In n Out to ban employees from wearing masks

[crimycarny]

I apologize if this story has already been posted on DU. I just now saw it on Twitter. Apparently In N Out has banned employees from wearing masks unless they get a note from their doctor. Some states, like California, have made it illegal for employers to ban employees from wearing a mask--but in other states, this ban applies.

This is just insane and so narrowly focused and short-sighted. What if the employee has no health conditions but some of their family members do?

Link to tweet

?s=20

[gratuitous]

1. And hand washing!

What's up with that?! I gotta wash my hands every time I go to the can? Or cough? Or sneeze? Or even pick my nose? Fascism, that's what it is.

[dalton99a]

2. Kick

[PufPuf23]

38. Just tried to call the phone # and got "All circuits are busy now".

Was going to tell them never intended to go to an In-Out again and would tell my friends to do the same.

Granted have only been to an In-Out once in life; seldom do fast food; and drive 100 miles to the nearest In-Out, 85 miles to nearest drive through fast food, and 38 miles to any restaurant. Live in a National Forest.

[MissB]

3. Crappy food and

Apparently an assholish company.

[Johonny]

4. Yeah, not sure why they're so beloved

Sort of a meh burger company

[sdfernando]

6. Many don't know this but printed on the bottom of their take-out bags are bible verses

Its a christian owned company.

[MissB]

28. I did not know that

We stopped by there last month for the first time. Will never go back; food was terrible.

[Mr.Bill]

5. Somewhat misleading headline.

This is far from a total ban on masks, and only applies in some states. Most notably, in California where most of their stores are, such a ban on masks is illegal.

Thanks for posting the story, it was interesting and informative after reading it.

[crimycarny]

8. Yes, I made that clear in my OP (that the ban does not apply to all states)

As I wrote in my original post:

"Some states, like California, have made it illegal for employers to ban employees from wearing a mask--but in other states, this ban applies."

Also, just having the ban at all--even if it doesn't apply in an employee's state--can make wearing a mask a stigma. And as someone else pointed out, In N Out has said that in those states where the ban is illegal, employees must wear a "company-supplied" N95 mask. A "soft way", for lack of a better word, to discourage mask-wearing.

[Hassin Bin Sober]

13. A company provided mask allows management to track the "troublemakers"

The troublemakers who place their health over the customer’s experience. No promotion for you!

[Mr.Bill]

14. I think if the company requires a uniform,

it's fair that they can provide a certain mask (as long as it is medically adequate and allows for a doctor's note to use a different mask) as part of that uniform. I wonder if they were having trouble with people wearing masks with political or religious statements, symbols or something like that on them.

I mean, if you're on a baseball team, you wear the hat they give you.

Another example I can think of is our local hospital where my wife worked. Employees paid for their own scrubs. It began with people wearing scrubs with cartoon characters on them, camouflage scrubs, etc. It was getting a little silly and pushing the envelope as far as taste. So they cracked down on things and required certain colors of scrubs for certain departments. It did somewhat add to the professional atmosphere. They forgot to regulate socks, though, so the rebellious ones still wear some silly socks.

[Blues Heron]

25. Not for something medical like a mask - they don't own you.

You your best mask that you obtained. What’s to stop them from giving you a shitty fake mask?

[Mr.Bill]

31. The story says they ar N95 masks.

And it further says if your doctor's note requires something different then you can use that instead.

These burger joints aren't franchises with rogue franchise owners. They are all owned by one huge corporation. I'm sure before they issued these rules, they were vetted by an army of lawyers, and they left all kinds of exceptions for every thing they thought might come up.

[Blues Heron]

32. I think the name says it all- PERSONAL protective equipment

You and you alone are ultimately responsible for your health. Do not cede that to some corporation that may not have your best interests in mind.

[Mr.Bill]

33. Okay, you win.

In-n Out Burger wants to issue fake masks to their employees and kill as many of them as they can.

[Blues Heron]

34. Finding a mask that fits and is breathable is very much a personal thing

They are not all the same. Some might prefer ear loops and a k94 from Korea. Others might prefer a more robust 3M k95 with wraparound straps. Maybe one fogs your glasses and another doesn’t. It’s a personal item. One size does not fit all.

[Mr.Bill]

35. And that's why the rules say

you can get a note from your doctor allowing whatever mask suits you.

[Blues Heron]

36. how about we skip the doctor part and go straight to the mask you want

I am so glad California bans this nonsense. What a waste of a doctors time and energy.

What is it about masks that triggers right wingers so very much? Its like a litmus test or something.

[liberal_mama]

39. Yeah, I'd love to see what their special N95 looks like. Hopefully, it's a 3M N95 Aura. That's

what most people who aren't interested in repeated infections with a brain destroying disease wear. Or a Drager FF3 1950. Or a P100.

I wouldn't be surprised if it's not an N95 mask at all. A lot of uninformed people think KN95s and KF94s are N95s.

And some people can get a good fit with an earloop mask so they should be able to wear their mask of choice without having to go to the frigging doctor for permission.

This seems like a right wing stunt to me.

Hopefully, someone files a lawsuit.

I would quit if I worked there. Who would endanger their lives or the lives of their loved ones for a lousy fast food job? My dad died of Covid 8 months ago. I'm sick of people living in a fantasy land and pretending it's okay to keep getting infected over and over again and that Covid is over.

Having to go to the doctor to wear a specific kind of mask and ask permission to wear a mask?

What a lousy, petty, controlling company this is. Even employees that don't mask should quit immediately and find more reasonable employers.

[area51]

45. +1

I'm sorry for your loss.

[kimbutgar]

7. After I found out they donated a lot of money to the Newsom recall and supported Larry Elder

I stopped going to in and out!

[marybourg]

9. Ate there for the first time recently, after hearing

good reports for years. Very underwhelmed.

[Sympthsical]

12. I think it's a localized nostalgia thing

I'm a Midwestern transplant to California. People have always gone crazy for the burgers - but also the fries.

So I've been many times, and it's a very good fast food burger. I like them. The fries are fine. For what you're eating, it's fine. Probably one step above McDonald's. But given the expectations I had from people talking, it was, as you said, whelming.

That crazy "OMG In N' Out!!" seems to come from people who grew up with it. I have one down the street, and I don't think I've ever gone of my own volition. But I have friends who grew up here who will always pick it when they come over, even though I have literally all the fast food places within a 5 min drive. Like, all of them.

But my opinion may not be great. I'm Taco Bell gang.

[underpants]

18. I think you nailed it. I had one almost 20 years ago

I remember it being freshly made and a bit sloppy. Not badly but not built/boxed to transport.

I thought the same of White Castle. I get it. Cheap and quick. Lots good times included a WC run I’m sure.

Same for Krispy Kreme in Richmond. I always thought of them as “band donuts” because the high school bands were always selling them. Farrakhan’s guys at stoplights in Hampton and Newport News either sold them or the shared a median strip with someone who did. In Richmond, the neon light comes on the minivans swarm. Open 24 hours in at least one spot.

[Sympthsical]

23. I friggin loooooove White Castle

And, here's the thing - I grew up with it. When mom was working and dad was lazy, he'd get one of those giant 30 burger sacks for $10 or whatever it was at the time.

Costco sells boxes of 30 frozen WC cheeseburgers for $20. They taste exactly the same as the restaurant. I literally cannot buy them. That box would be gone in a weekend. They're so, so good.

My Californian friends think this is insane.

Yeah, we didn't have Krispy Kreme in the Midwest. We had Dunkin Donuts (which the Bay Area just started getting, and it's very exciting). I have friends who love KK and had co-workers in the past who thought someone bringing in massive trays of KK was the best day ever.

It's sugar glaze over sugared fried dough stuffed with cream that is blended with sugar. It's sugar. I'm getting older, so more and more I find myself saying the words, "Oh, that's too sweet." But that shit was too sweet even in my 20s. I think we should do a study on diabetes rates and KK locations.

Gimme some munchkins and a coffee.

[underpants]

24. I've been more DD my whole life

I guess we had them in Ohio when I was young. We knew a bakery owner here. I just never GOT Krispy Kreme.

McD’s had 10¢ hamburgers on Tuesdays (I think) in the 90’s. My stepfather would go but the max every week and freeze them. He cracks me up.

[Sympthsical]

30. I knew a lot of your step-fathers

Worked in a McD's as a teenager in the late 90s and they would do 25 cent cheeseburgers. But they never advertised it. I only found out it was a thing, because I worked there. So you'd always get these older customers who somehow knew The Secret. The only surprise is that people didn't come in with actual garbage bags.

That day and whenever Big Macs and Quarter Pounders were 2 for $2 were hell. We'd complain to the manager that we were pretty sure those days violated some kind of child labor law.

[petronius]

51. I was in grad school in San Diego in the 90's, and the local McD's had the 25 cent deal

and the 'bucket of fries' - the biggest soda cup full of fries for a ridiculously low price. The change I found in the sofa was enough to clog my arteries for good (a conversation I'll probably be having with a cardiologist one of these days... )

But, it was glorious!

[Sympthsical]

53. 90s McDonald's was on another level

Maybe it's nostalgia, but I don't think it's been nearly as good since. I don't mean tastewise, just the kinds of promotions and experimenting they would do.

I almost never eat fast food nowadays, but I don't know what I'd do if they brought back the Arch Deluxe. The mayo/mustard sauce with the black pepper bacon. We always got free food after a shift, so I would just eat one of those in the car after work.

These McRib devotees are sucking up all the oxygen. Bring back the pepper bacon frisbee!

[moonscape]

27. KK were cloyingly sweet even

as a teen in the 60’s. But! We would get them fresh and hot and made up for everything

[Silent Type]

10. Bet, less than a few percentage of employees wear a mask nowadays.

[LuckyCharms]

15. Except that a mask is a personal protective device.

Not a piece of clothing.

Not a piercing.

Not a tattoo.

Not a hairstyle.

[Mr.Bill]

16. A football helmet is also a personal protective device.

But players have to wear the one provided.

[LuckyCharms]

17. If the issue is non-traditional masks, or decorative masks...

then why not just have a policy that says all masks must be a solid color?

Additionally, what if an individual wears a mask because they feel more protected from Covid, rather than because they have a condition that Covid would exasperate, thus requiring a legitimate note from a doctor?

What if they wear a mask not to protect themselves, but to protect an aging person living in their household were Covid to be spread to them by the employee?

[Mr.Bill]

19. In don't think anyone would have trouble getting a note from their doctor under those circumstances.

I know I wouldn't. If I had a high public contact job, my reason for wearing a mask would be that my wife is 73 years old and is on meds that compromise her immune system. If my doctor wouldn't support that, I would find another doctor.

[LuckyCharms]

20. But your doctor cannot not write a note for your wife's medical issues...

Your doctor can only write a note for your medical issues.

Your wife is not the employee.

You are.

[Mr.Bill]

21. Well, in my case, my doctor is also my wife's doctor.

If it were two different doctors, my wife could give permission to my doctor to review her medical records and take action to reduce the likeleyhood of me transmitting a potentially disease to her. That is a legitimate medical excuse.

[LuckyCharms]

22. Right, but the rule addresses "associates", not

"people who live with associates".

[liberal_mama]

48. I'm glad to hear you care enough about your wife to wear a mask to protect her. My dad was healthy

and 74 years old when Covid killed him 8 months ago.

Everyone is vulnerable to Covid's terrible consequences, but older people are especially at risk.

I couldn't believe how Covid tore my father apart. A horrible and agonizing way to die. I will never forget the look of terror in my dad's eyes as he died of this evil virus. I will never get over the PTSD of watching my wonderful dad die an unnecessary death because someone was too selfish to wear a mask or stay home when sick.

From reading this new policy, it appears that the employee has to have the health condition, not their loved ones. And that's a problem if this is the case.

[Mr.Bill]

52. Well, to be honest, my wife and I are not wearing masks unless we are in a very crowded indoor space

We live in a small town that is relatively isolated from large populations. There haven't been any covid cases in our county for awhile. We have all of our shots, and will get another in the fall. The shots helped last year when we finally did catch covid. For me it was a mild sore throat for about 24 hours. To show what a compromised immune system can mean, my wife coaught it at the same time, from the same person (our great granddaughter who was five) and she spent three days in the hospital on IV antibiotics and then three weeks after at home on oxygen. I'm sure without the shots, she would be gone. She also has asthma.

Anyway, we are both well now with no long term symptoms. But what I stated earlier was if I worked in a high public contact job, I would be wearing a mask at work.

[Blues Heron]

26. It's a medical item, not a baseball hat

[Ms. Toad]

37. COVID is not gone,

and the only comprehensive study I've seen indicates that 59% of people who have organ damage at one year. Only 7 organs were tracked, and the population was not an at-risk population.

A company that prohibiting their employees from protecting themselves from long-term consequences of COVID is a company that deserves to go out of business.

[LuckyCharms]

46. Great! Now, they should provide an exemption for healthy people...

who get totally devastated by the disease as well.

[LuckyCharms]

50. That's exactly the point I'm making.

It's probably never going away, and employers have absolutely no business in regulating how or why employees try to protect themselves.

[liberal_mama]

42. A mask is not a uniform! A mask can save someone's life and prevent infection with a deadly disease.

A uniform is just clothes! A mask is protective equipment.

This company is terrible to try to make employees jump through hoops to protect themselves and their loved ones from a deadly virus with unknown future health consequences.

[hatrack]

29. "Letting our employees show forced smiles is our priority - if a few of them die, meh!"

[DiverDave]

41. I went a couple of months ago.

I won't be back. The fries were ok, but didn't like the burger.
And fighting a crowd for a mediocre burger is not for me.

[JanMichael]

43. But where can I get my murdered burnt cow carcass?

[Celerity]

49. Shake Shack makes a damn good burger (veg or beef) and are progressive politically.