Biological warfare expert explains why you should never get in a Las Vegas pool

[Celerity]

https://www.iflscience.com/health-and-medicine/biological-warfare-expert-explains-why-you-should-never-get-in-a-las-vegas-pool/

A specialist in biological and chemical warfare has explained why he believes you should never get in a Las Vegas pool, and it's a rollercoaster. Author Dan Kaszeta began his career as a Chemical Officer in the US Army. He then became a defense contractor, working with the Pentagon on chemical and biological proliferation issues. His career spans historical research for the USA's decommissioned chemical and biological weapons programs to training on live nerve agents. Basically he's got the kind of C.V. that if he says "don't go in that pool" you don't get in that pool. Which made the following tweets quite worrying for Las Vegas pool fans.

Link to tweet

After receiving a few annoyed replies from Las Vegas pool enthusiast Twitter for the enigmatic tweet, he decided to elaborate on why you shouldn't go swimming in a Las Vegas pool, or even touch the water. Fair warning, it makes for some grim reading. In a Twitter thread, he explains in the late 1990s he was working as the "chemical and biological terrorism guy at the White House Military Office," right around the time they were starting to take chemical, biological, radiological, and nuclear defense seriously. While working there, he got a call from another federal agency that needed his help.

Link to tweet

Kaszeta hooked up the caller with a lab that could do a full chemical and biological analysis on a sample they needed looking at. The particular lab used a process that involved analyzing control samples, or "blanks", as well as the suspect substance. The scientists involved were not told which was which.

Link to tweet

Link to tweet

The suspicious sample, it turned out, contained something relatively harmless "like glycerine". But the control sample, in this case, swimming pool water from a major Las Vegas Hotel, hoo boy.

Link to tweet

Link to tweet

Link to tweet

So far, so disgusting. But he wasn't done. Being a science guy, he asked the contact to collect more samples from other pools "for giggles". Same results.

Link to tweet

snip
more at the top link

[smirkymonkey]

1. Thank god I have already finished my dinner.

Reading that just made me want to How disgusting! I have never been to Vegas - by choice - but I have been in hotel/resort pools. Ugh!

Mostly, I am in private pools, but I think from now on I am going to refrain from getting into any kind of pool that is used by more that a handful of people that I know. That story just bummed me out.

[msongs]

2. the ocean is a fish toilet...yet its the human stuff in it that makes us sick nt

[MagickMuffin]

3. I guess I'm glad every time I've been to Vegas it was mostly

just passing thru. Had one overnight stay.

[irisblue]

4. Water parks

I loved those things, my foster daughter loved those things. She got to take some samples for a HS biology experiment, a few drops on a petri dish. Yeah.

[Initech]

6. Yeah I used to go to Raging Waters all the time in middle and high school.

Then my mom's best friend who is a biology teacher, explained to us what was in the water at those places. Needless to say, there's no way in hell I would even stick my toes in the water at one of those places.

[Hortensis]

5. I'd definitely check this further. They don't have a health dept in LV?

Nevada doesn't have a state regulatory agency and politicians extremely committed to keeping the tourists coming?

The casino corporations don't hire professional managers and have risk management departments that have figures to prove that keeping their pools clean would be infinitely less expensive than sickening and even potentially killing many guests, losing enormous revenue from giant scandals, and paying out huge liability judgments?

If it claimed to be only ONE hotel and Trump owned it, ...maaaaybe. But I'd still definitely check before swallowing.

[Johnny2X2X]

11. Yes, this doesn't pass the smell test

Seems like BS. Snopes it.

[Celerity]

13. Snopes away, the author is legit

Dan Kaszeta

https://www.bellingcat.com/author/dankaszeta/

I have 28 years experience in CBRN response, security, and antiterrorism. I live and work in London, in the United Kingdom. I currently am the owner and managing director of Strongpoint Security Ltd. I also contribute articles to magazines such as CBRNe World, the Journal of Terrorism and Cyber Insurance, Politics.co.uk, and European Security and Defence magazine. I am a frequent contributor at The Integrity Initiative and am working on the definitive history of nerve agents.

I started out as a Chemical Officer in the United States Army, and served a total of 16 years as a military reservist, first in the US Army Reserve and then in the Maryland Army National Guard, reaching the rank of Captain. I was one of the founding members of one of the first Civil Support Teams. Of course, a military reservist needs to maintain a civilian career as well, and I was very fortunate that I was able to apply my military CBRN skills in civilian life. I served for 12 years in the White House in Washington DC, from 1996 to 2008, in two different jobs spanning two very different Presidential administrations. I spent six years as a Defense Department civil servant detailed to the White House Military Office, where I worked as CBRN advisor and emergency plans program manager. 2002 brought a transfer to the Technical Security Division of the US Secret Service, where I was assigned to CBRN countermeasures and the HAMMER team as well as traditional technical security and protective missions.

At various points in this career I have been trained and qualified as a military CBRN defense specialist (honor graduate at the US Army Chemical School), a fully trained Hazardous Materials Technician, a licensed Emergency Medical Technician (EMT), a Secret Service advance coordinator, an antiterrorist search adviser, and many other qualifications in the defense and security fields.

I moved to the UK in 2008 and worked for Smiths Detection for several years as a business manager for the CBRN detection market in Europe before leaving to start Strongpoint. I have a B.A. degree in Political Science from Texas Christian University and an M.A. in International Affairs from George Washington University in Washington DC. I am the recipient of several awards and decorations. I am the author of “CBRN and Hazmat Incidents at Major Public Events: Planning and Response” (Wiley, 2012) and numerous articles and papers.

snip


Dan Kaszeta’s Articles

http://strongpointsecurity.co.uk/resources/downloads/

The Guardian

2014


It’s clear that Turkey was not involved in the chemical attack on Syria (link)

(co-authored with Eliot Higgins)



Politics.co.uk (all 2018)



Myth busting: Why Didn’t the Skripals die on the spot? (link)

How to dismantle Assad’s Chemical Weapons (link)

This is how Putin kneecapped the UN Security Council (link)

Everything you need to now about Ricin (link)





BBC News Online (all 2017)



Syria Conflict: The Spectre of Nerve Agents Again (link)

Syria chemical attack: What can forensics tell us (link)



CBRNe World Magazine



2011:

How much is that detector in the window? (link)



2012:

From fish soup to an aquarium, and back again (link)

DUI – Detecting und Identifying (link)

When you believe (link)

Carry on or checked bags (link)

2013:

Managing the deficit (link)



2015:

Threats, risks, fears, opportunities (link)



2016:

Mine eyes have seen the glory (link)



NOW Lebanon



2013

Why Seymour Hersh has it wrong this time (link)



2014

Hersh and the Red Herring (link)

Was Arafat really poisoned? (link)

Does Sarin cause birth defects (link)





Bloomberg View (all 2013)

https://www.bloomberg.com/view/contributors/ASZcFc1UAMU/dan-kaszeta

(now pay-walled)



Integrity Initiative (all 2018)



How could Novichok have poisoned people four months after the Skripal Attack?


Yes, you can be poisoned by Novichok and survive


Demolishing the Kremlin’s absurd theories about Novichok and Porton Down


All the Buzz about BZ




Cicero Magazine (security and military affairs site)


Various articles in 2014 and 2015 (link here)



PRISM (Journal of the National Defense University) [peer reviewed]



(2018) The Forensic Challenge (link)


Journal of Terrorism and Cyber Insurance [peer reviewed]


(2016) Decontamination of Buildings after Anthrax Attack (link)

(2017) Protecting against chemical and biological risks to office buildings (link)



Radio Appearances:


Public Radio International: The World (2013) (link)

BBC Radio 4: Phosphorous (2018)

[grantcart]

17. Sure but what was he doing in June 2019 between the 18th and 24th?

[Celerity]

18. planning this hoax Twitter thread

[Celerity]

15. feel free to check, and if you find a legit reason for the FUD, then show the receipts

[Hortensis]

26. Turns out I won't be swallowing ANY pool water.

From 2018:

CDC issues warning on hotel swimming pools
https://www.ktnv.com/news/national/cdc-issues-warning-on-hotel-swimming-pools

Planning on going swimming while on vacation this summer? The CDC said on Thursday that an estimated 27,000 people were sickened, and eight died, from swimming-related diseases from 2000 to 2014 in hotel pools and hot tubs.

According to CDC figures, 1 out of 3 swimming-related disease outbreaks originated from hotels.

The CDC says that Cryptosporidium (also known as “Crypto”), Pseudomonas, and Legionella caused most of the outbreaks in swimming venues. Of the 27,000 people sickened, the majority had Crypto, which is a parasite tough enough to survive even in properly maintained pools.
...
* Check the pools, hot tubs and water playground inspection scores.
* Before getting in the water, use a test strip from your local retailer or pool supply store to check if the water’s pH and bromine or free chlorine level are correct.
* Don’t swallow the water.

[Kali]

19. I wouldn't be swallowing any pool water

that I wasn't managing myself.

[pnwest]

7. All of that is what I was imagining in that

video of the pool party at that bar after reopening from Covid....with aaaaall those people just standing in that water. Unwashed asses and feet...beer farts...Fecking gross, man. Shame, cause I love to swim, but I’ll prolly never get in a pool again. I swore off hot tubs in the 80’s after getting in one once, with one other person, and the ring left around the tub when we got out was disgusting. I had no desire to sit and boil in multiple-person body juices ever again. But I figured a large, cold, well-chlorinated pool would be ok. But got skeeved out about that not long after as well. No more pools for me. I would love to swim in the clear blue Caribbean waters just once before I die, tho.

[Blue_true]

21. The things that turned me off on public lap pools

was I noticed people in the change room that didn't shower before going in. The other is that I noticed floating hair once and finally a ring around the pool, I guess staff had not cleaned that off.

The thing that stopped me from swimming was when a really funky, funky guy showed up and started swimming when I was there. The first time, I thought he was just passing through. When he showed up a second and third time with the same horrid body stink, there was no way that I was getting in that pool or any public pool again.

One other thing, the water in public pools tend to be too warm for me. I know that is because some people develop hyperthermia in cool pools, but my body's skin surface seem to run hot when I workout, so a slightly cooler pool was desirable for me.

[genxlib]

27. I work in the Parks and Rec Design industry

And what you describe is actually a problem.

Pools for exercise or competition should be cooler than pools meant to be recreational.

It becomes a problem when an owner wants a pool to serve too many purposes. Something like a rec pool with a few lap lanes. It makes it impossible to properly set the water temperature.

[Blue_true]

29. The pool that I swam in was used for both Rec and laps. I don't know about Dancersize. nt

[Downtown Hound]

8. Whatever.

I've been swimming at different 24 Hour Fitness pools for YEARS. I go four or five times a week. I can swim up to three miles. I'd be willing to bet that you could find the same crap in the same levels in any one of those pools that they found in the Vegas pools. I shower after each swim, which gets any residual chlorine off of me and probably any of that other crap he's so concerned about as well. I'm perfectly fine and in fact in pretty good shape. Most swimmers use some type of public pool because backyard pools are simply not big enough to get a real workout in unless you happen to be rich and have a really huge pool. Most swimmers also live long lives and are very healthy due to both the cardiovascular benefits of swimming as well as the resistance training the water gives the muscles. Plus, it's been scientifically proven that being in the water can calm us psychologically, and that in turn can have positive health benefits.

I'd wager the health benefits of swimming regularly far outweigh any exposure to any of the stuff this man is sounding the alarm about. Show me someone who's been harmed by going into a Vegas pool, and I'll start to take paranoid warnings like this seriously.

[Kali]

22. things like skin rashes, ear infections, pink eye, and diarrhea

can be picked up in an unsanitary pool, and most people aren't going to figure out where they got these things, especially the runs - more likely from the buffet LOL

but pools that aren't properly maintained can indeed cause health problems.

[Laffy Kat]

9. I have been squeamish about pool and jacuzzi water for a long time.

As a matter of fact, I'm squeamish about lake and pond water, too. Running rivers and streams have always seemed safer. Of course, giardia is everywhere, but a strong immune system can usually beat it before it makes you sick.

[Thekaspervote]

10. Thx for posting this very important health information!!

[Wawannabe]

12. Oh my...

Glad this PSA came to me before I ever stepped foot in a Vegas pool. Uh, you can keep it in Vegas.

[George II]

14. I don't swim, so luckily I'd never get in any pool..........ever! Plus never been in LV either.

[Historic NY]

16. My friends why don't you come in for a swim...

I've stopped doing hot tubs because of dermatitis .

[Kali]

20. presence of various compounds and microorganisms without volume measures

is kind of misleading and scaremongering. having said that people tend to be more afraid of chlorine than the crap you can't see like mentioned in the findings. they are stupid.

[womanofthehills]

24. Indoor chlorine treated pools without good ventilation, can also cause upper airway problems

Esp for people with allergies. Besides rashes and hives from chlorine, you can also get an airway hyper
response. I do not do well in chlorine pools.

My allergy dr told me to never go into hot tubs because of high levels of fecal matter. I will only go into natural hot springs with running water. Never put my face under water and shower after.

[Kali]

25. indoor pools are rarely maintained properly

and ventilation is just one of the problems. proper chlorination shouldn't bother you, it is too little chlorine and the chloramines from what is there trying to burn off organic waste that is probably the problem.

[DENVERPOPS]

23. If you have a hot tub

dermatologists will tell you NO FRIENDS, only family members.......
they have a whole list of serious skin infections that come from hot tubs.......

[genxlib]

28. And yet...

They are probably the most sanitary thing to do in Vegas.

[pecosbob]

30. This from a guy who cleaned pools for twenty years...me

If the pool is in your yard and you or a pool man takes care of it, it's probably safe to swim. If not, it is probably not safe. I can confirm that all of the dangerous substances he mentions are in fact present in public pool water to some extent.

I cleaned a residential pool for a few years that was downwind from a hog farm and had large dogs in the pool all the time...you don't even want to know what all was in the water. Hygenically, swimming in a public pool is like having an intimate encounter with everybody that swam in that pool.