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Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsElon Musk gets the last laugh...
While the rest of us look on in pity
Unless you are a stockholder, in that case you are double facepalming
Link to tweet
relayerbob
(6,555 posts)USALiberal
(10,877 posts)brooklynite
(94,728 posts)Torchlight
(3,361 posts)USALiberal
(10,877 posts)FBaggins
(26,758 posts)Twitter is a pretty tough spot. They could probably win in court, but it probably won't go far enough to get there... in part because they almost certainly can't get through a trial without disclosing the bot info.
sir pball
(4,759 posts)First and foremost he literally signed a contract to buy Twitter before any of the usual due diligence stuff. All other issues aside, he made his choice.
Second, and more importantly, Elon asked for and Twitter honestly declared the number of "monetizable users". It's not the overall number of bots but rather the number of bots that are "monetizable", i.e. users, bot or human, who can click on ads. Elon's probably technically correct - it ain't 5% of Twitter that's bots. But in terms of users that can make a profit, it probably is only 5% bots and other scum, so Twitter is legally correct.
Elon has always played this "AKYUSHULLY" game, but it looks like it's gonna finally bite him the ass; ideally to the tune of $44B and serious hurt for him and Tesla.
FBaggins
(26,758 posts)Twitter very likely will be forced to reveal in court information that they didn't want to give Musk. IF it gets that far (unlikely)
Revealing that data (if it is as we assume) defeats your "bots but monetizable" because advertisers won't knowingly pay for ads delivered to a "bot that can click ads" (which would very likely be fraud if they knew it was happening - so they can't make that argument).
None of which is likely to occur because the case probably won't get that far. Twitter will cut a deal at a cheaper price.
Mike_in_LA
(187 posts)would be like, "Dammit! Didn't think about that!"
More likely that Twitter has accurate data and Elon is being a troll.
onecaliberal
(32,895 posts)weeks ago.
former9thward
(32,080 posts)We will have to wait for the trial to see who is telling the truth, if anybody.
onecaliberal
(32,895 posts)sir pball
(4,759 posts)And Twitter honestly provided that. The fact that 95% of bots aren't "monetizable", i.e. they don't click ads, apparently escaped Genius Boy.
jcgoldie
(11,646 posts)Musk shit the bed now he's trying to crawl out of it.
genxlib
(5,535 posts)Recognizing that Twitter has too many bots is very closely related to recognizing that you have to enforce standards for what can be posted.
So the reason for him backing out is almost contradictory to his reason for wanting in.
At the end of the day, anyone that runs a social media company will need to control content because there is an avalanche of shit waiting to flow through any gap.
Celerity
(43,499 posts)perfect summation of christofash Rethug 'Murica
OilemFirchen
(7,143 posts)That's not Twitter's problem. It's not likely that they'll be forced to divulge information not requested prior to a formal agreement, unless they intentionally withheld that information - which certainly doesn't seem to be the case.
The meme is, unsurprisingly, ignorant drivel.
Voltaire2
(13,159 posts)He can back out but at a minimum it is going to cost a lot of legal fees. My guess is that he will end up settling for some large fraction of the 1B penalty.
FBaggins
(26,758 posts)We don't want him owning twitter, so the best possible outcome if for him to pay much of the contracted fine for backing out.
But that isn't the best deal for Twitter. They aren't suing for a billion dollars. They're suing to get him to buy the company for what he offered (which is FAR more than the current market value - with or without the penalty).
They want as close to 44B as they can get... not to kill the deal.
moonshinegnomie
(2,487 posts)by just backing out he could be on the hook for the entire 44B.
twiter is going to sue him for specific performance which if he lose will mean he has to pay the 54.20/share
Cha
(297,655 posts)trump fan better Not "have the last laugh."
I like that.. "drivel". Boom.
Please Fight to Save Our Democracy💙 in 2022 & 2024!
Hugin
(33,202 posts)Good to know.
Musk is as usual pre-mature.
MichMan
(11,972 posts)Why hasn't Twitter stock price been going back up close to the $54 bid he made previously ? You would think investors would be buying like crazy right now in order to cash in when he loses in court, this driving the price back up.
Instead it has been going way down in value. Why?
Quixote1818
(28,968 posts)1 Billion to Twitter if he pulls out. Pretty dumb mistake.
48656c6c6f20
(7,638 posts)LetMyPeopleVote
(145,558 posts)My son and I are both corporate lawyers and we have both read the merger agreement and the letter from Musk's attorneys. My son subscribes to Matt Levine's newsletter. Levine is a former Wachtell attorney, investment banker and now has a column at Bloomberg. My son emailed to me the latest column and it is a good legal analysis of the Twitter lawsuit against Musk.
Link to tweet
https://www.bloomberg.com/opinion/articles/2022-07-09/elon-s-out?sref=1kJVNqnU#xj4y7vzkg
But the other thing that has to happen, for Twitter to get specific performance, is that the Debt Financing ... has been funded or will be funded at the Closing. Musk agreed to buy Twitter with $33.5 billion of his own money and $13 billion of debt financing from his banks, [7] and if the banks dont put up their $13 billion then he doesnt have to put up his $33.5 billion: In that case, he can pay the $1 billion to walk away.
Now, the banks have signed commitment letters obligating them to put up the money, and those commitment letters do not give the banks a ton of outs.....
This is not a perfect out: In theory, Twitter could ask a court to order Musk (to specifically perform his covenant) not to blow up his financing. There is some history of Delaware courts doing that, and of not being fooled by merger buyers who try to blow up their own financing. The banks commitment letters do not give them an out for anything that Musk does or doesnt do; if Twitter cooperates with the financing banks and a court finds that theres no cause to terminate the merger agreement, then in theory the banks should have to fund, so specific performance should still be available. But its messy, and you can sort of see a path to Musk says the deal is off, so his banks walk away, so his financing isnt available, so he doesnt have to close the deal and can get away with just paying $1 billion.
I like Twitters odds its odds of getting specific performance and making Musk close the deal in court, but I dont think anything is a certainty at this point. And obviously Musk will make this fight as unpleasant as possible; already the attorney general of Texas has opened an investigation of Twitters bot numbers in order to harass Twitter and capitalize on Musks popularity with Republican voters. I have suggested in the past that Twitters best weapon in this dispute would be banning Musk from Twitter, because he is such an addict, but in fact he recently stayed off Twitter voluntarily for nine days, which I assume he did just to prove to Twitter the company that he can survive without Twitter the product. It is all going to be pretty awful and stupid
Both my son and I believe that Musk breached the merger agreement and that the $1 billion fee is the floor that Twitter should get.
Having a former Wachtell lawyer agree with our analysis amuses me.
This litigation will be fun to watch
Hugin
(33,202 posts)Twitter Inc. seems a little above typical so far in its proactive legal stance. They have had several months to prepare and have used the time wisely. In the media at least, they have presented themselves as an earnest and open partner to the deal. Their final move so far being to secure from what youve said and is echoed in the business news as competent representation.
Musk on the other hand strikes me as the type who as he sees himself as the master of the universe will initially try to represent himself. Relying on his sense of entitlement and what his posse of supplicating yes doormats have convinced him of his infallibility in all things to carry him through. Until it doesnt impress the legal system. Whereupon he will scramble for legal aid and rightfully pay a premium for it. Which will initially buy him some time to continue feeling his oats and blabbing away making matters worse as they motion for a delay to come up to speed on his case.
Which is where I usually lose interest in the show.
Im glad youre here to talk us through the proceedings.
jmowreader
(50,562 posts)First, how could you even tell how many Twitter bots are out there? I've been told that some bots have very distinctive signatures - like tweeting at certain intervals, having a different "desktop to mobile device" tweet ratio than a typical human Twitter user does and not retweeting anything - but (1) not all humans "tweet like a human rather than a machine" and (2) it doesn't seem like a huge issue to throw a few RND commands into your bot's source code to give it a more humanistic feel. Yeah, if you named your bot account "Elon Musk Praisebot" you'll get picked off quick, but most people aren't quite that stupid.
The other: if this goes to court and Musk forces Twitter to reveal the number of bots out there, what happens if either (a) the total bot population is down around two to three percent of the total user population and/or (b) there are a ton of Musk/Tesla/SpaceX/Boring Company/other Musk-related bots?
GoneOffShore
(17,340 posts)I don't have any evidence, just a feeling.
Hugin
(33,202 posts)Edsel Muskrat.
Demsrule86
(68,667 posts)He violated confidentiality, got buyers remorse and hurt Tesla. Watch Ford and GM are going to bury him. I expect he will pay damages.
imanamerican63
(13,814 posts)As long as Trump isnt back on Twitter? I will happy if this deal doesnt get done! Musk is a rich man forcing his will on who ever he can and Twitter is like Facebook which allows people to post false statements. There is no difference between Musk and Twitter. It is all about who has the power to control people.
Sympthsical
(9,111 posts)He was able to off-load over $8 billion in Tesla stock whose options were about to expire without anyone really questioning it, because he needed the money to buy Twitter. However, if the Twitter deal falls though, he'll have to pay $1 billion.
So that's $7 billion he walks off with. The $1 billion wouldn't even really matter to him.
The lawsuits will be epic though.
The meme is really funny. "Under no circumstances should Twitter allow Musk to buy them!" Some months later. "He has to buy it!"
So much of this is tangled up in whether or not people like Musk and which scenario they perceive will hurt him more that throwing Twitter on a bonfire has become almost an ancillary consideration.
Musk will be fine. He's worth an unfathomable amount of money and doesn't care. Twitter might be less fine. A lot less fine.
But then, I'm one of those people who would be happy to see Twitter immolated. One of the worst things to happen to our culture, particularly in the realms of information and journalism. Our political discourse is now internet slap fights that have kids in high school thinking, "People really need to grow up and get a grip . . ."