So let me get this right: Obama thinks he has the power to actually end the tax cuts for the rich?

[originalpckelly]

He thinks he can actually win this time with even worse odds?

When the Democrats held the House, the Senate, and the Presidency, we couldn't end the tax cuts for the rich, right?

AND NOW

When we have lost the House and the Republicans control it, he actually thinks things will be any better?

What's going to be the difference this time? :shrug: It seems that things are worse and it makes it more likely the Republicans will fight tooth and nail for the tax cuts for the rich.

If he really has all this power, and he somehow thinks his odds will be better this time, why not just eliminate them for the 2012 tax year? They could do that. This country has made changes to its tax laws in the very year in which they have occurred, let alone giving someone many months of warning. This is still early 2011. He could do that, if he really had the power.

But he doesn't. The Democrats in Congress don't either.

And there is nothing, and I mean nothing, keeping them from losing this time like they did the last time.

I hope he does it, but I'm not holding my breath.

When you've broken your word on the very same exact issue, I'm terribly sorry when you don't have credibility on it again.

[gateley]

1. I think he presented it in a way that even most Republicans could agree with --

moderate Republicans, anyway. That may help.

Why can't you -- and others -- at least wait a LITTLE while to see how this shakes out before jumping on the bandwagon of assuming the worst? Maybe Obama has finally had enough - it's possible.

[bettyellen]

2. I'm terribly sorry when you don't have credibility too

[lumberjack_jeff]

3. You're confusing "will" with "power".

All he has to do is veto the next tax cut extension bill. Easily within his power.

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

4. He has the power. He just refuses to use it. It's called the veto..

[originalpckelly]

5. Ah, yeah, but then again the Republicans might just attach the tax cuts...

to something we need, say like, um, unemployment benefit extensions. Aaaaw, fuck that, that could never happen.

[subterranean]

6. Is he willing to let all the tax cuts expire?

That's the key question. As I see it, that's the only way he'll be able to not extend the tax cuts for the wealthy again. The Republicans certainly won't agree to decoupling them from the rest of the cuts. They'll insist on all or nothing.

[originalpckelly]

7. Probably not.

If it comes up before November 2012, he'll have to be for middle class tax cuts, and the Republicans won't have it.
If he seriously lets them expire for the middle class, his ass will be grass in the election.

[subterranean]

8. They're not due to expire until December 31, 2012.

So if he promises in the campaign to keep the tax cuts on income under $250,000, he'll have to break either that promise or the one he made today.

Of course, the Republicans might vote on an extension of the tax cuts before the election and dare Obama to veto it.

[JoePhilly]

15. See my post lower in this same sub-thread for how I think it plays out.

The fact that those 2 promises are connected is very important, and most people don't seem to see that.

[JoePhilly]

13. Those cuts expire AFTER the election, not before ... and that matters ...

Consider this ... Obama made two promises

1) End the Bush tax cuts for the rich.
2) Not raise taxes on those making under 250k.

During the 2010 election cycle the Dems in congress punted. They did not even try to pass an extension of the middle class tax cuts only. In my opinion, that would have been a smart thing for them to do, make the GOP vote against it. But they PUNTED. And so ...

After the election, Obama has to break (or DELAY) one of the 2 promises. If he breaks promise #2, he gets CRUCIFIED in the media, (and on DU) for breaking that promise. On DU, it would be proof that he hates the middle class and raised their taxes during a fragile recovery (the bastard!!).

So, he agrees to extend both for 2 years. This KEEPS promise #2, and DELAYS promise #1. By extending them 2 years, he puts the new expiration date AFTER the 2012 elections. By that time, if congress PUNTS again, he can let them all expire and break both promises. Why? Because he can't run in in 2016.

The only way he can keep promise #2 is for Congress to act. If they don't, he breaks promise #2 and keeps promise #1 (albeit delayed).

[AnnaLee]

9. No, he's giving the voters a choice (if they hear it)

So, he forces all to come forward either attacking him or supporting him. Nothing can be done right now because of the Tea Party "mandate". About all Obama can do is to try to put the playing field in his home court. He presented the Ryan plan and what he was not going to support. The people, if they can wake up for a few minutes, can make choices better. Many politicians ducked supporting the Ryan plan. Now they need to duck opposing the Obama plan/love-fest.

Did it work? Well, only if the stage is taken away from Ryan laughable, too applauded plan. If Obama can't command more attention than a fool, he loses the bet. Actually "lets talk about it in private" almost always loses the public conversation. But I hope it works out for him. If not, the public loses when the power shifts to the Republican radicals. They aren't dumb enough to allow obstruction from the opposition. Strike that. Ah darn, can't write what I'm really thinking.

[killbotfactory]

10. He's making the next election about tax cuts for the rich

That compromise all his critics, like you, decry as a betrayal saved middle class tax cuts in a sour economy, and now republicans will be forced to defend the tax cuts for the rich in the next election.

[leftstreet]

11. It's the new Wedge Issue

Great fundraiser and vote-getter for both parties, but nothing will change

[killbotfactory]

16. Nothing will change if people refuse to vote democrats into congress

The republicans have been using all of their clout to save those rich tax cuts, partly because it benefits their base of support, partly because it defunds the government and gives them the opportunity to start bashing social welfare programs as the source of all the nations woes.

They will hide behind "class warfare" rhetoric, abortions, fear of dark skinned foreigners, and gay bashing, and that's pretty much all they have left.

Meanwhile a vast majority of the populace supports raising taxes on the rich, and forcing the republicans to defend those tax cuts will put them at a disadvantage.

[muriel_volestrangler]

12. So let me get this right: you are no longer calling Obama a liar?

You moved on from saying you don't believe a word of the speech to saying he's deluded and powerless?

Well, I suppose that's progress of sorts.

[Zorra]

14. This has to be a rhetorical question.

No need to reply, is there?

[Bandit]

17. He is assuming he will even be President when the time arrives.

He says he will veto any extension of tax cuts for the wealthy, but he has to be President to do that and the tax cuts don't expire until after the election..He maybe has rallied the Democrats though and given them something to campaign on.

[subterranean]

21. He'll definitely be President when the time arrives.

At worst, he'll be a lame duck president. Then he can let all the tax cuts expire, and his Republican successor can sign into law even bigger tax cuts for the rich.

[reformist2]

18. This is beyond stupid. He had his chance a few months ago!

We're supposed to rally around him now?

[darkstar3]

19. Public opinion can be more powerful than two houses of Congress behind you.

After the shit 99% of wage-earners in this country have been through, and after the CLEAR problems we have seen with regard to spending cuts and budget deficits, it is becoming painfully obvious to even the most disconnected and indecisive voter that we NEED to tax the rich. There's simply no other conclusion to come to.

Polling data will bear this out, and congress-critters will then see the writing on the wall. They'll be forced to tax the rich or risk having the majority of their voters believe they're asleep at the switch.

Either that, or I'm moving to Canada...

[Bandit]

20. IMO this was just his first campaign speech.

His campaign is now fully under way..