Kemp signs bill allowing people to carry handguns without a license in Georgia into law

[Dial H For Hero]

https://www.fox5atlanta.com/news/kemp-constitutional-carry-bill-allowing-handguns-without-license-georgia

ATLANTA - Gov. Brian Kemp signed a bill allowing Georgia residents to carry handguns in public without a license or background check into law Tuesday.

The Georgia Senate passed the legislation on at the beginning of April, sending it to the governor’s desk for signature.

Kemp said the bill is a public safety measure.

"SB 319 makes sure that law-abiding Georgians — law-abiding Georgians, including out daughters and your family too — can protect themselves without having the permission of the state government. The constitution of the United States gives us that right, not the government," Kemp said Tuesday. "HB 218 ensures that individuals who are licensed to carry in another state are also authorized to do so here in Georgia."

(excerpt)

[jimfields33]

1. Is that 23 states now? Kinda scary.

[Dial H For Hero]

3. 25.

[hlthe2b]

5. "kinda?" Very...

[no_hypocrisy]

2. One more state to boycott.

Yahoooooo!!!!

[Dial H For Hero]

4. Do you boycott Shall-issue states as well?

[no_hypocrisy]

11. Yes and No

Yes to no discretion shall issue to states

No to limited discretion shall issue states, and just two: Pennsylvania and Virginia. And I watch my ass there.

[Dial H For Hero]

15. If I understand you correctly, you're now boycotting almost the entire country.

Here's a map;



As I read it and your post, I believe you're saying that you are boycotting every single state in the country except for PA and VA (which are shall issue, not limited discretion issue) and whichever areas of the map are red.

First of all, I want to say that's really having the strength of your convictions. No sarcasm, very few people will hold to a principle that strongly.

How does this work in practice? Are you not willing to travel through areas on this map which aren't yellow or red (VA and PA aside)? Do you also boycott products from these areas to the best of your ability?

[no_hypocrisy]

17. Just about. Sticking to NJ and NY mostly.

[Celerity]

24. May-issue, May-issue (No-issue in practice) & No-issue are the only 3 correct options (Vermont is a

horrid model to base anything off of for guns)



The 2nd Amendment (as wrongly interpreted) will end up being a national suicide pact.

[ripcord]

26. Make sure you stay out of California

We may have strict gun laws but the majority of the counties are Permissive May-issue (Shall-issue in practice).

[Celerity]

28. I have no plans to move back to the US anytime soon. Los Angeles is the only place

I actually lived there (born there, thus my US citizenship, but my parents moved us back to London before I was 2yo, and then 2 years in Marina del Rey, whilst I read for my MBA).

Have been to other states (NY, NJ, CT, VA, MD, PA, MA, RI, NC, GA, FL, AZ, OR, WA, plus DC and lastly, IL, if you count O'Hare airport, lolol).

Also have been to Vancouver, Toronto, Montreal, and Quebec City in Canada.

Only places in North America I would consider living in would be LA, San Diego, the SF Bay area, Portland, Seattle, Boston, DC, and the most likely, Vancouver.

Hard pass on NYC.

But none of the above is very likely atm.

I would rather live in some parts of Eastern Europe (barring full regional war now) than the US Midwest or the South.

[Straw Man]

60. I'm disputing that map's findings ...

... re my county in upstate NY. It is listed as "May Issue" when it is actually "Permissive May Issue."

[Dial H For Hero]

61. Well, it is from Wikipedia, and that particular classification is somewhat open to

interpretation.

[MagickMuffin]

6. Bang BANG Shoot em up

These corrupt governors will day wish they had at least a smidge of common sense.


I guess we'll wait and see how justice is meted out between certain groups.


Does this mean that the gun laws that were created for the War on Drugs around schools are no longer valid?

[lapfog_1]

8. always make me of this

[pwb]

7. Think I will get out my Fanner 50 and

take a walk. What fun?

[sop]

9. Gun violence spiraling out of control, bodies piling up and Georgia yahoos pass this, and call it a

"public safety measure."

[grumpyduck]

10. All I wish on these assholes

is karma.

[budkin]

12. This shit is just insane

Think about it

[lpbk2713]

13. "The bill is a public safety measure." File under "Oxymoron".

Especially under the moron part.

No background checks is really stupid.

[ForgedCrank]

16. That isn't

how this works.
The only difference is that now, you can carry without the local government taxing you for the piece of paper.
All gun purchases still require an FBI background check, and felons are still prohibited from owning them.
Felons and criminals weren't applying for permits before this either, it was basically just a tax on everyone else.

[sop]

19. It's more than "the local government taxing you for a piece of paper."

Not all gun purchases require an FBI background check; people buy guns face-to-face, at gun shows and by responding to personal ads on internet sites all the time. (The gun show loophole must be closed.)

Concealed carry permits require undergoing a training session with a certified instructor, background checks, fingerprinting by the authorities and an ID with a photograph. CC permits involve more extensive background checks than simple gun purchases.

A lot of people can legally buy a gun, but don't meet the requirements for a CC permit. Prior to this law, it was a felony if one was caught carrying a concealed firearm without a CC permit. This insane law now allows any yahoo to walk around with a concealed weapon.

[ForgedCrank]

20. Any yahoo is

the typical American citizen.
And many states, mine included, have never required training or anything to get a CC permit. It was literally just a tax and wait system.
It is already a crime to knowingly sell a firearm to a felon, and it is already a crime for a felon to buy one. It is also a crime to buy in another state and transport without the intervention of a licensed FFL. And these are very serious crimes at that. The 4473 already does the background checks every time you buy a firearm as well.
The permit process did little (if anything at all) to keep firearms out of the hands of criminals and felons, all it did was force everyone else to cough up cash and pay the local government for the privilege. There have also been no measurable negative consequences from all the states who have already long ago passed permit-less carry laws. It just doesn't really change anything significant other than removing the fees that low income folks couldn't afford.

[sop]

21. "The 4473 already does the background checks every time you buy a firearm as well."

That's not true. I know a lot of guys who bought handguns from friends, relatives and from perfect strangers, through face-to-face transactions at gun shows and by responding to ads on internet sites. And if this is about fees "that low income folks couldn't afford," then just drop the fees, not the stringent requirements for concealed carry.

"There have also been no measurable negative consequences from all the states who have already long ago passed permit-less carry laws." Not true. Publicly available data from local agencies, the FBI, and other national databases suggests that CC laws have led to negative consequences for safety in states where enacted. Three categories of violent gun-related crime have increased since their implementation: gun homicides, aggravated assaults that involve a gun, and gun-related homicides and assaults against law enforcement officers.

"Felons can already buy guns" is a strawman argument. Gun laws do not prevent all crime, but they do reduce violent gun crimes.

[ForgedCrank]

25. I disagree

on almost all those assumptions.
It is a fact that crime rises and calms in cycles, it always has.
If you can show that there is a measurable rise in crime committed with concealed firearms by non-felons without a permit, I'll concede on that subject, but it's simply not measurable.
And on the point of private gun sales, as I mentioned, it is already a serious felony to sell or buy any firearm if a felon or prohibited person is involved. My comments regarding the 4473 were obviously addressing firearms purchased through any FFL, which is the vast majority of gun sales. I've purchased several firearms from private sellers and every single one of them asked me for ID and asked me if I was prohibited. I'm not saying all people do this, but regular civilians and gun owners are very cautious. When I purchased guns from private sellers, I even submitted the serial numbers to local police to check for any reports of them being stolen, something I was advised by other gun owners to do. Most people who aren't a criminal do these things.
And it is a statement of fact when I say felons can already acquire guns and will continue to do so regardless of the laws. It is exactly what they do, they are criminals by definition, they don't care about laws.

[TeamProg]

30. It's hardly a consolation to parents that their kid was killed by a LEGAL gun owner.

See how that works?

[ForgedCrank]

34. "It's hardly a consolation to parents that their kid was killed by a LEGAL gun owner"

I never said it was.

[TeamProg]

29. I seem to recall that most of the mass shootings of recent were done by legal owners of the weapons.

So the gun-death-broken family-economic costs problem of firearms is the simple fact that there are too many in too many hands.

Hand guns, auto reloading and high capacity rifles should all be illegal.

Only bolt action, single load, black powder, muskets or lever action rifles should be legal.

Bolt and lever actions are higher tech weapons than when the Constitution was written.

[ForgedCrank]

33. That is

a fact when we are talking about mass shooters. Some (I don't know the ratio) have minimal or even no criminal history at all. These are people who would have been able to purchase a gun legally and get a CC permit without issue.
I'm not sure how requiring citizens to go through a permit process to legally carry a firearm would or could prevent any of that.

"Bolt and lever actions are higher tech weapons than when the Constitution was written."

As unpopular as it is to point it out, the 2nd Amendment was written to include (among other things) a means for the citizens to confront a corrupted government that may decide to stop recognizing our rights as individuals. All of these ideals are clearly defined by the originators in the federalists writings. Newer technology does not nullify the the intent in 2A anymore than any other protected right.

I know you are going to disagree, but that is my view on the subject, and it's unlikely to change. There is no answer to the issue of violence that effectively solves all the the problems and consequences. I see 2A as about as close as we can get.

[TeamProg]

35. Freedom of speech has also been regulated through laws, we can regulate firearms as intended as well

but we need the political leadership to step it up.

[ForgedCrank]

36. 2A rights are

also regulated through laws.
It is illegal to commit violence against others using a firearm or anything else.
There are thousands of laws regulating firearms and their use as well.

[TeamProg]

37. Yes and the laws aren't working so we need to REGULATE the types of firearms that people

can own.

No other developed nation has the same serious gun problems that we do.

States with the loosest gun laws have the highest gun related deaths per capita.

Like I said, we need the political leaders to step up and get rid of handguns and high capacity auto loaders.

I've got meet some freinds for breakfast. Can't respond to this any more. You aren't really addressing the gun death problem anyway.

[ForgedCrank]

38. "States with the loosest gun laws have the highest gun related deaths per capita"

That is completely misleading.
Just two examples, Chicago and New York City have among the strictest gun laws in the nation and represent the lions share of all the gun crimes in the entire respective states. And this isn't unique to those cities either.
And if you wish to completely ban guns and focus on the machines rather than the nutty people who commit the violence, and thats what it sounds like, then you and I can never agree on the subject. I firmly believe in our rights as written in The Constitution and do not agree that disarming me and those like me will reduce gun violence in any way.

[TeamProg]

39. Getting rid of guns will stop gun deaths. People can travel within a state just like weapons.

Local city laws mean very little if the state has loose gun laws.

Here's the list of states with a handy colored map, too!

https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/pressroom/sosmap/firearm_mortality/firearm.htm

Illinois has about the same rate per capita as Indiana and far mroe people!

The Nutty people that you refer to can get guns waaay too easy. So, ban hand guns and autoloading rifles.
Regulate the hell out of firearms.

Gun nuts are paranoid, but mostly just

[Dial H For Hero]

40. You have to know that there isn't the slightest chance of banning handguns and semiauto rifles, let

alone such a law passing constitutional muster.

[TeamProg]

44. Just need the political leadership. The Constitution is a living document and amendable.

Perhaps finally, after so many millions are killed by legal gun owners, when gun deaths get to within 2 degrees of every person in this country, maybe something will be done.


Then we'll all say, " why didn;t we do THIS earlier? So many lives could have been saved".

[Dial H For Hero]

45. Repealing or amending the 2A requires 2/3rds of both Houses of Congress

and 3/4ths of the state legislatures. Technically possible, but for a hot button issue like guns? No way, no how.

[TeamProg]

51. Like I said, when gun deaths are two degrees from every American's family, the hot button will

melt away.

[intelpug]

55. Bill of rights

Just an inquiry, We often hear that the second amendment should be repealed,modified,etc.because the constitution contains a mechanism to change it. Now since we have a bill of rights contained within the constitution my question is can the bill of rights its self be changed by amendment or does it stand separate from the rest of the constitution? are there parts of the constitution that are amendable and other parts that are not? It would seem that if the founders intended for the bill of rights to be subject also to an amendment process then none of the rights listed are in fact really rights but rather are conditional privileges subject to change. Does the bill of rights stand as a separate document on it's own or is it inextricably bound to the rest of the constitution as far as amendment purposes go?

[ForgedCrank]

41. I dont buy that argument

because you can expand it indefinitely.
What if all guns were banned in the US? Then the excuse would be Mexico or Canada. Fully automatic weapons have been used at massacres all over the planet and even places where guns ARE banned. Banning them does nothing but strip the innocent of their right to protect themselves. Just ask the Ukrainians how they feel about that right now.
The raw fact of the matter is that some people are evil and shitty, and it's not something we can "fix", we can only react to it when we identify it. Banning firearms will not solve the root problem.

[yonder]

14. Next up: flamethowers and mortars for all. Yay for public safety.

[sop]

23. The next thing will be suppressors (silencers) and fully automatic weapons without permits.

[maxsolomon]

50. I keep waiting for the "full-automatics shall not be infringed" argument

from the RTKBA Absolutists, but it never comes.

I think that even gunners know that full-autos should not be widely available; Americans (MALE Americans) are too prone to violence, too irresponsible, and too impulsive.

[Niphu]

18. Crazy

But then again, he's a republican. It is to be expected.

[Kaleva]

22. Following in the footsteps of Vermont

[ripcord]

31. Hopefully they are

Vermont is in the middle of the list of states when it comes to gun violence. I notice people who talk against legal concealed carry would rather not discuss Vermont carry. I have a concealed carry permit, the sheriff of my county in southern California thinks everyone qualified should get one if they want. Considering we are the largest county in the lower 48 and overwhelmingly rural desert with the number of meth labs and illegal pots grows many people prefer to have a gun in the vehicle especially when sightseeing in remote areas or off roading.

[Saboburns]

27. Hasn't it ALWAYS been legal to carry a firearm openly in Georgia?

The Second Amendment is very clear on this issue. Or is this a law about carrying a CONCEALED weapon?

[Kaleva]

32. I think it pretains to conceal carry

[maxsolomon]

42. Let me know when the Defensive Gun Uses outnumber

the Offensive Gun Uses. They never will.

Liberalization of every state's gun laws to a ideal state of non-infringement won't reduce gun homicides one iota.

The 2nd Amendment is a curse. See: Brooklyn Subway Shooting, Sacramento Closing-Time Gang Shooting, etc. etc. ad nauseum ad infinitum.

[sarisataka]

46. The CDC believes

That is the case based on the report they commissioned under President Obama in 2013

Almost all national survey estimates indicate that defensive gun uses by victims are at least as common as offensive uses by criminals, with estimates of annual uses ranging from about 500,000 to more than 3 million, in the context of about 300,000 violent crimes involving firearms in 2008.

https://nap.nationalacademies.org/catalog/18319/priorities-for-research-to-reduce-the-threat-of-firearm-related-violence

They do note the broad range among studies and recommend further research.

[maxsolomon]

47. That CDC "Study" has been cited multiple times on DU,

and probably a least a couple times by you. The estimate of "more than 3 million" beggars belief, and I think you'd agree. even the low number, 500K/year, means there are nearly 1,400 DGUs per day. 3 million means OVER 8,000 a day.

Here's breakdown from a Gun-Grabber fact sheet:

A counterargument heard from gun advocates is from a “Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC) Study”
commissioned in 2013 at the direction of the Obama White House.
1) The “CDC Study” is neither a study nor from the CDC. Rather, it is a review of the literature published by the
Institute of Medicine and National Research Council​.​ Its purpose was to highlight aspects of gun violence
that need further study.
2) One of the authors is Gary Kleck who cites his own flawed survey and fails to mention his bias.
3) The defensive gun use section is not new research, but is merely citing existing flawed research.
4) The Report was written in 2013, a year before the Gun Violence Archive began compiling data. The GVA’s
empirical data is more reliable than survey data in question (Kleck and NCVS) which has glaring flaws.

https://www.gvpedia.org/wp-content/uploads/2020/04/DGU-Fact-Sheet-2-Graphics-Split-Screen-Logo-April-16-2020.pdf

[sarisataka]

48. For the record

I, personally, am skeptical of the 3 million figure. I will not entirely dismiss it as statistics are not a field of expertise of mine however the number does strain credulity.

On the other hand the low end numbers also are rather implausible, such as ones that claim less than 2000 per year. I believe it was the VPC that promoted that figure but I may be wrong.

I also put no faith in GVA's numbers as they have their own flaws/bias. I have noticed several DGU incidents over the years that do not get counted for some reason. One recent one- Video shows armed robbery suspect back out after tables turned at Houston car dealership

If you read the report and look at those involved, besides Kleck there were several noteworthy gun control advocate s who helped create the report. I agree with the suggestion of more research, the first being to define what constitutes a DGU. Twice I have been armed during attempted robberies but would consider neither a DGU as I never unholstered a gun and it was a nonfactor. Others might count such incidents.

My suspicion is a truly unbiased report will have more DGUs than many folks would find comfortable. Perhaps more than the estimated number of gun related crimes, perhaps less.

Also, as you may recall, I have been and remain opposed to the growing no permit carry. I believe public carry of a weapon should require an amount of practical and legal training.

[maxsolomon]

49. Yes, there is common ground. I also wish the militia to be regulated well. It is becoming less so.

I don't know GVPedia's methodology on what counts as a DGU, but I have no issue with the true number of DGUs being whatever it is. It ain't 3 million. 2,000 is over 5 a day. Maybe that's low, IDK.

My anecdotal observation of DGUs I have learned about in my local press is that many are needless escalations. Absent a gun, several would probably have resolved themselves without fatal violence. A woman followed off a crowded public bus downtown by a street crazy; shoots him dead. A woman motorcyclist confronted by a road-raging old man in a traffic jam; shoots him dead. Neither were charged.

When all you have is a hammer, every problem looks like a nail.

[cherish44]

43. well you realize this includes all the "thugs" too right?

I mean that's why people in my little rural corner of the world have to have an arsenal of weapons....all the "thugs" roaming around wanting to sell drugs and steal their shit...

[Marthe48]

52. Another state I won't go to

Gee, will those gun-toting daughters have a say in their own health care and sex lives? What will happen if a gun-toting daugther kills her rapist father? Or is this just another fantasy law where all the bad guys are strangers?

[gldstwmn]

53. Let's let people drive without a license in Georgia and see how that works out.

[ecstatic]

54. Cool. I don't think kkkemp thought this through fully.

CAN'T WAIT for Stacey to win this year, despite qOP vote rigging.

[Greybnk48]

56. Can they bring their guns to his political rallies?

Or is that different?

[rockfordfile]

57. Republican pos making gun violence worst. Crime is up because of republican pos.

[Thtwudbeme]

58. Oh Jesus- the Old Southern "gots to protect the wimmenfolks" bullshit

I am a 7th generation Southerner--- so, no need to pull the "you hate the South" comments on me. I have lived in the South for the better part of 6 decades and have no plans to move.

law-abiding Georgians, including out daughters and your family too

[Initech]

59. What could possibly go wrong?