General Discussion
Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsSomeone took photos of Taylor's opening statement. PDF link (WaPo)
https://games-cdn.washingtonpost.com/notes/prod/default/documents/542ee36f-eafc-4f2b-a075-b3b492d981a5/note/75965f57-6561-42f8-af40-a9e984a85660.pdfA friend texted me that CNN had received a copy of the opening statement, and then my sister texted me a WaPo link, Opening statement of Ambassador William B. Taylor, that is just jpg images captured on a cell phone (no accompanying story). The link above is a pdf that WaPo created from the jpg images.
Wow!
California_Republic
(1,826 posts)Pacifist Patriot
(24,653 posts)Wondering if I need to steel myself with a glass of wine first.
lunatica
(53,410 posts)End of argument.
Pacifist Patriot
(24,653 posts)mcar
(42,334 posts)FakeNoose
(32,641 posts)I just came home with both bottles unopened.
VOX
(22,976 posts)Terrific photo!
lunatica
(53,410 posts)FakeNoose
(32,641 posts)... that I found on Twitter. That's not me, by the way.
lunatica
(53,410 posts)LOL! My question was a rhetorical one, but it would be a great gag gift!
Texin
(2,596 posts)asiliveandbreathe
(8,203 posts)Bed Bath and Beyond for one...many when I google...
Godinger Chugmate Wine Glass Topper
lunatica
(53,410 posts)Pacifist Patriot
(24,653 posts)I've never used it, but boy has it been tempting for the last year!
TeamPooka
(24,228 posts)lettucebe
(2,336 posts)Sondland is a liar, Pompeo is a liar, everyone involved knew what was going on was a clear quid pro quo.
He said there were two channels, the regular channel and the irregular channel. This is not how US policy is supposed to work.
The ones named as involved in the irregular channel were: then-Special Envoy Kurt Volker, Ambassador Sondland, Secretary of Energy Rick Perry, and Mr. Giuliani.
They should all be wetting their pants at this point
VOX
(22,976 posts)I'm kind of rushed today, so your thumbnail sketch was very helpful. Seriously!
kairos12
(12,862 posts)dixiegrrrrl
(60,010 posts)This marvelous age of information and music-tv etc at one's fingertips is a double edged sword.
I've learned that "saving to read later 'cause I am too busy with other things to read" does not actually work well,
because the "other things" become the new "I am too busy reading" them, so must save new stuff to read later.....etc etc etc
lunatica
(53,410 posts)Everything, especially news has a shelf life of about a second or so.
orangecrush
(19,570 posts)tclambert
(11,087 posts)Guilty! Guilty! Guilty!
mgardener
(1,816 posts)Worth the time.
3Hotdogs
(12,388 posts)NurseJackie
(42,862 posts)Also amazing that someone was able to photograph it so clearly! Even the parts in shadow are clearly legible.
Blue_playwright
(1,568 posts)🤣🤣🤣
IcyPeas
(21,884 posts)Skittles
(153,164 posts)no INDEED
FrankBooth
(1,603 posts)So basically Trump is going to say "I said explicitly that there is no Quid Pro Quo." And of course that's utter nonsense, like a murderer pulling the trigger and telling his victim, "I'm not shooting you right now." These people are corrupt, disgusting assholes.
wcast
(595 posts)I hope this shakes support loose from those with the power to make this right while punishing those who clearly had I'll intent.
The Velveteen Ocelot
(115,719 posts)cynatnite
(31,011 posts)They can scream "no quid pro quo" all they want. This is clear cut.
cally
(21,594 posts)Mike Nelson
(9,958 posts)... it was a nice opening statement. Hopefully, this means Rudy is going down, too.
FirstLight
(13,360 posts)Nail every one of them to the wall!
sheshe2
(83,785 posts)I am only half way through it.
CNN is on it now, they have a copy and are reading parts of it.
Hekate
(90,708 posts)ETA: Gratitude to our Career Diplomats, Career Civil Servants, and all those who see the nobility of Public Service!!
Pacifist Patriot
(24,653 posts)lagomorph777
(30,613 posts)Pacifist Patriot
(24,653 posts)This may do it.
lagomorph777
(30,613 posts)yonder
(9,666 posts)This stood out for me, to paraphrase: "Sondland's explanation to Taylor that 'Trump is a businessman' and that when a businessman signs a check, they expect to be paid up" is the very definition of quid pro quo.
Also, it sounds exactly how tRump might have explained to Sondland his reasons for doing this -- second hand trumpspeak.
Quid pro quo, baby.
grantcart
(53,061 posts)A great statement.
Exactly what Lindsay Graham said he needed to vote for removal.
For the first time I believe he will be impeached and removed.
B Stieg
(2,410 posts)You said it, brother!
Bayard
(22,075 posts)Its mostly confirming what we already know--that tRump and Giuliani pressured Zelensky to start these, "investigations", and he had to announce it on U.S. television. They were to cover the Bidens, and that Ukraine interfered in the 2016 election. If he wanted security funding.
The statement is extremely detailed about the time line, and the parties involved.
Flo Mingo
(492 posts)clutching pearls and looking frantically for the fainting couch.
hlthe2b
(102,283 posts)and total lack of regard for his oath of office, not to mention his lack of fidelity for the one he took in the military.
Traildogbob
(8,746 posts)Lesli Graham is a sad liddle' bitch. Trump's Liddle' bitch.
infullview
(981 posts)The PDF looks a bit like it was shot with a Minox spy camera, but it's readable.
hlthe2b
(102,283 posts)I put nothing past the denial of Republicans, but really, this has to move at least some of them.
to Ambassador Taylor
lagomorph777
(30,613 posts)I hope though, that it doesn't mess up the operation of the Committee. I have to wonder what was the motive of the person who did it.
Raftergirl
(1,287 posts)than a smoking gun. Its a bonfire.
Leghorn21
(13,524 posts)3. Giuliani has been silent for almost a week:
https://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=12609326
all for now, lying idiot traitors...
IronLionZion
(45,447 posts)and it is totally awesome!
bucolic_frolic
(43,173 posts)This is a pretty big thing that doesn't happen randomly
FM123
(10,053 posts)that told Taylor to send a "first person cable" to Pompeo to explain what was going on, just the way he told Fiona Hill to notify the chief lawyer what was going on. They need to get Bolton up there to speak.
Midnightwalk
(3,131 posts)What communication methods did the ukraine back channel use? Volker, Sondham had a 3 way chat with Taylor on whatsapp?!?
I guess it isnt email so not worth investigating?
What other unsecured methods were used? Can we subpoena whatsapp logs?
What is Barr doing involved in foreign affairs? Not DOJ business but trumps personal business. He needs to be impeached and disbarred.
Zelensky clearly understood what was going on and said he didnt want to be a pawn in us elections.
Sondland delivered the quid quo pro attempt. Investigate in exchange for a meeting. The extortion, the withholding of military aid, was done earlier. Im not a lawyer but l guess that extortion is different than a quid pro quo. Trump did both. Sondland made an illegal request.
Does trump know what a quid pro quo is other than it is illegal? He says it wasnt but has his minions trading a meeting for investigations.
For the lawyers among us, is withholding military aid extortion or a quid quo pro? Is extortion a form of quid quo pro?
iwillalwayswonderwhy
(2,602 posts)So specific.
Penthor-Mul
(1 post)...that seeking political help from a foreign state was impeachable. Also said that if such evidence from somewhere other than "the call" would be enough for him. Let's see where he stands now.
FreeState
(10,572 posts)gopiscrap
(23,761 posts)Jim__
(14,077 posts)Johnny2X2X
(19,066 posts)Trump is a businessman. This is how he conducts all business. Theyre going to find out that every single interaction Trump and his cabal has with foreign leaders was an attempt to extort them for Trumps personal gain.
albacore
(2,399 posts)OKNancy
(41,832 posts)ON edit, I just copied his tweets past the first one
Link to tweet
2/ Amb. Taylor says (p3) he met with Pompeo on May 28 when he was asked to become acting Ambassador after Yovanovich was sacked, and made clear that he understood why she was sacked, and that he wasn't going to come in unless Pompeo could assure Giuliani would have no role.
3/ Taylor says (p. 4) that upon arriving in Kiev he found two policy making channels, "one regular," ie the normal embassy chain of command, and one highly irregular" consisting of Volker, Sondland, Perry and Giuliani, a "shadow" policy group making its own decisions.
Brad Simpson
@bradleyrsimpson
·
40m
4/ Taylor realizes by June (p. 5) that this second, irregular channel is underminin existing US policy around the conditions of a Zelensky visit. Notes with alarm that Sondland "Did not want to include most of the regular interagency participants" in a 6/28 call planned with Z.
5/ Taylor is now alarmed, as any good bureaucrat would be. Sondland (p. 5) says wants to make sure "no one is transcribing or monitoring" the June 28 call with Zelensnky. Volker says he will meet Z next day and "planned to be explicit" about Trump's conditions for a WH visit.
6/ Taylor says the irregular policy channel is now in charge, with Giuliani - who has no policymaking authority and no clearance - running things. For an Ambassador, this must have been setting off multiple alarms. By mid-July, Taylor himself is being excluded from meetings.
Brad Simpson
@bradleyrsimpson
·
7/ On July 18, Taylor learns OMB has suspended security assistance at direction of President Trump. Embassy Taylor has *meticulously* documented every exchange. This is both bc of training and because he is alarmed and making sure he leaves a paper trail.
Brad Simpson
@bradleyrsimpson
·
8/ Taylor says irregular policy channel "running contrary to long standing goals of US policy." Taylor notes that at multiple meetings all cabinet level secretaries support releasing military aid. It is being held up solely bc of Trump. There are records of all these meetings.
9/ Talor gets readout of July 10 meeting with Sondland and Ukranian officials at WH in which Sondland pressed for Ukrainian investigations, which so outraged Bolton he called it a "drug deal" and told NSC official Fiona Hill to contact WH lawyers.
Brad Simpson
10/ The tell here is Taylor's description of Ukrainian officials confusion in the July 10 meeting. They are essentially being told about two contradictory US policies. Ukrainian officials later say Zelensky "Does not want to be used as a pawn in a US re-lection campaign."
11/ This is the damning part: the Acting US Ambassador to the Ukraine does not receive a full read out of the July 25 Trump-Zelensky call, only a "cryptic summary." Just crazy. the White House won't tell an Ambassador to the Ukraine about a call with the Ukrainian Pres.
Brad Simpson
@bradleyrsimpson
·
12/ Taylor doesn't see an official read out of the call til its publicly released on September 25. Let's repeat. The US Amb to Ukraine has to wait two months to find out contents of a call between Trump and the Ukrainian President. This is extraordinary and without precedent.
13/ Taylor (p. 10) relays to Bolton his concern about Trump withholding aid to Ukraine and writes Pompeo a letter. Congress will get this letter, you can be certain. Pompeo uses this letter in WH meeting on Ukraine aid. Taylor kept receipts, made copies, left a paper trail.
Brad Simpson
@bradleyrsimpson
·
14/ Taylor learns during Pence's Warsaw visit that Sondland told his Ukrainian counterpart that US security assistance would not be released until Zelensky agreed to an investigation of Burisma. NSC aid Tim Morrison says Trump insisted that Zelensky "go a microphone" and say...
15/ That Zelensky is opening an investigation into Biden and the 2016 election. Sondland Sept 9 says Trump insistent that Zelensky had to "clear things up and do it in public." Note that Ukrainians still getting conflicting policy signals from two opposing currents.
Brad Simpson
16/ On September 11, aid is released, after this blows up. So what can we learn, from the perspective of a historian of US foreign policy? First, the friction between the 'regular' and 'irregular' policy tracks leaves a thick documentary trail that Congress can track down.
17/ Taylor notes at how US policymakers who are frozen out of the regular policy loop, as well as Ukrainians, are confused because of conversations in the Giuliani led track. In bureaucratic terms this is damning. High level policymakers frozen out of their own policy tracks.
18/ Taylor also notes how many people are aware that a highly irregular policy group is running things, that they are undermining established US policy, that they are making corrupt domestic political demands, and - crucially - that they are trying to cover their tracks.
Brad Simpson
@bradleyrsimpson
·
19/ This is as damning as it gets, and Taylor recorded everything, as a good bureaucrat does. I don't see any possible wriggle room for Trump defenders here. This is a highly persuasive, exhaustively documented account of abuse of power from an unimpeachably credible source.
20/ If I were reading this years later, as a historian poring through the archives, this would read like a textbook conspiracy to undermine existing US policy in the service of a covert domestic political agenda, undertaken on a shadow policy track. Wow. Wow. Wow. END
Pacifist Patriot
(24,653 posts)OKNancy
(41,832 posts)his tweets.
Leghorn21
(13,524 posts)Good show!!
Your efforts are much appreciated!!
tinrobot
(10,903 posts)Really needs to be seen.
OKNancy
(41,832 posts)dixiegrrrrl
(60,010 posts)Most excellent indeed.
LiberalFighter
(50,942 posts)stuffmatters
(2,574 posts)Boy, Zelensky sure was Trump's hostage in that painful Zelensky "no push" /Trump: "no pressure!" show video.
Karma13612
(4,552 posts)Yea, I WONDERED if it was a cellphone image capture.
Wow indeed.
I think a lot of people are going to be really upset about this!
usaf-vet
(6,186 posts)... facing Russian troops within eyesight across a bridge and having not enough defensive weapons.
Again Trump doesn't care about anyone or anything unless it involves HIS wants and needs. The explanation that Trump is a businessman and won't give up what he promised until he gets what he thinks he is owed is outrageous.
Obviously, it proves to me that being a businessman is not an adequate experience to be a world leader. The man lacks any human compassion for others and would as the saying goes would deny even his own mother comfort and security if he thought she owed him something of value first.
I hope he, Rudy and others face severe consequences for this injustice.
jcgoldie
(11,631 posts)Bahh you just gotta let em fight it out like kids then yank em apart once in awhile...
sinkingfeeling
(51,457 posts)Jarqui
(10,126 posts)That is a very damning, thorough and comprehensive statement supported by the documents, transcripts, texts and previous testimony already in evidence.
triron
(22,006 posts)I think Pence will be caught up just not sure if he is guilty of a crime.
RainCaster
(10,880 posts)High crimes and misdemeanors are not always criminal offenses.
triron
(22,006 posts)RainCaster
(10,880 posts)I cannot see how any one in the GOP can support this crook.
It took me about 30 minutes and two glasses of Cab to read this. Everyone should. I am only left with questions :
1. Why is Giuliani not in prison?
2. Why is Rick Perry not in prison?
3. Why is Pompeo not in prison?