Tonight is the worst Rachel Maddow program I have ever begun watching. Her assessment of this

[Atticus]

indictment as "no big deal" and comparing it to the Memendez and Blagojevich etc. prosecutions is 180 degrees "off".

Yes, it will, take longer than we'd like, but this is the FIRST POTUS to be criminally prosecuted---and not just a POTUS---the ONLY traitorous POS elected with the help of a foreign adversary who incited a violent insurrection in an effort to retain power after losing a fair election.

This is a big deal, Rachel.

[SheilaAnn]

1. I turned her off. n.t

[Ocelot II]

2. I didn't get the impression she thought that at all.

She was just pointing out that we have a history of prosecuting many politicians, and that prosecuting a former president shouldn't be such a big deal.

[GuppyGal]

34. But it is a big deal because it's never happened before even when it should have n/t

[edhopper]

3. I think you missed her point

[Eliot Rosewater]

5. Exactly...she is trying to diminish the insane madness we are about to see from the right wing

traitors.

[Hortensis]

53. Yes. And to help those who are glad to settle in for the LONG wait ahead.

Perspective.

Rachel pointed out that from indictment of the tRump company to beginning of trial was 16 months while the defendants did all the things expected to prepare their defense.

Indicting a president for the first time for any reason is IMPORTANT, a big first, but once tRump's arraigned I plan to basically skip over, click away and fast-forward to the end -- however months that takes.

And I won't hold against this case against Bragg (or the "they" who're always to blame) that it's not trying him for treason with Russia, attempted coup d'etat, crimes against humanity targeting children, and advancing epidemic disease to a holocaust that's caused the deaths of well over a million Americans so far. And much more.

[Just A Box Of Rain]

4. She's arguing a very strange thesis.

"Boring?"

[LenaBaby61]

10. Yeah .....

I still watch Rach on Youtube, and anytime she does one of those 'shows' I don't like, I don't watch her segment. I wait and watch Lawrence live or Midas Touch live or I watch other pod-casters on Youtube. I am not Pollyanna about this whole thing re: tRump, because we've seen other white, rich (Used to be rich) white males get out of EVER being served justice.

But Rach's take on this whole tRump thing lately has been boring in my opinion. Friends are starting to notice this as well, and are also waiting until Lawrence airs to catch up on all things tRumputin.

[Ocelot II]

11. She didn't say it *was* boring; she said that as the process continues it will *become* boring.

And she's absolutely right. There will be great excitement as each indictment comes out, but there will be long stretches of time in which nothing is publicly happening while the legal process grinds on. There will be procedural motions, possible interlocutory appeals, extensive discovery, and other proceedings, most of which are technical and boring, at least if they happen as they are supposed to happen.

[Just A Box Of Rain]

15. Right, She said the process will be boring.

I don't believe that's so. Do you?

This may stretch out, I don't dispute it, but I highly doubt it will be boring.

[Ocelot II]

20. There will be stretches of boredom because we won't see most of what happens.

For one thing, New York does not usually allow cameras in court, and the federal courts never do. We will get secondhand reports of some proceedings but a lot of it will be technical legal arguments, and there will be long stretches when nothing is going on at all because of court calendars and briefing schedules. The legal process overall is boring for just about everybody but lawyers and judges. The interesting parts will be the crazy and unexpected shit TFG is likely to pull, but that will be interesting in a bad and destructive way. If we want the process to run smoothly we should be prepared for it not to be interesting all the time.

[Just A Box Of Rain]

21. Perhaps I'm biased by my own predispositions?

Of course, at 15 I watched nearly every minute of the Watergate Hearings--only missing some due to "Hell Week" football practices, but I don't think this will be boring.

Quite the opposite.

[Ocelot II]

23. I think it will be interesting, mostly,

but I'm a retired lawyer with geeky tendencies. Many members of the public are likely to become impatient with the lack of apparent movement, though.

[Just A Box Of Rain]

25. I was sure I'd go to law school from the time I was a little kid, and studied Political Science

in Uni, but in the end I was seduced by a career working in Hollywood.

Stuff happens.

[wnylib]

45. The Watergate hearings were broadcast on TV daily,

with new revelations and layers of involvement uncovered as the cameras rolled.

But an actual trial on this indictment and all the legal maneuvers leading up to the trial, will pale in comparison to Watergate. Most of what will be brought up in the trial is already public knowledge. The pre trial processes will be boring to most people. The trial itself might be interesting, but it will be several months at the least before it takes place.

[Just A Box Of Rain]

50. I think you missed my point.

[mcar]

6. That is not what she said

I'm watching it now. She said it would be "boring," not that it is no big deal. She and her guests agree that it actually should be "boring," just like any other politician indictment ends up being boring while both sides prepare for trial.

She also brought up DeathSentence's declaration that he won't extradite TFG if the need arises as very dangerous to our country.

[global1]

24. Tr**p Will Not Let This Mess Be Boring.....

He's going to milk it for all he can grift.

Unless the judge muzzles him.

[mcar]

27. Oh, I agree

She and her guests were more talking about the process. She brought up the Trump Org case where TFG lost bigly but we really didn't hear much about it until the judgment came in.

She was saying that the process that leads up to trial is going to take a while and that part will be boring. She did not mention the other pending indictments.

I don't necessarily agree with her; I was just setting the record straight on what she said.

[Cha]

36. About deSadist.. I was

thinking this declaration to Pander to the dt cult would hurt him in the GE if he ever gets there.

Ties him to the Domestic Terrorist.

[mcar]

51. I agree, Cha

At some point, he's going to have to answer questions from media other than Fox and OAN - and participate in debates. His safe little fascist cocoon here is not transferrable to the national stage.

[montanacowboy]

7. She is Way off base on this

remember no one, NO ONE knows what the charges are!!!! My guess is federal tax evasion and crimes that fall under federal jurisdiction - I believe that Weisselberg has flipped on Trump and get himself out of doing 15 years in prison. He fired his Trump paid attorneys the other day........ he is an old man and is doing time now on Rikers Island. Faced with 15 years, who wouldn't flip?

[cilla4progress]

8. I think all the MSNBC anchors tonight are

trying to keep the temperature turned down.

I imagine off‐screen they are happy dancing.

[TwilightZone]

9. MSNBC has been feeding the "it's never going to happen" frenzy for months.

Ari Melber, in particular. He couldn't go five minutes without complaining about how long it was taking and insinuating that nothing was ever going to happen.

Now that it's actually happened, they apparently have to find somewhere to pivot.

He and others fed the incessant negativity here on DU, which, frankly, got pretty brutal of late. Anyone who thought an indictment would happen was met with disdain. I notice that the usual suspects are pretty quiet tonight.

[Just A Box Of Rain]

13. I think the "re-framing" is going to be, "our incessant negatively" is what moved the ball."

[TwilightZone]

17. Yep, that's already happening.

There were already a couple of threads claiming credit for the indictments, as if Bragg was just sitting around waiting for DU to provide justification for the indictments.

[Just A Box Of Rain]

18. Some things are predictable.

[wnylib]

46. Send them a box of Kleenex as they cope with the disappointment

of their expectations.

[SharonClark]

35. I read the opposite on DU.

Anyone who complained that the prosecutors were going too slow was immediately slammed and accused of thinking they knew more than the DA.

[TwilightZone]

38. No one here had any clue what the prosecutors were doing.

Or the grand juries.

Many self-appointed experts here on DU acted as though they had some inside information that no one else had.

Many were 100% positive that he would never be indicted, because reasons, and let everyone know it as often as possible, often in the form of personal attacks about how gullible everyone else was.

They clearly didn't know shit.

[betsuni]

39. Everything's rigged, everyone's corrupt, shadowy Oligarchs/Billionaires/Establishment/THEM

control everything the U.S.: abandon hope and be cynically hip and cool like me.

It would be nice to have a little vacation from that.

[wnylib]

47. +10,000

[betsuni]

37. +1

[treestar]

44. already saw some goal post moving

along the lines of this does not matter; until he is indicted for treason it's nothing.

[wnylib]

48. Yup. And it will continue throughout

all the pre trial procedures as they drag on. We will hear about how the prosecution is responsible for the delays, etc.

[C_U_L8R]

12. The extradition conversation is stupid.

Trump will show up, unless he wants his property confiscated by New York State.

[Ocelot II]

16. He will show up because he wants to stay in the spotlight.

If he stays in FL while DeSatan tries to prevent his extradition (and he can't prevent it, just slow it down a bit), the spotlight will be on his current arch-rival DeSatan and not on him.

[crickets]

31. Great point. nt

[milestogo]

14. You're not listening.

[2naSalit]

19. I thought she was trying...

To encourage us to be the cooler heads who will, eventually, prevail.

[crickets]

30. That, and that it's going to take yet more patience to get through this.

It's heady stuff to have a former pres under indictment, but the actual legal processes will not be exciting at all, and will take place in between long stretches of time in which nothing happens. Court may get interesting, when the trial finally rolls around. In the mean time, Ron D. is a jackass ignoring the rule of law.

It remains to be seen what reaction will come from the MAGAs. Here's hoping most of them are keeping the fallout from Jan 6 in mind. All but the crazies will likely stay home, and if they're smart, none of them will tangle with NYPD.

I don't see anyone on the left dancing in the streets until and unless he's convicted and sentenced to some time in the pokey. By then, we all deserve to dance!

I did think the Teapot Dome conversation with Lawrence was fascinating.

[2naSalit]

33. I wanted to see what they all had to say...

So I stayed with it except for a few calls about it. I have friends from out of town who call to talk politics, they are all glad this has finally come to pass. After a few woo hoos and a toast, it's back to business until a verdict.

[Just A Box Of Rain]

22. Rachel just flipped her narrative.

Now it will be a fascinating part of American history.

[Maeve]

26. The trial will probably be boring and not good tv BUT

In the end, this whole mess will be full of odd twists that makes for better history than news. Her point....and she does have one...is not to expect a wild ride but a longer slog thru judicial restraint. Give the system time to work this through.

And yeah, sometimes she takes a really long route to get where she's going but the journey is part of the point

[madamesilverspurs]

28. Seemed to me

that she was cautioning that this is a legal process that takes place within parameters that do not change to accommodate personalities. It is not something scripted to fit into an hour with a dramatic Perry Mason moment to bring about the conclusion. We're finally here, let's not measure it with the demands of impatience. Her presentation was, not surprisingly, thorough and spot on, she doesn't work at Fox.


.

[BannonsLiver]

29. I'm as big of a Garland (and overall justice system) pessimist here as any

And even I am feeling hopeful tonight. Part of that is seeing other people hopeful and excited, including some that I have not agreed with. This is a big night for them and I think they should be allowed to celebrate without wet blankets. Rachel can be Eyore some other time. I think she may have missed the mark tonight.

[moondust]

32. Trial may be a year from now.

According to Dan Goldman. Rachel may just be trying to calm the waters a bit to avoid more disappointment with the slow pace.

[brooklynite]

40. Translation: how dare a news personality have an opinion I disagree with!

[bucolic_frolic]

41. A couple observations

Treating TDFG just like any other big time thug is a good idea. Notoriety feeds MTG, Boobert, Gymbo, Gaetz & Co. Notorious Trump can generate more fund-raising and rallies than "Oh, they finally got that guy, what was his problem?"

Alleged criminals are treated fairly. It does not help justice to politicize it. Convictions remain to be seen.

This is a tax and fraud case. It's not Traitor Tot's Romp in the Park. THis is not a Gotcha Moment. Let the wheels of justice grind.

[Ilsa]

42. Was Rachel on instead of Alex Wagner? nt

[PCIntern]

43. I'm with you...

But I think for additional reasons. From the beginning of the program, from the first moment , she seemed off. She was somewhat hyper and manic, and in addition to mentioning that she had applied her own makeup, which is typical of her to be somewhat self effacing, pardon the pun, she kept laughing at what she was saying, and was bouncing all over the set background in her chair. Quite frankly, I don’t think she gave that much thought to what she was saying, and it seemed off the top of her head. And then, she did one of those patented Rachel moves wherein she had a three minute introduction to state a fact which had already been broadcast, to wit, that DeSantis had said that he would not participate in any extradition from Florida. We knew this, and her lonnnnnnng introduction, filled with sub-clauses was positively weird, and I truly believe that she is a terrific broadcaster and wonderful personality with great insight at times, but last night was strange to say the least. This is all my opinion, of course and quite frankly, I could be wrong, but I was shaking my head through her entire broadcast. Even her intro of Lawrence at 10 o’clock, and her continued giggling was not great, again IMO.

[AngryOldDem]

49. I kinda see where she was headed with this.

This is low-level stuff that can be litigated forever. I’m waiting to see if Georgia indicts, as well as any federal indictments.

That said, everyone needs to remember that nobody knows yet exactly what NY has indicted him for.

[Paladin]

52. Rachel is capable of doing a poor show. I've seen a couple.

Last night's show was not one of them. Thank you Rachel, for yet another incisive take on a historic day.