Do.You think your vote doesn't count?..In 4 states, AZ, WI, GA, VT the difference was 164,000 total.

[Stuart G]

Last edited Mon Nov 23, 2020, 11:32 PM - Edit history (7)

For Joe Biden over Trump...Those 4 put the election on our side..for Joe.
That is a total of 164,000 out of.....11,300,000 votes.....in those 4 states..
....................Hit the link below and see for yourself, if you don't believe...

https://www.google.com/search?sourceid=navclient&aq=&oq=president+election+results&ie=UTF-8&rlz=1T4GGNI_enUS494US495&q=president+election+results&gs_l=hp..0.0i433j0l4.0.0.0.14269...........0.1jA5dT4pU-w#spf=1606184062304

Look carefully at... Arizona, Wisconsin, Georgia & Vermont..

Look at the totals for Biden & Trump at those 4 states...

If just 164,000 voters had gone for Trump instead of Biden then Trump would have won..

That is 164,000 out of 11,400,000 (total for 4 states)......about one out of 100......far less....
..................Someone can figure out the exact numbers, not me..................................

So when someone says....Every Vote Counts....Sometimes it does, and in this case those 146,000
votes that went for Joe Biden over Trump...elected him... President of the United States of America

...........If you were one of those votes in AZ, Georgia, WI or VT....We all ....THANK YOU..!!!!

In Arizona the difference was 11,000
In Georgia the difference was 20,000
In Wisconsin the difference was 13,000
In Vermont the difference was 120,00...
total....164,000....hit the link, & see for yourself....total Electoral Votes

(I have to apologize, original totals were off a little, these totals including Vermont correct that error)

also, that 164,000 total in 4 states...determined the outcome of an election that had over 150,000,000 votes..
even though Biden won by 5 million votes


Biden got 79,886,000
Trump got 74,880,00

[flamingdem]

1. Thanks for posting this, it gives me the chills

Talk about the importance of GOTV

[Skittles]

2. this fucking Electoral College nonsense

there are absolutely NO valid reasons why some votes are worth more than others, NONE

[Stuart G]

3. Yes, there was a..."valid reason"...That reason was to get the 13 states to become the United States

...When the Constitution was formed in the 1780s, the small states felt overwhelmed by the larger states..
Especially the huge ones like PA & New York..The deal was to give the small states some additional power
to vote in the "Electoral College" to get them to join the new U.S. Constitution. The old "Articles of
Confederation" were very weak and the country was weak..(no president, legislature not strong...etc..)
...So the deal was to give the small states more power through the electoral college then they would have otherwise.....that was the deal..and the 13 states did eventually ratify the Constitution with that extra
part of it.

[coti]

8. That's sounds like a political reason, not a valid reason

rooted in justice or democratic principles.

[Stuart G]

10. The small states wanted protection from the larger states who would over-rule them in elections..

This "electoral college nonsense" was the deal to get them to approve the Constitution...Now this
is not some deal, it was rooted in the idea that in order to have ...The United States of America all the states had to join the union.....Why?.........

Well the small states were indeed frightened of the larger states taking over...So that is why the Senate
has 2 from every state, and the House is based on population..This part of the deal got the small states to join the union under the new Constitution because they were going to set up their own independent countries...

NOW THIS IS IMPORTANT....YOU MIGHT SAY...WHERE DID YOU GET THIS INFO????
...I TAUGHT THIS IN U.S HISTORY FOR OVER 25 YEARS IN HIGH SCHOOL..THESE POLITICAL DEALS...WHICH WERE VALID REASONS IN THE 1780s (when this was written & approved) were the ultimate reason that the Constitution was indeed approved......The amendment process was very important so changes could be made from time to time, so the founders argued about that too.

These deals on the Constitution were made by our Founding Fathers..very bright people. (some of the brightest) and they knew that this Constitution had to be approved because the ARticles of Confederation were so weak.....

The Articles of Confederation were the laws that the original 13 states approved in the early 1780s..right after the revolution ended to get things going..Those were the rules the original 13 states worked with and they were very weak and that is why in 1787 the founding fathers called together the leaders for a ...Constitutional
Convention when this whole thing was drawn up with lots of deals to get total approval from the 13 states.

[coti]

18. Stuart, everyone knows how the Senate and EC came about.

What I'm saying, and many are saying, is that no, it wasn't fair for the smaller states to have wanted an outsized say in our government. By all defensible standards of fairness, when it comes to votes, it is numbers of people that matter, not arbitrary lines in the sand.

The compromise that was reached was a political one, reached for the sake of greater unity. It was not rooted in genuine principles of justice, and it was certainly not- as we are beginning to see now- a wise decision when considering the long-term growth and health of a fledgling democracy.

[Skittles]

12. yes there WAS a valid reason

there no longer IS

it has OUTLIVED ITS PURPOSE

[Stuart G]

13. Small states in my opinion will not allow a change to the Constitution that protects them

While the original reasons may be unimportant, small states still believe that larger states with lots of people will in the end control all laws and pass laws that only favor the larger states. (and that may be true)
... In some ways the "electoral college" represents power to smaller states. Getting rid of that clause in the Constitution would require an amendment which would require 3/4 vote of states. That will not happen, at least in my opinion.
...Small states will protect their.."power" at all costs. The "electoral college" indeed gives power to small states,
and they will not allow a change. (in my opinion)..I don't think it will get through Congress or legislatures of
small state governments.

[Skittles]

14. I don't give a fuck what they want

the EC has given us two nitwit presidents in recent history, makes it easier for foreign interference with elections and quite frankly is utterly fucking ridiculous......SOMETHING needs to change

[Stuart G]

15. Yes, we need change..but how to change is the issue isn't it.?

....So many people have argued in favor of just changing the Constitution to have a popular vote elect the President of the United States..Seems obvious and clearly worthwhile. Yes, I am in favor of that..

...But to get that change a change must be made to the Constitution itself. If Rhode Island has more power with
the present system, and Wyoming also has more power in the present system, how are we going to get the
change done if Wyoming and Rhode Island and states like them will not approve the change?...Of course I am
in favor of this change, and Illinois will vote for it, but will Rhode Island, and Wyoming? .......How about South Dakota? Idaho? Oklahoma ? Nebraska?..etc.

and....I ain't in charge of nothing...(maybe this computer??) Of course this system is wrong, but how to change the system is the issue, not that change is needed.....

(history points out that when they approved the Constitution in the 1780s & 90s, the founders knew that "slavery
was very bad" The founders thought it would..."die out over time"j)
...Southern states wanted it in the Constitution to protect their economy. Some in southern states thought it would die out too. When the invention of the "cotton gin made the production of cotton very profitable, then southern states did not want it to die out.. That is they way it goes...& what happened to .."slavery"?
.....The worst war we have ever been in was fought over it... Killed the highest percentage of the U.S. population of any war past, present, or in the future..(some might argue that the Civil War was not over slavery, but the right of
states to succeed if they wanted to..but why did they want to?..slavery that is why)

[Skittles]

16. well THAT was something not forseen by our "brilliant" Founding Fathers

and hoo boy does it ever STINK

[coti]

19. Yeah, it's a catch-22. We may have to find an extra-Constitutional

means of making changes at some point, if we can't find a way to pressure them to give up their unfair advantage.

[moose65]

23. Interesting

In the first census in 1790, Virginia was the largest state by far, with a population of almost 750,000. The smallest state was Delaware, at just over 59,000. There were 16 states by then - Vermont, Kentucky, and Maine had joined the original 13.

Virginia was 12.65 times larger than Delaware. I doubt that the Founders could have envisioned that in 2020 the largest state would be 70 times larger than the smallest.

[moose65]

4. Maybe you should proofread this

Is it 46,000 votes or 44,000? You use both numbers.

Is it 4 states or 3? You include Vermont in your title but then only talk about 3 states when making your point.

Biden won Vermont by 130,000 votes, so I’m not quite sure why you included Vermont.

[Stuart G]

5. I included Vermont, because the original numbers were off...I am sorry for my mistake..

They were not off by much, but Vermont had to be included to correct the mistake...again..sorry

[Dem2]

6. Also, small vote differences can be big percentages in small (population) states

36k in Alaska is a 10% margin

59k in NH is a 7.3% margin

99k in Montana is a 16% margin

78k in Maine is a 10% margin

96k in Delaware is a 19% margin

Vote margin - not a good indicator.

[Stuart G]

7. While vote margins may not be a good indicator, they are what they are..

Even if a state is close, all the electoral votes go to the winner of that state.....YES ALL GO TO THE WINNER

Skittles points this out in post number 2

[Dem2]

9. It IS the one case where a vote in a large state can have more weight than a vote in a small state

The whole system is quite bizarre when one analyzes it using modern ideas of fairness.

[Stuart G]

11. Of course the system by modern ideas is "bizarre" but this idea is very important:

This was they way that these ideas were dealt with in the 1780s..Small states like Vermont and Rhode Island, were totally frightened of the larger more populated states like New York and Pennsylvania..That is why deals like this were made. More important, the Constitution needed to be written and approved because the states were fighting each other in a number of ways economically and politically
...Yes, I studied this and taught this for many years. Most people forgot what they learned about this, or never were taught. I taught it over and over because Constitution Tests were required in Illinois where I taught and I thought these ideas were important to understand the reasons why certain ideas were in the Constitution in the first place.

.................................. Oh MY............. .....too much... ...

[Talitha]

17. Wow... just WOW!!!

[RANDYWILDMAN]

20. in Certain states it does...

wow the Electoral college really takes my vote for granted.

Biden won Oregon by 16 points

We have not had a presidential candidate visit Oregon since 2008 primary and it was Obama and he was great.


5 Million vote win for Biden and really we were 100k from losing the overall election, That is totally fucked up !!! Some Voters count much more then others and that is why are current system is garbage.