JD Vance Said We Just Need To Reframe The Idea Of Forcing Women To Stay Pregnant

[Yo_Mama_Been_Loggin]

President Donald Trump has picked Sen. JD Vance (R-Ohio) to be his running mate — and, in doing so, has chosen someone who believes people simply need to reframe the way they think about forcing women to stay pregnant because it’s “about the baby.”

In a 2021 interview with Spectrum News, Vance was asked if he believes a woman should be forced to carry a baby to term after she has been a victim of rape or incest.

The Ohio Republican suggested the framing of the question was flawed.

“It’s not whether a woman should be forced to bring a child to term, it’s whether a child should be allowed to live, even though the circumstances of that child’s birth are somehow inconvenient or a problem to the society,” Vance said. “The question really, to me, is about the baby.”

https://www.yahoo.com/news/jd-vance-said-just-reframe-230948667.html

What a creep.

[Walleye]

1. He forgot to add, the important thing is that the women suffer punishment

Someone should ask him when his wife’s last period was, since he doesn’t seem to think that should be private information.

[Deuxcents]

2. Repackage the same 💩 but it says the same thing.

[Turbineguy]

3. A new frame.

Same ugly picture as before. The Rubes will love it.

[Wicked Blue]

4. Let's see them try to reframe a life-threatening ectopic pregnancy

[bullimiami]

5. Will all fathers be equally responsible for the child from pregnancy to adulthood?

Or is that just the handmaids problem?

[hlthe2b]

6. Then you fucking have the baby, you GD monster. Let's force you to endur something equally traumatic.

and with lifetime impacts.

Gee, why am I reminded of that horrific-looking device commonly seen on cattle ranches-- that looks like a Medieval torture device but has a very practical use in limiting the numbers of breeding bulls? 'Just crossed my mind... no message, really, JD... None at all...

[localroger]

9. The word you are looking for is elastrator.

I have it on the authority of people who actually use them that the ones made for sheep (they come in different sizes) would work best on a human being. Just in case you needed to know.

[hlthe2b]

19. It is called an emasculator--used on bulls and boars. I was just being sensitive to some here.

My grandfather raised beef cattle. They look similar, but whether it is a Burdizzo, a Reimer, or a Serra emasculator, they differ only in whether they crush, cut the spermatic cord, and detach the testes all in one or only one or two of the preceding. But, I thought I'd save the men here from an unpleasant thought pattern.

[localroger]

37. Elastrator is yet another device that does the same job

It snaps a tight rubber band around the scrotum, denying blood flow to the testes so that they die and fall off painlessly. It's advertised as having fewer side effects and being less painful than other methods. It was under patent from 1952 to 1969 and marketed as an improvement thus the different name.

[hlthe2b]

38. Yes, but used on smaller (usually younger) animals. Considered cruel by many because of the high chance of

necrosis of the tissues from the elastic band and resultant gangrene. And if the latter occurs, I can damned well inform you that it is NOT painless but rather, deadly.

[Frasier Balzov]

7. Filling them with the fruit of our nation?

Or the baked goods?

[tanyev]

8. The baby farms on Battlestar Galactica were all about the babies, too.

[Maeve]

10. Let's play at reframing.....do non-citizens have

More rights than citizens, JD?
Ok, the Constitution defines citizens as "born" or naturalized in the US (Amendment 14, Section 1). Since the fetus has not been born, it is not a citizen, but the mother is. Are you saying that it has a greater set of rights than she does?
Take your time.

[valleyrogue]

12. It's a potential male, so yes, it would have more rights than the "weaker vessel," women. n/t

[whathehell]

29. Project 2025 wants to amend the Constitution

to remove Birthright Citizenship..I'm sure that would apply to "in utero" citizenship as well.

[CrispyQ]

59. Also, forced birth violates a woman's 13th Amendment rights.

Abortion and the 13th Amendment
2010
Forced Labor, Revisited: The Thirteenth Amendment and Abortion
Andrew Koppelman
Northwestern University School of Law, [e-mail]

https://scholarlycommons.law.northwestern.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?referer=https://www.google.com/&httpsredir=1&article=1031&context=facultyworkingpapers

snip...

I. The basic argument The Thirteenth Amendment reads as follows:

1. Neither slavery nor involuntary servitude, except as a punishment for crime whereof the party shall have been duly convicted, shall exist within the United States, or any place subject to their jurisdiction.

2. Congress shall have the power to enforce this article by appropriate legislation.

My claim is that the amendment is violated by laws that prohibit abortion. When women are compelled to carry and bear children, they are subjected to "involuntary servitude" in violation of the amendment. Abortion prohibitions violate the Amendment's guarantee of personal liberty, because forced pregnancy and childbirth, by compelling the woman to serve the fetus, creates "that control by which the personal service of one man [sic] is disposed of or coerced for another's benefit which is the essence of involuntary servitude."6

Such laws violate the amendment's guarantee of equality, because forcing women to be mothers makes them into a servant caste, a group which, by virtue of a status of birth, is held subject to a special duty to serve others and not themselves.

~more at link

Parents can't be compelled to donate their organs to their child, even to save the child's life. Why does a fetus have more claim on a woman's body than her child who has been born?

[Tumbulu]

61. I have been saying this for decades now

Thanks for bringing it up.

It needs to be repeated endlessly.

[soldierant]

65. Well done!

[valleyrogue]

11. According to this MRA neckbeard,

women are things to fuck and bear babies and are not even human.

To humanize a fetus, embryo, zygote is to render women as vessels, as subhuman.

[B.See]

31. THIS. In MAGA mentality, women serve the needs of men.

[Blue Owl]

13. Hey ladies! JD Vance wants to do the thinkin' for ya....

[ProfessorPlum]

14. No one is required by law to give up their bodily autonomy for another person

even if death is on the line. We aren't forced to give blood, donate kidneys and lungs, donate skin for grafts. We aren't forced by law to donate bone marrow to a match who needs a transplant, even if not doing so would lead to someone's death. This is a sign that we are a society that honors our legal right to keep our bodies to ourselves.

And neither should child-bearing people be forced to give up their bodily autonomy for a cellular process that could one day, with enough resources and time added to it, become a person.

it's such a simple thing - I can't believe how many people are bamboozled by this stupid argument about "babies"

[cpamomfromtexas]

17. Very good argument

[localroger]

39. There is the "Sister's Keeper" argument

There have been a case or two where a child was deliberately conceived to be an organ donor for a sibling for whom no donor was available; this was fictionalized in the book and movie where the donor child sues in her late pre-teens to emancipate herself and take control of the medical juggernaut that has been railroading her toward donating her designer organs to save her sister's life. The story is neatly wrapped up when the donor wins her court case but then dies of other causes, becoming a donor more conventionally, and I don't believe the legal question of whether such a child actually owns her own organs has ever really been definitely answered in court. So while it seems like a cut and dried question whether you have final ownership over your own organs, there are circumstances where even ordinary people might be tempted to make an exception if your attitude toward a purpose is insufficiently noble. Do we really believe that the bodily autonomy of a child is as important as a decade of medical prep, hundreds of thousands or millions of dollars, and the life she was created to save when she wouldn't even exist if she hadn't been deliberately created to serve this purpose? And if the answer is "no," that is one damn slippery slope we've just taken a step on.

[nuxvomica]

63. Well said, and well thought

We need to re-frame the question to something like, "If they can take a woman's right to bodily autonomy. what's to stop them from forcing you to donate a kidney to a politically connected billionaire who is a perfect match?" There's no daylight between those two possibilities.

[ProfessorPlum]

64. exactly - well put

that's a great and potent way to frame it

[CrispyQ]

66. Women are forced to give up their autonomy for this.

Pregnancy tissue at six weeks.

Heartbeat laws? Where is the heart?

It's absolute insanity.

[Baitball Blogger]

15. Proceed, Senator.

[cpamomfromtexas]

16. So how about picking up the tab and PAYING HER

That way at least a pregnancy isn’t slavery.

Only being slightly sarcastic.

They never consider that option do they?

[bluesbassman]

22. Not only is THAT not even a consideration,

Once there is an actual birth and a living breathing child is among us, you know, the thing they claim to care about most in the world; a CHILD, well that kid better have parents that have the wherewithal to provide adequate food, shelter, clothing, and healthcare for the next 18 years because they sure as hell aren’t going to have any part in providing it if they don’t.

[SamKnause]

18. In the large majority of abortions there is no baby.

If you don't know what a Zygote, Embryo, or Fetus is you shouldn't be allowed in the conversation.

Shut the fuck up you fascist piece of shit.

No one should be forced to carry a rapist's baby.

No on should be forced to carry a baby that resulted from incest.

No on should be forced to carry a baby that is not viable.

Fuck all these assholes that want to control women.

They pretend 9 months of pregnancy is no inconvenience.

They pretend is doesn't cost a fortune in hospital bills.

Then to top it off they pass every kind of bill that is against women and children.

Fuck all of them !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

They pretend it doesn't cost a fortune to raise a child.

[LetMyPeopleVote]

20. Does this work both ways?

[electric_blue68]

21. "WE "just" need to reframe the idea...". "Just!?" We're NOT your broodmares, effer!

Effin' trogolytes!

Such a infuriating attitude, drives me nutz.

[Blaukraut]

23. Would he still feel that way if his wife or one day his daughter

got raped and got pregnant by the rapist? Would he still consider them temporarily inconvenienced?

[B.See]

34. He'll still SAY the same throwback sht, but THEY never do

Last edited Thu Jul 18, 2024, 04:37 AM - Edit history (1)

what they say. So if it were his wife or daughter, he'd do what well connected or wealthy bstrds of PRIVILEGE like him have always done.

Get it quietly "taken care of."

[Xavier Breath]

24. Sorry, JD, there ain't enough lipstick for that pig. n/t

[DemocraticPatriot]

25. It isn't a baby until it is BORN........!

This framing that a fetus is a baby is religious, not scientific.... and in the Jewish religion, life is defined as beginning when one draws their first breath--- not beforehand.

[GPV]

26. Fuck that shit!

[unblock]

27. "And we need to reframe slavery to be about the rights of the business owner!

"It's not about forcing people to work, it's whether business owners should be allowed to run their businesses as they see fit in response to the needs of the market, even if the circumstances of some people's labor is inconvenient or a problem to the society"

Ok maybe not a direct quote but that's what I'm hearing....

[haele]

58. Well, you must have read Project 2025.

Yes, he will reframe labor as slavery. He's already said in an interview on Faux (fancy that) about how we should promote forced birth so we can have a "Healthy Ruling Class".

https://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=19161608

No one goes on about his elitist Tech Bro Class views. Because the Media keeps pushing he's just a "Blue Collar Worker" kid made good, y'know.

Haele

[NoMoreRepugs]

28. It's apparently what a large portion of Merica' wants.

[Ritabert]

30. So Vance is willing to pay for the woman's healthcare?

And the cost of raising that child until he's 18? I didn't think so. Sit down and shut up.

[Solly Mack]

32. Spraying rose water on shit gets you nothing but rose water on shit. The shit is still shit.

[DBoon]

33. someone who calls rape resulting in pregnancy "somehow inconvenient"

Should be driven out of civilized society

[Bristlecone]

35. That's right! Freedom Hatching is much better!

[Diamond_Dog]

36. Fuck you, JD, you misogynist piece of shit. You don't have a clue what you're talking about.

I hope you and your orange turd boss go down in flames. Times a thousand.

[lostnfound]

40. It's not inconvenient to "SOCIETY" -- in GOP-land, we are each ON OUR OWN, mom gets all the medical bills

Same jackasses gripe that the Affordable Care Act requires insurance companies to cover OB/GYN care.

Because they want a special discounted “man’s rate”, in effect, as the not-eligible-for-pregnancy clones that they are.
They weren’t really born, just decanted.

[Model35mech]

41. Yep, that's the babies are innocent meme. But babies CAN and DO create HUGE problems

for the women that don't want to carry their pregnancies to term.

[flying_wahini]

42. Let's reframe it to include the death penalty for rapists. And mandatory vasectomies for all males at 18.

You can have your sperms back when We think you are worthy. Also we are going to garnish father’s paychecks for all child care and expenses.

[rurallib]

55. The vasectomies should be earlier than 18 but otherwise seems

like responsibility for pregnancy is being focused in the right spot.

[Silver Gaia]

43. How Gilead of him.

I'm sure he would be fine with handmaids, too.

[karynnj]

44. Is it time for a "Bernard Shaw" question

If his wife was raped and became pregnant would he demand that she have that baby? What if it put her life at risk? What if his now 2 year old daughter were raped when she was a young teen, at an age where carrying a baby to term could be dangerous? Would he get her the needed abortion?

[hatrack]

45. "It's not that our sadistic policies suck - it's our MESSAGING that's the problem!!!"

[Dorn]

46. Hey Asshole:How about making birth control very widely available, how about paying for all child care costs, how about..

How about
* how paid excellent education through graduate school with tenured teachers
* how about food, clothing, medical care, housing for children
* how about time off work for parents to nurture children
* how about you just STFU Asshole!

[markie]

47. it's not

a fucking (excuse my language) baby... it's a zygot, a fetus, a parasite, etc... until it is wanted by a mother and the memories of that "inconvenient" rape will live with that woman forever... I boil at this kind of talk

[StarryNite]

48. "inconvenient"? What a stupid fuck.

[CTyankee]

49. "somewhat inconvenient"

Let's put that quote on a pro-choice poster and see how many women voters think that's just fine!

[niyad]

50. Hey, yahoo, it is convicted felon FORMER president.

[Klarkashton]

51. Twice impeached.

[SamuelTheThird]

52. He has some choice quotes for ads

[barbaraann]

53. Time to repost Monty Python's classic:

[Beartracks]

54. Was he the one that said, "The revolution will be bloodless if liberals would just let it happen"?

Gee, no threat of political violence there.

==========

[Wounded Bear]

56. A new frame around a turd is still a shitty picture...

[CrispyQ]

57. If it was about the babies...

What say you, Mr. Vance?

[Initech]

60. What a piece of shit!

[Colorado Liberal]

62. The modern republican party

"Rape or incest" are "somehow inconvenient". I have no words.

[LetMyPeopleVote]

67. Why JD Vance's record on abortion rights matters in 2024 race

If Donald Trump didn't want a running mate who was too extreme on abortion rights, he really shouldn't have tapped the senator from Ohio for the Republican ticket.

Link to tweet

https://www.msnbc.com/rachel-maddow-show/maddowblog/jd-vances-record-abortion-rights-trump-2024-race-rcna162554

To be sure, “too staunch” is a matter of perspective, but if the presumptive GOP nominee tapped Sen. JD Vance for the ticket assuming that his views on reproductive rights would seem mainstream, Trump made a poor choice.

Take this Washington Post report, for example.

Sen. J.D. Vance (R-Ohio), newly tapped as the GOP vice-presidential nominee, last year joined an effort to enforce the Comstock Act, the 151-year-old federal law that has become a lightning rod in the nation’s abortion debate. The Comstock Act, which bans the mailing of abortion-related materials, has not been invoked for that purpose in about a century. ... But some Republicans have attempted to resurrect the law to limit or effectively ban abortion nationwide, a position that Vance and other lawmakers conveyed to Attorney General Merrick Garland in a January 2023 letter.

Unfortunately for the Republican ticket, this is just one of many relevant data points.

While Trump has avoided endorsing a national abortion ban, for example, CNN reported that Vance, during his Senate candidacy, said, “I certainly would like abortion to be illegal nationally.”

Vance, the year before reaching Capitol Hill, said at the time, “I’m sympathetic to the view that like, okay, look here, here’s a situation — let’s say Roe vs. Wade is overruled. Ohio bans abortion, in 2022 or let’s say 2024. And then, you know, every day George Soros sends a 747 to Columbus to load up disproportionately Black women to get them to go have abortions in California. And of course, the left will celebrate this as a victory for diversity — uh, that’s kind of creepy.”.....

And did I mention that Vance publicly endorsed his home state’s six-week abortion ban, which does not include exceptions for rape or incest? Because he did that, too.

All of which brings us back to the concerns Trump reportedly expressed in the spring. “He’s concerned it will have a drag on the ticket if they’re seen as holding too staunch a position”? By any fair measure, Vance is one of the Senate’s most far-right Republicans when it comes to reproductive rights, with a series of beliefs that most Americans would see as extreme.

[TicketyBoo]

68. "Reframe The Idea"

A skunk by any other name…

…is still a stinking skunk.

[Old Crank]

69. So I expect the press to ask every GOP what they plan to do to help the babies

They are forcing children and women victims of rape to carry.

What kind of support will they call for. How much money to be paid?

There will be nothing. And no questions from the JINOs

[canetoad]

70. Just like you need to reframe

The definition of a harem; it's really a collection of women who own a man.