Why negotiating with Kevin McCarthy is a waste of time.

[no_hypocrisy]

* His coterie of neofascists in the House will not accept anything but ALL of their unreasonable demands.

* Therefore, even if Joe Biden were to accept 3 out of 5 demands, it wouldn't be enough for them.

* McCarthy may or may not get the votes for three of the five demands, but

* The next vote would be to expel him as SOTH. That would be unbearable for him.

* This situation is both a hostage scenario and duress/coercion/extortion.

* You can't negotiate when the other party is beyond adamant.

[gab13by13]

1. I do not understand why President Biden

is negotiating with McCarthy? The MSM and everyone else is framing the talks as debt ceiling talks when they are actually spending/budget talks.

Now spending and raising the debt have been combined as one when raising the debt should be a stand alone issue.

When McCarthy and his Magats default on our debt the MSM is going to point to the failed Biden/McCarthy negotiations.

Buckle up, economic disaster is fast approaching, the fossil fuel industry that funds the Magats is just fine with defaulting.

President Biden better be looking long and hard at the 14th Amendment.

[betsuni]

2. He's not.

[jimfields33]

8. I can't understand why waiting until January was supposed to be easier

then dealing with Manchin and Sinema in December. They have to be easier then these clowns.

[Walleye]

3. You can't negotiate with a person or an entity that is basically dishonest

I can’t imagine any deal that McCarthy would actually be able to keep.

[BeyondGeography]

4. Republicans will take any tool in the shed to gut Democrats

The economy? Our standing in the world? Meh.

The debt ceiling must be permanently removed as leverage for minority rule. Now is the time.

[2naSalit]

5. +1

[gab13by13]

6. Chaos will work just fine

in the Magat's quest for autocracy.

The "Republican Party" isn't even trying to win anymore, it needs to cheat to stay in power, and I believe the fascist Supreme Court will oblige.

[2naSalit]

7. My take on it...

And the delay being used, at this point, for a couple of purposes.

Since the Rs insist on this temper tantrum set of tactics, Biden is not only going to play them, being the wise adult who has truly seen it all, and expose their treachery in big, loud, bold letters so everyone can clearly see, again, who they are.

They are standing in a state of insecurity and stubbornness with little knowledge of where they go after they fall on their faces, not realizing they will be falling on their faces. Why? Because they are stupid, crisis actor-like tools who can only follow instructions to a point. After that, it's full on self aggrandizement and hubris rocketing into the abyss of irredeemable stupid. And trying to drag the rest of us down with them.

Biden has their number and I think he'll be letting them think he'll be using the 14thA and/or the (can't remember the term right now, the petition House members have been signing). It shows there is no negotiating with them while they think they are calling Biden's bluff. They are soon to find out that he's got the upper hand and is moving on like a wise dad who ignores the screaming child in the throes of of a tantrum while exposing their incompetence to everyone.

JMHO.

[gab13by13]

9. I'm looking at what McCarthy is asking for in the budget negotiations;

McCarthy's requests are give aways to the fossil fuel industry. The fossil fuel industry owns the Magat party and it will be just fine with defaulting on our debt. Why do you think that Magats love Saudi Arabia and Russia? What will defaulting on our debt do to the price of oil?

I have no idea why President Biden negotiated with McCarthy, the negotiations are being framed as debt ceiling negotiations when they are actually budget negotiations, so when McCarthy defaults on the debt the MSM will claim it was because of the failed debt ceiling negotiations.

I believe the discharge petition has already failed, maybe it can be revived?

Buckle up, build a dog house, buy a big dog and bury your money under the dog house.

[kelly1mm]

16. What does Biden 'moving on' look like though? The discharge petition failed and use

of the 14th Amendment is problematic at best (uncertainty during litigation will drive up borrowing costs considerably even if ultimately upheld)

The Senate has not passed anything and does not look likely to do so. The House bill, as unpalatable as it is, is currently the only piece of passed legislation out there.

The 'trillion dollar coin' idea, which seems la-la land crazy, may actually be the safest bet going forward .....

[2naSalit]

18. Ever...

Played poker?

[gab13by13]

10. Something to consider;

According to an article on Forbes, if a default happened it would collapse the value of the dollar as investors fled to the safety of more reliable sovereigns. All else equal, that should prove bullish for globally traded assets that are priced in dollars but globally fungible — like oil.

Follow the money.

[marybourg]

11. He has no power within his own party.

He's to weak to lead and not sure they'd follow.

[Emile]

12. You don't negotiate with a gun to your head.

[sarcasmo]

13. Yep, when one side wants to burn the government down there is no cooperation.

[karynnj]

14. Agree with your analysis, but we MUST negotiate in good faith and state what we have offered

President Biden has put out on excellent list of things that will actually help lower the deficit. He also is still clear that those are for the budget/appropriations discussion that happens in the fall. He also has REPEATEDLY and more clearly than any previous president made clear that not raising the budget cap as needed is refusing to pay bills that have already been legally incurred. The deficit (and the debt) were made much higher by revenue cuts that were the result of the Trump tax cuts.

Obviously, Biden can NOT agree to McCarthy's plan as written without destroying his own legacy .... and once he gave into a hostage deal ... it is totally clear it will not be the only one. (In retrospect, I wish that there would have been a small number of Republicans who would have rejected that extreme bill in the first place.)

[Hortensis]

15. Don't forget they're also intensely motivated by their own

political survival, at very least retention of power. The ability to allow an opponent to have "success" to claim is a powerful bargaining point.

"Never back a wild animal into a corner."

[Mr.Bill]

17. My best guess (hope, really)

is that Biden has enough republican votes in the House to make things happen if certain things are in place, and those are the real negotiations we are not seeing. And if even a few republicans cooperate with Biden, that will split the republican House and Mc Carthy is done. And he knows it.