Moving in to independent or assisted living.

[PoindexterOglethorpe]

Last year in November, and this year in August, my sister and I made trips to the DC area to help our brother and his wife, both 79 years old, transition to assisted living. He's legally blind. She can see just fine, but has serious mobility issues, and I am convinced she's at the beginning stages of dementia. We've helped clearing out some of the stuff from the home they've lived in for over 40 years. We found an assisted living place that is wonderful, perfect for them. But they need to clear out at least 80%, perhaps more like 90% of what's still left to be able to move into a 2 bedroom place from a two-story plus basement home that they've hoarded for decades. There is still a lot to be done.

My advice to everyone: Do NOT delay moving into Independent or Assisted living until it becomes a crisis. Plan ahead. Brother and wife are truly in a crisis situation, and it's frustrating and unnecessary. Pay attention as your ability to live on your own begins to fade, or as mobility issues happen, or as vision fades. Don't expect to stay home. Don't. Especially if you have the financial resources to live elsewhere, which they do.

I do realize that some of you reading this will simply not have the money for such a thing, and I can only offer you compassion, and the hope that you can figure something out. But others can do independent/assisted living. I think about this a lot for myself. I'm currently 74 years old, in excellent health. I live alone, which is just fine, but I'm very aware that I don't want to be in this small home when I'm in my 80s. Even now I'm not crazy about the maintenance I need to do. I have a son who lives near DC, getting a PhD in astronomy at George Mason University. When he finishes the degree, and hopefully gets a permanent job, I hope to relocate to be much nearer to him, wherever that might be. I sincerely hope he comes out to this part of the country, but that probably won't happen, alas. But I don't want to be so far away from my only child. When I do relocate to be closer to him, I may well move into independent/assisted living. He's a wonderful son, but I'm not about to expect him to care for me in my old age.

End of rant.

[Basic LA]

1. I'm in the same boat

And I'm planning to make the move to one next year, near my daughter. I'll be 77 & will have owned my little house for 50 years. So thanks for sharing! It's a big step.

[PoindexterOglethorpe]

2. Good for you.

What helps me is that I've moved more often than most people. The first ten years of my marriage, we moved about every two years. Then settled into one place, and after 18 years there my now ex found someone else he'd rather be with (Darn!) and I relocated from Kansas to Santa Fe at the age of 60. For various reasons it was the best thing I could have done for myself.

I have a wonderful life here. I'd prefer to stay in New Mexico the rest of my life, if possible, but given the choice, I'd rather be closer to my son, even if living in a part of the country that's not my first choice. He seems to want to stay in the DC area. I actually lived there in the 1970s, was a ticket agent at National Airport, and could tolerate living there again, as much as I hate the heat and the humidity. I just don't want to be so far away from him, my only son.

My not so secret dream is that he'd get a job somewhere in New Mexico, Colorado, or Arizona, and I could stay here until I really do need to go into independent/assisted living. But I'm realistic, and know that he's very unlikely to move to this part of the country. Too bad. His PhD will be in astronomy, and there probably are lots of jobs out here, but I know there are also lots of jobs not far from where he is.

[niyad]

3. Very much on point.

As an aside to your son getting a degree in astronomy, I just discovered the most interesting group last night, the International Dark Skies Communities. Four towns here in CO now are ""Dark Skies" communities.

[PoindexterOglethorpe]

4. That's wonderful.

I'm in Santa Fe, and while I don't think it is an official "Dark Skies" city, the skies here are pretty dark, and I get to see lots of stars. Lucky me.

[niyad]

6. I just looked at www.newmexico.org and found the listing ffor the

NM International Dark Skies Parks on that site. I am not familiar with some of them, but amazed at the number of them.

[PoindexterOglethorpe]

12. Ahhh, yes.

Even in a place that is not an official Dark Skies location, I have pretty dark skies. And just a bit north or south of Santa Fe, the night skies are even more amazing.

I grew up in northern New York State, about 10 miles north of Utica, NY. In the 1950s we had Dark Skies there. No noticeable city lights. It's what triggered my fascination with stars and astronomy, and is partly why My Son The Astronomer is becoming an astronomer. I would have loved to have become one, but girls in my era generally didn't do things like that.
Sometimes I go outside, look at the stars, then phone my son and ask him exactly what I am looking at. He can always answer my questions, which is wonderful.

[Karma13612]

21. St Lawrence County here!

Grew up in Black River in the 50’s, a few miles from “Fort Drum”, now Camp Drum.

Spent many years elsewhere and with husband, have been back in NNY since 2003. For cheap clean safe living and carp fishing (hubby).

We have lovely dark skies and hubby has a telescope and does astrophotography.

We will have to relocate in the next few years as hubby is 75 in November and I won’t be able to take care of the place on my own. We live too far out in the country for practical necessities like food shopping and medical care.

Down sizing after decades of “acquisition” is going to be hard.

[MagickMuffin]

5. Good luck on all your endeavors & good advice for the rest of us

Thanks for sharing

If you have the time to go through your family’s things for valuables, and then have an auction company take it from there.

I too worry about assisted living facilities. Not too keen on them, especially nursing home environments. Not for me.

[PoindexterOglethorpe]

9. Actually, one of the things I did for them

was to contact a local company that would hold an auction for everything left over.

Assisted/independent living facilities can be wonderful. You need to look into them. Nursing homes can be a bit of a different thing.

I hope to move into a place that has independent, assisted living, and memory care, in case I get dementia. The reality is that staying at home simply won't work for a lot of people. Over the years I've been very frustrated by those who either assure the older generation they won't put them into a nursing home, or the older person who begs the younger one to promise not to put them in one. Here's the thing: If someone has dementia, or complex medical needs, the average son or daughter cannot take effective care of them. The stories of spouses or children totally exhausting themselves trying to care for someone are legion.

Four different times in my life I've looked at care places on behalf of a relative. I've always been pleasantly surprised at what's out there. When it came to the recent tour of places for my brother and his wife, we looked at seven different places. One was vastly better than any of the others. The essential issue was that most places had very small one bedroom units, and these are two people who have lived in a decent sized home for many decades. They would not survive being crammed into a 700 square foot (maybe even smaller) one bedroom unit. The place we found, White Springs in Warrenton, VA, is very new, and has wonderful units. They even have a lot of amazing and very large studio units. I could personally move into any one of those. They are strictly assisted living an memory care, meaning dementia unit. All of us loved it. It's a matter of filling out all the paperwork and then getting moved.

We all need to be realistic about our aging years. And as we Boomers, and eventually the next generations, move into this stage of our lives, there will be more and better such facilities.

[Karma13612]

22. The studios sound great!

But I am fearful of cost.

Seems like any assisted living facility I have found online is astronomically more than I can afford once hubby is gone.

What do you do when you are low on funds with just SS as the only income source?

[PoindexterOglethorpe]

29. Unfortunately, if your only income is SS,

then you would have to find a place that accepts Medicaid, which not very many do. Unless you own a home that will sell for hundreds of thousands of dollars, which could then finance assisted living.

[Karma13612]

31. Nope, house doesn't crack

200K.

Yea, we take good care of our elderly in this country.


Even those that have worked all their life, but just never made much money. I just hope Medicaid nursing homes have better oversight and combat elder abuse. That’s my fear, elder abuse.

[Joinfortmill]

7. I'm with you.

[Demovictory9]

8. Is it Sweden that has that custom where people clear out their junk at a certain age

Good plan. No one wants someone elses trinkets and such.

[PoindexterOglethorpe]

10. Yes, it's Sweden. A wonderful thing.

I'm trying to get rid of or give away my excess stuff, especially because I realize I don't have descendants to give that stuff to. I have a LOT of jewelry. No daughters. My one son isn't going to reproduce, so I won't have granddaughters. I do have nieces and great nieces, so perhaps I can unload stuff on them. Otherwise, a giant yard sale might be good.

[LittleGirl]

11. Very important post!

I agree. My Mother passed away last year but she had already sold almost everything when she moved into an independent living place for over 55 year olds a decade ago. She arranged for her cremation in her will and everything was done in about 30 days.

My brother who died at age 57 suddenly was another story. He had a house with 4 acres, three barns and was a frequent shopper and had his house stuffed full of stuff. My niece who inherited everything thanks to my brother, who set up a will exactly 2 months before he died, has just sold his house. She's spent the past 3.5 years emptying it out and cleaning it up for sale. That's how long it took when she had a job, her own house to care for and all of the grief of his sudden death to deal with.

He had a will because my oldest brother died in 2018 and didn't have a will. It was a nightmare for his immediate family. Half of his belongings were in storage in another state. When he died, my Mother asked all of her remaining children if they had wills and when my baby brother said no, she said you better get that done.

So I agree, get a will done and start clearing out your 'stuff' nobody wants before you get into your 70s. I'm in my mid-60s and doing that right now. Thanks for your post.

[PoindexterOglethorpe]

13. Thank you for sharing.

Having a will is incredibly important. And updating it when things in your life change, matter just as much.

I've made I think four wills over the years. The most recent was an update after a family member died. I also had a heart attack nearly two years ago, and there is now an envelope on the outside of my refrigerator that says in large print: For EMTs, Health Care Directive. the local hospital also has a copy of my advance care directive.

My younger brother died unexpectedly at the end of 2020. He had no will, but he also had almost nothing. My sister drove out to his place a few days later and cleared out what she could deal with in the week she spent there. He wasn't a hoarder, but he'd lived there more than 20 years, so there was a lot of stuff.

I worry about my jewelry. None of it is terribly valuable, but it's reasonably nice stuff that someone would appreciate. I am hoping to give at least some of it away in the next few years. Then, of course, there's things like my wedding china, which I several years ago promoted to being my everyday china. I only wish I'd done that earlier. I just hope that when I am finally gone, it can be given away to someone who would also love to use it.

[LittleGirl]

16. Updating a will is just as important too

My hubby and I got a will when we got married nearly 16 years ago. We are in the process of updating it because I named family members in that will that have disappeared in my life since and I don't want them to get anything of mine. I have several friends that have become much closer than my family and I want them to get a few things I have instead.

[DFW]

14. We have the same issue with my wife's mother

We were just up at her place in a tiny town up north for her 95th birthday. She is nearly blind and is going deaf. She has hearing aids, but is too stubborn to use them. She insists on staying in the house she has lived in for over 30 years. We checked the assisted living facilities in her area, but they were awful. A friend of hers, the same age as she, and in better health, moved into one of them two or three years ago. She was dead within two weeks.

My wife and I are now both 70. We have had our house for 32 years now, and have accumulated some stuff over the years. Anything of value, I’ll have sent to Heritage Auctions in Dallas, since I have connections there, and the insignificant stuff can probably be disposed of locally, if and when. Our Germany-based daughter is an attorney—she’ll know someone who can do the mechanics.

I still work full time, and I’m in a different country practically every day. I’ve got to start slowing down at some point, but I’m not there yet. I fear boredom will kill me quicker than my work schedule. My wife is “retired,” although she is more active now than when she was working. Her most-oft repeated phrase is, “I just don’t have time for that!” Like Warren Zevon sang, “I’ll sleep when I’m dead.” Which, come to think of it, he now is.

[PoindexterOglethorpe]

15. I hear stories like this, your elderly mother and her situation, all too often.

I think that in general the older generation, like your mom, are very stubborn about things like hearing aids and the need to move into independent/assisted living. I'm hoping that us Boomers, because of what we've gone through with our parents, are more realistic and willing to relocate when necessary.

I do applaud your attitude and planning. I know we are completely different people, but I will tell you that for me, no job has ever been better than not working. You need things other than work in your life. Hobbies, reading, crafts, whatever. As someone who loves to be busy and active, as you are, I would think you would have no trouble staying busy in "retirement". Honestly.

[DFW]

19. For me, not working would be my downfall

I have my hobbies, there's no lack of them. I am fascinated by minerals, have an extensive collection of them (California Peggy can tell you about that, she has been here). I also have an array of musical instruments in the house, including some of the legendary 12 string guitars built by Božo Podunavac to my specifications. I also wrote a novel, never found the time to finish my second one, hope to some day. And I like to travel. Getting my wife to find the time to come with me is the trick, there. We always go to Cape Cod in the summer, but it has been a while since we did something really new (for us). There was Alaska in 2015, plus our 40th wedding anniversary trip to Hawai'i this past April, but other than that, it was always the usual favorite haunts, like Barcelona or Berlin. Once a year, we go to Charleston, SC for New Year's, and then occasional stops in New York, Dallas or Washington.

If I were to retire, I don't know WHAT I'd do. Probably spend more time in Atlanta making music with the Freedom Toast, instead of directing it from afar. I miss the studio and the live interaction with my fellow musicians. But my wife knows no one in Atlanta and doesn't play any musical instruments, so she wouldn't come.

Besides, when I work, if you overlook the frequent travel snafus, I get to do my job in Paris, Brussels, Utrecht, München, Berlin, Hamburg, Barcelona, Madrid, Geneva, Zürich, København, Basel. etc etc. My careful structuring of my job so I would have ironclad job security has, over the years, painted me into a corner. With all the perks I get (good pay, all the vacation I want), I made sure they couldn't replace me. Well, now I'M the one that wants to replace me, but still can't find someone who can do it. At SOME point, the day will come when I just can't do it any more--as likely as not due to my having dropped dead on the job. If it happens, then it happens. Mother Nature had scheduled me to drop dead on April 29th, 2004 anyway. I lucked out, and missed the appointment. "Appointment in Samarra" was not THAT night (fooled you, Mother Nature!) and the-lady-who-was-death did indeed miss me. She'll catch up to me sooner or later, but I'm not dropping her any hints to speed up our next appointment.

[msfiddlestix]

23. Making Music is not a pass time for me.

I'm learning and playing more now than I ever did as a single mother struggling through life's challenges competing with full time work schedule, multiple teen age crises events, political activism and on and on.

these past few years, it is often the first thing I do early in the morning with my coffee , particularly the past five years.

It's very gratifying and nourishing, keeps my brain tingling with ideas.

[DFW]

24. I take it seriously as well, don't get me wrong

I played in rock bands in the sixties, played at German folk festivals as a featured solo guitarist in the 1970s, played with a Dutch folk band in the 1980s, and have performed live in front of two presidents (Ford and Clinton). To that, add one off duets with Theodore Bikel and Howard Dean. I may not play pro any more, but it’s still a big part of my life. But cloning hasn’t yet been perfected, and I can’t fingerpick in my sleep, so there aren’t enough hours in the day to to follow all of my interests as thoroughly as I’d like to.

[msfiddlestix]

27. I know exactly what you mean...

I'm 72, I've only been playing since my late twenties.. and it still feels like I've got years to go to accomplish all the things I want to achieve technically speaking.

On top of those challenges, I acquired a banjo last month for my birthday!

Rank beginner! Talk about musical challenges!

[LittleGirl]

17. DFW, you really should consider slowing down

the pace of your work makes me yawn just thinking about it. Take care of your health, both physically and mentally.

That poor woman died because she was ready. If I live to 95, I'll be ready too. Once all of that stuff was taken care of, she could finally rest and let go. RIP.

[DFW]

18. I consider it, but so far, choose not to.

It’s what keeps me going. When people meet us, they think we are ten years younger, due to how we speak, think and move. When I told one of the new guys from my Dutch office I was 70, he congratulated me on landing such a pretty, much younger wife. I asked him how old he thought she was, and he figured maybe close to 55. He couldn’t believe it when I said she was 70 just I was, and a two time cancer survivor as well.

My mom-in-law’s friend was in good shape for someone her age, and they talked for over an hour every day. She got depressed only when surrounded with people in awful stages of mental decay, and wished she had never set foot in the place. She was anything BUT ready to go.

I’ll slow down when I FEEL like slowing down. It is still mentally stimulating to be, in the course of a week, in Spain, speaking Catalan with my Barcelona colleagues, in Paris, accepted as an almost-local by my friends there, and then ending up the week in my Dutch office, being accepted as one them, not even being spoken to in English, since my Dutch is good enough to blend in. Yesterday, there was also a meeting at our Dutch office with a Ukrainian colleague who was in Holland, and spoke no Dutch. I don’t speak Ukrainian, but he was from an area near the Russian border, so we had no problem speaking Russian. The constant mix of languages and cultures keeps me mentally on my toes, and as long as I don’t have to give ghat up, I don't see why I should. For ten years, I have been looking for a replacement to take my job when I’m done. No takers. So, I keep on keepin’ on.

[sir pball]

20. My father moved into a CCRC* 10 years ago, best move ever

The upfront costs were no worse than simply selling the house in Maine and moving to Florida, but the long-term benefits are incomparable. He's only 75 now, still completely independent (driving, cooking, fishing in all sorts of exotic locations around the world) and living in what are essentially condos right now, having a ball with a wonderful group of peers. It's no different than a gated community with an age limit, really.

But as he ages more and his needs increase, he'll move to assisted living and on to skilled nursing, all at the same set monthly "rent" he contracted when he bought in to his condo. No scrambling to find a room/bed in a facility, and no $8,000/month fees. It's well worth considering if you're willing to cash in your current home.

* - Continuing Care Retirement Community

[LuckyCharms]

25. Excellent advice. n/t

[mnhtnbb]

26. There are two extremely popular continuing care retirement communities

in Chapel Hill, NC. One has been around for 40 years--was a leader in the field--and has lengthy wait lists. I just checked it, and the average wait for a studio is 3 years; for a 1 bedroom apartment the wait is 6-20 years (average 13); and anything else (including the cottages) the wait is 11-17.5 years (average 13). There's a declining scale to return the entrance fee; after 50 months, it's zero return and the entrance fees range from $103,000 to $482,000. Then there are monthly fees on top of that. I couldn't find them on their website, but the other comparable place in town has a minimum $3000. single monthly fee, with an additional requirement of minimum dining on top of that ($250/mo).

The other one has more of an ownership option for your apartment or villa, with a guaranteed return of your entry fee, less a 5% marketing fee, updating/remodeling expenses, and some possible appreciation. Their minimum entry fee (buy in) is $133,600 and goes all the way up to $798,500 for a 2 bedroom 2210 sq ft villa with a garage. The single monthly fee, on top of the entry fee, is $3038. mo for a single all the way to $3995. for the most expensive villa. Add a second person and the monthly fee goes up about $1000. per month, regardless of the category of home.

These two places are the Cadillacs around here. There are lots of other independent or assisted living retirement communities that don't offer continuing care. It's a puzzle figuring them out, especially not knowing if you'll be physically challenged as you age, or have memory issues.

My 90 year old uncle moved to an assisted living facility in Pasadena about 12 years ago after my aunt died. He started out with a $4500/mo monthly fee, but when he started having falls, the facility required him to have an aide with him from 7 am to 7 pm daily. Very quickly his monthly fees went up to about $11,000./mo. My cousin ended up moving him out to live with him in Seattle. It was a real shame, because my uncle no longer had the supportive community of younger friends to come visit him, friends he'd had for many years.

My own plan--at 71--is to go feet first out of my little single level house I bought about 18 months ago. It's in a new development. My oldest son lives 10 minutes away and my youngest son lives 20 minutes away. Our family house burned down in 2007, and with all the subsequent moves/rebuilding/selling the rebuilt family house in 2018, I actually had to buy some furniture for this new house. So cleaning this place out when I go should be fairly easy for my sons. If they sell the house after I die, they will divide the equity (and I took out a 2.3% 15 year mortgage when I bought the house after putting 50% down, which either one of them is allowed to assume, should they wish to not sell), which means I won't have thrown $100's of thousands of dollars away on entry fees and monthly costs.

I'm happy where I am now, and basically healthy. I like living alone and I moved from a high rise apartment--which I loved--to a house because of COVID. I can't see giving this up to move to a retirement community. Most of my neighbors are 50ish or older, and it's a very sociable community because we all moved in right about the same time. If I wanted to interact more, I could, right where I am.

The two communities I mentioned are Carol Woods https://www.carolwoods.org/
and Carolina Meadows https://carolinameadows.org/about/

[PoindexterOglethorpe]

30. Yeah a continuing care retirement community would be nice.

I may eventually look into one.

Your situation, sons nearby, and the involuntary downsizing that occurred with the fire, puts you in a good place. So many people live not very near the services and such that they need, and if they can no longer drive (part of brother and sister-in-laws problems) getting groceries or to doctor appointments can be difficult. They should have relocated years ago. The other huge issue for them and a lot of others is living in the same place for so many decades, and rarely getting rid of stuff.

People really need to start thinking about these things early on, and I'm glad to see that so many here apparently have.

[HipChick]

28. Very valuable advice and PSA

[llmart]

32. Most people aren't as practical or realistic as you and I.

I've been downsizing since I turned 50. I never was someone who liked having a lot of stuff anyway, so it was easy for me. I don't attach to material items. I pretty much started over at 60 when I divorced. I bought a detached condo and paid cash for it. I owe nothing - haven't used credit in decades. I have two grown children, so my will and trust says they will divide everything 50/50. They have always gotten along very well, and both of them have very good careers and plenty of money, so I don't even worry about them getting anything. I've never been into jewelry or expensive cars. As a minimalist, I tell people that I could close my eyes and probably go room to room envisioning each and every item I own. It's such a freeing lifestyle.

Most of the people in my neighborhood are seniors and some of the stories I hear are ridiculous. Old women in their late 80's who have boxes and boxes of Christmas decorations they never use, Easter decorations, yard tools in site condos where you don't have to do your yardwork. I've witnessed many times people in here dying and the grown kids end up being angry at their parent(s) for leaving such a mess for them to clean out. They have jobs and kids and their own homes to take care of. I've seen 1-800-Got-Junk trucks parked in driveways and stuff being just tossed into it left and right.

I think a lot of people still have that notion that their stuff is "valuable" when in fact very little of it is and most of the time, the grown kids want none of it. So, your advise is good, but I fear it falls on mostly deaf ears in my experience. I am very close to my son and always have been, but physically he's not close by. He lives out of state. My daughter is nearer to me but she has a small child and I rarely see her. Plus, since she's married and I'm not so sure I trust the influence he has on her in certain areas, I prefer to have my son make the decisions if or when I get unable to care for myself.

Quite frankly, I've often thought that if I knew I had something fatal and I was in my 80's, I'd do nothing to prolong my life. I've had a wonderful and interesting life and have done much more than I ever envisioned, so I hope to be very practical about death.