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shockey80

(4,379 posts)
Mon Feb 18, 2019, 10:45 AM Feb 2019

The FBI: Trump does not understand this and he will pay a big price for his ignorance.

The FBI is a tight knit group. I believe they have a culture similar to the culture in the military.

When I served in the military we did not play politics. We had each others backs, even in peacetime . If any outsider messed with one of us the entire company would help them. If any outsider messed with our leaders the entire company would have become enraged.

I believe the FBI has the same type of culture. When Trump fired Comey he tried to turn FBI agents against each other. He was playing politics. It doesn't work that way. When Trump attacked Comey and McCabe that was considered by agents of the FBI as an attack on all of them. When he attacks Mueller they consider that as an attack on all of them. They consider it an attack on the entire institution.

Mueller, the Southern District of New York and the scores of FBI agents investigating Trump will conduct themselves in a professional manner. At the same, I believe they will follow Trump to the gates of hell in order to nail his ass. Trump crossed a line you should never cross. You do not ever attack the bond that the people in the FBI live by.

They will pursue you with great anger and vengeance. When they get you they will cut you no slack.

Trump does not understand this type of loyalty. Trump thinks loyalty is something you force, you demand, you threaten. This will be his downfall.

94 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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The FBI: Trump does not understand this and he will pay a big price for his ignorance. (Original Post) shockey80 Feb 2019 OP
I hope this is accurate. lark Feb 2019 #1
You are right Cosmocat Feb 2019 #31
That group needs to be purged from the FBI. LiberalFighter Feb 2019 #80
When will he pay that price, do you think? MineralMan Feb 2019 #2
He wakes up every day knowing he is despised by just about everyone. SallyHemmings Feb 2019 #4
Doesn't even have a dog. empedocles Feb 2019 #7
How can he clean up it's poop? SallyHemmings Feb 2019 #8
There's a story about Gerald Ford and dog poop I always liked. thucythucy Feb 2019 #16
Damn right. EVERY president has shown some of that. EVERY PRESIDENT. Except THIS one. nt oldsoftie Feb 2019 #88
How could you forget Checkers? maddiemom Feb 2019 #22
true... subana Feb 2019 #28
The Reagans had dogs and horses on their ranch. gldstwmn Feb 2019 #64
Who says she even wants to see him naked by now? calimary Feb 2019 #19
I don't think she'll divorce him JohnnyRingo Feb 2019 #27
the prenup won't allow for that . n/t Schmice3 Feb 2019 #50
I agree with Schmice3 LiberalFighter Feb 2019 #79
Then she'll get his Social Security JohnnyRingo Feb 2019 #83
Does he even pay into soc sec? dhol82 Feb 2019 #94
There's a legit story for the NA! 2naSalit Feb 2019 #36
She shares his values. Both seem heartless spooky3 Feb 2019 #43
I'm not so sure that he truly understands how despised he is... jmbar2 Feb 2019 #35
I once worked for a narcissistic boss who spooky3 Feb 2019 #45
That's very sad. jmbar2 Feb 2019 #58
Yes, it is. I suspect it's pretty similar to Trump's situation. spooky3 Feb 2019 #66
I don't believe he does know this jcgoldie Feb 2019 #54
I agree. He honestly believes he's beloved, PoindexterOglethorpe Feb 2019 #62
He has pardoned a few people actually lunatica Feb 2019 #69
The people he pardoned aren't people to him. They're PR projects, red meat for his base. haele Feb 2019 #81
Yeah, there's that lunatica Feb 2019 #84
I wish I knew. I don't know how long it's going to take to nail Trumps ass. shockey80 Feb 2019 #5
Oh he will pay, and pay dearly vlyons Feb 2019 #21
Yes, but we are his Karma and if we don't act he goes without consequences onit2day Feb 2019 #49
Who says that we are not going to act? vlyons Feb 2019 #55
while i agree stevesinpa Feb 2019 #85
Welcome to DU! flying_wahini Feb 2019 #90
He's never paid a price for anything he's done throughout his life. Texin Feb 2019 #29
Exactly, I'm not holding my breath. cwydro Feb 2019 #86
Beware the Ides of March....... ProudMNDemocrat Feb 2019 #3
March 15th is a Friday PJMcK Feb 2019 #89
Are you including the New York office in your little hope-fest... Wounded Bear Feb 2019 #6
Agreed. Fuzzpope Feb 2019 #18
And all good buds with Ghouliani... Wounded Bear Feb 2019 #37
Just look at the names of those he has attacked, repeatedly. Cracklin Charlie Feb 2019 #9
I think it goes beyond the FBI YessirAtsaFact Feb 2019 #10
He also jeopardizes their lives with his unpredictable behavior. llmart Feb 2019 #15
Yeah, and then look at Japan's Abe nominating him for a fucking Nobel Peace Prize for goddsakes! Texin Feb 2019 #33
Abe is a conservative politician YessirAtsaFact Feb 2019 #38
abe is japanese rampartc Feb 2019 #57
That is true as well YessirAtsaFact Feb 2019 #59
Fortunately the Nobel Committee is not comprised of MAGAt-Americans The Velveteen Ocelot Feb 2019 #41
trump wants to eliminate the agency completely duforsure Feb 2019 #11
Is this a true statement? I wouldn't put it past him, though. LastLiberal in PalmSprings Feb 2019 #52
That's why I don't worry about the government falling apart - there are a lot more patriotic... George II Feb 2019 #12
My brother and I have discussed that. murielm99 Feb 2019 #48
I used to think the organization was apolitical pecosbob Feb 2019 #13
The FBI are the boy scouts of the law enforcement world Johnny2X2X Feb 2019 #14
This message was self-deleted by its author SharonClark Feb 2019 #25
And the fact that FBI people are very patriotic Perseus Feb 2019 #17
I know for a fact this is true The Blue Flower Feb 2019 #20
My dad (lifelong Democrat) was a Marine and a cop... interesting observation about his friends: Still In Wisconsin Feb 2019 #23
Dotard has a lot of fans in the military awesomerwb1 Feb 2019 #24
I hope the FBI agents that fed giuliani inside info about HRC email investigation being reopened yaesu Feb 2019 #26
He denigrates, humiliates and openly ignores the FBI daily. Kablooie Feb 2019 #30
The only loyalty Trump knows is what's he's bought. gtar100 Feb 2019 #32
only thing is.... Locrian Feb 2019 #34
And it became far more conservative after Rove's litmus-testing in the second Bush term. byronius Feb 2019 #39
Libertarianism Locrian Feb 2019 #51
AND libertarianism has been bought by billionaires EndGOPPropaganda Feb 2019 #78
Well said. flying_wahini Feb 2019 #91
From what I've witnessed 2naSalit Feb 2019 #40
Trump is thinking like always, "I can get away with anything" Stuart G Feb 2019 #42
I don't think he thinks he's getting away with things. IMO he thinks he's right to begin with. Shrike47 Feb 2019 #47
Trump thinks loyalty is one way lovemydogs Feb 2019 #44
Trump hasn't got a clue..not even a tiny clue..none, zero, empty, nada. Stuart G Feb 2019 #46
Your last paragraph describes the ultimate fate of dictators. gordianot Feb 2019 #53
Read the Abramson thread matt819 Feb 2019 #56
I've often thought PatSeg Feb 2019 #60
Union Member Here Tink41 Feb 2019 #61
K&R BlueJac Feb 2019 #63
Gangs and Tribes, the human mess. n/t MarcA Feb 2019 #65
Not to mention pissing off The CIA... czarjak Feb 2019 #67
Let's hope that's the case. Firestorm49 Feb 2019 #68
General Sessions said the FBI was better with Irish Drunks running it bottomofthehill Feb 2019 #70
I hope your right but remember, the FBI is mostly republican lancelyons Feb 2019 #71
Yes, but they're EISENHOWER republicans. Haggis for Breakfast Feb 2019 #74
Nah, they may be Republicans but when it starts to go down they won't want to lose face. flying_wahini Feb 2019 #92
Tell It To The Managers Of His Vermin-Ridden Restaurants! (wink!) (n/t) corbettkroehler Feb 2019 #72
I'm an old soldier Roadside Attraction Feb 2019 #73
". . . peel him off the ceiling !!!" Haggis for Breakfast Feb 2019 #75
Trump, being a sociopath, does not understand the concept of loyalty. Or honor. guillaumeb Feb 2019 #76
Protect the Constitution against all enemies foreign and domestic. dem4decades Feb 2019 #77
Agree except maybe for FBI NYC. They would have Laura PourMeADrink Feb 2019 #82
I doubt it. nt cwydro Feb 2019 #87
So what's the deal with Barr? I was hoping he was ecstatic Feb 2019 #93

lark

(23,099 posts)
1. I hope this is accurate.
Mon Feb 18, 2019, 10:48 AM
Feb 2019

I worry about the Guiliani FBI connection that went out of it's way to shape an election to their liking. How many of these assholes are there, quietly doing their best to thwart the rest of the FBI and protect drumpf? But then, I am a worrier by nature.

Cosmocat

(14,564 posts)
31. You are right
Mon Feb 18, 2019, 12:12 PM
Feb 2019

they are "conservative" by nature.

All in all, we have to hope they will do the right thing, but you have to believe there are elements within the bureau that are as vulnerable to conservative group think as the average americans are.

SallyHemmings

(1,821 posts)
4. He wakes up every day knowing he is despised by just about everyone.
Mon Feb 18, 2019, 10:57 AM
Feb 2019

With the exception of his shrinking base.

His staff leaks. DA wife hasn’t seen him naked in years (sorry for the visual).

The fact that SNL making fun of him irritates him speaks volumes.




empedocles

(15,751 posts)
7. Doesn't even have a dog.
Mon Feb 18, 2019, 11:03 AM
Feb 2019

Amazing. Even Nixon had Bebe Rebozo, Reagan had his 'ranch' handyman.

[Any self respecting dog would turn on trump].

thucythucy

(8,050 posts)
16. There's a story about Gerald Ford and dog poop I always liked.
Mon Feb 18, 2019, 11:38 AM
Feb 2019

He was at Camp David, and his dog crapped on a rug. One of his valets was going to clean it up, and Ford told him not to, that he'd do it himself. I believe his comment was, "No man should have to clean up after another man's dog."

That kind of simple decency is of course far beyond Benedict Donald.

subana

(586 posts)
28. true...
Mon Feb 18, 2019, 12:00 PM
Feb 2019

to be an animal lover, first you have to have a heart. Trump has no heart!

I don't have a dog but I have a cat!

calimary

(81,261 posts)
19. Who says she even wants to see him naked by now?
Mon Feb 18, 2019, 11:43 AM
Feb 2019

I’m expecting divorce proceedings to commence as soon as he’s out of office.

There will be payback. Hopefully boatloads of it.

Karma doesn’t need Michael Avenatti to help out or otherwise speak for it.

JohnnyRingo

(18,628 posts)
27. I don't think she'll divorce him
Mon Feb 18, 2019, 11:59 AM
Feb 2019

Why settle for half of everything he owns when she can wait until he goes tits up. She knows more about his health than anyone.

spooky3

(34,452 posts)
43. She shares his values. Both seem heartless
Mon Feb 18, 2019, 12:50 PM
Feb 2019

And unconcerned about anyone other than certain family members.

jmbar2

(4,886 posts)
35. I'm not so sure that he truly understands how despised he is...
Mon Feb 18, 2019, 12:22 PM
Feb 2019

Narcissists seem to believe they are loved by everyone.

By virtue of having money and servants, he has been catered to all of his life, which he may interpret as being "liked". I truly don't believe he can comprehend the difference between buying services, and being loved and respected.

spooky3

(34,452 posts)
45. I once worked for a narcissistic boss who
Mon Feb 18, 2019, 12:53 PM
Feb 2019

Was successful because he manipulated most people well and had a superficial charm. But when his marriage was breaking up and he confided in me I asked him why he didn’t talk it out with a good friend. He replied that he had lots of acquaintances but no one he considered a friend.

jcgoldie

(11,631 posts)
54. I don't believe he does know this
Mon Feb 18, 2019, 01:55 PM
Feb 2019

Trump seems to be the very special type of self deluded who believes all of his own lies. Sure he knows a lot of liberals and people of color hate him but in his mind those aren't real Americans. I think he believes he's popular and the lying press just misreports his numbers. He's stupid enough that he can go to a rally of 5000 rednecks screaming for him and he thinks that's more meaningful than actual polling data that says those hateful people are in a shrinking minority.

PoindexterOglethorpe

(25,855 posts)
62. I agree. He honestly believes he's beloved,
Mon Feb 18, 2019, 03:11 PM
Feb 2019

that he's The Best President Ever, and it's only a small number of dastardly (only that word wouldn't be in his vocabulary, he'd say "bad&quot journalists and a few comedians who tell lies about him.

Notice that he has not issued a single pardon. My take on why he hasn't is that he believes that those who've been indicted or sent to jail are losers who deserve what's happened, not loyalists who should be rewarded. It's why he will be the most surprised person on the planet if he ever actually is escorted out of the White House.

lunatica

(53,410 posts)
69. He has pardoned a few people actually
Mon Feb 18, 2019, 05:39 PM
Feb 2019

Sheriff Arpaio, Scooter Libby, Dinesh D’Souza, and a couple of other lesser known people.

haele

(12,653 posts)
81. The people he pardoned aren't people to him. They're PR projects, red meat for his base.
Mon Feb 18, 2019, 11:42 PM
Feb 2019

Their "pardons" were part of the script, supporting the part he's playing as the tough conservative icon protecting Real Amuricans (tm).

His "people" who are going to jail are losers in his mind - they failed him by getting into trouble. No one outside his organization cares about them, so they aren't important enough to pardon.

Haele

 

shockey80

(4,379 posts)
5. I wish I knew. I don't know how long it's going to take to nail Trumps ass.
Mon Feb 18, 2019, 10:59 AM
Feb 2019

I do believe Mueller, SDNY, and the FBI will get him in the end. Two years of investigations seems like forever. It is hard being patient.

vlyons

(10,252 posts)
21. Oh he will pay, and pay dearly
Mon Feb 18, 2019, 11:47 AM
Feb 2019

I believe in the truth of karma. That karma is just like gravity, in that it never stops working. But the causes and conditions have to come together in a way that make karma ripen and bear fruit. Just like a seed that we store until the conditions are right for planting.

You have to know that there are plenty of FBI agents (and others), who harbor hatred and vengence to pay back Trump for the harm that he has caused. Just like there are plenty of DUers, who write here every day how they wish Trump would rot in hell. So make no mistake, Trump's day of retribution is coming. We just have to be patient. There are more than enough people, with Mueller and with the House Dem investigations, who are diligently collecting all the necessary evidence to wipe Trump off the stage. We cannot move forward with our liberal agenda until we deal with Trump and his enablers.

So just stay calm and focused on taking the Senate and electing a competent and virtuous POTUS in 2020.

stevesinpa

(143 posts)
85. while i agree
Tue Feb 19, 2019, 01:35 AM
Feb 2019

we need to focus on our plans to take the senate and the white house in 2020, relying on "karma" is a joke. it's called justice and hard work by diligent and patriotic Americans that will take trump down, if it happens.
there have been too many good people that have suffered and too many outright evil people that never faced a day of suffering to believe in karma.
it will be good people that bring down the trump criminal organization not some spiritual belief in the universe equaling out.

Texin

(2,596 posts)
29. He's never paid a price for anything he's done throughout his life.
Mon Feb 18, 2019, 12:08 PM
Feb 2019

Why would it change now? I've said it before, he's the luckiest son of a bitch that ever lived on Earth. I don't imagine his luck will change now.

ProudMNDemocrat

(16,785 posts)
3. Beware the Ides of March.......
Mon Feb 18, 2019, 10:56 AM
Feb 2019

As Senators awaited the arrival of Caesar as he entered the Roman Senate, daggers poised to eradicate the corruption that would eventually bring down the greatest Empire on the planet.

I am confident that by the Ides fo March, there are going to be some fireworks exploding regarding Trump and his corrupt Administration. It is time.

PJMcK

(22,037 posts)
89. March 15th is a Friday
Tue Feb 19, 2019, 09:43 AM
Feb 2019

Robert Mueller has taken some of his boldest actions on Fridays.

Still, sooner would be better.

Wounded Bear

(58,653 posts)
6. Are you including the New York office in your little hope-fest...
Mon Feb 18, 2019, 11:01 AM
Feb 2019

they were responsible as much as anybody for Hillary's loss.

 

Fuzzpope

(602 posts)
18. Agreed.
Mon Feb 18, 2019, 11:42 AM
Feb 2019

Those assholes don't seem to have been with the general program and politically aligned themselves as co-conspirators in a clandestine effort they had to have known was illegal.

Yet there they are.

Cracklin Charlie

(12,904 posts)
9. Just look at the names of those he has attacked, repeatedly.
Mon Feb 18, 2019, 11:17 AM
Feb 2019

To list but a few:

Mueller
Comey
McCabe
Brennan
Clapper

These are not low level FBI/law enforcement nobodies. This is the upper echelon. Without googling, I think at least three of these guys were FBI Director.

Assface is in serious trouble.


YessirAtsaFact

(2,064 posts)
10. I think it goes beyond the FBI
Mon Feb 18, 2019, 11:22 AM
Feb 2019

I think the entire IC in the US and the intelligence services of our traditional allies are all in on nailing Trump.

He is a threat to the Western alliance and NATO. Almost every professional intelligence officer on both sides of the Atlantic want him gone.

llmart

(15,539 posts)
15. He also jeopardizes their lives with his unpredictable behavior.
Mon Feb 18, 2019, 11:31 AM
Feb 2019

I think the intelligence community would love to stuff a sock in his mouth or cut off his tiny fingers to keep him from tweeting the bizarre rantings.

Texin

(2,596 posts)
33. Yeah, and then look at Japan's Abe nominating him for a fucking Nobel Peace Prize for goddsakes!
Mon Feb 18, 2019, 12:13 PM
Feb 2019

He'll probably win the goddamned thing too!

The Velveteen Ocelot

(115,691 posts)
41. Fortunately the Nobel Committee is not comprised of MAGAt-Americans
Mon Feb 18, 2019, 12:40 PM
Feb 2019

who are beholden to or in any way fond of Dolt 45. They're pretty good at awarding the prize to people who actually deserve it.

duforsure

(11,885 posts)
11. trump wants to eliminate the agency completely
Mon Feb 18, 2019, 11:24 AM
Feb 2019

And reorganize he claims, but he's doing like Putin did in russia , where only the most loyal were kept and used to further only what he wanted it to do.

George II

(67,782 posts)
12. That's why I don't worry about the government falling apart - there are a lot more patriotic...
Mon Feb 18, 2019, 11:27 AM
Feb 2019

...Americans - Democratic, republican, independent - than people think. When it comes down to ideology vs. the country, organizations like the FBI, CIA, even Congress (now to a lesser degree) who line up behind the country instead of their blind political loyalty.

This goes for most judges, too. They recognize that ruling with their ideology instead of country is dangerous and wrong.

Going back to the 1970s, many of the personalities that took down Richard Nixon were republicans, including Judge John Sirica.

murielm99

(30,739 posts)
48. My brother and I have discussed that.
Mon Feb 18, 2019, 01:31 PM
Feb 2019

We both know more about how things work at the local and state level. Even though we live in different states, we see how the courts work in our area, how elections work, state government, and even law enforcement.

I have to work with a lot of Republicans in my area. You are right. They do take down their own, if they are incompetent or corrupt. it surprises me sometimes.

pecosbob

(7,538 posts)
13. I used to think the organization was apolitical
Mon Feb 18, 2019, 11:31 AM
Feb 2019

but the events leading up to the election proved that to be incorrect. Buttercup Giuliani and his clique out of the NY office were definitely political. Without the FBI's apparent co-signing of the accusations against Ms. Clinton the election likely doesn't go for Trump. They were way off base and in retrospect their actions should have resulted in disciplinary action if not prosecution.

Johnny2X2X

(19,066 posts)
14. The FBI are the boy scouts of the law enforcement world
Mon Feb 18, 2019, 11:31 AM
Feb 2019

First, the FBI is extremely difficult to get into, you need extremely good grades and have the right temperament they are looking for. The FBI has an amazing reputation of integrity and rule following. This is the group of people where the line between good guys and bad guys is most sharply drawn.

It's a group who takes pride in crossing all the T's and Dotting all the I's.

They are rule followers, rule followers to the Nth degree. If agents have a $25 a day per diem while out in the field, you can bet your paycheck they are not spending a single penny over $25, every time, year after year, for their whole careers. That's the type of people you're dealing with, people who take an immense amount of pride in doing everything the way the guidelines say to do it. These are the type of people who never miss a day of work for decades, ones who never have a missed piece of evidence or paperwork for their careers. Men and women who do their jobs right every time.

Response to Johnny2X2X (Reply #14)

 

Perseus

(4,341 posts)
17. And the fact that FBI people are very patriotic
Mon Feb 18, 2019, 11:40 AM
Feb 2019

The FBI has made a career of watching the #1 USA enemy, Russia, and they hate traitors, so I expect they will come after all those traitors with the maximum weight of the law, I just can't wait for it to happen, I wish it had already happened, but the wait will be worth it if the next pictures we see of these traitors are in orange suits.

The Blue Flower

(5,442 posts)
20. I know for a fact this is true
Mon Feb 18, 2019, 11:43 AM
Feb 2019

And I've been thinking it all along. He's an idiot and a traitor, among all else that's wrong with him.

 

Still In Wisconsin

(4,450 posts)
23. My dad (lifelong Democrat) was a Marine and a cop... interesting observation about his friends:
Mon Feb 18, 2019, 11:50 AM
Feb 2019

My dad is quite elderly now, having served in the Korean war, but thankfully several of his buddies are still around and they keep in touch. My dad's cop buddies are almost all Trumpers and that's been tough on my dad. They're loud and proud of Trump and love what he's doing.

Dad's Marine Corps buddies are a totally different story though. If I had to guess, most of them are Republicans, but according to Dad none of them can STAND Trump. They fought for their country, not for a political party or a race or a socioeconomic group. They are more like what you have described as the characteristics of the intelligence community. You mess with one of them and you've messed with ALL of them.

So I guess patrolling the streets of Milwaukee and suburban Milwaukee doesn't have the same effect as surviving Chosin Reservoir.

yaesu

(8,020 posts)
26. I hope the FBI agents that fed giuliani inside info about HRC email investigation being reopened
Mon Feb 18, 2019, 11:59 AM
Feb 2019

have seen the light, but I doubt it.

Kablooie

(18,634 posts)
30. He denigrates, humiliates and openly ignores the FBI daily.
Mon Feb 18, 2019, 12:09 PM
Feb 2019

He's been doing it for over 2 years and remains totally free to continue to do so indefinitely.
All his underlings are being caught but there is no real evidence that he personally will be taken down. In fact it appears that because of his position he may well escape any real retribution.

There is little chance he will be impeached, no matter what the charges, so the worst thing would be losing the 2020 election. Until then he will continue to poison and erode the foundations of our nation.

The only real hope I see is if Mueller is deliberately supporting the impression that there is no court worthy evidence that Trump deliberately ran the whole traitorous enterprise for personal gain so he can be smashed more completely, and shockingly, when the hammer finally comes down.

gtar100

(4,192 posts)
32. The only loyalty Trump knows is what's he's bought.
Mon Feb 18, 2019, 12:13 PM
Feb 2019

If he didn't have the control over the money he has (or appears to have), with his attitude nobody would give him the time of day. When the money is gone (which most of us know is inevitable), so will be all his "friends" and supporters. Donald is in for a rude awakening no amount of money can protect him from.

Locrian

(4,522 posts)
34. only thing is....
Mon Feb 18, 2019, 12:21 PM
Feb 2019

the FBI is conservative by nature. I do think they will "get" trump, but as for exposing all the issues in the russian / gov thing I do not think they are willing to show the US in that damaging light.

So expect some degree of coverup etc.

byronius

(7,394 posts)
39. And it became far more conservative after Rove's litmus-testing in the second Bush term.
Mon Feb 18, 2019, 12:37 PM
Feb 2019

Thousands of agents in both the FBI and CIA were forced to retire because they wouldn't swear loyalty to Bush.

I find it utterly, darkly comic that both the traitors that sold CIA secrets and NSA software to the Russians were conservative libertarians. Any nation that permits libertarians anywhere near their national security apparatus is flirting with disastrous Darwinian consequences.

I'd also like to point out that, in contrast to the popular meme, liberals are far more patriotic than conservatives. Conservatives worship an America that never was and will never be; liberals worship the actual ideas and the language.

Conservatism is a racket. Liberalism is patriotism. Libertarianism is pure self-interest; liberalism is concern for the earth and all life.

Axiomatic. Conservative libertarianism should be a disqualifier for service in the national security apparatus.

Locrian

(4,522 posts)
51. Libertarianism
Mon Feb 18, 2019, 01:34 PM
Feb 2019

Libertarianism - ah the most stupid of the self-interest diseases.

It's literally stone age government - with the added feature that any group that actually formed would vaporize the "rugged individual" (ahhhh, freedom - government get off my back) going it alone.

EndGOPPropaganda

(1,117 posts)
78. AND libertarianism has been bought by billionaires
Mon Feb 18, 2019, 10:32 PM
Feb 2019

For example the “libertarian” think tank, Cato, is purchased lock stock and barrel by the Koch network. Billionaires USE real libertarians, paying people to say we should destroy the government — so we can cut taxes on the rich.

2naSalit

(86,604 posts)
40. From what I've witnessed
Mon Feb 18, 2019, 12:37 PM
Feb 2019

as the child of very patriotic military personnel and having been in public service my self for a few years, there is a camaraderie among fellow public servants. Even at lower GS grades. A sense of patriotism and fealty to country and it's stated values. There is an expectation of "playing by the rules" and honest desire to move us all forward by performing one's assigned duties. It is this set of values and expectations along with individual expertise that creates a bond, as with the military, of dependence and trust, indeed the public's trust, to do the work of the people that has been assigned to you. You are expected to uphold the Constitution at the bare minimum and there are legal consequences for not upholding your oath of office... every federal employee takes the oath of office.

That said, I am sure that there was major concern at all levels upon the early indications of a co-opted president and an ongoing coup. I am confident that there is going to be a big change in the near future. Such blatant corruption cannot be accepted and must be eradicated ASAP. I am confident that anyone in our government employ who can see what's happening is working to do something about it because it's their duty and our way of life at stake.

Stuart G

(38,427 posts)
42. Trump is thinking like always, "I can get away with anything"
Mon Feb 18, 2019, 12:49 PM
Feb 2019

..He has put down and maligned leaders of the FBI, CIA, etc. Trump thinks he can "...get away with it." He is totally wrong, and doesn't believe that he can be wrong.
..As I have said before, and will say again. It isn't if Mueller gets him, it is when. Let's say Trump fires Mueller.............
Ok, there will be a replacement. That person will get Trump. And...that person will get Trump's team. That team includes his son or sons that have broken the law.

...Trump thinks he can get away with it, because he always has. Bankruptcy denied those who he owed. Divorce got rid of the women he got tired of. Firing people gets rid of those who work for him that he does not like. So, Trump thinks he can stop those he despises in the same way. He is much too stupid to realize that the FBI will "nail his ass." The FBI is not in a rush to "nail his ass." When it is done, Trump is done.. He thinks he can continue the way he has been doing. One example and then I am done..just one more..

..When the USA dropped the atom bomb on Japan, there was some thought, just some I suspect, that Japan might survive and continue fighting the USA. After the second bomb, it was over for good. Trump will get the 2nd, 3rd, and 4th so called "bombs" They will take many different forms. His lawyer has already been charged, and convicted. All the lawyer's paperwork is in the hands of the FBI. So other bombs are coming. Again the question is not if they come, it is when will they come. The FBI will nail Trump's ass. He will resign, and his name will be ruined, as will his family's name.

Shrike47

(6,913 posts)
47. I don't think he thinks he's getting away with things. IMO he thinks he's right to begin with.
Mon Feb 18, 2019, 01:04 PM
Feb 2019

I think he doesn’t have the insight to grasp that the opinions of others have any merit. What he wants is the right thing to do. Those who block his way are just doing it out of spite.

lovemydogs

(575 posts)
44. Trump thinks loyalty is one way
Mon Feb 18, 2019, 12:53 PM
Feb 2019

He gives no loyalty but, demands it of others. Threatens others to give loyalty to him.
The FBI is like a band of brothers.
However, with Comey it was extra because he was well liked. And respected.
The FBI agents looked up to him.

Stuart G

(38,427 posts)
46. Trump hasn't got a clue..not even a tiny clue..none, zero, empty, nada.
Mon Feb 18, 2019, 01:03 PM
Feb 2019

The FBI will get him. Along with help from the CIA, (Trump went around them directly to Putin). You see, these are lifelong people in the CIA and FBI who are dedicated to the ...United States of America..

Now they know, like the rest of us know, that Donald Trump is... only dedicated to ...Donald Trump, no one and nothing else

So, if anyone thinks that Donald Trump can get away with "it" they are wrong. The FBI and CIA will get Donald Trump. The question is not if, it is when. And when it happens, it will be total and complete.

gordianot

(15,238 posts)
53. Your last paragraph describes the ultimate fate of dictators.
Mon Feb 18, 2019, 01:51 PM
Feb 2019

This is why authoritarians do not last especially those who want to live in a binary world of winners and losers. Trump wins are illusions right now the real winners are cashing in on monumental Trump loses.

matt819

(10,749 posts)
56. Read the Abramson thread
Mon Feb 18, 2019, 02:22 PM
Feb 2019

I will grant that there's an FBI culture, as there is a CIA culture and a military, police, fire, etc. culture.

But not all are part of these cultures, even if they are part of the organization.

Seth Abramson's thread from this morning reminds us of the pro-Trump clique in the FBI NY Field Office. So while Trump is fucking with the FBI, there are those in the FBI who feel that it needs to be fucked with in order to remove the liberals or the truly apolitical.

PatSeg

(47,430 posts)
60. I've often thought
Mon Feb 18, 2019, 03:01 PM
Feb 2019

you'd have to be a total fool to mess with the FBI. They have resources we can't even begin to imagine and if you piss them off, I'm sure they'll have no problem using them.

I'm quite sure the FBI knows far more about Trump, his associations, and finances than even Trump knows. I find it highly unlikely that the FBI will overlook the firing of Comey and McCabe, and let byones be bygones. He fired their respected leaders to cover his own ass and vindictively made sure McCabe couldn't even collect his earned pension.

I can't believe that Trump doesn't realize he has taunted a bear. Guess I've watched more spy dramas than he has, because I find the FBI to be truly intimidating.

Tink41

(537 posts)
61. Union Member Here
Mon Feb 18, 2019, 03:06 PM
Feb 2019

I understand this. I've been part of a "brotherhood" for almost 30 yrs. It is unspoken that if an outsider pokes their head into "our" business, whether the individuals "like" each other or not, there will be hell to pay. I've seen it and been a part of it. Members can fight and argue all day long about the "brotherhood" discuss it's history,scandals, and short comings. If an outsider dare voice their opinion or feelings about it a total shutdown happens. YOU are not one of us, WE have loyalty only to each other. It's an odd thing that's never been discussed, it's not like someone informed me of these things when I got in.

Trump does not know what he is dealing with, most people wouldn't unless you were a member of an exclusive club and money cannot buy your way in.

Firestorm49

(4,035 posts)
68. Let's hope that's the case.
Mon Feb 18, 2019, 05:33 PM
Feb 2019

I’d like to believe that any one of the thousands of three initial agencies could or would at some point, and only if no other option existed, do something to save our once great country from total Anarchy. You sure can’t just rely on your vote anymore, can you? Oh, oh. Am I sounding conspiratorial? Negative? Influenced? Persuaded? Have they succeeded in creating doubt in my mind? Am I just “pawn in game of life?” (Mongo; Blazing Saddles) Is there plan working??? Have I been sucked in to the propagandized, no brain in your head, wall adoring, pussy grabbing, multi-alias, Ally shedding, adversary adorning, child stealing, tax grubbing, hotel building plot that they think is tricking my ass?

Blah Blah, blah - I think I’m going to go soak my feet.

bottomofthehill

(8,329 posts)
70. General Sessions said the FBI was better with Irish Drunks running it
Mon Feb 18, 2019, 06:18 PM
Feb 2019

He will soon learn that those bitter little Irish Catholic drunks from BC, Fordham, Holy Cross. St Johns, Seaton Hall.....Are coming for him and his old boss.

 

lancelyons

(988 posts)
71. I hope your right but remember, the FBI is mostly republican
Mon Feb 18, 2019, 06:23 PM
Feb 2019

I hope your right but remember, the FBI is mostly republican.

I could see them caving and going along with their own party.

To have all the things happen to them, to lose many of their leaders because they investigated trump and to not have Rosenstein or Wray standup and say enough is enough.

I dont trust any of them.

flying_wahini

(6,594 posts)
92. Nah, they may be Republicans but when it starts to go down they won't want to lose face.
Tue Feb 19, 2019, 10:09 AM
Feb 2019

They will protect Trump but STFU when threatened with being cast out.
At least that’s the way it works in my family.
 
73. I'm an old soldier
Mon Feb 18, 2019, 08:45 PM
Feb 2019

Thirty years in the Army, three tours in Vietnam, an old airborne infantry officer.

You talk about bonds between and among soldiers. God save the troops from A Company who bad-mouthed our company. I've cleaned out a lot of bars in Fayetteville simply because of a minor bit of disrespect. Got my head thumped a few times, too.

I've known a few FBI guys. Talk about sticking together, all for one, one for all.

After 17 years of service, a wound from Vietnam made it impossible for me to continue serving with troop units, so, I was transferred to the Army's Military Intelligence branch where I had successive assignments to operations run by the CIA. Those intelligence guys are tighter than the FBI and the Airborne. A few weeks ago, I asked an old CIA friend of mine what his contacts in the intelligence community thought of Trump's attacks on them. Had to peel him off the ceiling!!! Thought he would have a heart attack!!

Trump continues to attack the FBI and the intell community. He is fucking with the WRONG people.

Haggis for Breakfast

(6,831 posts)
75. ". . . peel him off the ceiling !!!"
Mon Feb 18, 2019, 09:46 PM
Feb 2019

I've had the privilege of knowing some of these guys. You are right on with your observation. It made me laugh out loud.

 

Laura PourMeADrink

(42,770 posts)
82. Agree except maybe for FBI NYC. They would have
Mon Feb 18, 2019, 11:47 PM
Feb 2019

leaked that Hillary still being investigated so Comey did it first. They don't like the Clintons. They were the ones who ignored Steele.

ecstatic

(32,701 posts)
93. So what's the deal with Barr? I was hoping he was
Tue Feb 19, 2019, 10:13 AM
Feb 2019

somehow conning dump into a false sense of security, but now I hear his son in law will be on dump's legal team?! Please tell me that's part 2 of an elaborate plan he cooked up with Mueller.

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