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Boogiemack

(1,406 posts)
Mon Oct 5, 2020, 11:11 AM Oct 2020

Supressing the vote, not wanting people to vote...this is more like socialistic, communism

than it is like democracy. What is it that people who decry socialism and communism don't get about that? No dictator or tyrant wants people to vote.

Biden/Harrise should be making this a major point for the voters to understand. I am always amazed by the Cubans in FL Maybe they really did like living under a dictatorship like Batista?
I guess it's all about the money, who gets to steal it and who gets to keep it without having to share it?

26 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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Supressing the vote, not wanting people to vote...this is more like socialistic, communism (Original Post) Boogiemack Oct 2020 OP
No. Not like socialism or communism. Those are economic models like capitalism. bullimiami Oct 2020 #1
Americans conflate economic and political systems all of the time. Yavin4 Oct 2020 #11
I have said this numerous times. smirkymonkey Oct 2020 #20
A lot of them benefitted under the pre-Communist/Socialist yet still authoritarian government. Yavin4 Oct 2020 #24
Authoritarianism. Totalitarianism. House of Roberts Oct 2020 #2
Suppressing the vote is about totalitarianism. Caliman73 Oct 2020 #3
Incorrect. johnp3907 Oct 2020 #4
ABSOLUTELY ! Thank you for your post. Budi Oct 2020 #5
Absolutely not... Caliman73 Oct 2020 #8
It is indeed true in communist & socalist nations. Budi Oct 2020 #9
Are we a communist or socialist nation? Caliman73 Oct 2020 #13
We are a Democratic Republic of course. Budi Oct 2020 #16
I agree, there are no magic unicorns Caliman73 Oct 2020 #18
Nice try Cirque du So-What Oct 2020 #6
Do we still conflate anything we think is bad with socialism? aidbo Oct 2020 #7
No different than conflating everything unicorn pretty with socialism. Budi Oct 2020 #10
Lol wtf are you even talking about. aidbo Oct 2020 #12
Google has pages of paragraphs explaining just this issue thruout world history. Budi Oct 2020 #14
Google is a search engine. It finds you things on the internet that you want to believe. aidbo Oct 2020 #15
Of course. And where do you find your info? Budi Oct 2020 #17
Bye bye, Budi. aidbo Oct 2020 #21
Haaaahaa. You use google too. Budi Oct 2020 #22
Yes I use google sometimes. Was I not clear about that? aidbo Oct 2020 #26
"in the hands of a Dictator...economics becomes easily a means to suppress fair elections." Yavin4 Oct 2020 #25
No, the so-called "socialist" countries wanted everyone to vote DFW Oct 2020 #19
It is one of the 10 indicators of emerging fascism. roamer65 Oct 2020 #23

bullimiami

(13,076 posts)
1. No. Not like socialism or communism. Those are economic models like capitalism.
Mon Oct 5, 2020, 11:17 AM
Oct 2020

This is a corruption of democracy to favor oligarchy.

Yavin4

(35,423 posts)
11. Americans conflate economic and political systems all of the time.
Mon Oct 5, 2020, 11:57 AM
Oct 2020

They associate socialism and communism with totalitarianism because of years of massive anti-Communist propaganda.

Yes, there were nations that switched their economies to socialism or communism were also totalitarian, but those nations were also totalitarian before the switch.

 

smirkymonkey

(63,221 posts)
20. I have said this numerous times.
Mon Oct 5, 2020, 12:53 PM
Oct 2020

It is why so many people who have come from former socialist or communist countries (Cuba, China, Russia, other Eastern European countries, etc.) seem to tend to vote republican - because they fear that the Democrats are going to take the country back to what they left at home. They don't understand our economic or political system and that Democrats are anit-authoritarian. You would think they would be able to recognize it when they see it, but a lot of them don't.

Yavin4

(35,423 posts)
24. A lot of them benefitted under the pre-Communist/Socialist yet still authoritarian government.
Mon Oct 5, 2020, 02:22 PM
Oct 2020

But when the switch happened, they lost everything.

Caliman73

(11,726 posts)
3. Suppressing the vote is about totalitarianism.
Mon Oct 5, 2020, 11:26 AM
Oct 2020

While there were definitely dictators who stated that they were communists like Stalin, Mao, and the Eastern Bloc dictators, it wasn't about the communism it was about the dictatorship. Hitler was not a socialist or communist, Pinochet, Franco, Mussolini (at one time he was, but he denounced communism when he took over Italy). Putin and Lukashenko are not socialists or communists. Berdimuhamedow, the president and dictator of Turkmenistan is not a socialist or communist.

For those leaders who have totalitarian tendencies, the economic systems are just as much about the control as anything else. They will use the collectivistic thinking of socialism and communism, or the lure of riches of capitalism to draw people in, but they will manipulate those systems for the sake of retaining power.

Biden did a pretty good job in his closing statement of making that case. Trump is doing what he can to make it harder to vote because he and the GOP know that they serve only a small segment of the population. The rest of his supporters are saps who think they will get to share in the wealth, but they will only be used as fodder or muscle and discarded when no longer needed.

 

Budi

(15,325 posts)
5. ABSOLUTELY ! Thank you for your post.
Mon Oct 5, 2020, 11:31 AM
Oct 2020

"Supressing the vote, not wanting people to vote...this is more like socialistic, communism"

It is exactly as you state

Caliman73

(11,726 posts)
8. Absolutely not...
Mon Oct 5, 2020, 11:51 AM
Oct 2020

Suppressing the vote is not about an economic system. It is about power. Are you stating the the Republican party and Trump are socialists and communists?

 

Budi

(15,325 posts)
9. It is indeed true in communist & socalist nations.
Mon Oct 5, 2020, 11:54 AM
Oct 2020

Economic suppression is voter suppression too.



Caliman73

(11,726 posts)
13. Are we a communist or socialist nation?
Mon Oct 5, 2020, 12:02 PM
Oct 2020

Economic suppression AND voter suppression exist here.

Are we communist or socialist?

 

Budi

(15,325 posts)
16. We are a Democratic Republic of course.
Mon Oct 5, 2020, 12:14 PM
Oct 2020

But the 'selling of Socialism as an economic magic unicorn' is certainly a method of weaking our strength.

This is how Venezuela came to be the horror it is today.

Caliman73

(11,726 posts)
18. I agree, there are no magic unicorns
Mon Oct 5, 2020, 12:29 PM
Oct 2020

Capitalism has horrible problems and Socialism likely doesn't work in large societies.

Demonizing socialism is just as bad as "selling it as a magical unicorn".

In Venezuela industry is 81% privately owned. Hardly a socialist paradise. The problems in Venezuela are complex and cannot be blamed on an economic system that accounts for less than 20% of the economy.

Venezuela is a horror because powerful people are fighting for control of the country and do not care if the people in that country get hurt.

 

Budi

(15,325 posts)
14. Google has pages of paragraphs explaining just this issue thruout world history.
Mon Oct 5, 2020, 12:09 PM
Oct 2020

Economic suppression is a means as well. Socialism is a means of production & distrubution & in the hands of a Dictator regime, economics becomes easily a means to suppress fair elections.

I don't expect some to look beyond the 'selling of socialism' to know it's detrimental effects of a people, once they're in the hands of a dictatorial govt

Some conflate Socialism with Democracy.

 

aidbo

(2,328 posts)
21. Bye bye, Budi.
Mon Oct 5, 2020, 01:20 PM
Oct 2020

To answer your question though, I sometimes use google to find information on the internet. But I also remember that google is providing the search service to me at no cost because the way google makes money is by selling our search information to advertisers and that it’s algorithm is easily gamed by websites that want to.

 

aidbo

(2,328 posts)
26. Yes I use google sometimes. Was I not clear about that?
Mon Oct 5, 2020, 03:45 PM
Oct 2020

If I may ask, do you hold capitalism to the same standard as socialism?
So when the USA wages wars for oil access in foreign countries or when through its inaction 200k of its citizens die in the span of 5 months from preventable infections, do you blame capitalism for that?

Yavin4

(35,423 posts)
25. "in the hands of a Dictator...economics becomes easily a means to suppress fair elections."
Mon Oct 5, 2020, 02:25 PM
Oct 2020

That would be true regardless of the underlying economic system. The Slave/Jim Crow South "suppressed fair elections", and they were market based capitalists, not socialists.

DFW

(54,302 posts)
19. No, the so-called "socialist" countries wanted everyone to vote
Mon Oct 5, 2020, 12:38 PM
Oct 2020

It's just that their 98.7% vote in favor of the ruling party never got checked by anyone except the ruling party. Pretty much like the Diebold and ESS machines showing "surprise upset victories" for Republican candidates, but never for Democratic candidates.

But Republicans always were the truest Stalinists the USA had to offer. Their identical goals: one party rule with all money and privileges (in return for blind ideological loyalty and public deference to fearless leader) the state could muster.

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