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kentuck

(111,092 posts)
Fri Sep 21, 2012, 03:31 PM Sep 2012

What is your opinion of taxes on capital gains??

Should they be taxed at a lower level than workers' wages?

Should they be taxed at a progressive rate?

How much does the Treasury lose each year because of the low capital gains rate? If the wealthy don't pay their fair share of capital gains taxes, doesn't it have to be made up somewhere else, or added to the deficit?

What is the argument for taxing capital gains at a lower rate??

29 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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What is your opinion of taxes on capital gains?? (Original Post) kentuck Sep 2012 OP
Should be taxed at a higher rate randr Sep 2012 #1
Since those that make their money this way are not making or building anything but their... L0oniX Sep 2012 #2
I think capital gains should be treated as wages wrt taxes. Liberal Veteran Sep 2012 #3
Do you include the capital gain when you sell your house here? (nt) Nye Bevan Sep 2012 #17
Yes. Regardless of where the income come from it is money made. Liberal Veteran Sep 2012 #23
I can see capital gain tax on the sale of a your primary residence could be ThomThom Sep 2012 #26
highly progressive rate which should be higher than wage income tax rate Fresh_Start Sep 2012 #4
That they're about half of what they should be. MrSlayer Sep 2012 #5
Truly "long-term" capital gains should continue to get a tax break. dawg Sep 2012 #6
You are absolutely right...the lower tax rate is due to the fact that inflation True Earthling Sep 2012 #22
Welfare for the Wealthy is ugly. Tax them using progressive tax rates. n/t Agnosticsherbet Sep 2012 #7
Maybe the rate should be based on percentage of income that comes... polichick Sep 2012 #8
Yes, I like this idea. Jankyn Sep 2012 #19
Income is income edhopper Sep 2012 #9
No, they should be taxed the same as another income. sinkingfeeling Sep 2012 #10
They should be taxed more highly than income from work. hifiguy Sep 2012 #11
Taxed on a time based progressive scale DJ13 Sep 2012 #12
Not high enough RoccoR5955 Sep 2012 #13
Same rate as wages. And kill the cap on FICA. Everyone should pay the same rate on that. HopeHoops Sep 2012 #14
They should be taxed as ordinary income SteveG Sep 2012 #15
When... Xolodno Sep 2012 #16
Labor should be valued more highly than investment capital. DrewFlorida Sep 2012 #18
An arbitrary and completely false designation of income that is reserved for the few to exclude the Egalitarian Thug Sep 2012 #20
I might be naive, but... KSstellarcat Sep 2012 #21
I used to believe they needed to come up but remain at a discount to the income tax TheKentuckian Sep 2012 #24
I think they are a good thing. bemildred Sep 2012 #25
Lower. Money doesn't have to be invested. If there is no incentive to help offset the risk RB TexLa Sep 2012 #27
I believe the "Capital Gain" IS the reward for taking the risk. aka-chmeee Sep 2012 #28
I'm for 'em! Iggo Sep 2012 #29
 

L0oniX

(31,493 posts)
2. Since those that make their money this way are not making or building anything but their...
Fri Sep 21, 2012, 03:34 PM
Sep 2012

bank account, they should pay a lot more than those that actually work for a living.

Liberal Veteran

(22,239 posts)
3. I think capital gains should be treated as wages wrt taxes.
Fri Sep 21, 2012, 03:35 PM
Sep 2012

And it should be progressive.

If you make 100k in capital gains, why should it be treated as some kind of "magical non-money"?

Liberal Veteran

(22,239 posts)
23. Yes. Regardless of where the income come from it is money made.
Fri Sep 21, 2012, 05:08 PM
Sep 2012

If we start splitting hairs then we are right back to the Swiss cheese loophole system that is causing us so many problems already.

ThomThom

(1,486 posts)
26. I can see capital gain tax on the sale of a your primary residence could be
Fri Sep 21, 2012, 09:13 PM
Sep 2012

lower but the other capital gains should be higher than the rate working people pay. This gives an incentive to leave the money in the business. Higher wages, new equipment, growing the business would be the result.

Fresh_Start

(11,330 posts)
4. highly progressive rate which should be higher than wage income tax rate
Fri Sep 21, 2012, 03:35 PM
Sep 2012

if you want to reward people for hard work, reward wages.

 

MrSlayer

(22,143 posts)
5. That they're about half of what they should be.
Fri Sep 21, 2012, 03:37 PM
Sep 2012

Making money without doing work should be taxed higher than money earned through productive work. The system is backward.

dawg

(10,624 posts)
6. Truly "long-term" capital gains should continue to get a tax break.
Fri Sep 21, 2012, 03:42 PM
Sep 2012

If you bought a property in 1980 for $40,000 and sold it in 2012 for $80,000, you haven't really had an economic gain. The difference is entirely due to inflation, so it makes sense to tax this "gain" at a lower rate.

But one year is far too short a period to qualify for this break, in my opinion. I would make capital gains fully taxable up to five years; 50% taxable from five to twenty years; and non-taxable beyond 20. (If they're holding something for 20 years, they're probably planning on dying with it anyway.)

And as for the carried interest loophole that allows fund managers to classify their fees as capital gains, that is pure unadulterated bullshit and should be repealed immediately.

True Earthling

(832 posts)
22. You are absolutely right...the lower tax rate is due to the fact that inflation
Fri Sep 21, 2012, 04:57 PM
Sep 2012

artificially appreciates assets...your argument for holding periods is spot on as well.

Good post.

polichick

(37,152 posts)
8. Maybe the rate should be based on percentage of income that comes...
Fri Sep 21, 2012, 03:44 PM
Sep 2012

...from capital gains - so small investors aren't discouraged.

Jankyn

(253 posts)
19. Yes, I like this idea.
Fri Sep 21, 2012, 04:49 PM
Sep 2012

I don't necessarily think we want to penalize the investor class, but they shouldn't be paying a LOWER rate than that for earned income.

So weight capital gains taxes for the length of the investment (thus rewarding those who live in their homes rather than those who flip them), and offer a lower rate for retirement investment gains in addition to deferred taxation.

But I think this is the sort of question that we the wage-earners ought to be talking about at every opportunity, thanks to Romney.

edhopper

(33,575 posts)
9. Income is income
Fri Sep 21, 2012, 03:47 PM
Sep 2012

no reason a paycheck should be taxed more than an investment.
the only reason there is a difference is to make the rich richer. In that it has been highly successful.

And not talked about is how many CEOs and Fund Managers pay capital gains on their salary, even though it is based on the investment of other people's money.

The Kleptrocasy is alive and well.

 

hifiguy

(33,688 posts)
11. They should be taxed more highly than income from work.
Fri Sep 21, 2012, 03:48 PM
Sep 2012

The Repukes tell us over and over again about how work is "dignified" and necessary, and how laziness is criminal.

There is nothing that involves less work and more sloth than sitting on a pile of money while doing nothing and raking in the filthy lucre.

Progressive taxation at a rate 5-10% higher than taxation of income earned by actual work, maxing out at around 70%.

DJ13

(23,671 posts)
12. Taxed on a time based progressive scale
Fri Sep 21, 2012, 03:49 PM
Sep 2012

The highest rate would equal the top income tax rate, and be for holding the equity for any period below 1 month.

I would also reduce to 10% the capital gains rate for any equity held longer than 2 years, which would reduce the rate on the typical small investor.

This would not just increase tax revenues, it would discourage the pump and dump selling the major institutions have been doing, lessening the volatility in the process.

 

RoccoR5955

(12,471 posts)
13. Not high enough
Fri Sep 21, 2012, 03:52 PM
Sep 2012

Sure they may risk their money, but with all the money that the rich banksters and speculators make each year, and the fact that WE THE PEOPLE bailed their sorry asses out, and the fact that their main aim is to rip people off, they don't risk much. After all, it's only money.
Not like a cop, or fireman, or other worker who risk their lives and pay more than twice that. Not like a laborer who makes money by the sweat of his or her brow.
No, the whole thing is flip-flopped. Capital gains and other investments should be what wage earners make, and wage earners should pay what investors are paying today.

 

HopeHoops

(47,675 posts)
14. Same rate as wages. And kill the cap on FICA. Everyone should pay the same rate on that.
Fri Sep 21, 2012, 04:06 PM
Sep 2012

What the hell is up with cutting it off for the upper middle class and higher?

SteveG

(3,109 posts)
15. They should be taxed as ordinary income
Fri Sep 21, 2012, 04:07 PM
Sep 2012
Amendment XVI [1913] The Congress shall have power to lay and collect
taxes on incomes, from whatever source derived, without apportionment
among the several States, and without regard to any census or
enumeration.


As far as I am concerned, it should be treated the same as winnings from gambling, because essentially when you invest in a company you are betting on their success. When you buy a corporate bond, you are betting that you will get paid back with interest.

I would give this exception, a one time exemption of paying capital gains on investments after a person reaches say 55 or 60 (they do t his for primary residences already). This would encourage long term investments for retirement and it would reduce churn in the markets making long term investing much more attractive than short term investments.

Xolodno

(6,390 posts)
16. When...
Fri Sep 21, 2012, 04:19 PM
Sep 2012

...Interest rates are low, they should be very high. That way it encourages investment, development, etc. which causes people to get hired, raises wages, etc.

If interest rates are high they should be low to help with combating inflation, stop overheating the economy, etc.

DrewFlorida

(1,096 posts)
18. Labor should be valued more highly than investment capital.
Fri Sep 21, 2012, 04:43 PM
Sep 2012

Therfore capital gains should be taxed at a higher rate than income from labor. While investment capital adds value to the economy indirectly, labor is the main ingredient of added value to any product or service.

 

Egalitarian Thug

(12,448 posts)
20. An arbitrary and completely false designation of income that is reserved for the few to exclude the
Fri Sep 21, 2012, 04:50 PM
Sep 2012

many. I can give you the blatant lie that is pushed out for consumption by the sheeple, but since it is a lie, I won't bother unless you really want to read it.

Being true to my user name, I think that they should be taxed at at least the same rate as earned income, and can make a good argument for taxing them at a significantly higher rate.

And finally; Yes, the rate of taxation should be progressive, of course.

KSstellarcat

(50 posts)
21. I might be naive, but...
Fri Sep 21, 2012, 04:55 PM
Sep 2012

This is a topic that I'm unsure about. I'm a teacher, and I do receive some capital gains when I use some trust money that my parents invested for me. If these were taxed at a really high rate, it would definitely have a negative impact on me. I do know that I'm really lucky to have this safety net, but I can't decide if I just selfishly don't want a big tax hike.

The same uncertainty applies when my parents talk about the inheritance taxes.

TheKentuckian

(25,026 posts)
24. I used to believe they needed to come up but remain at a discount to the income tax
Fri Sep 21, 2012, 07:41 PM
Sep 2012

but that was me, to a degree, falling for the "common wisdom" that incentives are required to encourage investment but I now believe that at a minimum the rate should be the same as income from labor and think somewhat above that is needed to restore value to work in this country. Especially since a lot of this income is just borrowing tax dollars at near zero and hitting the casino for a quick return.

bemildred

(90,061 posts)
25. I think they are a good thing.
Fri Sep 21, 2012, 07:44 PM
Sep 2012

They should be taxed at at least twice the rate for earned income. Corporate taxes on proifit should be very high too, make them re-invest.

 

RB TexLa

(17,003 posts)
27. Lower. Money doesn't have to be invested. If there is no incentive to help offset the risk
Fri Sep 21, 2012, 09:16 PM
Sep 2012

less people will take the risk. Saying it should be taxed at the same rate is the libertarian position. To say the government should not do something to help spur investment is like saying the government should not build roads, people should build them themselves.

aka-chmeee

(1,132 posts)
28. I believe the "Capital Gain" IS the reward for taking the risk.
Fri Sep 21, 2012, 10:19 PM
Sep 2012

The lower tax appears to be an additional reward for taking a profitable risk. I don't understand what you mean by "if there is no incentive to help offset the risk". If the risk was realized and the investment lost, it doesn't help at all. Historically, it seems the "incentive to take the risk" justification for lower capital gains taxes are just as much a canard as the "lower taxes on the wealthy "job creators" will lead to higher employment for the rest of us".

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