General Discussion
Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsBiden should under no circumstances cave on anything to Repugs! They are turning this fiasco
into another side show like when McCarthy sought the speakership! Biden should just say either agree or I invoke the 14th Amendment! Dont F around with the Repugs. The 80+ million of us that voted for Biden should bombard the Whitehouse with 14th Amendment emails!
Blue Owl
(50,407 posts)brewens
(13,592 posts)happens with a Democrat in office. Joe has to do his job and pay the bills without any strings. End of story.
W_HAMILTON
(7,867 posts)But guess what? If Biden """caves (as) he intended to all the time,""" there are enough progressive congressional representatives to thwart any deal since many (most?) Republicans still will not vote for whatever comes from this because they are instinctively against voting in favor of anything Biden is for anyway.
So, if a deal goes through since that's what those evil dastardly establishment corporatist blah blah blah planned for all this all the time, it means that progressives also failed us, yes?
EDIT: And, yes, this only happens when a Democrat is in office because Democrats are the responsible party and good stewards of our nation's governance whereas Republicans are all too happy to run it all into the ground when a Democrat is president because they can just let their conservative media and """both sides""" media give them just enough cover and/or blame Democrats for it happening under their watch. Democrats won't crash the world economy to hurt Republicans because it would hurt everyday Americans as well and there ain't a """liberal""" media out there to propagandize such a maneuver away like Republicans have.
emulatorloo
(44,131 posts)THAT I CAME UP WITH IN MY MIND WITHOUT ANY EVIDENCE.
I know, it is a long DU tradition to get upset over things that havent happened. So I get it.
tritsofme
(17,379 posts)This perception, that seems to dominate right now, is extremely flawed.
There would be real consequences in the markets, similar to an actual default.
If Biden can negotiate a two year spending deal and raise the debt ceiling, taking default and government shutdowns off the table until after 2024, it would be a great accomplishment
lame54
(35,293 posts)The Steve Bannon plan
They think they can hang it on Biden
Beachnutt
(7,324 posts)republican voters ?
Maybe Joe has a strategic plan to show the rethug voters what they vote for.
Bev54
(10,053 posts)I dearly hope Fani Willis has the goods to put him away too.
Sky Jewels
(7,111 posts)I sure hope there's a plan to shut down these GOP motherfuckers.
NGeorgian
(47 posts)on next Monday. He needs to explain what is going to happen to all of us. He needs to blame the Repugs.
Joinfortmill
(14,428 posts)Ligyron
(7,633 posts)littlemissmartypants
(22,691 posts)
But wait, there is more.
We said that conservative claims betrayed an unawareness or willful elision of federal budgeting and debt incurring as astounding as their assaults on the 14th Amendment. How so, you might ask?
In 1974, Congress took charge of the federal budgeting process in a way it had not done before. The precipitant was The Imperial Presidency of Richard M. Nixon, who had developed a worrying penchant for regularly impounding that is, refusing to spend funds that Congress had appropriated for specifically authorized federal programs. In effect, Nixon had been flouting both Congresss Article I power of the purse, of which some commentators make pointlessly heavy weather, and the Constitutions own Article II take care clause, pursuant to which the president must take care that the laws be faithfully executed.
Congresss response was the Congressional Budget and Impoundment Control Act of 1974, pursuant to which Congress, with the presidents signature, legislates in detail: federal expenditures, federal taxes, and hence, federal debt issuance to cover gaps between expenditures and taxes. This, of course, means that debt obligations are fully congressionally legislated as precisely and as fully as federal taxes and spending themselves are congressionally legislated. The federal budget, in other words, is its own debt ceiling and indeed floor.
There is, thus, simply no role, since 1974, for the old Liberty Bond Act of 1917 the source of the ersatz debt ceiling that Republicans now routinely wield like a weapon to play any longer. It is a childrens toy, not a real gun, and its high time the Senate and all reasonable Republicans in the House called the bluff.
Lest there be any doubt on this score, we suggest that conservatives note how the current incarnation of the no longer meaningful (since 1974) Liberty Bond Act of 1917 is a would-be freestanding ceiling whose disregard leaves in place all sections of Title 31 that authorize needed borrowing per the U.S. Code Subchapter I, sections 3102 through 3106. Conservative critics are accordingly dead wrong again, be it deliberately or inadvertently, in suggesting that we and others are proposing the president borrow without congressional authority.
https://thehill.com/opinion/finance/4009101-biden-can-and-should-ignore-the-gops-debt-suicide-attempt/
Joinfortmill
(14,428 posts)Grumpy Old Guy
(3,170 posts)Sessuch
(106 posts)Do not bombard the President. Bombard the Republican leaders who threaten their constituents with disaster.
SouthernDem4ever
(6,617 posts)My email is on the way!
paleotn
(17,931 posts)He's as calm as mill pond. I think he knows how this will play out. Not with a default and not in McCarthy's favor. As they say, the trick to playing chicken is knowing when to flinch. McCarthy will l back down because, like nuclear war, the next step is one he cannot take.
emulatorloo
(44,131 posts)Bidens got a lot of experience at this and hes smart.
leanforward
(1,076 posts)And the history lesson from littlemissmartypants,
Thank you.