I think that his greed has ruined him.

I do respect much of what he sacrificed for his country. IMO, much of it was misguided, but he has earned (mainly past tense) Respect.

Hopefully, as he ages, he may decide to "level" with the people. He knows a lot.

[YellowRubberDuckie]

28. Who better to speak out against torture than someone who was tortured?

I feel for the guy. He's a little off in his old age, but he lived through some SHIT, and I'm not going to disagree with this. Sure he is "flip flopping" as you guys put it a little bit, but why is it such a bad thing for people to learn from previous errors and change their minds on important issues that they were wrong on? I don't particularly care for how he treats his wife when she's not nearly as horrible as he is, but forces her to shut the fuck up to keep him from looking bad.
sorry for all the F Bombs this morning. I'm feeling a little better, and I'm feisty. LOL

[Fire1]

30. McCain is not a 'bad' guy for the most part. He may even be a

potential democrat, albeit conservative. All in all, though, he's far from the worst I've seen.

[cstanleytech]

32. His choice of Palin as his VP though calls into question

his judgment which is what kills it for me as far as voting for him when it comes to an office as high as President.

[Fire1]

33. I don't think it was "his" choice. He was acting on the advice

of his appointed campaign manager, Rick Davis.

[cstanleytech]

34. In the end though it was his choice to follow that advice however poorly

that advice ended up being.

[Fire1]

35. True but if you're 'paying' somebody for their expertise it's

only logical to take their advice. Who knew she would be a whack job!

[cstanleytech]

36. I believe the correct term may be "village idiot".

[Fire1]

37. And a more 'polite' term, at that! More accurate, as well! LOL!!!

[colsohlibgal]

38. No Surprise

He joins more than a few republicans who, once any further ambition is gone, feel compelled to be a little more honest and not necessarily toe the party line.

That said good for him because he knows first hand about torture.