I am at my dads house - he does NOT believe in the Coronavirus.

[alittlelark]

He is telling me that he is 81 and that he lived to be this old because He Knows what is dangerous. He believes the coronavirus is a small joke.


This is a man with 3 PhDs - he headed the Star Wars project at Sandia Labs. He seems to believe that MD's are not REAL Scientists.........


He just yelled at me telling me I was listening to conspiracy theories........................................................................................................................................................................................................................................


I am at a loss at want to flee to the backyard and cry.

He does NOT watch Faux News.

[AlexSFCA]

1. lots of people are like that

in fact 3 weeks ago I was just like that too. But things have developed rapidly. A month ago I was ridiculing my spouse for stocking on masks, sanitizers, etc. And I am the one who is more concerned now to a paranoid level.

[gldstwmn]

31. Someone went out and bought all

the toilet paper this weekend so I think some folks are more concerned then they want to let on.

[SnowCritter]

66. I'll be headed out to get toilet paper this weekend

It won't be a special trip, we should be down to our last roll or two by then and we'll need it. It'll be a "regularly scheduled" Costco run.

[stopbush]

76. If Costco has TP. My Costco has been out for days.

[Dorian Gray]

48. My husband was mocking me for my Zicam/Emergen-C routine

He is right on board with the hand sanitizer/clorox wipes, though.

Cautious is important. But, doing that little bit extra to stay healthy for my family too.

I know there is no guarantee, but if the vitamins up my chance by1% for not getting sick, I'll take it.

[alittlelark]

2. I got him to turn on the TV to CNN

He is watching and laughing bout how these ppl are so uninformed. I am at a loss.

[renate]

11. He sounds exceptionally intelligent

He’s probably used to genuinely knowing more than just about anyone else in the room. If he’s just looking at the math (comparing coronavirus incidence to the flu’s, and focusing on the way that most cases will be asymptomatic or mild), I can see why he’d think he knows more than the reporters on CNN. He may not know enough about epidemiology to recognize what he doesn’t know about it.

I’m sorry. It must be so frustrating to see this behavior in someone who really should know better. I think he’s right in thinking that meltdown panic isn’t merited, but concern and caution certainly are.

[OhNo-Really]

73. You can do your best to keep him safe

I’d be frustrated too!

[certainot]

85. limbaugh has been calling it a hoax, overblown, another liberal scam. ask him

an obtuse question to ascertain if he knows/listens to limbaugh

or find the radio and see what station it's on

it's not fox, not money in politics, not the corporate media - they are all symptoms of ignoring talk radio

[elleng]

3. ;-(

[Doodley]

4. I am sorry. Does he have dementia?

[alittlelark]

12. I believe he is in early stages

He would never allow himself to be tested.

[Doodley]

36. He's an old man, probably with dementia. What is there to gain by

trying to convince him of something he refuses to believe? Why worry him and cause him anxiety? Just accept that in some ways he is detached from reality.

[alittlelark]

40. Cuz I don't want him dying from this virus.

[jberryhill]

57. Whether he believes it or not does not affect his chances

[handmade34]

78. the best way to protect him

is to take care of yourself probably doesn't make sense to be angry with him or try to convince him of what you believe

my dad, before he died, would probably have said/thought the same thing... just try to love him and take care of yourself

[Doodley]

84. Very good advice, I am sorry about your father.

[Butterflylady]

79. Having lived 81 years, he feels that he knows what's best for him.

The most you can do is to for him is to keep an eye on him and be there for him, which I'm sure you do regularly. Sometimes we need help we just don't want to admit it.

[Doodley]

83. What do you want him to do that he isn't? Is he independently living, going out and mixing

with other people? Or is he in a more controlled environment? If it is the former, then you might warn him about flu (something he does believe in) and taking precautions. If he has carers, then that is an easier situation, as others can help to protect him.

[Hoyt]

5. I am hopeful this will be another event that turns out not to be as bad as

many people think. But, for that to happen, we have to take precautionary steps and be ready for the worst case.

Point is, your dad has probably decided the odds are that he and the vast majority of people will survive. That seems true. Now, if he doesn’t give a damn about those who will suffer, that’s different. I don’t hear that.

[CountAllVotes]

6. My husband is 83

He does not seem very concerned at all.

He thinks he's seen it all in life.

Maybe he has.

However, I have not and do not pretend to.

I was there when AIDS appeared in San Francisco in 1979 and I sure remember the way that situation was handled!

Many died before anyone was able to discover what was going on.

It was too late ... 80% of the gay men in S.F. were seropositive by the time it gathered the attention and precautions that were necessary to contain it.

Hang-in there!!

[Kittycow]

33. I've watched a few AIDS documentaries lately..

A super good one about SF in the 70s is We Were Here. Equally good is Quiet Heros about the first AIDS Dr and her assistant in Salt Lake City starting in the 80s.

Anyway, it's kind of in the back of my mind to sort of compare the two epidemics, although I haven't reached hair on fire yet. (Not implying you have.)

My own outlook for myself is sort of fatalistic. I've had a decent enough run here on Earth and the years are ticking to a close anyway.

[CountAllVotes]

46. Understand

I am tired of life.

I live in severe chronic pain due to MS.

My life revolves around trying to get the medications I require to function and I am constantly drug tested to see if I am selling the medications I get.

It is a life filled with humiliations. Its gotten so bad that some people are not allowed to close the bathroom door when they go to collect a sample of urine to be tested. I've heard of other instances where people are watched while they piss in a cup.

Everything I do is a painful effort.

Right now I have some sort of a mysterious rash that has appeared on my hand and wrist that appears to be spreading. What it is it? Another MS joke or what? I don't know what it is and I am afraid to go to the health clinic out of fear of being exposed to the coronavirus.

So, yes, I hear you as I'm sick and tired of being sick and tired!

If it weren't for my beloved cats I think I would have given up by now and I'm too old to hope for a viable treatment or cure for this disease which has ruled my life since the mid-80s or longer which is more than half of my life. What a waste!

[Kittycow]

62. As a chronic pain patient myself...

Maybe you could call a dial-a- nurse for your rash?

[moonscape]

69. Very sorry you are going through this, and the

constant toll it is taking on you

[CountAllVotes]

71. I'm beginning to wonder if this rash is stress related

I've had various skin reactions to stress in the past.

After the Loma Prieta earthquake in San Francisco I broke out with red spots all over me.

I went to the ER and they gave me some cream to rub on some of it.

The next day it was much worse and I went back again.

They shot me up with something, what I cannot remember, but the red spots went away luckily.

It was scary as they we asking me if I'd ever had the measles. I told them I had them as a child.

I never know what to expect from this shit disease.

Best to get ready to piss in a cup and go if it worsens I guess!

I put some lotion on it last night and it is no better today as it creeps up my arm!

[samnsara]

59. and reagan not believing that AIDS was dangerous

[CountAllVotes]

67. Right!

And once his buddy Rock died, it changed!

Oh how it changed!

It had spread all over the world by that time as as for "Patient Zero" that is a crock of lies!

I knew someone that died in 1979 because of it but they did not have the name AIDS for it yet!

[renate]

7. I read an article about coronavirus on Medscape this morning

There were a LOT of MDs in the comments saying it was all overblown. I was pretty shocked that things were being said, by highly educated people, that were like on any message board anywhere else. One accused another commenter of having Trump Derangement Syndrome (he was a plastic surgeon, so it’s not as though he’s an expert in respiratory or infectious disease).

It seems weird to have opinions about a factual event like a pandemic, but here we are.

[alittlelark]

15. I think they 'say' things to make themselves feel safe...........

If they keep repeating it it must be true

[Strelnikov_]

23. Are you sure they are MD's

Because if true, more than disturbing.

Yea, it's not Capt. Trips, but anyone in the med profession, with one look at the %critical cases, should understand the possibility of overwhelming the medical system in this country.

[renate]

39. Good point, but I'm almost entirely sure

Medscape has articles that are available to the lay public through Google searches, and then there are articles that you can only access if you have an account. The registration process is a bit time-consuming as I recall, or at least it was several years ago, but I don’t think they ask for your license number or anything like that, so yeah, it’s possible to claim to be an MD without being one. But you could also be any kind of health professional, so there’s no particular reason to claim to be an MD when you could be an NP or RN or.... Most articles are 100% dry and medical and aren’t politically sensitive, so people wouldn’t register just to cause trouble.

So I’m pretty sure these were MDs, but not positive.

[marybourg]

43. As though you have to be deranged

to despise tRump.

[Baitball Blogger]

8. A few days ago I got text blocked by one of my children.

I had only sent her two updates on the coronavirus. Just two. Her parting words, "It's just a virus."

So, yes, we need help out here to get everyone to understand how important this is.

Second anecdote: I'm going to a memorial service for a family member of a close friend. I was concerned about the mother, who is a centenarian, and asked if we should pare down the hugs and kisses in order to protect her from exposure. My friend said that her mother would want the hugs and kisses, but would let me know if something changes.

I don't feel right about this. It will be a big service.

[Dorian Gray]

50. Re: your daughter

My mother in law has been sending us daily texts about the coronavirus.

They create anxiety in both my husband and myself.

We are aware. We are taking precautions. We have a child. We have offered her and my father in law help if they get sick.

But the daily texts are a drumbeat that really make us more anxious.

My husband asked her last night to stop sending them to me.

She may have been wanting simply to share information, but to me it felt more of a "look how bad this is! You need to know!" (I do know. I'm keeping on top of the news and the home preparation.)

(The anxiety regarding personal parent/child relationships is real, and many relationships have unspoken communication patterns. So, it's possible that your communications were being read as something you didn't intend.) Speak to your child on the phone, ask, and accept their reasoning even if it sounds strange. We are all handling this the best way we know how.

[chia]

54. Wise words.

[Baitball Blogger]

64. My situation is entirely different.

I didn't send daily tweets. I sent them a week apart. I also know that one child is tapped into the news because he's on the internet all the time. The other one, the one that blocked me, doesn't watch news at all and brushes off concerns that would alarm most people. And I think she does it because thinks she's being tough. I also know that by the time she gives me a call for help, it will already be too late. There won't be any supplies for her to buy and she lives too far for an easy drive to reach her. Besides, if we're dealing with a quarantine in my own house, then I won't be able to reach her at all.

I know my child and would never tweet on a daily basis because they are busy. So I haven't stressed that line of avenue. I also know about anxiety. Her text was not about anxiety. In fact, it was quite the opposite. It was annoyance and, yes, she works in an industry where she might think she knows better than what she's hearing around her.

Until everyone in the health industry comes together in agreement over this, the mixed messages will continue to provide that kind of reaction.

[Dorian Gray]

75. It's tough

when our children don't listen to us. Your daughter is an adult. You're going to have to trust her to make decisions that she thinks are right for her kids.

Many people show bravado in the face of things that frighten most of us. It's possible she is quietly preparing and doesn't want to hear reminders about it from anybody outside of her immediate home.

I hope she stays healthy. And I hope you do too. Take care of yourself and your immediate household. Luckily younger, healthier people are weathering this quite well. So as long as she gets some food/supplies, she'll be fine. Best of luck!

[Baitball Blogger]

77. Thank you.

At least I know I tried.

[DonaldsRump]

9. Show your dad this from Johns Hopkins

While he may have 3 PhDs, it doesn't sound like he is an MD.

https://www.arcgis.com/apps/opsdashboard/index.html#/bda7594740fd40299423467b48e9ecf6

[marlakay]

10. I told my democrat 93 yr old mom

To stay in her senior apt building and to try not to go out except to doctor. She said, but we go out to lunch twice a week and they take us to the casino!

At this point I am thinking she has had a long life and I should let her live the rest of it her way. I know it would kill her at this age but I guess she doesn’t want to sit at home.

She lives where they serve meals in dining room and have bingo and happy hour once a week so she would still be social at home but she misses going out. We just took car from her 1 1/2 yrs ago.

[3Hotdogs]

18. Casinos are interesting labs/petrie dishes.

You're sitting next to people at the table or at a row of slot machines. You touch the buttons or handle the chips.

[marlakay]

65. I know I absolutely hate that she

Goes there have for years but not from germs but wasting money. She didn’t lose a lot but I know she did some and she always struggled financially.

[No Vested Interest]

72. Likely the community where she is living will curtail trips outside, and will do

what they consider necessary to ward off infection in the building.
The other residents may not want to go out to lunch, and, if they do, let it be, unless your whole community is quarantined.
She will likely be fine.

[lpbk2713]

13. Good luck Dad.

You're gonna need it.

[greenjar_01]

14. My father said the same

He's 78 with limited lung function.

Love him, but he's what we would call in Italian un vecchio scemo, an old fool.

[Maraya1969]

16. a physician relative told me recently that Big Foot was an alien. She learned it from

these courses taught by some former military guy that does "Remote Viewing"

I don't know how much she pays for this crap but she has taken at least more than one course.

He also said something about a civilization under the ocean? Or in a fucking tree? I don't know but when she talks like that she is completely nuts.

And people go to her to be treated for physical illnesses.

[defacto7]

17. Sounds like the old Art Bell crowd.

[chia]

55. I know someone who's a long, long-time Coast to Coast listener. He's a successful engineer.

I just don't get it, the cognitive dissonance does me in. He's intelligent, educated, a stable family man, professional leader - and he believes in stuff that's beyond bizarre. Last I knew, he was a Trumper. I don't know if anything's changed, I make sure we don't talk politics.

[gldstwmn]

32. I saw a Mariachi band in a tree once

but I was on drugs.

[Quixote1818]

19. Does he still live in Albuquerque? I would let him continue not believing. He will be happier

and less stressed. You probably won't be able to change his mind anyways.

[alittlelark]

25. We r in the house I grew up in.

I think NM has not yet been infected due to the anti-viral properties of Green Chile !!!!!

[wackadoo wabbit]

28. Green chile can cure anything! (n/t)

[eleny]

35. I just made a big pot of it the other day!

We like it in a bowl like soup with a tortilla on the side. Medicine never tasted so good when I was a kid.

I wish I had some sage advice for you regarding your dad. There's an old saying that goes, good people can make bad decisions. It helped me a lot when my parents were in their advanced years. So if you need to go out in the backyard for a cry then do it. A good cry is like a safety valve. And today is a good day for you to take care of yourself.

~Hi from up here in Colorado where I'm wishing the best for New Mexico.~

[Goodheart]

20. Here's the deal... intelligent or not, NOBODY is an expert on EVERYTHING.

He's wrong. Ask Italy.

[alittlelark]

29. I know that - but he knows he is right about EVERYTHJING

...... let's not go into psychoanalytics.

[Duppers]

51. Can I ever empathize there.

See my post below.

[eilen]

68. That is his personality. He is dug in. No point in arguing with him.

At his age, well, enjoy him while you can and discuss other topics that don't cause aggravation.

My father was very stubborn.

If it is any consolation, most people think they are the exception. They are the ones who will pull through any medical procedure without complication. They also think they have better/special knowledge about medications despite warnings or benefits.

[uponit7771]

21. 10% of the human race has been quarantined, anyone intimating this is no big deal is in denial now

[grantcart]

22. Tell him if he says it one more time he gets shipped to the Life Care Center in Kirkland WA.

Explain that the Nursing home has 14 beds that have suddenly opened up and they are giving big discounts.

[dawg day]

27. So true..

That place must be the saddest place in the country.

[GulfCoast66]

24. I sincerely hope he is correct and it is nothing. But the entire nation of Italy would disagree.

I’ve read about the 1918 flu. Imagining that in the age of Trump and social media scares me more than the virus. If it gets bad they will have to find a scapegoat. They always do.

And it looks like they are deciding on China. I am fearful for our Asian America brothers and sisters. Frightened racist can get dangerous quickly.

[Newest Reality]

80. Have you looked at Iran?

It seems to be getting much worse there now from what the tracking sites show.

[GulfCoast66]

81. Oh yeah. But I am using Italy as a benchmark

While overall a better health care system than ours I think they are a better predictor of what might be coming. And because we have a health care industry not system, Italy is way ahead of us in testing.

[Newest Reality]

82. I see.

Those are good criteria. Thanks.

[dawg day]

26. Tell him about all the scoffers

Who today went into quarantine.

[gldstwmn]

30. My son in law is flying to Seattle

next week to attend an XFL game. I know how you feel. I am still scheduled to fly to California in two weeks for work but do not want to go.

[John Fante]

34. Don't like reality? Create your own!

That's the mentality of certain types, and this phenomenon isn't exclusive to the dullards of society, as your father shows.

We live in a post-facts America, and it stinks. I'm so tired of it.

Ask your father if it's a common for an industrialized nation like Italy to completely shut down over a "small joke". If love to hear his rationale for that one.

[procon]

38. Denial is a method of self preservation.

Fear is at the heart of the denial. Facing a deadly scourge that seems to target seniors, knowing there is no known treatment and no way to predict where it will pop up next, that's a daunting scenario.

[KT2000]

41. you can tell him to believe what he wants

but he must not put others at risk so he should monitor his own health carefully.

[Kablooie]

42. My wife doesn't take it seriously either.

People can't imagine anything seriously disrupting life here.
They assume it's all hype and everything will continue like always.

I hope they are right.

[Hortensis]

44. Well, he's right in this in that for most it'll just be a cold.

Even if he is more susceptible, he's not completely divorced from reality if behind this "don't believe" thing he's actually taking a big view and declining to be afraid for himself and the very elderly risk group he falls in.

Reminds me of a woman who refused to leave the mobile home she'd retired to in Florida when Hurricane Irma was bearing down. Apparently she's at the stage where her big fear is of having to go to a nursing home. Like you, her daughters, one of them a friend of our daughter, got to be terrified for her. Probably that time again for them too.

Alittlelark, maybe take a cue from your dad if you can and stay cool. He'll probably survive it if he gets it, and eventually there'll be a vaccine.

[Warpy]

45. Tell him to stick to his own field

That should get you written out of the will.

I remember Reagan's pipe dream as being far less successful than the movies., but don't rub that kind of salt in the wound.

Just let him know that you're online in a group or groups were current and former medical professionals are well represented and that he needs to take this seriously. He's not immune, nobody is, and that's the problem.

In my experience, whistling past a graveyard just lets any lurking thieves know whee you are.

This is real.

[Meowmee]

47. So sorry

That must be sooo stressful

[Duppers]

49. Early onset dementia perhaps?

He's not reading enough sources?


He'll eventually come around to acknowledging the truth in a few months. Just hope he'll extend that mea culpa he owes you.
But if he's like the 2 very obstinate PhD physicists I deal with in my immediate family, I kinda doubt you'll get an apology. I know how tough it can be plowing through their stubbornly held but wrong assumptions on subjects outside their fields of knowledge. My condolences.

[KentuckyWoman]

53. It doesn't matter

I'm about your Dad's age and have an aunt still living. She's pushing 100 but is still of generally right mind. She is also of the opinion "this Corona thing" is just to scare people. We all just play along - it isn't worth the contention. In the meantime we just do what we can to be sure she'll be as safe as we can make her. Then take it as it comes.

Love your Dad. Whether the end is thanks to Corona or 25 years from now when he's blown past 100 -- your relationship will be all that mattered.

My humble 2 cents.

[no_hypocrisy]

56. At the end of his life, my Dad was like that too.

AND he was a physician (cardiology/internal medicine).

HE would have said the exact same thing, that he wouldn't have believed that COVID-19 exists. He could have died from it, insisting it was a hoax.

He did watch FOX-News.

[samnsara]

58. my uncle is the same way...ugh...these old farts. Just wear a mask around your dad..

[mnhtnbb]

60. I came home early from a birthday trip

and found this email from UNC Health about coronavirus.

Tell him a real scientist keeps an open mind while data is coming in, and the data about coronavirus is still pouring in because it is novel.

https://e.unchealthcare.org/acton/rif/16477/s-00e5-2003/-/l-00ab:3e8a2/l-00ab/showPreparedMessage?sid=TV2:ObbR8SL5L

If he wants to ignore data, that's his choice, but he raised you to believe in science, so you're going with your head on this and keeping an open mind and paying attention to the data.

You might see if you can interest him in following the data that Johns Hopkins is mapping.

https://gisanddata.maps.arcgis.com/apps/opsdashboard/index.html#/bda7594740fd40299423467b48e9ecf6

[Chainfire]

61. It is said that faith moves mountains

I don't know if faith stops viruses, I guess we will find out.

[Locrian]

63. PhDs ....

So it's natural that he believes in the "system" working and will prevail - since it's worked *really* well for him
Science works, the system works, etc.
At the same time he's notices and seen how everything is 'hyped up' for sensational effect etc... that the media etc has cried wolf. So he has direct experience on not to "trust" those sources. The scientific process: evaluate and review data.

Problem is that this is not standard operating procedure.
It's a "outside the box" event and people are just not experienced with it.

[ismnotwasm]

70. Well it's real

Corona virus are part of the kind of virus that can give you a cold. People who are susceptible to colds probably have had a form of it.

A new virus and one we are not sure of, is more concerning.

So according to your Dad, if he ends up in a local hospital, that hospital should take no special precautions, no screening, no testing for it, just keep people on respiratory isolation until they get better?

That’s not how we treat ANY respiratory infection. We test so we can treat appropriately. When you are sick with a respiratory virus, you are prone to secondary bacterial infection.

Does he believe in MRSA, or VRE, or MDRO’s? Or does he believe these are special, because, you know, science.

I do believe we are seeing a lot of hysteria because the initial management was bungled so badly, but yes, the corona virus is real, and your Dad is being pretty stupid for a smart guy.

[lambchopp59]

74. Offering a virtual hug

I lost my dad to the RW-crazy-sphere a few years back. It was a tremendously painful and expensive process to get him committed to a lock-down facility that accepted his VA benefits, only after he pulled a gun on his caregiver and was physically abusing my mother.
Largely, I blame Fox News however for his sharp decline into dementia that alienated everyone, language that became peppered with hateful "you G-D liberal takers" to all his children, despite that most of his retirement was largely funded by his hard-working offspring and many other Fox Noise "talking points" regardless how invalid.
It took all the mettle I could muster to maintain relative equanimity and not to argue with him. He had to be "tricked" into the nursing home that fateful day under the guise of taking them out to a new restaurant with other visiting family and the local Sheriff's representative there. I'd do it all over again to provide the relatively peaceful, non-injurious atmosphere my mother passed away in bed, knowing she was well-cared for.
It took quite some time to get over the shock and grieve appropriately.