General Discussion
Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsThis Map Shows Where You Can Buy Legal Weed Now in the United States
Despite the protestations of policy experts, medical professionals, and dedicated activists around the country, the federal government continues to classify marijuana as a schedule 1 narcotic. The DEA defines that particular class of substances as drugs with no currently accepted medical use and a high potential for abuse, a phrase that quite objectively does not describe marijuana. But despite the federal governments intransigence, it appears that more and more Americans arent taking Reefer Madness as gospel.
Yesterday, with minutes to spare, New Jersey legislators passed the laws that will govern the legal sale of marijuana for adult use in the Garden State. The legislation came after voters overwhelmingly passed a referendum last November, as did their peers in four other states. And while you cant yet buy legal weed in New Jersey, it is now officially decriminalized, and the rules that the legal cannabis industry will have to follow in the Garden State are now in place.
A handful of other states across the country that have already legalized and decriminalized the drug for recreational and medical use, suggesting that voters have changed their minds about whether marijuana is a gateway drug and whether people deserve to go to jail for possessing it.
And then theres the money. Part of the reason voters like legalizing weed is the demonstrated impact it can have on the economy. After Colorado legalized weed, the state gave the tax dollars from weed sales to their public school systems to the tune of $160 million in the first five years. The states that are joining Colorado can expect to see a similar economic boom from the legalized, taxed, and regulated sale of the drug.
https://www.msn.com/en-us/lifestyle/parenting/this-map-shows-where-you-can-buy-legal-weed-now-in-the-united-states/ar-BB1aHkur?li=BBnba9O&ocid=DELLDHP
lagomorph777
(30,613 posts)Now the Commonwealth is working out how to license and tax it.
PoliticAverse
(26,366 posts)Treefrog
(4,170 posts)ignore it. There are a number of recreational stores in the area.
kcr
(15,318 posts)it's only a matter of time before it's decriminalized at the federal level.
PoliticAverse
(26,366 posts)LizBeth
(9,952 posts)WA-03 Democrat
(3,052 posts)They are the same as Mississippi.
NNadir
(33,532 posts)My fellow citizens disagreed with me, but I'm not happy about legal weed.
Beetwasher.
(2,979 posts)Or should that also be illegal? Cigarettes? The difference as I see it is, alcohol and tobacco are far more dangerous with far more negative societal and individual health consequences, so what is so awful and dangerous about weed that it needs to be in a different category than alcohol and tobacco?
NNadir
(33,532 posts)Look, cigarettes killed my father. I am acutely aware of how deadly they are.
I cannot stand to be in a room where tobacco products are in use. All of the tax money collected from cigarette sales will never address the human cost.
I'm told my grandfather used to beat the shit out of my grandmother, my father, my aunts and uncles while drunk - during prohibition.
I'm not naïve about pot. I'm not young; I hate to admit it, but when I was a kid, a big time activity that we all engaged in was attending Grateful Dead concerts. Very few people ever actually realized that they were seldom in tune.
There are lots of legal things that are bad for people. That doesn't mean that we should encourage that people embrace more things that are bad for you.
The fact that more people die from drowning than die from volcanos does not represent an endorsement of building cities closer to volcanoes because cities near water have death rates from drownings.
OK?
obamanut2012
(26,087 posts)Beetwasher.
(2,979 posts)Your son is right, and you're wrong, and a hypocrite. If society is ok with cigarettes and alcohol as personal choices, then so should weed use be a personal choice. You know, what you do with your body and all is your business. Sort of a progressive value. Glad most of the folks in NJ are way more sensible than you are. And good for your son not standing for your hypocrisy!
"The fact that more people die from drowning than die from volcanos does not represent an endorsement of building cities closer to volcanoes because cities near water have death rates from drownings."
No, I guess we should make volcanoes and water illegal, according to your logic.
NNadir
(33,532 posts)I really, really, really don't enjoy talking to stoners.
They almost never can think straight. QED.
Beetwasher.
(2,979 posts)Irrelevant thing off the list and ignored all the actual facts and evidence.
Response to Beetwasher. (Reply #29)
Post removed
Beetwasher.
(2,979 posts)BannonsLiver
(16,411 posts)Weak, reefer madness arguments.
USALiberal
(10,877 posts)myccrider
(484 posts)Prohibition showed that making alcohol illegal didnt solve the problem of alcoholism, it just fueled a black market that fueled and gave economic power to criminal gangs, i.e. The Mafia, who used their clout to infiltrate and corrupt the rest of society, especially government - because bribery and violence work to an uncomfortable degree.
Keeping prostitution illegal doesnt stop the sale of sex, it just leaves the "industry" largely unregulated and controlled by violence and greed and criminal gangs and encourages the corruption of other parts of society, while leaving its workers and clients largely unprotected.
Same for gambling.
IMO, the best way to deal with this kind of human behavior is through reasonable regulation, education of the public and medical treatment, if necessary. One thing that might help in that regard would be to prohibit or tightly regulate almost all forms of advertisement for cigarettes, alcohol and other drugs, sex trade, etc.
And marijuana is probably the least personally destructive and by far the least addictive of such drugs. Study of its medical properties has been almost completely suppressed by its status, too. I use it for health problems that prescription drugs have been unable to adequately address and Im not alone in that.
Of course, then theres the problem of the use of such laws in the oppression of minorities and economically disenfranchised groups, but thats another discussion.
Elessar Zappa
(14,016 posts)NNadir
(33,532 posts)I don't believe that substance abuse - of any substance - should be addressed by prison, but that is a different issue than making substance abuse easier to embrace.
Elessar Zappa
(14,016 posts)I dont like it because it gives me a headache but I dont see it as a societal ill.
Beetwasher.
(2,979 posts)who used it. Guess that's not a problem for this poster.
NNadir
(33,532 posts)Google scholar is your friend.
If one searches the terms marijuana brains adolescents, and chooses to look at titles published since 2017, one will get 17,400 hits.
https://scholar.google.com/scholar?as_ylo=2017&q=marijuana+brains+adolescents&hl=en&as_sdt=0,31
It's not like this subject is not studied. It is.
Not all of them, of course, say the same thing, nor should they: That's science.
I am very fortunate inasmuch as I have excellent access to the full scientific literature, in which I spend a very large portion of my life.
I won't tell you that I'm an expert on pot, since I really don't care about it all that much as long as I am clear with the people that I love that I oppose its use, but that said, I have reviewed a portion of the literature on the topic for the purpose of talking to my sons - both of whom are now men and can do what they want in New Jersey.
Is marijuana the worst problem in substance abuse? No, probably not. That distinction belongs to either cigarettes or alcohol, both of which are perfectly legal although restricted by law - but seldom by practice - to adults. The fact that alcohol and cigarettes are legal and are worse substance abuse problems than pot doesn't, to my mind, indicate that legal access is a good idea. Arguably it is a case for the opposite.
In my life I've heard so many claims not only that pot isn't bad for you but rather it is good for you. I've known enough stoners in my life to question that assumption. I don't enjoy speaking with people who are stoned.
Cuthbert Allgood
(4,928 posts)Treefrog
(4,170 posts)Why do you oppose it?
obamanut2012
(26,087 posts)No, really, why?
NNadir
(33,532 posts)Alcohol is a much worse substance abuse problem than pot. Alcohol is legal.
Is this an endorsement of legal pot?
Cigarettes are a far worse substance abuse problem than pot. Cigarettes are legal.
Is this also an endorsement of legal pot?
Except in some Muslim countries, alcohol is legal and has long been socially acceptable for generations. It does, nonetheless, generate a high social cost.
My father used to call his cigarettes "cancer sticks" and "coffin nails" but nevertheless smoked them almost constantly. The social cost of this substance abuse problem involved the quarter of a million dollars in resources it took for him to die, an ugly death, in great pain.
Look, if someone grows pot in their basement and gets high all the time, so long as they don't drive while wasted, I can live with it.
I probably wouldn't want to engage or spend time with people who do this, but I have enough of a (gasp) libertarian view to not endorse breaking down the door and hauling the person off to prison for doing that, but it doesn't imply that I would feel compelled to value interacting with that person either.
I don't believe that punitive approaches to addressing substance abuse are wise, the limitation being that if someone kills or injures someone while drunk, or stoned, or otherwise impaired, well then it's still murder.
The historical result of an attempt to deal with alcohol through punitive approaches failed, clearly. Arguably the attempt to control pot through punitive approaches has also failed. On the other hand, an introduced substance abuse problem that arose without strong cultural precedence is tobacco abuse, which was not known throughout the world until the "discovery" of the "New World" and the introduction of the practice to acquisitive colonialist Europeans by Native Americans probably represents an element of revenge.
Was making tobacco use culturally acceptable a good idea or a bad idea?
When pot stores open in New Jersey, as they now will, pot use will become more culturally acceptable, open, and use will increase. I don't think it's a good idea to do this.
USALiberal
(10,877 posts)Midnight Writer
(21,771 posts)Meanwhile, people are still being locked up for doing what people in other states are doing routinely.
I would never advise anyone to smoke pot, but I sure the hell would not send them to prison for it.
Voltaire2
(13,095 posts)I agree, the best advice is chow down!
Arthur_Frain
(1,855 posts)I note that UT is depicted as medical marijuana only. The last time I checked, it looked like they were getting ready to do the right wing SOP in this situation, which is throw a sop by making it technically legal, but then not issuing any licenses for dispensaries to operate anywhere in the state. I defy you to find a dispensary in UT where you can buy medical mj. You wont find one, and you arent going to.
Exceptionally stupid, even for the Mormons, but like everything else, when they finally have no choice because its been legalized at a national level, UT will then only sell from state run dispensaries, and only if the church gets all the profit.
Wyoming, Idaho, the Dakotas, pretty much the same.
Greybnk48
(10,168 posts)for recreational use for 21+ y/o.
roamer65
(36,745 posts)You can have 12 plants at home for personal use.
Shanti Shanti Shanti
(12,047 posts)regnaD kciN
(26,044 posts)...because, whatever the state laws may be, cannabis remains illegal nationwide at a federal level. All it would take is a conservative administration with the will to crack down to wipe the whole system out. (Frankly, I thought AG Sessions was going to do so remember, hes the guy who said he thought the KKK was all right until he found out some of its members smoked pot but it appears Trump vetoed his attempt at a crackdown.)