Who here remembers Dunblane, Scotland?

[SheilaT]

March 13, 1996.

Go ahead and Google it. I'll wait.
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Sound just a little familiar? Now check out what the response was.

Note that it wasn't just to wring hands and say, oh, gosh, how awful but gun ownership is a sacred right.

NO! They made private ownership of guns illegal in the UK. Yes, they did.

I wonder if there is not some limit, some number of people murdered all at once which would finally say, Enough! None of us need guns.

Apparently not. The gun apologists are out in full force. Good Christ, apparently no one near and dear to a gun owner EVER gets slaughtered in a mass shooting. Oh, they periodically "accidentally" mistake someone coming home late at night for an intruder, but they always seem to think that's a trivial price to pay.

And DON'T start blathering on about not letting crazy people have guns, or how our mental health system somehow, mysteriously, failed us. Because you NEVER can tell when an otherwise normal seeming person will just lose it and grab some of those precious, more precious than life itself, guns and start shooting.

[Skittles]

1. a remember a surgeon who worked on the terribly injured children

after being notified her own child was among the dead

[dhol82]

2. andy murray

just learned recently that tennis pro andy murray was a student at the school when the attack happened. he lucked out.

sadly, don't think gun control will happen here in my lifetime.

[Londoncalling]

3. He and his brother

hid under their head teachers desk while it happened. I read a rare interview about it.
It most likely explains something in his personality...http://www.guardian.co.uk/sport/2008/jun/05/tennis.scotland
I certainly remember it, I remember the pictures of the children all over the front pages the next day.

[xchrom]

4. indeed. nt

[sendero]

5. Yeah...

.... just pass a law and all of the guns will magically disappear. Just like all the drugs did. And the explosives, and like -well like ALL CRIME. After all, if something is illegal it will not exist in the minds of the delusional.

It really gets tedious.

[SheilaT]

12. And these kind of mass murders

aren't tedious?

The UK criminalized gun ownership. So I guess only their criminals have guns, and the mass killings continue merrily there?

Oh. They don't. I learned from Rachel Maddow that in the last 50 years, yes 50 years, 15 of the 25 worst mass murders occurred here in the U.S. Such a lovely thing to be number one in.

[Ilsa]

6. I actually thought about the Scotland school

shooting yesterday. I didnt know that they changed their gun laws, though. Good for them. I doubt anyone here will have the courage to do that.

[jsr]

7. Certainly.

[a la izquierda]

8. That is the first thing I thought of. Nt

[HiPointDem]

9. gun ownership isn't illegal in the uk.

[baldguy]

11. The NRA thanks you for your service.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunblane_school_massacre

"Public debate subsequent to these events centred on gun-control laws, including media-driven public petitions calling for a ban on private ownership of handguns and an official enquiry, the Cullen Report. In response to this debate, the Firearms (Amendment) Act 1997 and the Firearms (Amendment) (No. 2) Act 1997 were enacted, which effectively made private ownership of handguns illegal in the United Kingdom."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Firearms_%28Amendment%29_Act_1997

"It effectively banned the possession of all handguns other than those chambered for .22 Rim-fire cartridges by civilians in most of the United Kingdom by making them subject to Section Five (Prohibited Weapons) of the Firearms Acts."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Firearms_%28Amendment%29_%28No._2%29_Act_1997

"This new (No. 2) act further banned the private ownership of all cartridge ammunition handguns, regardless of calibre."

[HiPointDem]

13. i'm the furthest thing from an nra member you could imagine. the simple fact is that possession

of guns is not illegal in the uk.

To possess any kind of firearm in the UK, any person, including foreign nationals resident within the UK, must normally hold either a Shotgun Certificate (SGC) or a Firearm Certificate (FAC). Air rifles which produce less than 12 foot pounds of energy at the muzzle, and air pistols which produce less than 6 foot pounds of energy at the muzzle, are not classed as "firearms" for certification purposes, but they are still subject to various laws restricting their ownership and use.

A firearm is, broadly speaking for certification purposes, any lethal, barrelled weapon which isn't a shotgun or an airgun or a "prohibited weapon". The term "prohibited weapon" covers a multitude of devices including, but not limited to, machine guns, rocket launchers, pepper sprays, semi-automatic and pump-action centrefire rifles, disguised firearms, grenades, torpedoes and "any firearm which either has a barrel less than 30cm in length or is less than 60cm in length overall" (the most common member of this last group is a cartridge loading pistol).

For the purposes of legal possession of a firearm, effectively the above leaves black powder weapons (both rifles and pistols), manually loaded centre-fire cartridge rifles (and all types of .22 rimfire rifles), and manually loaded cartridge pistols with dimensions larger than those defined above. All these weapons are what are termed "Section 1" firearms and are held on a Section 1 Firearms Certificate (there are other Sections for different categories of firearms, for example machine guns are in Section 5 and historic breech-loading firearms are in Section 7). It is difficult for private citizens to obtain an FAC for other than one covering Section 1 firearms.

A shotgun is, broadly speaking for certification purposes, a smooth-barrelled gun which discharges a number of pellets, rather than a single projectile, when it is fired. Shotguns held on a SGC must not be capable of holding more than three cartridges in total. They may be single barrel, double barrel, pump action or semi-automatic, but the three cartridge limit still applies and the barrel(s) must be longer than 24 inches. Pumps and semi-autos must be longer than 40 inches overall.

http://www.marplerifleandpistolclub.org.uk/general/gunlaw.htm

[baldguy]

14. How come the most blatant & disgusting RW NRA lies and propaganda

Always seem to come from people who claim to be "the furthest thing from an nra member you could imagine"?

[HiPointDem]

16. it's a lie that it's legal to possess some firearms in the uk? prove it.

Air rifles with a power output of less than 12ft/lb are available to shooters without the need for a licence. For air pistols, the power limit is reduced to 6ft/lb...

The Home Office has a list of ‘Obsolete Calibre’ rifles, shotguns and pistols. These may be bought, sold and possessed without a licence of any kind, provided that they are owned as curios only...

Any weapons listed on the ‘Obsolete Calibre’ list may be hung on the wall or form part of a display, as there are no security requirements...

Most shooters do most of their shooting in the UK with a shotgun. The law defines this as a smooth-bored gun with barrels of not less than 24”. If the gun is a semi-automatic or pump-action, the magazine must be restricted to hold no more than two shells, with a third in the chamber...

To buy, sell or possess a ‘Section 2’ shotgun you are required to hold a valid Shotgun Certificate...

Shooters wishing to use a .22 for rabbiting, a .17HMR for vermin control, a .243 for foxing or a .308 for stalking will need a ‘Section 1’ Firearms Certificate. This enables the holder to possess the exact calibre, number and type of rifles specified on the licence and outlines the purposes for which each may be used...

Unlike ‘Section 2’ shotguns, a ‘Section 1’ firearm must be required for a specific purpose (called ‘Good Reason’) and the police need to be satisfied that the applicant needs it and has good cause to want it for the specified purpose...

‘Section 5’ covers weapons that are prohibited unless special permission is granted by the Home Secretary. This section covers automatic weapons, military weapons and modern handguns. Specialist collectors and dealers are able to gain Section 5 authority but is will not be available to the vast majority of shooters and collectors...

http://www.sportingshooter.co.uk/features/ask_the_experts_2_8808/firearms_law_1_1529690


In fact, the OP, which creates the impression that guns are completely banned without exemption is the 'propaganda'.

[baldguy]

10. The US has has 17 mass shootings in 2012 alone.

That's more than all of the countries in Europe combined.

[HiPointDem]

15. yet the homicide rate is down -- significantly since the 1990s. strange.

1993: 24K murders

2003: 16K murders

2011: 11K murders

http://www.disastercenter.com/crime/uscrime.htm