HomeLatest ThreadsGreatest ThreadsForums & GroupsMy SubscriptionsMy Posts
DU Home » Latest Threads » Forums & Groups » Main » General Discussion (Forum) » LAWFARE: It was about Rus...

Fri Jan 11, 2019, 09:24 PM

LAWFARE: It was about Russia. It was always about Russia. Full stop.

What if the Obstruction Was the Collusion? On the New York Times’s Latest Bombshell
By Benjamin Wittes Friday, January 11, 2019, 8:43 PM



...................

What is the significance of all of this? I have two big takeaways.

First, if this analysis is correct, it mostly—though not entirely—answers the question of the legal basis of the obstruction investigation. The president’s lawyers, Barr in his memo, and any number of conservative commentators have all argued that Mueller cannot reasonably be investigating obstruction offenses based on the president’s actions within his Article II powers in firing Comey; such actions, they contend, cannot possibly violate the obstruction laws. While this position is disputed, a great many other commentators, including me, have scratched their heads about Mueller’s obstruction theory.

But if the predicate for the investigation was rooted in substantial part in counterintelligence authorities—that is, if the theory was not just that the president may have violated the criminal law but also that he acted in a fashion that may constitute a threat to national security—that particular legal puzzle goes away. After all, the FBI doesn’t need a possible criminal violation to open a national security investigation.

The problem does not entirely go away, because as the Times reports, the probe was partly predicated as a criminal matter as well. So the question of Mueller’s criminal theory is still there. But the weight on it is dramatically less.

This possibility, of course, raises a different legal puzzle, which is whether and under what circumstances the president can be a national security investigative subject of his own FBI given that it is ultimately he who defines national security threats for the executive branch. But that’s a question for another day.

Second, if it is correct that the FBI’s principle interest in obstruction was not as a discrete criminal fact pattern but as a national security threat, this significantly blurs the distinction between the obstruction and collusion aspects of the investigation. In this construction, obstruction was not a problem distinct from collusion, as has been generally imagined. Rather, in this construction, obstruction was the collusion, or least part of it. The obstruction of justice statutes become, in this understanding, merely one set of statutes investigators might think about using to deal with a national security risk—specifically, the risk of a person on the U.S. side coordinating with or supporting Russian activity by shutting down the investigation.

It was about Russia. It was always about Russia. Full stop.




......


WAY MORE:
https://www.lawfareblog.com/what-if-obstruction-was-collusion-new-york-timess-latest-bombshell
https://www.democraticunderground.com/100211658856

8 replies, 980 views

Reply to this thread

Back to top Alert abuse

Always highlight: 10 newest replies | Replies posted after I mark a forum
Replies to this discussion thread
Arrow 8 replies Author Time Post
Reply LAWFARE: It was about Russia. It was always about Russia. Full stop. (Original post)
kpete Jan 2019 OP
DURHAM D Jan 2019 #1
kpete Jan 2019 #2
doc03 Jan 2019 #3
Scurrilous Jan 2019 #4
chimpymustgo Jan 2019 #5
BumRushDaShow Jan 2019 #6
bdamomma Jan 2019 #7
Andy823 Jan 2019 #8

Response to kpete (Original post)

Fri Jan 11, 2019, 09:26 PM

1. Link? Thanks

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink



Response to kpete (Original post)

Fri Jan 11, 2019, 09:29 PM

3. Sounds like what Malcolm Nance has been saying is

all falling in line.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to kpete (Original post)

Fri Jan 11, 2019, 09:31 PM

4. K&R

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to kpete (Original post)

Fri Jan 11, 2019, 09:42 PM

5. Yup - get to the bottom of this - it shouldn't be too hard.

Joy is having a field day on Rachel's show. Right now she's talking about the Russians' visit to the Oval Office, where he announced he had fired some FBI members!!

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to chimpymustgo (Reply #5)

Fri Jan 11, 2019, 09:46 PM

6. Benjamin Wittes - "I don't BOOM my own work"



TEXT
Benjamin Wittes

@benjaminwittes

I don't boom my own work. https://www.lawfareblog.com/what-if-obstruction-was-collusion-new-yorks-timess-latest-bombshell
2,378
8:44 PM - Jan 11, 2019



Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to kpete (Original post)

Fri Jan 11, 2019, 09:52 PM

7. Watching now

to us DU'ers is this news to us??? We know this so called President has been in the back pocket of Putin. He is a security threat to our country. We have seen all pouting, the looks between him and Putin that this has been going for a long time.

It is still going on our Government agencies have been gutted, i.e State Department, Justice Department etc. Putin wanted to see the destruction of the US. Hated President Obama, and Hillary Clinton. Putin wanted to neutralize US by using his Russian asset tRump.

We are seeing it now with this shutdown. Munuchin relaxing sanctions for Russia. Everything is falling into place, or just falling.

This has to stop.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to kpete (Original post)

Sat Jan 12, 2019, 11:47 AM

8. K&R

nt

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink

Reply to this thread