Oregon homeowner's association refuses to let bus come into neighborhood to pick up a girl with

[turbinetree]

Last edited Wed Aug 15, 2018, 01:29 PM - Edit history (1)

special needs: lawsuit

SARAH K. BURRIS
14 AUG 2018 AT 21:26 ET


A child with disabilities is suing the Oregon Senate Republican leader and a Salem homeowners association board after it voted to bar a school from picking the child up.

According to The Oregonian, Sen. Jackie Winters serves on the HOA board that is allegedly violating federal and state housing laws.


Parents Erika Hernandez and Paolo Regalado are asking the court to allow the school bus into the Golf Course Estates to pick up their daughter for school and pay unspecified damages and legal fees. They also want the HOA to create a plan to provide equal access for residents with disabilities.

The parents explained that their daughter “has developmental disabilities and attends a special needs school.”

The girl’s school district developed an Individualized Education Plan for her that specifies “due to her disability and the associated concern that she may run into the street, she is to be provided transportation to school in which the school bus picks her up directly in front of her house,” the lawsuit alleges. “(Her) medical providers also found that (her) disability required that she be provided an assisted pick-up and drop-off in front of her home.”

https://www.rawstory.com/2018/08/oregon-homeowners-association-refuses-let-bus-come-neighborhood-pick-girl-special-needs-lawsuit/


Let me just try to understand this, its a private development, they have public utilities and water, firefighters, and police and they are more worried about the roads.......................instead of a child mind you that has a disability...............

[Initech]

1. More of that conservative #Civility.

[olegramps]

29. I moved into a HOA community. Worst mistake I have ever made.

[workinclasszero]

42. Yup

Pathetic that these aholes will not allow a bus into their precious community to pick up a child with special needs no less!

Just damn!

[DURHAM D]

2. No mention of the ADA in the article.

The family should win this debate.

[Major Nikon]

3. The ADA only applies to government services and public accommodations

It's possible they might be able to get a judge to decide the neighborhood is a public accommodation but the law doesn't favor that interpretation. That doesn't mean they don't have a basis to sue the neighborhood under tort law.

[Guy Whitey Corngood]

4. Not quite. Every single corporate project I've ever worked on has to be

designed in compliance with ADA. The little residential high rise experience that 8 have also indicates that a certain number of units have to comply with ADA. It's a civil rights law not a construction code. There may also be local accessibility ordinances that can come in play here.

[Lee-Lee]

9. It's a tougher fight when it's against an HOA

Because an HOA is something you voluntarily join and agree to abide by the rules when you move into a neighborhood that has one.

That’s why HOA rules can be and usually are far more restrictive than what government could ever pass into law in most cases.

You see often people fighting with an HOA because the HOA won’t allow any political signs or won’t allow them to fly an American flag. There are some that won’t even let you have stickers if any kind on your car if is ever parked in public view. There is no way in almost all cases a local government could ban those as it would be a First Amendment issue, but when you voluntarily move into a neighborhood with an HOA you agree to abide by whatever rules they put into play.

So this isn’t a case of public accommodation like an apartment complex, it’s a case of the HOA having rules about what vehicles are allowed in the neighborhood.

I hope the family wins, but I think it’s a hard fight ahead for them.

[marble falls]

11. They'll have plenty of help. Bet this goes away fast. Bet that state legislator gets on their side.

[kcr]

18. Political signs and flags aren't ADA issues.

HOA's aren't exempt from the ADA. They can't forbid homeowners from building a wheelchair ramp for example. They can't infringe on the rights of people with disabilities with their rules. The ADA most certainly does apply in the case of the OP. They very well could easily lose. The fact that they allow other services on their roads but won't allow an accommodation for that little girl? I bet it's a slam dunk.

[Lee-Lee]

22. Don't be so sure

A lot will depend on if the courts decide that the private roads are a “public accommodation”. And that’s not as clear cut as it may seem.

If it’s a gated community and private roads then they are not public accommodations under the law, as it’s only open to residents and guests.

If the roads are open to the public, even as private roads, then it may be.

If there are no gates but there are signs stating that only residents and guests are allowed on the roads and property then that’s a gray area, but generally courts have held that if posted that the general public is not allowed then it’s not a public accommodation.

As an example an HOA pool used exclusively by residents and guests may not have to be constructed with the same ADA accessibility as one that is open to the public. But if they have events where the public uses it or allow people to pay just for pool privileges then it has to meet all the ADA requirements.

So this isn’t as open and shut a case as you may believe.

[Sedona]

38. I'm a licensed Realtor in three states

HOA or no HOA, they can't violate the Americans with Disabilities or Fair Housing Acts. EOM.

[Lee-Lee]

49. But those may or may not apply in this case

If they are private roads and they have any kind of access restrictions- even signs saying only residents and guests allowed may qualify- then the roads wouldn’t be considered a public accommodation and the ADA wouldn’t apply.

It’s a more complicated issue than just saying ADA covers it. ADA isn’t unlimited in when and how it applies.

[d_r]

80. I understand

what amazes me is that they are such assholes that they are willing to take it to court in the first place

[Lee-Lee]

81. That's the kind of people who love HOAs

After one experience living in a community with an HOA I said never again.

What makes it worse is that the only people willing to do the work to run the HOA and enforce the rules, without pay, are the exact types you don’t want doing it. They are all petty, power hungry, arrogant control freaks.

I saw where recently one HOA was requiring all residents to have their garage doors open one day a month, all day, so they could look in and make sure nobody was doing anything “unauthorized” in their garages. Not acting on complaints and checking specific homes, but literally making everyone leave their garage doors wide open all day so they could snoop.

The one I lived in was not bad at first. Then a new board was elected and the 7 member board was dominated by two retired married couples who could both be on the board because both couples owned more than only lot on the development. They got elected because nobody else cares enough to show up for HOA meetings and they usually hold them in the middle of the work day. They immediately started putting in all kinds of new rules- you can only have X model trash can in X color. You can only have X square feet of your lawn landscaped in mulch or pine straw. You can only have X number of pets, only these kinds, only this weight.

I actually had them demand a letter from my very certifying my dog was under 65 pounds.

But those are the kinds of people who thrive on these kinds of things. And since they are the only ones who show up for HOA meetings and elections they end up running things.

[Major Nikon]

10. Not the same situation for a number of reasons

Multifamily accommodations are specifically addressed by the ADA. Such projects routinely receive FHA funding which kicks in ADA compliance. You are also talking about design considerations, not accommodation after the property is established. You are also talking about a housing provider which the HOA is not.

[Persondem]

25. Not just ADA at play. IDEA also comes into the situation.

If a bus pick up is in her IEP, then it will happen.

[thucythucy]

35. Are you certain about all this?

I didn't think the ADA covered housing. I thought that was covered by the Fair Housing Amendments Act of 1988.

As I understand the history, the authors of the ADA specifically didn't include provisions that were redundant to already established law. So, for instance, the ADA is silent on public education, since that's covered by the Individuals with Disabilities Education Act (formerly the Education for All Handicapped Children Act).

Also, if an entity receives FHA funding (or any federal funding) it's covered by Section 504 of the Rehabilitation Act of 1973, and its subsequent amendments. Much of the language included in the ADA ("reasonable accommodation" for instance) came out of court decisions related to 504. The civil rights provisions of the Rehab. Act were reaffirmed by the Civil Rights Restoration Act of 1988 (which, incidentally, was passed over Reagan's veto--those were the days).

It's difficult for me to see how excluding a vehicle, seemingly purely on the basis that it is being used to transport a child with a disability, isn't disability discrimination. The article at the link says the HOA allows garbage trucks into the area, I assume it also allows delivery trucks, moving vans, lawn maintenance vehicles, etc.

I think this is another instance of conservatives either not understanding the law, or not caring until confronted by litigation or the threat of litigation. Advocates in the disability rights movement run into this all the time. The fact that conservatives like Newt Gingrich and the Heritage Society and the Cato Institute have made it their decades long quest to repeal or gut disability rights laws proves to me how effective such laws are in instances like this.

I suspect the Association will reach a settlement before this ever gets to court, as soon as its general counsel lets them know what they're doing puts it in jeopardy. I've personally been involved in cases where some entity--both public and private--huffs and puffs about its right not to comply, only to reverse course once someone explains the law.

[Major Nikon]

52. I am reasonably certain the ADA does not apply

That doesn't mean someone can't make an innovative argument that a judge accepts. Just because it's discrimination based on a disability, doesn't mean the ADA covers it.

I'm pretty sure this discrimination is covered by possibly several other laws and possibly the homeowners covenant.

[thucythucy]

78. It is difficult for me to see which particular title of the ADA might apply.

It's almost like it slips between ADA and IDEA. If this transportation is required for the child to get an appropriate education, and the covenant prevents that, it might be IDEA, but it's a stretch.

There might be state laws that apply as well, which might be a better option.

It'll be interesting to see how this all works out.

[Lee-Lee]

83. Except the school system has an option that makes it all work

IDEA can force the school system to comply in a way that only impacts the school system.

The school system is saying that they can’t meet the terms of the IEP because the HOA won’t allow bus sized vehicles on the private roads.

So they are throwing up their hands saying “we tried.”

When the answer is the school system uses a smaller vehicle to pick up the child.

Bam- you don’t break the HOA rules for use of the private road, you meet the terms of the IEP for the child.

In all honesty the parents should be suing the school system to force compliance with the IEP by using a smaller vehicle.

[Nevernose]

15. Fair Housing Act has almost identical provisions

And applies to HOAs. They have to let the bus in, make all HOA services (such as the streets and parking) handicapped accessible if reasonably requested.

[Major Nikon]

19. The difference is the ADA is subject to the public accommodation requirement

The FHA is not.

[Major Nikon]

5. Dum as day old dog shit

Even if you ignore the stupidity of denying a disabled child transportation access, their logic for doing so just doesn't get any better. Compared to other commercial vehicles, school buses aren't that heavy. A large passenger van will put about as much stress on a roadway as a school bus.

[forgotmylogin]

41. Wow. They could save so much time and trouble and bad press

if they'd just let this bus pick up the girl.

[MineralMan]

6. In reality, this mean-spirited HOA is trying to force

that family out. They don't want disabled children marring the complacency of their days. There can be no other explanation, really.

[FakeNoose]

12. Also you may not have noticed this

The parents have Latino surnames.

If their names were WASP-ish there probably would have been no problem with the special-needs kid.

[malaise]

70. Ding ding

First thing I saw

[maxrandb]

7. Don't worry! "Ditzy" Devos is eliminating any program that serves special needs children

see, in Retrumplican land, problem solved! If God wanted your child to attend school, he'd miracle her there.

[KentuckyWoman]

14. Not funny but I laughed.

Sadly, this is the attitude too many Republican voters have toward other people and yes, pretty much anger inducing. How can these people seriously show their faces inside of a church?

But ... If God wanted your child to attend school, he'd miracle her there....

Next time my evangelical nutjob cousin starts ranting about what victim she is about whatever... I'm pulling that out.

[sinkingfeeling]

8. So they better have only private mail and garbage services in their little

private kingdom. Also, no public fire trucks nor police cars should be able to enter. And absolutely no public buses should be allowed.

[Augiedog]

13. I'll bet they claim to be Christians too.

[Crunchy Frog]

58. And "pro-life".

[LakeArenal]

16. Be best.

[ProudLib72]

17. Why is it impossible for them to be the least bit nice?

Seriously, they go out of their way to be assholes every damned day. It's like a full time job with them... with overtime

[NewEnglandAutumn]

20. They

must have some cheap a$$ streets if they can not withstand the 'wear and tear' of vehicles driving on them.

[PatrickforO]

21. This HOA doesn't have a leg to stand on.

They should never have refused to allow the bus in the first place.

Sigh.

Some people are just stupid.

[thucythucy]

37. Stupid, or mean-spirited.

The fact is, some people can't abide the sight of someone with an obvious disability.

It's a core tenet of Nazi "thought" that people with disabilities are "unworthy of living."

Such "thinking" is more widespread than we'd like to believe, and I don't doubt the folks who hold such beliefs, like bigots in general, have been emboldened by the current travesty in the White House.

[mythology]

45. There's no reason it can't be both stupid AND mean-spirited

[thucythucy]

77. True enough.

[Doreen]

23. The HOA's are what my friend and I call "Neighborhood Nazi's"

My friend is a blind widow who was raising three children in a affluent neighborhood. They were always sending her notices about a piece of grass out of place and most of the complaints they gave her were things extremely small and they had to basically go up near the porch and look carefully to see it. She had a job, a teenager and two 12 year olds and time to mow the lawn was not there. She could not afford to pay someone to do it and it was hard to find people to do it for her. Well, she got pissed and at 11:00pm on her Friday she went out and mowed the lawn. After that someone in the neighborhood came over to mow her lawn until her finances improved. The HOA in that neighborhood does not have the same people running it anymore and the neighborhood's residents have changed for the better and are nice to her now.

[Revanchist]

47. If she had a teenager and 2 twelve year-old's why was she doing the mowing? N/T

[tazkcmo]

64. My question too

My 12 year olds and teen would be doing that work if for no other reason than to learn responsibility.

[Doreen]

74. People are under some illusion that just because she is blind that

her kids would help her. They were just like any other teenagers. Getting her kids to do anything was like pulling teeth without Novocaine. Not having their father there to back things up they kind of ran over her and she had to be careful of what she did because for some reason the school and state figured that she would be a bad mother simply because she was blind. All of her kids have turned out to be well rounded adults. In the end they did help her and they go to her place sometimes to help but she has remarried so she does not need as much help and her finances are much better.

[PoindexterOglethorpe]

24. What I want to know is where the non-disabled kids get the bus.

Also, is the garbage picked up by minivans? Or the usual gigunda garbage trucks which (I know I'm going out on a limb here) are probably just a tad heavier than a full school bus, although admittedly they probably don't have daily garbage pickup.

[The Velveteen Ocelot]

26. Here's the original article without the Raw Story clickbait:

https://www.oregonlive.com/politics/index.ssf/2018/08/lawsuit_oregon_sen_jackie_wint.html

[ScratchCat]

27. n/t

One simple question here: How was the daughter previously getting to school?

It is clear she was going to school before the district determined she has developmental disabilities. So, how was she getting to school?

There is more to this story which probably includes this family recently moving to this neighborhood.

I work in Real Estate in Florida, and laws very from State to State. But I am pretty sure that a school district can't overturn an HOA provision in any State. The other kids obviously get on/off the bus outside the gates. If they allow one child to get on inside the gates, they all do. The HOA already determined it didn't want school buses in the neighborhood. This is common in all gated neighborhoods in my area - kids get on/off bus outside the gates. The notion that the ADA extends to covenants such as this is extremely questionable. Buying a home in the neighborhood and then telling the HOA they have to change things for you because of your medical condition or disability is a legal joke.

[Coventina]

33. This child has a medical need that requires door-to-door pick up and drop off.

Why is it OK for mail trucks, garbage trucks, and parcel delivery trucks but not school buses for children with medical needs?

This HOA is evil.

[thucythucy]

39. Sorry, but HOA provisions don't trump federal civil rights law.

Just as an HOA can't explicitly exclude people or color or of certain ethnicities (much as some of them might like to) they can't violate disability rights law. They (and you) may think civil rights laws are a "joke"--but the courts in numerous instances have ruled otherwise.

My guess is these folks will settle before this ever gets to court.

[ScratchCat]

54. n/t

There is no federal civil rights issue. This has been litigated before in other States. This isn't an apartment complex. Its a single-family detached subdivision developed with an HOA. There aren't "public areas" or "areas of public accommodation". The "public" has no right to enter the subdivision. That's what negates the legal issue. It is all privately owned, and you legally agree to abide by the C&R's when you buy into the subdivision. The restriction is recorded and it has nothing to do with civil rights or federally-protected rights. This is a restriction against school buses - all of them. There is no federal protection for school buses. It doesn't matter that mail and garbage are allowed as most - if not all - city/county development codes require mail and garbage access. Who would buy into a neighborhood where they can't collect your garbage and you can't have mail delivered?

Again, the girl is not being prevented from going to school or accessing school - the bus is being prevented from going into a subdivision. No federal issue. If there was a federal issue regarding access to school for children living in gated neighborhoods governed by HOAs, then this type of provision would have been invalidated decades ago. It hasn't.

[marylandblue]

55. The federal issue is the IDEA

Individual with Disabilities in Education Act. The school determined that door to door transportation is required for this child under IDEA. This makes it a legal requirement for the school to comply with. An HOA cannot override a public agency that is bound by law to do something.

[Lee-Lee]

57. IDEA only applies to what schools must do or provide

It can’t force anyone outside the school system to do anything to help the school system meet that need.

I don’t think even by the longest stretch of the law you could have IDEA force a private party that is in no way a part of the school system to do anything.

It only forces the school to make all efforts to make the accommodations. And if they can’t because of an outside party it doesn’t have the ability to change that outside parties actions.

[marylandblue]

60. A 3rd party agreement can't block a public agency doing it's duty

For example, an HOA agreement could not prevent you from calling the police in an emergency, or prohibit you from calling the building department to investigate a code violation.

From the parent perspective, the parent is required to send their kid to school. An HOA can't stop you from sending your child to school, force you to put your child in danger to do so, or force to not comply with the IEP. An example of this is when a child is homebound. The school may send tutors to teach the child. They can't say the tutor is not allowed on HOA property.

[Lee-Lee]

61. There is no legal authority for the school system to force it

Let’s say that a person had a kid that needed the same accommodation and they lived up a long, twisty driveway that a bus cannot navigate.

Let’s say behind the child’s home is a private driveway that the school bus can navigate, but the owners do not want the school bus on their driveway.

The school system cannot force them to allow access to the driveway. It’s private property and a private road.

Since this development is private roads, the same things apply. They can set rules.

There is a better chance of them succeeding in ADA grounds maybe, or on other grounds, than anything IDEA related. But the school system can’t force use of a third parties private property.

I suspect if it went to court the courts would say that the school system could send a smaller vehicle to them, as the issue is the size of the bus, so there was a way for the school to comply. Since there is a way for the school to comply by using a smaller vehicle then it’s on the school systemz

[marylandblue]

63. Door to Door transportation is defined by courts as the front of your property

Where it meets the street. Not the shortest or easiest possible path. If a smaller bus is required to get to the property, then the school is required to provide that bus.

HOA public/private access roads are not the same as strictly private roads. Your neighbor can block your use of their driveway. The HOA cannot block your access to the common street. This is a matter of land law. They can't effectively lock you in your house no matter what.

[Lee-Lee]

65. But HOAS can restrict what kind of vehicles you use

Lots of HOAs prohibit commercial vehicles, vehicles over a certain size, etc. And you agree to abide by that when you buy a property where the deed says you must follow the HOA rules.

The kid isn’t being blocked in. The HOA said it’s the size of the bus that’s an issue. The school could send a smaller vehicle to pick him up without issue based on what the story says.

[marylandblue]

68. In that case the school probably has to use a smaller bus

But it would also depend on if the larger bus actually would damage the streets. A school bus twice a day is really not that much. The concern in street design is usually multiple heavy vehicles every hour every day for several years.

[Lee-Lee]

69. Doesn't matter how legitimate the HOAs reasons are

As long as they allow a reasonable approach, like using a smaller vehicle, the the Parents and school system don’t have a case.

They could say “we just don’t like an ugly bus on the streets” and as long as they allow the smaller vehicle it’s not a violation of anyone’s rights.

Lots of HOAs don’t allow any commercial vehcile to be on the grounds at all between certain hours. I know someone who lived in one who worked for Bellsouth and they wouldn’t allow his work van to be parked in his driveway. Since Bellsouth wouldn’t allow him to leave it anywhere else he had to make a 30 minute drive to the closest facility they had with a fenced lot before and after every work day to leave the van there when he was allowed by Bellsouth to take it home.

Hell, I’ve know cops who the HOA wouldn’t allow to park their patrol cars in their own driveways.

[marylandblue]

71. It does matter, they can't just make up reasons for restrictions

There would have to be something specific in the bylaws about that, and I doubt it would cover this situation exactly.

You are treating this like it is a fully private road, owned by a single individual. It is not. It is property held in common, which gives the homeowner more rights and puts more obligations on the HOA.

On edit: They also can't tell the city what size garbage trucks are allowed. On the other hand, the city can tell the developer how much traffic the HOA streets have to handle.

[Lee-Lee]

72. Actually they can do all that

And HOAs sometimes do.

I’ve seen HOAs go so far as to require people living there to use paid private garbage services instead of city ones because they didn’t like the way the city did things.

This is assuming even that this HOA covers a development the city limits, it may not be inside a city at all.

I will bet the HOA has limits on vehcile size and style that’s allowed on its streets. Most do.

[marylandblue]

73. Yes they may use private services instead of city services

But if they use city services, they are stuck with whatever service the city offers, whatever size truck the city uses, and whatever rules the city imposes, such as recycling rules.

I am not talking about this particular HOA. I am talking what limits an HOA can impose on a public agency and what they can do that may put your child in danger. And there are limits to what they can impose.

[Crunchy Frog]

59. Do you know what "n/t" means?

It means that there's no text in the body of your post.

[ScratchCat]

28. Yep

Just read the link above, they moved in there in 2017 and want the rules changed for them. They didn't have to buy, could have checked the covenants first and have no legal leg here.

[fescuerescue]

34. maybe

Maybe not.

Convenants are over turned, invalidated, all the time. There are a surprisingly a large number of properties in this country with covenants that disallow black families from living there. Those are still written and on the books, but obviously not enforced and ignored because it violates a ton of Federal laws.

Another example is satellite dishes. Lots of HOAs, including my own have rules and convenants banning them, but FCC regulations override this.

Between fair housing act and ADA, I bet they will win. That's just at the Federal level. Oregon probably has their own set of state laws to leverage as well.

Finally the HOA has to defend this in open court, and it's not exactly a sympathetic position.

My money is on the family winning.

[Lee-Lee]

82. Here is why the family won't win

The HOA is not banning the child being picked up in the yard.

The HOA is only banning large vehicles like busses from doing it.

There is nothing stopping the school system from using a smaller bus or a van. The use of different vehicles and equipment is often needed for comply with an IEP.

If the child lived up a twisty mountain road a bus could not navigate safely the school system would have to similarly use a smaller vehicle.

The judge will say “Why doesn’t the school system use a smaller vehicle?” And the only answers will Be we don’t want to spend extra money to meet the terms of the IEP- not good enough- or we just don’t want to- also not good enough to override the private property rights of the HOA.

[fescuerescue]

86. This is why I believe they will win.

They already let in garbage trucks and other large vehicles. Letting in a school bus is likely to be viewed as a reasonable accomodation (which is key parts of most applicable federal and state laws that purtain to this)

The onus is NOT on the school system, but if the school system does have a smaller bus or unallocated van, sure. However if this is like most schools, they probably don't have extra unused vehicles or extra

Finally, an HOA (unsympathetic) picking on a disabled child. Thats a big uphill fight even before the facts are discussed.

It might be different if the school system is in a mountain area and have a fleet of ready vehicles ready to address this. That's not the case here.

[Lee-Lee]

87. It really doesn't matter what they let in

First, under IDEA only the school is obligated to make an accommodation. If the IEP requires it the school system must provide it unless they can demonstrate its not possible.

Under the ADA it’s questionable if the law even applies because they are private roads. ADA only covers public accommodations. Under the law if it’s a provae facility for use of residents and guests than the ADA has no jurisdiction. So if it’s a gated community or even has signs that say roads for members and guests only then the ADA doesn’t apply. That’s one of the reasons facilities like gyms, pools, playgrounds etc in these places all have those signs, because it costs far less to have all those facilities, especially pools, when you don’t have to build to ADA standard.

However, even if they argue the ADA applies the examples of garbage trucks and delivery trucks are not exactly comperable. The delivery trucks are all smaller and lighter. Garbage trucks only come once a week, not two times a day 5 days a week.

So under their argument that it’s about wear on the streets they will say a garbage truck once a week is far less wear than a school bus 10 times a week, and that garbage truck provides a service to all residents not just one. Since all residents share the cost of the road maintenance something that gives 10x the wear for benefit of only one homeowner is a dispaparate impact.

The onus is indeed on the school system. Once the student has an approved IEP documenting a needed accommodation the school system is legally obligated to do all it can to meet that obligation. And that includes using specialized vehicles or modified routes when needed.

[woodsprite]

40. I'd look at the make up of the neighborhood

Could it be the parents last names are Hernandez and Regalado?

I would not have thought that my kid couldn’t get to school, with or without an IEP.

[csziggy]

48. It could be the age of many of the residents

<SNIP>

The district's transportation director, Michael Shields, told Hernandez in a letter that it was his understanding that "if mail, garbage, and other services have access to the development, then we should be able to provide service as well." However, the district ultimately complied with the association's request. Shields could not immediately be reached for comment Tuesday afternoon.

<SNIP>

Another family with a child with disabilities had a similar experience in the subdivision. Christina Pimentel said her son Evan Lewis is autistic and since he cannot ensure his own safety walking to and from a bus stop on the busy road, Evan's Individualized Education Plan always called for door-to-door bus service.

The HOA stopped, reinstated and then stopped Evan's bus service at the same time it was interfering with transportation for Hernandez and Regalado's daughter, Pimentel said.

"I think somebody just complained because they didn't want the buses in there and I didn't understand why," Pimentel said, noting that garbage trucks and parcel delivery trucks are allowed in the subdivision. Families stood out in a neighborhood with many residents in their mid-50s and older, and Pimentel said people left anonymous notes on her door telling her to "shut my kids up." Her family moved over the summer after their landlord put the house on the market.

More: https://www.oregonlive.com/politics/index.ssf/2018/08/lawsuit_oregon_sen_jackie_wint.html

[Iggo]

44. You can change the rules all you want.

If the rule breaks federal and state housing laws, then fuck the rule.

[thucythucy]

79. Especially if it puts a child or children's lives in danger.

Seems their priorities are a tad skewed.

[Coventina]

30. I read the article: The HOA are evil hypocrites

They do allow public mail and garbage trucks.

They also allow parcel delivery trucks (UPS, Fed-Ex, etc.)

Also, the child in question has been deemed to have MEDICAL need for door-to-door pick up and drop off.
She CAN'T just wait at the bus stop with the other children.

I hope these parents win their case.

HOAs are generally evil. This one is going out of their way to be evil.

[radical noodle]

31. I live in a HOA community in Florida

I can guarantee that I can allow anyone I want to enter. All these communities let in vendors, delivery trucks, moving vans, landscapers, and other less than pristine vehicles. There is absolutely no excuse for this and I have a feeling they will be changing that rule.

[IronLionZion]

32. The sort of people who run for HOA boards tend to have an agenda or like power

But they can be voted out, or at least one or two problem individuals could be replaced if the rest of the residents are interested and organize.

[Hortensis]

36. Thank goodness: Sen. Jackie Winters is a Republican!

First thing I always look for. "Please let this felon/sexual abuser/HOA fascist be Republican, not Democrat."

[Iggo]

43. As soon as I saw "Golf Course Estates" my fuck you projector started humming.

:middlefinger: :middlefinger:

[beachbum bob]

46. The lawsuit will be settled, they won't let it go to trial...

[Ms. Toad]

76. Most likely.

My spouse handled a nearly identical case over a decade ago. The settlement included permitting the bus to pick the child up in front of their home.

[ck4829]

50. Kick

[Thomas Hurt]

51. Some HOAs just go crazy with the power...

think they are feudal lords or something.

[marylandblue]

53. HOA will lose this for sure

The school is obligated to provide door to door service under it's plan for the disabled student's education. HOA cannot exclude a public agency performing it's duties. It can't stop police, fire, housing inspectors etc. There is simply no basis to stop a public agency from doing it's job. That's in addition to all the other federal laws that apply.

[Lee-Lee]

84. Nope. The school system still has options and can pick up the child

The school is obligated to provide door to door service, yes.

They are not obligated to do it in a large bus

The HOAs only issue is the size of the bus.

The school system can use a smaller bus or a van and meet all their obligations to the child.

If the parents lived in a remote area up a twisty mountain road a bus can’t navigate it would be the same, they would have to use a smaller vehicle. Except in this case it is HOA assholes instead of a twisty road. But still, even though it’s because of assholes the school system still has legal options and ways to do what they need to do.

[bitterross]

56. The HOA is really stupid. They are going to lose.

There is no way the courts will allow them to flaunt the ADA. Their argument is the bus will cause them to have to repair the roads sooner than if the bus was not allowed. That is not going to fly.

On Edit: That seems as dumb as saying you don't want to make the improvements required by the ADA because they'll cost money.

[Lee-Lee]

62. Here is one big reason why the HOA will likely win

The roads are private, and they are allowed to set conditions of use.

They have evidently only objected to the size of the bus because of concerns about the wear on the road. A possibly legitimate concern as busses are heavier than most residential delivery trucks and things like garbage trucks only run once a week and not twice a day.

However the school system has the ability to comply with the students IEP by simply using a smaller vehcle, such as a van or smaller bus, to pick up the child. School systems all over use vans for transporting kids. They use them if kids have special needs or even if it’s a short route. I lived in an area where they used vans to go pick up kids who were in remote areas where it was uneconomical to run the full bus, then the vans met the busses and the kids got on the bus.

Would it cost the school system more? Sure. But there is often additional costs that come from complying with an IEP. The HOA is under no obligation legally to change its rules to make it cheaper for the school to meet the students needs.

So if it goes to court the HOA will say simply “it’s the size of the bus that is the issue,the school is welcome to use a smaller vehcile” and the judge will asktge school why thy didn’t do that. And unless they have a reason better than. “It would cost money” the case will be tossed.

[Vinnie From Indy]

66. The court will tell the school to use a different vehicle to pick the child up

The issue is not whether the HOA will prevent the school from picking this child up at their doorstep, the issue is what type of vehicle will be allowed to do it.

The HOA is not in any way preventing this child from being picked up, they are simply saying that a full sized school bus is not allowed on the property.

The HOA will win this court case.

[Lee-Lee]

67. Yep- that's what I posted above

The school system could send a smaller vehicle and comply with the HOAs requests.

Since the school system has the ability to pick the kid up and evidently just doesn’t want to spend money to comply with the IEP the courts will say that there isn’t a problem.

[ck4829]

75. Kick

[Lee-Lee]

85. The parents actually should be suing the school system

The more I think about this, the more I see that while the HOA people are assholes the parents are going at this wrong and are also in the wrong to a degree.

They moved into the HOA knowing that their child had an IEP refuting door to door pickup. The HOA had rules about vehcile size using the roads that the parents should have checked on before buying, if not that is their failure.

However the school system can still pick up the child simply by using a smaller vehicle.

That would comply with the IEP and meet the child’s needs and also not violate the HOA rules that the parents legally agreed to honor when they purchased the property.

So to meet the child’s needs the school system needs to provide an appropriate vehcle to pick the child up at their home. That is where the lawsuit needs to be aimed- at forcing the school to comply with the terms of the IEP.

Now, that may not be what they are doing because the court may ask why they think it’s justified to demand additional expenses on the schools part because they moved to a place knowing it made it harder to meet the terms of the IEP.