We have a radical democracy. Will Trump voters destroy it?

[Nevilledog]

https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/2024/04/24/trump-tyranny-christian-nationalist-democracy/

No paywall link
https://archive.li/GHvT6

For some time, it was possible to believe that many voters could not see the threat Donald Trump poses to America’s liberal democracy, and many still profess not to see it. But now, a little more than six months from Election Day, it’s hard to believe they don’t. The warning signs are clear enough. Trump himself offers a new reason for concern almost every day. People may choose to ignore the warnings or persuade themselves not to worry, but they can see what we all see, and that should be enough.

How to explain their willingness to support Trump despite the risk he poses to our system of government? The answer is not rapidly changing technology, widening inequality, unsuccessful foreign policies or unrest on university campuses but something much deeper and more fundamental. It is what the Founders worried about and Abraham Lincoln warned about: a decline in what they called public virtue. They feared it would be hard to sustain popular support for the revolutionary liberal principles of the Declaration of Independence, and they worried that the virtuous love of liberty and equality would in time give way to narrow, selfish interest. Although James Madison and his colleagues hoped to establish a government on the solid foundation of self-interest, even Madison acknowledged that no government by the people could be sustained if the people themselves did not have sufficient dedication to the liberal ideals of the Declaration.

The people had to love liberty, not just for themselves but as an abstract ideal for all humans.
Americans are going down this route today because too many no longer care enough whether the system the Founders created survives and are ceding the ground to those, led by Trump, who actively seek to overthrow what so many of them call “the regime.” This “regime” they are referring to is the unique political system established by the Founders based on the principles of universal equality and natural rights. That, plain and simple, is what this election is about. “A republic if you can keep it,” Benjamin Franklin allegedly said of the government created by the Constitutional Convention in 1787. This is the year we may choose not to keep it.

A healthy republic would not be debating whether Trump and his followers seek the overthrow of the Founders’ system of liberal democracy. What more do people need to see than his well-documented attempt to prevent the peaceful transfer of power with the storming of the U.S. Capitol, the elaborate scheme to create false electoral slates in key states, the clear evidence that he bullied officials in some states to “find” more votes, and to persuade Vice President Mike Pence not to certify the legitimate results? What more do they need to know than that Trump continues to insist he won that election and celebrates as heroes and “patriots” the people who invaded the U.S. Capitol and smashed policemen’s faces with the stated aim of forcing Congress to negate the election results? As one 56-year-old Michigan woman present at the Capitol on Jan. 6, 2021 explained: “We weren’t there to steal things. We weren’t there to do damage. We were just there to overthrow the government.”

*snip*

[hadEnuf]

1. Well over 30+ years of pure, unchecked right-wing propaganda and outright lies in all forms of communication

have played an enormous part in literally brainwashing and indoctrinating part of the country. This continues right up to the minute.

This isn't just disagreements over the backyard fences anymore. A couple of generations have been raised on this programming and are absolutely convinced that it is true. Many have also become militant at the urging of their "leaders". They are also well armed, and I suspect in some cases, well financed.

Little has been done to counter this poisoning of the country. The government's role, desire or ability to limit this treasonous and seditious propaganda is simply not there. Our side's response to meet this on equal terms and fight fire with fire has been limited.

We need to organize and make a concerted, well funded effort to try and excise this fantasy, fascist narrative that has gripped our country, along with making sure that this horror story now happening in our courts and elections is no longer tolerated.

And we better do it real soon.

It is, and has been, the media that has given this insanity wheels.

[kimbutgar]

2. I think we will have to use scare tactics and say if the orange menance is re-elected you will lose your social security

And Medicare. And then show clips of him and the repukes saying that! Scare the crap out of thse magaloons! Because our democracy is in danger and the orange one will destroy our country to make himself a dictator. Again show and tell those scary images to these idiots!

[slightlv]

4. I know it's not everyone,

but too many of the magats don't believe in SS and Medicare. They consider them to be "socialism", cause that's what they've been told over and over again by their R "betters." According to "conservative values" the family and the church should take over all responsibility... not SS and Medicare. And these stupid people actually buy into that belief! There really is no reasoning or scaring these people. What scares the crap out of us, they dance in rapturous joy at the mere thought. They are so brainwashed and so lost, I honestly don't think there's any hope for them. The only hope WE have is to vote for Biden and other D's down the ticket everywhere that it cannot be denied; cannot be cheated on even in plain sight. And even then, I fear they're going to find a way... if no other way than just to declare the election "null and void" and have the SCOTUS put *rump into the office, just like they did Bush. And I don't think there's anyone who can talk me down. My anxiety level is way too high...

[Caliman73]

3. Self governance is difficult, especially when external pressures add stress.

One of the things Marx posited, in my very simplistic language, was that Capitalism alienated people from the benefits of their labor and efforts. They are left to selling their labor for whatever price the person with the money and power is willing to pay. People usually have little time to study, to create, to grow as people, which are all things needed to be a well rounded, civically minded, and engaged person.

Democracy requires informed people. It requires interested people willing to talk and listen and learn and take action. It is difficult, especially when you are juggling work, school, children, bills, etc... People will often fall into the idea that the "experts", who are usually just people with louder and more amplified opinions, can make decisions for them. They follow, and they vote how they are told to vote. It is more common on the right, but happens all along the political landscape. Similarly to how we as people, allow others to do jobs that we cannot or do not want to do. The problem with politics and "letting people do what you can't or don't want to do" is that this is about choosing our representatives and making decisions that affect our daily lives. We can't allow people to make those decisions for us. We can certainly take the opinions and the research done by experts into account when making those choices, but we at least need to know how to judge who is an expert and what bias their opinions have.

We need to do the hard work that is required by democracy, but we also have to have the time and space to do that work. The system needs to change to stop overvaluing "productivity" and "profit" and value humanity and our development much more.