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Thu Jul 18, 2019, 10:01 AM

I'm 64 and I never expected to say THIS, but...

...Donald Trump not only makes me miss Reagan, but he makes me miss NIXON!

Reagan was, as my father referred to him, "Senile Sam.". Nixon was as corrupt a son of a bitch rat bastard as they come. Nevertheless, as awful as their policies were, I do believe that they loved and were loyal to our country. On top of that, Nixon was likely among the most intelligent men to ever hold the office.

And then we have Donald Trump, idiot and traitor.

If my father heard me saying that I miss Tricky Dickie in any way his ashes would probably be making a storm in their urn. Hell, just saying it might put me in mine...yikes!

That's my 2 cents and quite possibly overpriced at that.

RESIST!

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Arrow 37 replies Author Time Post
Reply I'm 64 and I never expected to say THIS, but... (Original post)
MarianJack Jul 18 OP
marble falls Jul 18 #1
MarianJack Jul 18 #4
MarianJack Jul 18 #5
marble falls Jul 18 #6
LiberalArkie Jul 18 #12
marble falls Jul 18 #16
yonder Jul 18 #30
RVN VET71 Jul 18 #31
hlthe2b Jul 18 #2
MarianJack Jul 18 #3
progressoid Jul 18 #7
unc70 Jul 18 #10
yaesu Jul 18 #8
keithbvadu2 Jul 18 #9
not fooled Jul 18 #11
DownriverDem Jul 18 #32
Uncle Joe Jul 18 #13
Amimnoch Jul 18 #14
keithbvadu2 Jul 18 #35
KPN Jul 18 #15
Red Pest Jul 18 #17
spanone Jul 18 #18
bdjhawk Jul 18 #19
Caliman73 Jul 18 #22
Caliman73 Jul 18 #20
NRaleighLiberal Jul 18 #21
Caliman73 Jul 18 #23
NRaleighLiberal Jul 18 #33
jalan48 Jul 18 #24
stopbush Jul 18 #26
stopbush Jul 18 #27
jalan48 Jul 18 #29
Vinca Jul 18 #25
crazytown Jul 18 #36
C_U_L8R Jul 18 #28
fescuerescue Jul 18 #34
crazytown Jul 18 #37

Response to MarianJack (Original post)

Thu Jul 18, 2019, 10:09 AM

1. Not defending Nixon but - EPA, voting rights amendment, he worked WITH ...

Teddy Kennedy towards a Universal Healthcare program, raised minimum wages, froze the banks for 30 days to prevent a run ....

Not a nice man but he did have some good sides.

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Response to marble falls (Reply #1)

Thu Jul 18, 2019, 10:12 AM

4. I agree, and

...somewhere in Hell my father is having g a s**tfit.

RESIST!

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Response to marble falls (Reply #1)

Thu Jul 18, 2019, 10:20 AM

5. One time and one time only I heard my father defend Nixon.

When he fired Wally Hickle from his cabinet for being critical of Vietnam policy I said my usual nasty things about Nixon. My father said that as president, Nixon was entitled to the support of his Cabinet Secretaries. He was, however, STILL a bastard.

RESIST!

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Response to MarianJack (Reply #5)

Thu Jul 18, 2019, 10:29 AM

6. Wally Hickle was a genial and genuinely nice person. His difference with BMN ...

was voiced in an even handed manner.

Your dad's attitude carried to an extreme he would not support, I'm sure, gives us the kind of Cabinet we're saddled with right now. They do agree with the Orange Shitgibbon.

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Response to marble falls (Reply #1)

Thu Jul 18, 2019, 11:07 AM

12. Nixon started with Quaker roots, Trump started with MOB roots.

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Response to LiberalArkie (Reply #12)

Thu Jul 18, 2019, 12:01 PM

16. Simple factual distinction between the two.

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Response to LiberalArkie (Reply #12)

Thu Jul 18, 2019, 12:50 PM

30. +1.

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Response to marble falls (Reply #1)

Thu Jul 18, 2019, 01:00 PM

31. I have to agree -- but I'm taking a shower shortly

because I'll need one after this:

Nixon guided legislative changes through Congress that improved the lot of every citizen. He was, as Marian suggests, indeed the most intelligent president of, at least, the 20th century. But he was deeply flawed, deeply paranoid, and hatefully vengeful. Still, you have to remember that it wasn't his many acts of corruption that forced him out of office. It was one stupidly conceived and clumsily carried out burglary engineered not by Nixon, himself, but by his chief fixer John Mitchell and, of course, "superman" G. Gordon Liddy.

Sadly, as I noted at the time, Tricky Dicky wasn't going down for his many, many crimes against the constitution and human decency. He went down because he engaged in a cover up to protect the moronic vipers who bugged the campaign headquarters of presidential candidate George McGovern. Had he thrown the participants under the bus, I think he would have served out his second term.

But,to be clear, I hated the bastard, hated him deeply, for his escalation of a war he and Henry Kissinger said they would end "with honor" and quickly. I hated his war on drugs, his phony promise to "defeat cancer" -- even as our new Leader has promised. His breaking into Ellsberg's psychiatrists office, sans warrant or legal reason. Shoot, his "pink lady" campaign against Helen Gahagen Douglas. But nasty son of a bitch though he was, his evil pales almost to invisibility in comparison to "Individual-1".

Nixon was a bad man, a corrupt man, a hateful man. But Nixon was not a traitor.

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Response to MarianJack (Original post)

Thu Jul 18, 2019, 10:09 AM

2. The only one who truly doesn't look much better IN COMPARISON is Cheney, IMO

Cheney is one of the most vile and truly evil individuals in any recent administration. His daughter is on track to be equally vile, though hopefully never as powerful.

Obviously, Trump has the nod for his overwhelming ignorance, but damn, I detest Cheney. Every time I think of the poor man's family whose donor heart gave Cheney many more years, I feel horrible. To me, it would be like finding out your loved one died to give Hitler life.

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Response to hlthe2b (Reply #2)

Thu Jul 18, 2019, 10:11 AM

3. I wonder if they ever want the heart back?

RESIST!

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Response to MarianJack (Original post)

Thu Jul 18, 2019, 10:31 AM

7. At least Nixon and Reagan's racism was kept behind closed doors for the most part.

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Response to progressoid (Reply #7)

Thu Jul 18, 2019, 11:00 AM

10. Reagan's racism was very evident

Reagan won election because he adopted the racist tactics that had been honed by Jesse Helms. Welfare queens and all.

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Response to MarianJack (Original post)

Thu Jul 18, 2019, 10:55 AM

8. Nixon was scum, like all repugs, and he had mental issues, like tRump & like tRump

was very vindictive. With that said he wasn't out to destroy the country like tRump, he wasn't working for russia and he helped pass some great progressive legislation. Reagan?, no thanks, he was the beginning of the destruction of america.

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Response to MarianJack (Original post)

Thu Jul 18, 2019, 10:55 AM

9. Dubya thanks God every day that he is not the stupidest President anymore.

Dubya thanks God every day that he is not the stupidest President anymore.

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Response to keithbvadu2 (Reply #9)

Thu Jul 18, 2019, 11:03 AM

11. Yeah

Never ceases to amaze me, that a mere 8 years after the worst president at the time, America installs an even worse one. I guess lying the nation into war and crashing the economy weren't sufficient to warn enough voters that the GOPee is bad for America.

I thought that after chimpy's disastrous presidency, and with the election of Obama, that there would never be another GOPee president for a generation at least.


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Response to keithbvadu2 (Reply #9)

Thu Jul 18, 2019, 01:02 PM

32. Not just dumb

trump is a DANGEROUS moron.

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Response to MarianJack (Original post)

Thu Jul 18, 2019, 11:46 AM

13. Trump is Nixon and Reagan's love child but he won't be the last,

if current dynamics aren't altered, there will be more and they will be worse.

Trump has expanded the envelope of possibility if not acceptance.

Trump is a symptom of our national dysfunction, not the disease.

Thanks for the thread MarianJack.

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Response to MarianJack (Original post)

Thu Jul 18, 2019, 11:47 AM

14. He's the "hold my beer" president of the south..

Old Jokes:
"What's the last words you'll hear from a redneck's mouth? Here, hold my beer."

It's that ridiculous mentality that whatever you can do, we can do even worse.

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Response to Amimnoch (Reply #14)

Thu Jul 18, 2019, 01:19 PM

35. "president of the south" - That's actually pretty funny.

Trump, a NY yankee, calls Sessions a 'dumb southerner' and they love him.

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Response to MarianJack (Original post)

Thu Jul 18, 2019, 11:59 AM

15. I understand the sentiment, but I just can't say the same. As far as I'm

concerned Trickie Dick and Ronnie paved the way for the ignorant autocratic asshat we have occupying the WH illegally and dismantling our Constitutional Democracy and law right now. The fat ass would never have reached 1600 Pennsylvania Avenue had they not preceeded him.

Not intended as criticism. I just can't let any R who isn't openly opposing the fat fucker off the hook at this moment including those who set the stage.

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Response to MarianJack (Original post)

Thu Jul 18, 2019, 12:05 PM

17. Comparison of Trump to Nixon is like asking which smells worse pig excrement or human excrement

Let us remember that Nixon, while a intelligent man, did come up with the "Southern Strategy", he committed treason by telling the South Vietnamese government to block the peace agreement that LBJ was negotiating to stop the war, he continued the war with >25,000 additional American soldiers KIA (& several times that wounded) with hundreds of thousands more Vietnamese killed, and he expanded the war to Cambodia. Further, by employing the Southern Strategy, Nixon pushed the Republican Party much further to the right and picked up all the segregationists that had been in the Democratic Party. This set it all up for Reagan and eventually Trump.

Yes, Nixon did sign the legislation that established the EPA, but he did that because he was a practical politician who was able to recognize that even his own party was willing to support the legislation. At that time, the Republican Party was not yet a wholly owned subsidiary of the fossil fuel (Oil, gas & coal) industry.

The big difference between Nixon & Trump is that Nixon was an actual politician, while Trump is a wanna be dictator. As such Nixon could actually win majorities in elections; Trump cannot do that. Trump can only win if we don't vote and his willing partners (Russia, are you listening?) rig the vote.

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Response to MarianJack (Original post)

Thu Jul 18, 2019, 12:06 PM

18. nixon was a petty thief, trump is a mob boss.

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Response to MarianJack (Original post)

Thu Jul 18, 2019, 12:24 PM

19. Neither Nixon nor Reagan (both of whom I detest)

Were whores who would sell our country to Russia to make a buck, unlike the money and pussy grabbing scumbag currently dumping on our country from the Oval Office today.

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Response to bdjhawk (Reply #19)

Thu Jul 18, 2019, 12:31 PM

22. Are you sure?

Nixon prolonged the Vietnam War for 5 years to win the presidency. Sabotaged peace talks that were ongoing and at least according to Johnson, going pretty well.

Reagan went behind the back of the Carter Administration and negotiated an arms for hostage deal with Iran. It was illegal to sell arms to Iran by that time (remember Iran-Contra?) but Reagan did it so that the Iranians would not release the hostages until Carter was out of office. He kept Americans in captivity for another year just to weaken his political opponent.

So, yes, you are technically correct that Nixon and Reagan wouldn't sell our country to Russia for a few bucks. They were crazy anti-communist, but they did sell out the country to other foreign powers to gain the presidency. So I will ask again.

Are you sure?

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Response to MarianJack (Original post)

Thu Jul 18, 2019, 12:26 PM

20. I understand the sentiment, but no.

Both of the men who compare favorably with Trump BOTH of them, came to power by conspiring with hostile foreign nations and committing (at least in my view) treason. Nixon sabotaged the peace talks that Johnson had going on to end the Vietnam war. Nixon, through the Chennault Affair, got the South Vietnamese to pull away from the peace talks in 1968 with the promise of a "better deal" once he was elected. 5 more years of war, how many American soldiers and Vietnamese people died because of that. Johnson got word of it, but did not go to the FBI because he though it would have torn the country apart. That haunted him to his dying day.

Reagan similarly went behind the backs of the Carter Administration and told the Iranian government not to release the hostages in the US Embassy until after the election and promised to sell the regime weapons, which was illegal as Iran was already seen as a state sponsor of terrorism. So Reagan used Americans as pawns to win the presidency and started of his administration by breaking laws against selling weapons to foreign adversaries. Some of those very weapons were likely used to bomb the Marine barracks in Beirut in 1983.

They all "loved" the US, but only their image of what the US should be and they had their idea of who "real Americans" were too. They were not loyal to the people. They were loyal to what they wanted America to be, a place for rich White conservative people.

Democrats for our flaws (and we have many), want to help the vast majority of the people, even conservatives. We want to inconvenience the powerful and wealthy, who will continue to have more than enough, for the sake of giving everybody else at least the basics of what we need to survive. That has never been in the mindset of any conservative.

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Response to MarianJack (Original post)

Thu Jul 18, 2019, 12:30 PM

21. There would be no trump w/o Nixon, and no Nixon w/o Raygun

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Response to NRaleighLiberal (Reply #21)

Thu Jul 18, 2019, 12:34 PM

23. Quibble...

No Trump without Reagan, no Reagan without Nixon.

Nixon preceded Reagan in politics if only slightly but Nixon's presidency and plans for conservatism did boost Reagan.

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Response to NRaleighLiberal (Reply #21)

Thu Jul 18, 2019, 01:09 PM

33. Ah, yes. Too much hot gardening! A worthy quibble indeed!

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Response to MarianJack (Original post)

Thu Jul 18, 2019, 12:36 PM

24. It shows how far to the right our country has drifted. Fascism didn't happen overnight.

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Response to jalan48 (Reply #24)

Thu Jul 18, 2019, 12:41 PM

26. Our country has not drifted to the far right. Most Americans like D policies.

Itís the R party that swung to the extreme right (drifting? Hardly.).

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Response to stopbush (Reply #26)

Thu Jul 18, 2019, 12:42 PM

27. Let's not forget that W said that a dictatorship in the USA might be OK

as long as he was the dictator.

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Response to stopbush (Reply #26)

Thu Jul 18, 2019, 12:46 PM

29. Dems have moved right as well. Reagan and Nixon were awful.Do you think a Republican President would

welcome the EPA today? It's just one example how we have moved to the right.

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Response to MarianJack (Original post)

Thu Jul 18, 2019, 12:37 PM

25. At least Dubya must be sort of happy about Trump. Until the Orange Fuhrer came along

GWB was hands down the worst POTUS of the United States ever. Trump makes him look like a hybrid of Mother Theresa and Albert Einstein.

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Response to Vinca (Reply #25)

Thu Jul 18, 2019, 02:43 PM

36. Trump has not murdered millions ... yet.

Dubya would have pushed the button on Iran without a word from Bolton, one way or the other.

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Response to MarianJack (Original post)

Thu Jul 18, 2019, 12:43 PM

28. I can't think of a worse President

So much winning. Ugh.

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Response to MarianJack (Original post)

Thu Jul 18, 2019, 01:14 PM

34. And the next Republican will be even worse than Trump

I guarantee that some folks on this very forum in about 8 or 12 years will be talking about how much worse that current Republican is and how they miss Trump, Bush or Nixon.

It's just the nature of the beast. Republicans always get worse than the previous one. (fortunately Democrats always get better)

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Response to fescuerescue (Reply #34)

Thu Jul 18, 2019, 02:46 PM

37. The Veeps (Ford, GHWB, were not worse)

and in Fords case, better than the Dick.

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