Why do the cops come on so aggro?

[cyclonefence]

In every one of these killings, and in the traffic stop of the serviceman, the cop making the first contact seems enraged right from the get-go. What's going on? None of the reasons for stopping any of these folks was for a violent crime. Are the police trained to be aggressive to the point of (seemingly) blind rage from the very first contact?

If the initial contact had been calm and (dare I say it) respectful, how different the outcomes would have been! Plus, as I understand it, in all these recent cases, the cops had identifying information about the "perpetrators," making an instant arrest not necessary, if anything more than a ticket was necessary.

As a white woman who has been stopped a couple of times for speeding (and who has driven countless times with expired tags and inspection stickers, not to mention burnt-out taillights), I have never ever been approached by a cop this way. It's strictly "license and registration, ma'am, and proof of insurance. Do you know why I stopped you?" The biggest discourtesy I've ever suffered is being called by my first name by a cop young enough to be my grandchild.

[WhiskeyGrinder]

1. The entire concept of policing in the U.S. is a white surpemacist institution, partially based on

a deeply held belief that Black people and otherwise marginalized people must be "made" to "behave," that they need to be controlled.

[Watchfoxheadexplodes]

4. Seems if that were the case all other races in law enforcement

Would quit.

[Elessar Zappa]

7. No.

The amount of minorities in law enforcement is irrelevant when discussing systemic problems.

[WhiskeyGrinder]

8. People participate in systems of their own oppression all the time, for a variety of reasons.

[Solomon]

42. Something a lot of people don't

understand.

[BannonsLiver]

10. +1

It’s a child like oversimplification of a complex issue.

[Treefrog]

14. This.

+1

[jimfields33]

2. Traffic stops are the most dangerous for cops or so it's been said

We’ve lost 11 cops in Florida this year so far.


https://spacecoastdaily.com/2021/03/attorney-general-moody-issues-update-on-record-amount-of-2021-florida-law-enforcement-officer-deaths/

[we can do it]

9. Domestics are more dangerous.

They create their own problems on many “traffic stops”.

[jimfields33]

17. That's an excellent point.

[brush]

19. Agreed. It seems to me officers should not approach...

a car stopped by presenting themselves full-on to the driver's window thereby creating an easy target if the driver has intent to harm the officer. Why not approach no further than the rear fender request the driver to show hands before anything else is done?

[greenjar_01]

3. 1312

[Aviation Pro]

5. PEDs

Steroids.

[Treefrog]

15. I do agree on this. Look at the size of these guys compared to cops of earlier years.

Roid rage is real.

[Claire Oh Nette]

30. This...

Another poster in another thread pointed out that many, many cops are gym rats (probably the same subset who peaked with high school football) and 'roided up.

The Lieutenant faced almost immediate hostility because he drove with hazards on for 100 seconds after the cops hit their lights. As a woman, I'd make the Army officer's decision, too. (My mother taught me that, if you get pulled over, drive to a safe well lighted place. Not hard in the suburbs.) What angers me about that, aside from the assault, was the assumption he was a specialist or corporal. Even I recognize officer insignia. In the 2019 Floyd arrest, the officer grew hostile and angry in seconds, issuing conflicting commands, as though daring Floyd to move at all.

If they're going to police for drugs and alcohol, then yes, the police should be randomly drug tested, and mandatory testing after any shots fired incident. They have to account for every shot, don't they?

[Jerry2144]

6. Thank you, Jesus

Your most rapid of fundamentalists are the cause of most of the world’s problems

[Hekate]

35. How did you get that out of the OP? "Rapid fundamentalists"?

Speedy fundies — that’s a new one.

[Jerry2144]

40. Dang auto correct

I meant rabid. Auto correct now tried to make it rabbi. Dang, computers are now putting words in our mouths.

[dawg day]

11. Roid rage?

You're right-- they seem to come into these encounters already enraged.

I once was stopped (also white woman-- did not fully stop at a 4-way stop) by a cop who stayed way to the back of my car, hand on his gun. It was scary-- I had my little kids in the backseat. He didn't even give me a ticket because he was too cautious-- didn't want to come up to my window. Later I learned that they were all on full alert because of that spree killer who ended up killing Versace was supposed to be travelling through town.

I'm still not sure why he thought this young mom in a minivan might be the killer.

Another time I was about a block from my house and there was a squad car at the intersection blocking traffic. I tried to go around him. (I know, I shouldn't have, but I didn't realize he meant to block off the street.) He jumped out of the car and ran after me screaming, and when I stopped, he ran up with his nightstick out like he might break my window. "Why did you disobey me!" He ranted for several minutes, always brandishing that nightstick. I imagine if I hadn't been a young mom in a minivan, he might have actually used it. He was FURIOUS.

"Being disobeyed" or perceiving disobedience seems to be a trigger for some of them.

[The Magistrate]

18. That Killer, Ma'am, Might Have Hiding On Your Back-Seat's Floor

And popped up like a jack-in-the-box with an Uzi if the officer had come near your car.

An officer can't be too careful --- the whole world's out to kill police at the drop of a hat, and anything can happen.

This is not mere humor, it is part of police training, and deeply ingrained in police culture. In effect, they are trained to be cowards....

[misanthrope]

22. That's it. "Contempt of cop"

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Contempt_of_cop

[tenderfoot]

12. I think it's the kind of people (bullies/authoritarians) that go into law enforcement

Too many horrible people want to be cops.

[Withywindle]

37. Anecdata, but: I had a friend in college who wanted to be a cop for a while

He was Puerto Rican, from New York, wanted to help his community. He didn't pass the psychological profile test: basically he was too compassionate and kind. He became an EMT instead and I think he's much happier that way.

[Buckeye_Democrat]

13. Some of them are aggressive immediately, and others...

... become aggressive after suspects repeatedly demonstrate aggression and belligerence.

The latter cops can go too far as well, from what I've observed in various videos, but their behavior makes more sense to me sometimes.

When I've worked in quality control, I became quite upset at some employees who frequently acted belligerent towards me for doing my routine checks. And they tended to be the same production workers who made the most mistakes too. They despised me because I might find yet another mistake by them, which could then result in more reprimands from their supervisors or worse. Several
of them seemed to think I was "picking on them", which wasn't true at all. I followed routines and treated everyone the same, and they just sucked at their jobs compared to others.

No guns or physical restraining was involved in those situations, thankfully!

[jcgoldie]

16. I think that a certain personality type often pursues career in law enforcement

I'm not saying its all cops or even most but I certainly think that its significantly higher than the population as a whole, the number of law enforcement officers who feel a need to assert some level of control over others often due to some self esteem issues. I think it manifests itself violently when they don't feel their authority is being respected. Throw in racism and you have a recipe for some of the shit we are seeing. Shit thats probably always went on in the shadows but is now out in the light due to cell phone videos and body cameras. Just my amateur psycho-theorizing worth about nothing I suppose...

[misanthrope]

23. I've often believed some of those who want most badly to be in law enforcement

are exactly those who don't need to be. I've known too many who wanted to use it to make up for "control" or self-esteem issues. Then again, I've known others who sincerely wanted to help their community.

It's hard finding people who want to be cops. It's a stressful, dangerous and poorly paying job where a great number of your interactions with others have a negative tone. It also breeds a lot of cynicism as you quickly discover the three truths in most disagreements or crimes: my truth, your truth and the whole truth.

It's not a good job and it's no wonder it sometimes attracts the people it does.

[jmowreader]

20. This is why

I'm not going to post the video, but if you go to YouTube and feed in "2010 West Memphis police shootings" you'll find it.

On May 20, 2010, two sovereign citizens, Jerry Kane Jr. and his son Joseph, were "traveling" (SC slang for unlicensed driving) a minivan with homemade license plates on it through West Memphis, Arkansas. (Memphis, TN, and West Memphis, AR, basically touch each other...it's like St. Louis/East St. Louis or the two Kansas Cities.) The West Memphis police pulled the van over, and while the officers were talking to Jerry behind the van Joe jumped out with an AK-47 and slaughtered both officers. The Kanes then fled to Walmart, where a game warden rammed their van and shot them dead with his duty rifle.

Since that time, the police have been taking no chances whatsoever. If you look like you're going to give them even the slightest bit of trouble, they go all Rambo on your ass.

[maxsolomon]

21. Their training teaches them that intimidation of everyone is warranted and appropriate.

It also inculcates a paranoia that is out of proportion to the threat.

Not that there isn't a threat in a nation stuffed to the gills with semi-automatic weapons...

[misanthrope]

24. Your last point is the most important

That genie is out of the bottle.

[maxsolomon]

29. America prefers to be a nation of Binary Choices Only.

Yes, there is a threat to Police from our Gun-Crazy culture. But it isn't 100%, and it isn't 0%.

Now, the cops treat the citizenry, and black men in particular, as if they were a 100% threat.

So now we're in a situation where black men are convinced they're about to be shot dead regardless, so they panic and attempt to flee, and then they're shot dead. Seems to me their fears are rational.

[stillcool]

25. steroids and the mentality that goes with them...

Lots of inferiority complexes, which I think draws them to police work, where they have some power over others. I bet lots of them tortured animals as kids.

[DetroitLegalBeagle]

26. Because going home at the end of your shift

is the absolute highest priority in policing. Everything else comes second.

[Chakaconcarne]

27. Their job is risky and they deal with a lot of bullshit.....day in and day out...

I couldn't even pretend to know what it's like to be a cop....what they see, experience, the ebb and flow of stress and varying emotion...

Not all cops are bad, but some pockets of American culture shape who they are and their responses to situations which I believe many are rooted in just trying to keep alive. It has to be taxing.

[Mysterian]

32. Not even in the top 10 most dangerous jobs

https://www.cnbc.com/2019/12/27/the-10-most-dangerous-jobs-in-america-according-to-bls-data.html

[misanthrope]

33. I wonder how they pay in relationship to law enforcement

Some of those pay fairly well.

[Mysterian]

41. Logging? #1

Doesn't pay shit. Most of the more dangerous jobs pay less than police.

[Withywindle]

38. This list here has it at #22

Not even top 20!


https://www.ishn.com/articles/112748-top-25-most-dangerous-jobs-in-the-united-states


I'm not saying they don't face a lot of risk on the job. Of course they do. But the mythologizing is way out of proportion to the reality.

[Mysterian]

31. Because they're insecure assholes who became police for power-tripping

And love to pretend they're soldiers.

[Sympthsical]

34. Too many police think assertion of authority means assholery

It does not. I understand that police are authority figures, and they want that authority deferred to when they're acting in an official capacity. (Which is a whole other topic, because there are too many times where there is no good reason to defer to their authority because they're acting outside the capacity of it).

But I wonder a bit if this is a cultural thing. In a lot of movies, you see assertion of authority - especially in male characters - as being this huge, difficult hard ass. "He takes no bullshit!"

Yeah. In real life, authority can be asserted in many different ways that aren't aggressive. I had this boss once. When you walked into a room, you knew he was in charge. He never raised his voice, abused or bullied anyone. He just had this way of talking, of phrasing his sentences. It brokered no question that the final say in matters was his. It was really impressive, actually.

But too many cops see, "Go be a total asshole!" in TV and films and figure that's how it's done.

If only there were some random thing that addressed and corrected that. You know, some kind of . . . I dunno . . . training or something. Where certified people tell them not to do that.

Pipe dreams, eh?

[Vinca]

36. I've said the exact same thing to my husband. I was especially bothered by the nutzoid cop who

stopped the Army officer. That was such an easy, no brainer, traffic stop. You ask the guy for his license and reg., tell him why you stopped him, when he tells you about the temporary plate you check it, you give him back his license and reg. and say thank you it seems to be in order, apologize for the inconvenience and wish him a good rest of his day. End of stop. I think it's nothing short of a miracle that poor man wasn't shot. The nutzoid cop was bad, but the other one - the baby cop - looked like he was holding a gun for the first time in his life and didn't have a clue what to do. He could have fired off a round with just a little twitch. It's just crazy.

[Johnny2X2X]

39. Cops get terrorized from Day 1 of training

They spend a lot of their training viewing videos of cops getting killed. They get refreshers on the ways cops can be killed throughout their time on the job. Basically they get terrified into being aggressive. When you're scared everything gets dealt with with extreme force and mistakes happen.

[hvn_nbr_2]

43. If they're screaming and cursing, they're not policing. They're bullying. nt