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Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsOn Trump's condition
For all the talk about Trump's condition, here's something to bear in mind: all the reports you're hearing about him could pretty much all be true at the same time.
Today we've heard from Trump's doctor's that he's fine, just fine, except they didn't want to tell us what his temperature was or whether he was on oxygen. Then we heard from anonymous sources (Mark Meadows) that Trump's condition is serious and people are very concerned for his health. The we saw a video of Trump talking about how great he was feeling. Then we find out that he really did suffer a drop in oxygen levels and was on supplemental O2.
My thought is that none of this is necessarily inconsistent. There's still a lot we don't know about COVID, but quite a lot we do know. For example we know that the time from infection to symptoms is roughly 2-14 days -- Trump and everyone else is right in this zone if they all got it at the same event last week. We know that a fever is one of the first symptoms -- Trump had a fever. We know that a drop in oxygen levels is a sign that the condition could become serious. We also know that it's not uncommon for patients to go through cycles of feeling okay and then feeling worse. In a lot of cases, patients started with a fever, then started feeling better, then got significantly worse.
This is not to say that Trump is going to get better or worse. The point is we don't know, but there's a reason that I'm sure Trump's doctors are feeling worried, and that's because they also just don't know where this is going to go. There's absolutely no reason why Trump couldn't have felt well enough to make that video today. There's also absolutely no reason why he might not be on a ventilator tomorrow.
The next 48 hours really will be critical, and we'll know in a few days what is likely to happen to him. Either way, speculating about it at this juncture is probably not going to get us anywhere. To quote the world's biggest asshole, "It is what it is." And pretty soon we're going to find out what "it" is.
(Of course, none of this changes the fact that THEY ALL DEFINITELY KNEW HE HAD COVID AND SENT HIM OUT TO DO FUNDRAISERS ANYWAY WITHOUT TELLING ANYBODY -- and whether he recovers or not, that's just despicable.)
Edited to add: I wrote 48 hours above, but many reports on COVID have indicated that 10 days or so after the onset of symptoms is the real danger zone. At that point you either get better or get much worse. So if Trump first started exhibiting symptoms last Wednesday, we probably won't know if he's out of the woods or not until at least next weekend.
flibbitygiblets
(7,220 posts)Thekaspervote
(32,820 posts)Agree covid is an up down, I feel better I dont, fever no fever, O2stats good not good, but since they lie ALL the time we really dont know truth from fact about his particular condition
Laura PourMeADrink
(42,770 posts)All be orchestrated.
BComplex
(8,086 posts)I'm wondering what shape Ivanka and Jr. and Eric are in. They were also all around Hope Hicks and Kelly Ann Conway, who are both pretty sick.
Retrograde
(10,181 posts)This was discussed on DU after Robert Trump died. The official death certificate lists something like heart disease. What it actually was - well, I'm not a doctor and don't want to speculate.
NRaleighLiberal
(60,035 posts)Blue_true
(31,261 posts)He got sick at school, tested positive. Was treated at school, seemed to recover and was sent home to quarantine. He got to the point where he felt fine at home, so he returned to school for remote classes. Within about 3 days, he went from feeling fine at school to dying. His family said that he was in perfect health before contracting COVID19, he was an avid runner and played basketball, and didnt have any pre-existing health issues.
SARS-COV-2 can be real unpredictable.
mnhtnbb
(31,417 posts)much earlier than any of us would get it, if we even could get it. The antibody cocktail that he received before he was even transported to the hospital is not FDA approved and only available in clinical trials. It might turn out to be very effective.
https://www.sciencemag.org/news/2020/10/heres-what-known-about-president-donald-trump-s-covid-19-treatment
Laura PourMeADrink
(42,770 posts)a treatment plan ready before he got sick? ( if he really is)
Wounded Bear
(58,774 posts)but it usually doesn't mean a whole lot in the end.
ffr
(22,681 posts)I think Meadows assessment was calculated and meant to lower expectations, so that one day soon it would seem that Saint Donnie miraculously rose from his deathbed.
EarlG
(21,992 posts)As in, they want to put propaganda videos out there of Trump telling everyone that hes fit as a fiddle, but at the same time Mark Meadows is leaking to the press that Trump might die because Trump really might die, and Meadows doesnt want to be the White House chief of staff who told everyone his boss was doing great only for him to snuff it the next day.
Personally I think that scenario is more likely because it relies on pure self-interest (a TrumpCo speciality) as opposed to an intricate, Machiavellian plot that relies on people keeping their mouths shut (definitely not a TrumpCo speciality).
But here I am speculating again
As I said, well find out whats going to happen to him soon enough.
crickets
(25,990 posts)not_the_one
(2,227 posts)Their refusal to answer straight forward questions today SHOWS they will lie and obfuscate to spin whatever he wants.
Ronnie Jackson and the hippie-dippie doctor lied. The official report about his unexpected visit to Walter Reed was lies.
Just like the turd, HIS doctors do nothing but lie to promote the myth/brand.
ONLY believe OTHER reputable sources. The leaks about his condition are probably a lot closer to reality than anything his doctors say, or any OFFICIAL report of what is going on.
RockRaven
(15,080 posts)Obama or Bush or Clinton or Bush or... You get the idea.
From the first day they have always been disorganized and seemingly incoherent. Probably because of one of Trump's more obvious lies, the one about hiring "the best people."
Jarqui
(10,131 posts)perceives it, he would have.
The White House reported he got supplemental oxygen yesterday. Again, that's not something he'd like to admit.
This is an obese, unfit 74 year old who had an oxygen saturation problem yesterday due to this virus.
He's probably on a health rollercoaster for the next 10-14 days or so.
If this bug were so easy to handle, there wouldn't be 35+ million infected with over a million dead already.
Trump is where he should be. There's a very good chance being in one of the best hospitals and with the benefit of some medical advances in treatment that he'll survive. But he'll probably have a rough few days before this is over.
appleannie1
(5,077 posts)She has had patients they thought would not make it leave the hospital to cheers. She has also had patients that they were thinking of releasing soon die in a matter of a couple hours. All they can do is treat the symptoms and try to make the ones awake and aware as comfortable as possible. And there is no guarantee one way or the other. Although he made that video tonight, it was obvious he is having some breathing issues. And he is very pale, which could be a sign his oxygen levels are a little on the low side. But only time will tell.
brush
(53,977 posts)covid patients do fairly well but as the infection takes hold there are reversals and their condition worsens.
trump's condition is following that pattern. And the Remdesivir treatment takes five days so he'll be in the hospital at least that long.
Considering his age and poor physical condition, I predict it'll be much longer.
DallasNE
(7,404 posts)While it is true that "we know that the time from infection to symptoms is roughly 2-14 days" but we additionally know that it is a little like a ball curve and that the most common period is 5 days. 5 days takes us squarely back to the Saturday Rose Garden rollout announcement of Barrett as SC Justice nominee. We know, too, that they were performing daily CV-19 tests of the President and people that come in contact with the President - maybe more. What all of this means is that with daily testing Trump should have turned positive on his daily test no later than Monday -- not the Thursday at 1AM Tweet announcing he was positive when he already had symptoms.
These are reasonable extrapolations given the facts made available. It also means that he was not only positive for the debate but that he knew he was positive for the debate. Now what kind of monster would do something like that. (What a blessing that they did not shake hands). That 2-14 days also means that Biden needs additional tests up until 2 weeks after the debate, with the peak time being Saturday/Sunday.
Cha
(298,025 posts)The trump Virus & his Gaslighting Bullshit daughter side Faking it from Walter Reed
Link to tweet
Shocking I know
DallasNE
(7,404 posts)To disinfect them? As is they are extremely dangerous. But we know that this is just a photo op.
niyad
(113,897 posts)No jacket in upper pic, no file folders. And what is that weird reflection? Not even signing his name in bottom pic, just pen to paper.
Honestly, daughter spawn, you really have to stage these things better. As much lying as you all do, one would think you would be better at it.
Cha
(298,025 posts)in the two pics. My bad..
I know he's not "relentlessly working" but I don't know what to think about the difference in the 2 pics.
I know Andrew Feinberg is trusted but..
TY, niyad!
niyad
(113,897 posts)poorly tailored, cheap clothes. . .but cuff links?? REALLY????
dchill
(38,611 posts)Then he took off his jacket and really got to work. On more blank paper.
Cha
(298,025 posts)dchill
(38,611 posts)So, take one pic, go to another room, remove jacket, take another pic.
niyad
(113,897 posts)niyad
(113,897 posts)Cha
(298,025 posts)and I don't see a bandage.. it looks like the sleeves of his white shirt to me.
niyad
(113,897 posts)Cha
(298,025 posts)I have trouble with my eyes.. ergo the magnifying glass.. but sometimes it doesn't pick up everything. I have trouble with details. Very frustrating but learning to adapt.
You're talking about the right hand of the first pic?
If you say there's a bandage I believe you!
niyad
(113,897 posts)I was looking for a White Bandage.
I'm glad we kept at this & I asked which pic..
I do see it.. now I feel better.
Good on your details, niyad!
niyad
(113,897 posts)Cha
(298,025 posts)niyad
(113,897 posts)Cha
(298,025 posts)niyad
(113,897 posts)DallasNE
(7,404 posts)And what you question as a bruise I think is a shadow from the overhead lighting caused by the large wrinkles/veins.
I'm 6 years older than Trump and while I have some veins showing they are nothing like what Trump has. Also, some of that darkness could be from age spots. Need to see other pictures of his hand to confirm that though.
spooky3
(34,525 posts)lost all credibility.
BadGimp
(4,024 posts)I'm leaving my tin foil hat on tonight
Laura PourMeADrink
(42,770 posts)only trump as calling the shots. He's got an innate need for $ and adoration that is too strong for any staff minions to stop.
You have to admit, Earl, that this whole thing seems so fishy.
*Treatment plans immediately formulated on the ready
* Esteemed epidemiologists locked out. Military "obey orders" WR staff in.
* PR machine in full force.
* No real press access to the truth. Can't even shout a question over copter noise.
* Wife conveniently has it too the day after the tape comes out where she uses Christmas and the f word in the same sentence. And trump talks about how great she is? And with covid, no one expects you to answer interview questions.
Sorry, still not 100% sure he has anything. But you and others are right. It would require way too many people to lie. Way too risky.
Although it's get reelected or go to prison.
Only truth:. Covid does not affect psychosises.
GulfCoast66
(11,949 posts)I joined DU because it was the only fact based Democratic site I have seen.
Facts are sometimes messy. But they are facts.
Some of the crazy shit I have read here today is mentally painful.
You take care.
Wash. state Desk Jet
(3,426 posts)it is a day by day thing, thing of is, if it were not serious to begin with, he never will have been convinced to board the helicopter than spending at least 4 days surrounded by doctors he does not have power of control over. He hears what it is from the doctors that will not tailor what has to be said about the way it is to his fragile ego. They may not be able to tell the general public about his situation as it is ,it is doubtful however they would give out misinformation about his condition. And we still don't exactly how many staffers and supporters are infected with it.
As far as what Trump has to say, nothing has changed, I wouldn't believe a word he says. In this case, time will tell. Christie it ,he went all in from the start.
WheelWalker
(8,957 posts)Lucinda
(31,170 posts)notinkansas
(1,096 posts)It looked like it always does as he walked to the helicopter taking him to Walter Reed. The update video he did from the hospital - jacket, hair same as always.
When you are sick enough to be hospitalized, there generally is no time or inclination to style your hair.
Weird.
uppityperson
(115,681 posts)FDT