I am amazed at the fact that zero news has been posted about the Venezuelan election fraud.

[Escurumbele]

I understand that most everyone is worried about the USA's November election, but what happens in Venezuela impacts the USA November election more than what people understand.

Why is it so? For one, you have Marco Rubio and other republicans talking about it, and the Latino voters noticing that almost nothing is coming from the Biden administration, or from Democratic sites like DU, they take notice, they don't like it, disinformation starts going around that "Democrats don't care about Latinos", and thus Latinos end up voting for trump. If anyone has heard the term "MAGAzolanos" they understand this is what happened in 2016 and 2020.

According to a 2019 Gallup Poll, 29% of Latinos identify as conservative, and that same number, 29%, voted for Donald Trump in the 2016 Presidential Election. In the 2022 U.S. House Elections, 39% of Hispanic voters backed Republican candidates and 60% backed Democratic candidates.

If the numbers of Latino voters moves up, that could represent a real problem for Harris.

Anyone who has followed what happened in Venezuela during the campaign and the election will have noticed that Maduro repeated the trump "bloodbath" rhetoric almost word for word during the campaign, he has now proclaimed himself the winner of an election that everyone knows he lost by a huge margin 70/30. It seems that he has also flown mercenaries from the Russian "Wagner Group", from Cuba, China, and some Arab countries that support him, the "bloodbath" has already began. The day after the election 10 people were killed, a young woman was among them, all she was doing was walking the streets of the town where she lived, they were all shot in the head by snipers.

Venezuela also represents a geographical danger for the USA. Russia has been in that country now for many years, they have built military bases, same as China, they have been taking natural resources from the country, gold, silver, steel, precious stones, oil, etc. If, or when, Russia decides to attack the USA, they will be able to do it from Venezuela, the proximity will allow them mount an attack with very little time for the USA to react.

Last thing I will say is that, if Maduro succeeds it will have proven to be a blueprint for what trump and his sycophants from the republican party will try to do in November. This is no joke, the news of what is happening in that country has to be spread, and the Biden administration must take strong actions, and I don't mean sanctions, now is a question of force. Some will say it is none of our business, but it is more our business than people understand.

[Think. Again.]

1. That's not true, there have been multiple posts about it.

[Dennis Donovan]

2. The Carter Center is monitoring

Link to tweet

https://www.cartercenter.org/news/pr/2024/venezuela-073024.html

[hlthe2b]

3. Not true... Several articles have been posted, including the Carter Center weighing in, another with

SOS Blinken stating the US negative assessment and quite a few others over the past several days.

Maduro's close relationship with Trump has been discussed here on many occasions--only adding to concern.

DU and DUers are not ignorant to what is going on and neither is the Biden admin (and our CIA/NSA). Obviously, the RW wants to inflame the situation to lead to another major influx of immigrants at the border from Venezuelans desperate to flee.

[Marcus IM]

15. Can you show us some credible info on this Trump/Maduro relationship?

Please inform us with some credible sources.

Thanks

[hlthe2b]

20. It would take time to do archival searches. Start with a google search yourself. I'm on a 16 hour shift...

Sorry. I only check in on breaks..

Trump tried to tie Maduro to "socialist dems' when it was exposed he had backchannel meetings with him before the Previous election and was planning to meet with him after his loss in Florida. Some of TSF's henchmen types (Miller? Bannon? not sure all) reportedly had met with Maduro and worked with his campaign prior to the LAST unsuccessful election.

[Marcus IM]

21. When you get a chance, would be great to see some proof

Thanks.

[hlthe2b]

35. There were some articles written about Jason Miller, and a few other Trumpies in Venezueala prior to 2020

election. Undoubtedly (once) quite a bit on the old Twitter, but Poof from Google now, so take that for what it is worth. TSF DID manage to use that election to smear Biden with the refugee community in Florida during that election and when Maduro came to Florida, Trump originally planned to meet with him. I recall clearly that Don JR had some contact, but it was all swept under the rug when they decided to use him to paint Biden as a Socialist. And it worked in Fl.

So, unless some fairly mainstream reporter kept some materials on that reporting or another DUers can be helpful, it appears very difficult to find now. It may be that David Corn wrote about it (maybe Michael Isikoff? ) It has been a while and attempts to search DU archives back beyond a year or so don't seem to work. I just get errors.

So... I have detailed memories, but no linked articles. Just like much of the corrupt crap Trump and his ilk undertake--it all of a sudden goes poof... Take it for what it is worth...

[ImNotGod]

4. U.S. arrests a former Green Beret over failed 2020 raid to remove Maduro

A former U.S. Green Beret who in 2020 organized a failed cross-border raid of Venezuelan army deserters to remove President Nicolás Maduro has been arrested in New York on federal arms smuggling charges.

A federal indictment unsealed this week in Tampa, Florida, accuses Jordan Goudreau and a Venezuelan partner, Yacsy Alvarez, of violating U.S. arms control laws when they allegedly assembled and sent to Colombia AR-styled weapons, ammunition, silencers, night vision goggles and other defense equipment requiring a U.S. export license.

Goudreau, 48, also was charged with conspiracy, smuggling goods from the United States and unlawful possession of a machine gun, among 14 counts. Goudreau appeared in federal court following his Tuesday arrest in Manhattan but it was not clear a day later whether he would be released from custody pending trial. He was being held at a federal detention center in Brooklyn.

https://www.wlrn.org/americas/2024-08-01/u-s-arrests-a-former-green-beret-over-failed-2020-raid-to-remove-maduro

Jordan Goudreau, an ex-Green Beret who has boasted about protecting President Donald Trump, was behind the foiled plot to topple Maduro

[Escurumbele]

11. This one was years ago. But OK, I guess I have missed the few that have been posted, maybe I was expecting a

continued discussion because the struggle of the Venezuelan people is ongoing, and its getting worst, and unless people don't start pushing for a resolution I don't see forceful actions from Biden Administration. I am hoping that things are going on behind the scene where we cannot see what action are taking place, but innocent people are getting killed there, and the mercenaries the regime has brought into the country will make things worst.

They have also filed documents of incarceration for the leaders of the opposition, it is "Plan 2025" in 2024 in Venezuela, people need to see what is happening.

So my apologies for not seeing what has been posted, but then again, not enough to make a dent, it is important for the USA as of course it is important to the Venezuelan people, this is their chance to get rid of a criminal and violent dictator, one dictator less in the World is a very good thing.

[Marcus IM]

19. Show us those filed documents. Thanks.

Fyi, opposition candidates who lose the election who call for insurrection should be locked up.

Isn't that a major goal for the leader of the J6 insurrection? Trump.

Pretty hypocritical to walk both sides of insurrection and the instigators.

Note: I'm not supporting Maduro.

[tritsofme]

5. There are plenty of Maduro apologists ready to attack you as a MAGA or Heritage Institution lackey if you question their

Dear Leader’s results, as the Biden administration, and all EU states, with the exception of check…Viktor Orban’s Hungary, all have.

Pretty pathetic if you ask me.

[Marcus IM]

9. Some just don't like insurrection by the losers.

And some support insurrection by the loser's minions.

And then there are some who support a military junta/dictatorship in Venezuela.

And some who support waiting for the final tabulations and recounts before calling the winner of the election a dictator.

I, for one, do not support RW Heritage backed insurrection to stop constitutional election processes.

In the USA and Venezuela

I do not support yet another episode of US interventionism in the Latin Americas.

Because of my position, some here accused me of being a Maduro minion. Nope. I've explained this to no avail.
Some here accused me of extolling communism. Nope. I've explained that to no avail.
Some here accused me of supporting dictatorship. Nope. I have made that clear, also to no avail.
The slander, accusations, innuendo, and fabrication of comments I have never made continue.

No clarification is enough for some. The false accusations continue.

[Escurumbele]

14. To intervine to stop Maduro is in USA interests, you don't want Russians, Chinese, and Arabs who hate the USA

so close to home, in no time they will take over the entire Central and South America. I don't get it why they allowed Chavez and his ilk to take power in Venezuela, everyone knew who they were and who their allies were, why let that happen?

[Marcus IM]

24. Are you suggesting that the US should control the Latin Americas

What do you mean "allowed to take power"?

Chavez was elected by majority vote.
Maduro was elected by a majority vote.

Are suggesting that we do away with democracy in Latin American countries because they vote in ways we don't like?

[gab13by13]

27. I worked in Venezuela for a short period

and the people loved Chavez, at least when I was there.

[Marcus IM]

28. I have also, and saw the same.

I've been there on surgical seminars.

I have cousins who live and work in healthcare there too. I visit yearly.

[tritsofme]

30. Maduro is only the "winner" because he declared himself the winner.

If Trump had that sort of power in 2020, January 6th wouldn’t have been necessary.

I haven’t seen any compelling reason to accept these “results” just because the Maduro regime released them.

The Biden/Harrris administration, the EU, and basically anyone who isn’t in Putin’s orbit, are disputing them.

Why do you suppose this is? Are they just MAGA Heritage dopes?

[Marcus IM]

38. Quite a leap you make.

Some think that we should allow the final numbers to be tabulated before scrambling to the "dictator" route.

Announcement of a winner of a large margin is normal process, just as it is here.

The final tallies in every precinct can take weeks here and in most democracies.

But, there are people who yell "fake news" and "rigged election" just because their favored candidate lost.

Here and in Venezuela.

[tritsofme]

39. So why do you suppose that Biden/Harris, the EU, and basically all governments not connected to Putin

are questioning this result?

[Marcus IM]

40. I don't have a problem with questions.

It's coming up with conclusions before the recount and accounting is complete that is problematic.

Insisting that the winner of a significant margin is a dictator before the final and full counts are completed is bombast, not based on evidence.

Just like it's problematic and bombastic here with our last presidential election for the opposition to be calling the winner a "dictator", as we see at opposition rallies here.

Especially by the same media that soft peddles the same type of unsubstantiated accusations here.

[Happy Hoosier]

47. I'll just say you seem content with...

Maduro fraudulently claiming victory, despite even the Carter center expressing doubt.

I’ll leave it at that.

[maxsolomon]

6. Why didn't you do something about it earlier?

I've seen multiple stories posted.

[Escurumbele]

18. Because I have not seen any of what has been pointed out, felt it premature to say something.

I check on DU every day, and I must confess, a few times a day, and I did not see anything, but when you start seeing news about mercenaries from the Russian "Wagner Group", China, Cuba, etc. moving in that country, when you start looking at video of thugs walking the streets of Caracas carrying AK-15 type weapons (could not tell if those are Russian weapons, but would not doubt it), when you start seeing young men and young women killed from sniper head shots, then you start asking why isn't there enough coverage, why are we not talking about these horrors?

[Johnny2X2X]

7. Lots of threads on this

We're all paying attention as this is the GOP plan for the 2028 US elections.

[Marcus IM]

12. It's interesting to see so much support for insurrection in them

DUers believe that that rejecting RW Heritage candidates is what we should be doing here. And rightly so.

But Venezuelans who voted against the same Heritage interests are not to be trusted? Americans know what's best for Latin Americans and the Latin Americas?

Why would that be?

That smacks of the Monroe Doctrine, in 2024.

[Johnny2X2X]

16. What are you even talking about?

Heritage interests in Venezuala? Moduro is a dictator who has destroyed his country, people voted him out and like a true dictator he's staying in power.

[AZSkiffyGeek]

26. Tankies gonna tank

[PufPuf23]

29. What is tankie? nt

[sir pball]

34. A violent Communist

It's just a polite term for a Stalinist.

Communist revolution by Any Means Necessary, but the more violent and suppressive the better.

[PufPuf23]

36. Thank you but wonder how that applies to Venezuela. nt

[Sympthsical]

44. Some people love authoritarianism

As long as it is their particular flavor.

Tankies are some of those people.

In this instance, no matter how authoritarian Venezuela devolves into, they'll approve. Because it's their guy.

[Marcus IM]

41. How do you respond to those advocating for US intervention

There are posts in this very thread.

Fyi, a "tankie" is a minion of the various US Think Tanks, like ... The Heritage Foundation, Rand, AEI, IRI, NED, ETC ETC

Most all right wing if not extremely right wing.

One would logically conclude that those calling for US intervention and control of Latin American countries might be the "tankies".

Telling DUers that "tankies" are communists is laughable.

[orange jar]

43. Would you support an "insurrection" if it happened in, say, Russia?

Like, progressive and/or Leftist Russians protesting the far right authoritarian government there? If the same thing that's happening in Venezuela right now happened in Russia, would it be more acceptable to you or would you also find that to be a criminal act that requires detainment, police brutality, and imprisonment as a response?

[Marcus IM]

45. I support democracy where the winner gets the most votes.

So, unfortunately, despite my love for this country, that excludes the US because the winner of the most presidential votes often loses by the contorted US's undemocratic electoral college system.

Then, here, we vote for electors - that are not required to cast their votes as their constituency elected them to do. In some states ... but not others.

My parents taught me to get my own house in order before I insist others do. I think it's pretty good advice.

[Sogo]

8. You're suggesting our military is not aware of and prepared for the threat? That's laughable....

" If, or when, Russia decides to attack the USA, they will be able to do it from Venezuela, the proximity will allow them mount an attack with very little time for the USA to react."

[TwilightZone]

10. DU has a search function.

Give it a try. You'll find numerous posts on the subject.

[yardwork]

13. I think you greatly overestimate the importance of DU discussions to global politics.

Somehow I feel sure that the Biden administration is on top of this, whether or not you've noticed the threads about it here.

If you're worried about Latino voter support for the Harris ticket, maybe do some outreach or even just start some threads about Venezuela. Scolding us because you don't think there are enough threads about it here seems sort of unproductive.

[Escurumbele]

22. Where do you get I am not doing my part to make sure the DNC, for example, does more to sway and to make

sure the Latino vote is not lost? Do not assume please, I do my part, and that is why I wrote this post because I don't see enough conversation on what is going on in Venezuela.

Show me a post today, which I may not have seen because I have seen none, neither yesterday or the day before yesterday.

I do my part, I communicate with my local DNC and the one in Washington.

Anyone remember Elian Gonzalez and how that fiasco affected Latino votes? and who won? who lost votes because of that action?

I have a lot of Latino friends, and I hear what they are saying, they believe the lies that trump and his minions say all the time on how the love Latinos, how they are engaged in bringing Maduro down, although if you read Chapter 9 of the John Bolton book (and I am no fan of Bolton), which he dedicated to Venezuela, you will find out that Bolton had everything planned out to oust Maduro, Putin told trump not to do it, so trump told Bolton to stop it that "Guaido is weak and Maduro is 'Strong & Intelligent'", but they only believe what they see, they don't read the books.

[obamanut2012]

17. Nope -- quite a few posts about it

I first learned about it here, not on Reddit or my local news.

[Escurumbele]

23. If by chance you have the links please share? Thank you

[carpetbagger]

31. As another poster said, search function.

We have a search function. 30 threads, including this one, in 10 days with the word Maduro in the starting post.

[Escurumbele]

25. OK, I googled, found 19 posts with news about the Elections in Venezuela, the rest is old, as far as I found.

But none of the current events, the killings, the huge mass of people complaining about the fraud, but I will continue to look.

[obamanut2012]

37. God, yes there was, including a post with DUers who have relatives and friends there asking for help

[ck4829]

32. My post 2 hours ago. Simply unthinkable that millions of voters could just be ignored. Unthinkable.

https://www.democraticunderground.com/100219272000

[carpetbagger]

33. Elections and invasions in the same paragraph....

...has 2002 entered the room?

[Torchlight]

42. I've read a few pretty good threads about it in the past five days or so.

But they do tend do go off the rails with empty assertions and meritless finger pointing at other posters. That said, after separating the chaff from the wheat, the posts I've read have provided some insights and a few contained sources cited.

[TommyT139]

46. Behind the scenes

From The Guardian:

Venezuela election: US recognises opposition candidate Edmundo González as winner
US secretary of state Antony Blinken says there is ‘overwhelming evidence’ González beat Nicolás Maduro in last weekend’s presidential election

https://www.theguardian.com/world/article/2024/aug/02/venezuela-election-us-edmundo-gonzalez-maduro-results-disputed

If it walks like a Trump, talks like a trump, refuses to leave power after losing, like a trump...the opposition doesn't look much like the insurrectionists, do they.

[Turk182]

48. Deleted

Last edited Fri Aug 2, 2024, 10:38 AM - Edit history (1)

[RJ_MacReady]

49. sad to see

Some people here siding with Maduro. He lost and is trying to steal the election. Good on President Biden calling it out.