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Thu Mar 1, 2018, 05:48 PM

When Trump is impeached, what if he refuses to leave office?

Like any game of chess, it's important to think past the next move.

I'm convinced that Trump will be impeached, sometime in the next year or so. However, our assumption that he just packs up leaves needs to be examined.

This is a guy who had the Russians steal the election for him (or at least was the recipient of Russian action), so it only follows that he(or Russia) would resist impeachment when it comes to that.

What if he orders the Military to enforce his rule (using generals he installs/promotes)? What if he mobilizes the NRA in support?

I know it's easy to say "one step at a time, we'll worry about that later", but we really do need to some succession and follow on planning.

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Reply When Trump is impeached, what if he refuses to leave office? (Original post)
fescuerescue Mar 2018 OP
Fresh_Start Mar 2018 #1
Eliot Rosewater Mar 2018 #2
ProudLib72 Mar 2018 #39
lisa58 Mar 2018 #3
ooky Mar 2018 #20
poboy2 Mar 2018 #26
johnp3907 Mar 2018 #4
NewJeffCT Mar 2018 #6
octoberlib Mar 2018 #9
fescuerescue Mar 2018 #15
SoCalMusicLover Mar 2018 #27
fescuerescue Mar 2018 #32
MichMary Mar 2018 #33
cos dem Mar 2018 #57
octoberlib Mar 2018 #5
marylandblue Mar 2018 #7
Demsrule86 Mar 2018 #8
sarisataka Mar 2018 #10
fescuerescue Mar 2018 #17
sarisataka Mar 2018 #23
NCTraveler Mar 2018 #24
fescuerescue Mar 2018 #31
NCTraveler Mar 2018 #38
fescuerescue Mar 2018 #47
NCTraveler Mar 2018 #48
fescuerescue Mar 2018 #50
madinmaryland Mar 2018 #11
Hortensis Mar 2018 #12
The Velveteen Ocelot Mar 2018 #13
fescuerescue Mar 2018 #19
Major Nikon Mar 2018 #14
fescuerescue Mar 2018 #18
onenote Mar 2018 #16
kairos12 Mar 2018 #21
bullimiami Mar 2018 #22
briv1016 Mar 2018 #25
Stallion Mar 2018 #28
samir.g Mar 2018 #29
mcar Mar 2018 #30
uponit7771 Mar 2018 #34
mcar Mar 2018 #35
uponit7771 Mar 2018 #42
mcar Mar 2018 #45
LanternWaste Mar 2018 #36
waddirum Mar 2018 #37
mcar Mar 2018 #46
Calista241 Mar 2018 #40
GulfCoast66 Mar 2018 #41
spanone Mar 2018 #43
hedda_foil Mar 2018 #44
honest.abe Mar 2018 #49
Takket Mar 2018 #51
nini Mar 2018 #52
doc03 Mar 2018 #53
jberryhill Mar 2018 #54
YOHABLO Mar 2018 #55
JDC Mar 2018 #56
no_hypocrisy Mar 2018 #58
FarCenter Mar 2018 #59

Response to fescuerescue (Original post)

Thu Mar 1, 2018, 05:49 PM

1. cut off the supply of big macs....he's cave quickly nt

nt

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Response to Fresh_Start (Reply #1)

Thu Mar 1, 2018, 05:50 PM

2. LOL



well done, comedy writing quality level

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Response to Fresh_Start (Reply #1)

Thu Mar 1, 2018, 07:33 PM

39. Outlaw McDonalds in this country

He'll leave quickly.

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Response to fescuerescue (Original post)

Thu Mar 1, 2018, 05:50 PM

3. US Marshalls?

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Response to lisa58 (Reply #3)

Thu Mar 1, 2018, 06:08 PM

20. Hope they feel free to rough him up a little

as they carry his lard ass out.

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Response to ooky (Reply #20)

Thu Mar 1, 2018, 06:19 PM

26. Yes...and don't put their hand over his head when they put him in the squad car

 

You know, let him hit his bald spot head, its only fair.

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Response to fescuerescue (Original post)

Thu Mar 1, 2018, 05:51 PM

4. Did Bill Clinton leave office when he was impeached?

Thatís not how impeachment works.

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Response to johnp3907 (Reply #4)

Thu Mar 1, 2018, 05:52 PM

6. he was impeached, but not convicted

I assume the OP means that he's impeached and also convicted

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Response to johnp3907 (Reply #4)

Thu Mar 1, 2018, 05:55 PM

9. Well, Clinton was acquitted but, you're right , Trump won't have to leave office right away.

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Response to johnp3907 (Reply #4)

Thu Mar 1, 2018, 06:01 PM

15. Well to be clear, I mean impeached and convicted.

God help us if he is impeached and not convicted.

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Response to fescuerescue (Reply #15)

Thu Mar 1, 2018, 06:26 PM

27. 2/3rds Of Senate Needed For Conviction

 

Under the current Senate, that means getting every Democrat and at least 17 Repubs. That could change come November, but it's still going to take 10+ Repubs in order to have any chance at conviction, and probably several more.

I'm not sure that many would vote to convict, even if he was accused of killing someone on 5th Avenue.

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Response to SoCalMusicLover (Reply #27)

Thu Mar 1, 2018, 06:32 PM

32. So you are saying we are stuck with him for 4 years?

depressing thought.

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Response to fescuerescue (Reply #32)

Thu Mar 1, 2018, 06:36 PM

33. Look at the numbers

It is mathematically impossible.

Nixon resigned because he had lost the confidence of the Senate Republicans. Conviction would have been likely. Things are so polarized right now that there is no way the Rs won't vote unanimously to acquit.

Yes, unless he resigns we will be stuck with him for all four years.

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Response to fescuerescue (Reply #32)

Thu Mar 1, 2018, 10:06 PM

57. It's definitely an uphill battle.

About the only way I see it happening is if '18 is enough of a bloodbath for Rs (in what should be a good year for them) that they get panicky enough about '20 to bail on the orange idiot. Still, as pointed out, a lot of Rs have to get on board.

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Response to fescuerescue (Original post)

Thu Mar 1, 2018, 05:52 PM

5. Then the appropriate law enforcement agency can frogmarch his ass out of the

White House.

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Response to fescuerescue (Original post)

Thu Mar 1, 2018, 05:53 PM

7. If he can't keep Hope Hicks loyalty

Do you really think his generals are going to follow the orders of the non-President?

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Response to fescuerescue (Original post)

Thu Mar 1, 2018, 05:54 PM

8. He doesn't have to leave unless he is convicted in the Senate.

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Response to fescuerescue (Original post)

Thu Mar 1, 2018, 05:56 PM

10. Until convicted nothing

And he won't be convicted.

As for succession, that is well covered and was discussed at length some months ago.

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Response to sarisataka (Reply #10)

Thu Mar 1, 2018, 06:04 PM

17. to be clear

While I suppose I appreciate all the discussion that conviction is required (I thought that was obvious, but ok), the question is what happens if he is convicted and then refuses the succession plan.

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Response to fescuerescue (Reply #17)

Thu Mar 1, 2018, 06:11 PM

23. Like any other convicted criminal

"Nope" is not an option. Once the Senate convicts a person they are no longer President. There will be no President until the Vice President takes the oath of office, which if anyone is on the ball, should occur within minutes.

The ex-President may object, shout, stamp their foot or hold their breath until they turn blue; it won't matter because they no longer have any power.
A smart person would quickly leave by the back door.

Still a moot point as I see no scenario where the Senate votes to convict.

edit add-ons the military is not going to support illegal orders especially from a President being impeached.
As for the other, to paraphrase Stalin 'How many battalions does the NRA have?'

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Response to fescuerescue (Reply #17)

Thu Mar 1, 2018, 06:14 PM

24. Why do you think that option is available to him?

 

You think Marshallís will have his back? You keep mentioning only one person. It would take major agencies, including all top military, for something like this to even be a possibility.

Unless you mean he hides in a closet pissing himself. Then I say we leave him.

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Response to NCTraveler (Reply #24)

Thu Mar 1, 2018, 06:31 PM

31. I'm worried about who would have his back

While I have no use for him, he did have enough support to steal his way into the Whitehouse.

Certainly the Russians have their own people during what they do. I doubt that he would be 100% isolated then any more than he was 100% isolated on election day

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Response to fescuerescue (Reply #31)

Thu Mar 1, 2018, 07:28 PM

38. That leaves the question standing.

 

Who has his back at that point? I now know of two people who would refer to him as President at that point, Trump being one of them. So who are the people who help him to maintain power instead of simply being a trespasser.

Thatís the question. The amount of people, including agencies, would be rather large. Agencies he has relentlessly attacked. Otherwise he is simply an unwelcome occupant, with two people for sure referring to him as President, and his removal would be swift.

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Response to NCTraveler (Reply #38)

Thu Mar 1, 2018, 08:29 PM

47. Who is the second?


I hope you are right, that he'll be totally isolated.

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Response to fescuerescue (Reply #47)

Thu Mar 1, 2018, 08:37 PM

48. Hope is not necessary.

 

You have yet to make any case. The question is still unanswered. How would Trump get the Joint Chiefs, Dept of Justice and others to answer to him instead of Pence?

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Response to NCTraveler (Reply #48)

Thu Mar 1, 2018, 09:49 PM

50. I'm not here to advocate for Trump

I'm just an observer and I'm not making a case. I'm asking a question.

When we look at any dictator, king or other evil leader we can ask the same thing, "Why do people follow him"?

Any rational person would have assumed that people would have abandoned Hitler once it became clear he was evil and was doing evil things, yet he remained in power until millions died to remove him.

I think the answer is, because there are follower who think they will be rewarded, or they fear punishment. Take Kim Jung-un for instance. Evil person, hated by millions including certainly his own people. Yet he is flesh and blood and his body is just as fragile as any of ours. Nonetheless he lives and stays in power.

I never thought Trump would be nominated. I never though he would be elected. Yet we know what happened.

To answer your question, I don't think he would get the Joint Chiefs, Dept of Justice and others to answer to him. But my predictions haven't been textbook, and furthermore, they are quite irrelevant, because if they were, he wouldn't be where he is now.

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Response to fescuerescue (Original post)

Thu Mar 1, 2018, 05:56 PM

11. The House impeaches and the Senate holds a trial to convict. If he is convicted

by the Senate, would he voluntarily leave? Assuming Pence doesn't get convicted by the Senate also, the he would be handed all controls of the Presidency and would have tRump removed from the White House (forcibly if necessary.)

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Response to fescuerescue (Original post)

Thu Mar 1, 2018, 05:56 PM

12. Have his congressman refuse permission

to for him tour the White House like the rest of us?

Fescue, after impeachment would come trial by Senate. If he was removed by that process, the VP would become president.

Most of us would have more than enough to worry about with a new President Pence, who'd then be Commander in Chief.

If Trump threw a tantrum, WH security and the rest of the Secret Service could tend to him, though probably someone he was still talking to might be there to schmooze him out quietly. But otherwise it'd be the job of the WH's Chief Usher to move ex-President Trump's and Mrs. Trump's belongings to their destination of choice, make sure they didn't accidentally take any WH property, etc.

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Response to fescuerescue (Original post)

Thu Mar 1, 2018, 05:56 PM

13. I remember, when it became obvious that Nixon was going down,

the same question came up. Some people wondered whether he'd barricade himself inside the White House and refuse to leave if he was actually impeached. As it happened, once the articles of impeachment came out of the House judiciary committee, he gave up and resigned. But he'd become pretty buggy the last few months, and there was some speculation that he might do something drastic.

Trump is probably even crazier, but he's also a big fat coward. So, we'll see.

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Response to The Velveteen Ocelot (Reply #13)

Thu Mar 1, 2018, 06:07 PM

19. Thanks

I really didn't intend to get into the technical process of conviction etc, I thought that part was obvious (But I suppose not since there are a dozen replies repeating that part )

I appreciate the historical perspective, I didn't realize that the same concerns were raised about Nixon.

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Response to fescuerescue (Original post)

Thu Mar 1, 2018, 05:58 PM

14. Hes almost never there anyway

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Response to Major Nikon (Reply #14)

Thu Mar 1, 2018, 06:05 PM

18. So....Lock the door when he steps out



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Response to fescuerescue (Original post)

Thu Mar 1, 2018, 06:03 PM

16. Fantasy.

Pure fantasy.

The guys a nutjob, but the military isn't going to set up a barricade around the white house.

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Response to fescuerescue (Original post)

Thu Mar 1, 2018, 06:09 PM

21. Cut him off from the golf courses. He'll leave.

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Response to fescuerescue (Original post)

Thu Mar 1, 2018, 06:09 PM

22. Theres a little saying we have around here. Maybe you have it too.

LOCK HIM UP!

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Response to fescuerescue (Original post)

Thu Mar 1, 2018, 06:16 PM

25. It's by no means guaranteed we'll retake the House AND Senate.

Especially will Russian help.

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Response to fescuerescue (Original post)

Thu Mar 1, 2018, 06:27 PM

28. Trump Will Have a George Wallace Moment

the military would enforce a final judgment of conviction by the legislative branch and/or the next in line of succession as mandated by the constitution.

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Response to fescuerescue (Original post)

Thu Mar 1, 2018, 06:28 PM

29. Seal team 6 drags him out by his heels

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Response to fescuerescue (Original post)

Thu Mar 1, 2018, 06:29 PM

30. Do you mean if the Senate votes to remove him?

Impeachment doesn't do anything without a 2/3rds vote of the Senate to remove.

Even if Dems take back the Senate, it'll be by a seat or two. Removal won't happen, this the impeachment argument is not all that relevant, IMO.

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Response to mcar (Reply #30)

Thu Mar 1, 2018, 06:41 PM

34. +1, which is why Ryan and McConnel are Red Don's biggest enablers

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Response to uponit7771 (Reply #34)

Thu Mar 1, 2018, 06:42 PM

35. I never understand why some are so focused on impeachment

when it will get nowhere in the Senate.

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Response to mcar (Reply #35)

Thu Mar 1, 2018, 08:09 PM

42. +1, Red Don is shameless and doesn't care if he gets impeach 20 times he's staying in the WH

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Response to uponit7771 (Reply #42)

Thu Mar 1, 2018, 08:24 PM

45. That's why GOTV and vote for Democrats is key

Mueller will do what he does, but unless he can perpwalk the Dotard out of the WH, it's up to us.

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Response to fescuerescue (Original post)

Thu Mar 1, 2018, 06:47 PM

36. Lure him out with a bucket of fried chicken and a tax abatement.

Lure him out with a bucket of fried chicken and a tax abatement.

I know I sound flippant, but Trump is too much an idiot, too incompetent, and too lazy to pull off a Boris Yeltsin stand,

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Response to fescuerescue (Original post)

Thu Mar 1, 2018, 06:57 PM

37. The Sargent at Arms of the United States Senate has the power to arrest the President

I believe refusal to leave office would after impeachment and Senate trial would qualify for such an arrest.

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Response to waddirum (Reply #37)

Thu Mar 1, 2018, 08:25 PM

46. Senate trial being key

2/3rds of the Senate is not going to vote to remove.

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Response to fescuerescue (Original post)

Thu Mar 1, 2018, 07:37 PM

40. I don't think he'll be impeached.

They've already laid most of the groundwork that the independent counsel is a biased, partisan process.

We'll hear about how there are no Republicans on Mueller's staff, we'll hear about how they relied entirely upon the Steele memo (which isn't evidence of anything) as a legal foundation for all their subsequent investigations.

And we'll hear about how it's the Democrats, the outgoing Obama administration, and everyone else he doesn't like's fault. And he'll still have that 35-40% strong approval rating, which is enough to keep 50 Repub Senators in office, and we're SOL.

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Response to fescuerescue (Original post)

Thu Mar 1, 2018, 07:41 PM

41. He will never be impeached and convicted

But I will play...

The minute he is convicted he is not President. President Pence would have him, Jarvanka, and anyone or thing that reminds the country of Trump removed by the Secret Service so fast you head would spin.

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Response to fescuerescue (Original post)

Thu Mar 1, 2018, 08:11 PM

43. this congress supports trump to the end. the house has to impeach him and it's 90% looneytunes

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Response to fescuerescue (Original post)

Thu Mar 1, 2018, 08:16 PM

44. I've thought that since Summer 2016. He won't go if impeached. Not willingly.

I see a potential scenario where his masses of armed followers descend on the WH to prevent him from being physically removed.

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Response to fescuerescue (Original post)

Thu Mar 1, 2018, 08:45 PM

49. The Generals wont obey him. They know hes a lunatic.

They only tolerate him now because he holds the office of the President. Once that is legally stripped they will treat him like a criminal if he tries to forceably remain on office.

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Response to fescuerescue (Original post)

Thu Mar 1, 2018, 09:51 PM

51. once he is removed from office his orders carry no more weight than yours or mine

he can refuse to leave but after about 5 minutes the FBI will take him into custody to stand trial.

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Response to fescuerescue (Original post)

Thu Mar 1, 2018, 09:55 PM

52. Send the fucking marines in to scare the hell out of him

the take him to prison to rot till he dies.

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Response to fescuerescue (Original post)

Thu Mar 1, 2018, 09:56 PM

53. I am willing to go in unarmed and take his fat ass out nt

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Response to fescuerescue (Original post)

Thu Mar 1, 2018, 09:57 PM

54. President Pences Secret Service detail would remove the unauthorized occupant

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Response to fescuerescue (Original post)

Thu Mar 1, 2018, 10:02 PM

55. I think he will resign before he will be impeached. Of course impeachment is not a pink slip.

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Response to fescuerescue (Original post)

Thu Mar 1, 2018, 10:03 PM

56. He'll need to play golf. He will be gone in an instant

IMO

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Response to fescuerescue (Original post)

Thu Mar 1, 2018, 10:17 PM

58. 1. He'll get the hint when he can't use AF#1 to go to Mar-Lago.

2. When he uses his own jet, they'll change the locks of the WH.
3. Just wait for him to leave on his own initiative. He doesn't stay at the WH more than 5 days in a row.

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Response to fescuerescue (Original post)

Thu Mar 1, 2018, 10:20 PM

59. President Pence would have the Secret Service escort him from the White House

 

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