Latest Pathetic Conservative Attack on Social Security: Disability Fraud Hysteria

[xchrom]

http://www.alternet.org/economy/latest-pathetic-conservative-attack-social-security-disability-fraud-hysteria




Conservatives are not happy. Despite their best efforts, the public continues to give Social Security a big thumbs up, and the President has just launched his second term with a speech hailing the program as a force that strengthens America.

You can understand their frustration. They’ve tried so very hard to make Americans think that we cannot afford to treat sick, disabled and elderly people with dignity while we subsidize the rich and fight unnecessary wars. But the public hasn't bought their solvency fabrications. And we haven’t been fooled by various pretenses for cutting, from the “chained CPI” adjustment to extending the retirement age again. Even the means-testing ruse, cloaked as sensitivity to the poor but intended to drain public support for the program, hasn’t worked out for them so far.

Conservatives still hate Social Security. Since the day the program was passed under Franklin Roosevelt, the greedy rich who don’t want to pay taxes and the financiers who want to stick Americans with private retirement accounts on which they can charge fees continue to invent new ways to attack and discredit the country's best-loved program. The think-tank minions and PR units attached to these Scrooges keep themselves up at night imagining new ways to dupe the public into accepting grotesque economic inequality as the norm and a downgraded future as the price we must pay for Wall Street greed.

Now the Social Security haters are taking a page from the Welfare Queen smear campaign book of the ‘90s to conjure a new scapegoat for all that is wrong with America: the Disability King. According to this meme, the problem with America’s economy and society is vast numbers of lazy, lying, good-for-nothing loafers cheating the American taxpayer through disability fraud.

[Recursion]

1. A friend of mine is an SSDI lawyer

(By which I mean a lawyer for SSDI, not an ambulance chaser.) She says that apparently if you're incredibly persistent over the course of 4 or 5 years, you can pretty much "find" a behavioral/mood disorder if you wear down your shrink by whining long enough. This rarely happens because it's much less work to just get a job, but it is a case of "complain long enough and we'll pay you to shut up".

She also said the increase in disability enrollment has happened, and happens every economic downturn, and is usually people whose disability made them marginally employable to begin with: if you have a construction company, Fred with the bad back is going to be the first guy you let go.

[Glitterati]

6. This is just complete bullshit

qualifying for disability is incredibly difficult. It entails not only YOUR doctor, but THEIR doctor as well.

In fact, my husband didn't HAVE a doctor when he applied for disability. We were too poor paying for PAST doctor bills.

The ONLY doctor who examined him for his disability claim was THEIR doctor. Who, in fact, begged him to go straight to the ER from the office. Chased him out the door begging him to go to the ER.

So, you and your pathetic "attorney" can just go kiss off. People DIE waiting for social security.

[Recursion]

8. That's a lot of hostility for agreeing with me

It's difficult to get on disability and takes years.

Verification is difficult for chronic conditions with non-specific presentations and behavioral health issues. This is a problem with the underlying medicine ("Is Fred really intermittently explosive?&quot not the program, but that's why if you have all four limbs it can take way too long.

[Glitterati]

9. Not agreeing with you for one second!

Because you're completely full of shit. You AND your "attorney."

Go ahead.

Try to turn disabled workers into your new "welfare queen by St. Ronnie."

Won't work.

Too many have been there,done that and know the truth.

I am one.

[Recursion]

12. Breathe

The incidence of disability fraud is non-zero. That's part of why it takes so long to get on it.

I also have to assume you didn't read my post, since you're freaking out about things I didn't say.

[Glitterati]

15. Again, calling bullshit on you

It doesn't "takes so long to get on it."

What part of that are you sooooo hard trying to ignore?

[Recursion]

19. Then why do people die waiting for it? (nt)

[Glitterati]

21. Ummmmm, because they're SICK?

See how that works.......sick......disabled........oh, yeah, THAT was the conversation.

Not SSDI Welfare Queens created out of whole cloth. By "attorneys" and their mouthpieces.

[Recursion]

27. Look, so far I've agreed with everything you said

Except the part where you inexplicably accuse me of attacking disabled workers, so I'm just going to let this go.

[Glitterati]

31. Yeah, I bet you are

Hard to create welfare queens out of whole cloth, now isn't it?

[rbixby]

88. I think your anger is misdirected

Basically what's being said is that disability takes a long time, whether legit or not, its a slow and long process. It sucks for the people who are legitimately deserving of it. That's essentially what's being said here, no one is accusing anyone of being a welfare queen.

I'm not quite sure why these statements made you angry, applying for disability sucks, and the poster you're arguing with is completely agreeing with you.

[Glitterati]

90. OK

if you say so.

[kickysnana]

105. +1 "Your (Glitteri) anger is misdirected"

[Glitterati]

106. Awwww, thank you

for being so concerned!

[Hekate]

116. +2 "Your (Glitteri) anger is misdirected"

Somebody is having a very bad day and is lashing out at people who are not attacking her.

[Glitterati]

14. More bullshit

Getting deep in here.

My husband had all 4 limbs. Hell, he LOOKED quite normal.

Until you looked at his medical records and listened to his heart.

He was approved for disability on the FIRST go round, by their doctor. Who also noted in his approval, that the Social Security Administration should do everything possible to get him medical attention IMMEDIATELY.

I've got the facts, not your St. Ronnie Welfare Queen Attorney.

[Recursion]

17. Can you slow down and read what I'm saying?

I mean, if you're going to reply that might be a good idea.

Disability is very difficult and time-consuming to get on. Why are you so angry at me for saying that when it's what you're saying too?

[Glitterati]

20. Because that's NOT what I'm saying

Try again.

I'm inserting the TRUTH, you and your "attorney" on the other hand.........

[Recursion]

24. Two posts up you're saying "people die waiting for SS"

I know it took my sister three and a half years, and she has MS which should be pretty cut and dry. SSDI kept kicking her back to do different kinds of tests.

[Glitterati]

29. Oh, I see

so your sister died waiting? Is that what you're saying?

Now, my goodness, why oh why didn't you get your "attorney" friend to help her before she died?

[Recursion]

40. As I said in that first post you attacked without reading, disability scammers are mythical

Because it takes so much work even for people with disabilities to get on it.

so your sister died waiting?

That's creepy, and no. The "die waiting" was a quote from you. I understand your "husband" (see? I can do that too!) had a good experience with a doctor who helped him out right away -- that's great. Not everybody gets that treatment, particularly when the presentation is difficult to pin down like my sister's non-standard MS.

[Glitterati]

45. Trust me, honey, I read every word

and knew EXACTLY where you were headed. It was easy as hell to see......loud and clear.

Once again, why is that your "attorney" friend didn't help your sister? And just what the hell is "non-standard MS?" Never heard of such a thing.

In fact, it sounds exactly like a case history made out of whole cloth! Now, isn't that just a coincidence?

[Recursion]

49. Well, if I had known my friend back then I would have asked her

And just what the hell is "non-standard MS?" Never heard of such a thing.

Good thing you're not her doctor, then. She has damage to her myelin sheaths in only parts of her spinal cord, in a pattern that the doctors keep saying is very unusual. Hence "non-standard". There's this laundry list of diagnostic criteria for MS (it's kind of like Lupus that way: one from column A and two from column B, etc.) and because we don't know the etiology in some senses it's a judgment call; the initial presentation is that she can't move her legs very much some days. He calls it MS but has to gloss that with "but it's not like the vast majority of MS cases and we don't know why". It took a lot of effort to get her on disability despite the fact that she can't even safely drive her car to work because she doesn't always have control of her legs.

[Mojorabbit]

109. It took me a two years to be approved for disability for MS

If you look at me most of the time you could not tell anything is wrong with me. I had to get a lawyer after being denied several times which they told me would happen. They almost never approve you on the first go round. I have debilitating fatigue among a host of other problems which lets me be active for about an hour doing anything before I have to rest and that is on a good day.

[Hekate]

118. "Trust me", you are being exceptionally hostile for no reason

You're having a bad day. I think we get that. But you are attacking the wrong people. Take a break.

[Glitterati]

126. I did take a break

all day..........why was it you came to the party so late?

I never was angry. Just really tired of passive aggressive right wingers loading this bullshit up on DU.

You really should pay attention to the TIME STAMP on posts when you tell folks to "take a break,"

[WinkyDink]

119. That is not what you wrote! You wrote one can "find"--as in, FAKE--by "wearing

down" & "whining," some eligible disability.

DO YOU KNOW THE MEANING OF "TONE"?

[dotymed]

79. Actually, I believe that SS

wants you to die while waiting for disability.
I had 5 heart attacks and a spine and appendages that obviously made it impossible to work. My Dr.'s were really pissed the first time that I was denied. The SS people have "employment professionals" that advise them what type of job that you can do (even if that job is non-existent) in our economy.
I was denied because they said that I could be a toll booth operator..really. I had 5 heart stents and (obviously) trouble breathing, not to mention that I could not be relied on to have "good days" when they scheduled me in (there were no toll roads where I lived anyway). With my prognosis smog was the last thing I could tolerate.
I fired my lawyer and filed my own appeal. Every SS Dr. that I saw, until the last one, could barely speak english. The last SS Dr. (American) told me that it was a sick joke (15 different meds a day) that I could expect to have "good days" on demand (according to schedule), she was appalled that I had to fight this system at all. The other SS "Dr's" said (I think) that I was fine despite the specialists diagnosis.
After 6 years (thank you Carpenters Union for my temporary disability checks that I had paid for when I was able to work) I finally got my disability. Of course the SS "judge" would not go against the original "judge" who determined that I could (at that time) work as a toll collector. So I got back-pay that began after the first "trial." I had tried unsuccessfully to work for two years before I ever filed for disability. I have the scars to prove it.
I now get paid less each month than I used to earn in two days. I get less because SS goes by your earnings from the last five years. It took me six years after filing and I waited two years to file because I want(ed) to work..because they only went back to the first trial, I lost out on my pension. You have to work full-time Union within the last five years in order to get your Union disability retirement...bastards (SS). I missed it by a few months because I could be a toll collector.

[Glitterati]

81. As was explained to us

the question isn't can you GET a job, the question is can you PERFORM ANY job.

That is the test of disability.

[Mojorabbit]

110. They did this to me too.

They advised me to get a job doing telemarketing. I had been a nurse. I had tried to work in my field for as long as possible even ending up doing medical paperwork. The problem in the first place was that I was unable to work a full shift doing anything anymore.

[OldDem2012]

39. Your lawyer appears to be incredibly calloused to the needs of those who can no longer work....

....because of physical or mental issues, or can no longer work a full day even though though they want to do so.

How about sharing with us some of the stories about the people she has helped to get the disability they desperately needed instead of the bs you actually posted?

How about a discussion about all of the people who can't get disability of any kind because they haven't had health insurance for f___ing YEARS and can't afford to see or pay a doctor because they're trying to scrape together enough money on a monthly basis to pay the mortgage/rent and their utilities?

I would tell your lawyer to kiss my ass, but I don't want her calloused hard-brittle lips anywhere near my butt.

[Recursion]

42. Which part of "this rarely happens" set you off, I wonder?

Does anybody bother to read past the first sentence anymore?

It is possible but onerous to get on disability fraudulently. It's almost as onerous to get on it legitimately if you're in a situation like my sister where your diagnosis is not 100% cut and dry.

[OldDem2012]

43. You wrote your post....you live with it. nt.

[AlbertCat]

51. You wrote your post....you live with it.

Yeah... like this quote from the "dreaded" post:

"This rarely happens because it's much less work to just get a job,"

Some people need to get the chip off their shoulder and work on reading comprehension. "Recursion's" post does not say what you outraged posters think it does. You are actually all in agreement. It's just some are too eager to find fault and defend.

Really.... read....and understand.... what was written before going ballistic.

[OldDem2012]

53. Thanks for your insight. Your concern is duly noted and filed. nt.

[AlbertCat]

54. Good.

Glad to help alleviate hysteria.

[OldDem2012]

94. Ah, yes...the old "alleviate hysteria" flame....

...to support a poster who claims he or she was paraphrasing an SSDI lawyer.

Who to support? Hmmmm.....

[Glitterati]

95. It's really funny

poor guy evidently called out the army for defense.

[AlbertCat]

100. called out the army for defense.

an army of 2? 3?....


It is funny when thinking hysterics from not understanding what someone wrote will disappear with snark....


...and more hysteria (an army!?)

[Glitterati]

101. ROFL, yeah OK

[AlbertCat]

98. Who to support? Hmmmm.....

That's "whom to support" I think.

[Gidney N Cloyd]

55. Thank you!

[Recursion]

59. In retrospect, my post was badly written

I was trying to make the point that while it's possible, it's rare (and specifically behavioral health seems to have some problems with both false positives and false negatives), but I could see that it comes across as saying "people scam the system!" (which, of course, a few do, and they will always be all over the media).

[AlbertCat]

65. In retrospect, my post was badly written

But not incomprehensible.

[Kencorburn]

68. I understood your post.

I got the inference and the nuance. Instead of jumping on the dogpile, people should have really read the post. Recursion was paraphrasing a lawyer who was saying how hard it is to dupe the system and become an SSDI queen/king. Anyone who has dealt with the system knows that first time acceptance is rare, there are very few conditions that guarantee that. The application process is arduous--sometimes too much--that very nature of the system dissuades fraud. Come on people, read that post. You are jumping all over the poster, when you share the SAME opinion.

[dotymed]

87. Hell, it's no wonder we can't change the world.

We have motivated people on DU who agree yet want to quibble about how it is said...Shit, then the whole thread gets wasted over it...

No, I don't want to argue...

[plethoro]

56. Friends and lawyers are non sequitur in my opinion having dealt with lawyers most of my

life. My wife is a Georgetown RN and has been working with seniors at SNF's for almost 50 years now. Yes, many have gotten on to SSDI from abject persistence. But as time goes on, it seems to be more dependent on who is handling the claim--money talks with these merceniary people. Claiments with money seem to get on faster with less continuous snafus. Of course, economic downturns spur filing for SSDI. Until life gets back to taking care of those based on need rather than those who have no need, this will only get worse.

[Glitterati]

64. Again, please get your facts straight

But as time goes on, it seems to be more dependent on who is handling the claim--money talks with these merceniary people. Claiments with money seem to get on faster with less continuous snafus.

What the heck is this even supposed to mean? Money has no bearing on SSDI. In fact, most SSDI claimants have used up every penny of savings, gone through everything of value they own, and are on food stamps and welfare by the time their claim is approved.

Until life gets back to taking care of those based on need rather than those who have no need, this will only get worse.

Wait, I'm confused.....are you suggesting that disability insurance should be means tested? On top of proving you're sick/disabled, you should also have to prove you're poor? Really?

[Kencorburn]

74. no, thats not what plethoro said.

What he was saying was that the way the system is currently, applicants have become dependent upon the services of lawyers to get approved. Those that have to depend on the services of paralegals at large law firms--who are guaranteed 25% of the bulk back payments applicants receive, and are often not motivated to push their applications through faster--often have a rougher time with the process.

The second quote was espousing a philosophy that we should give extra attention to people who are in need of their disability for the basic needs of life, before we attend to those that can afford to pay for a high priced lawyer to represent them. Though i am at a loss at how to implement that, seeing as how lawyers have insinuated themselves to the point of being an integral part of the system.

[Glitterati]

77. Yet again, generalizations that are not true

We didn't use an attorney. My husband's claim was approved in 4 months. There were NO lawyers involved. Period.

You see, that's the point though......a disability is a disability is a disability is a disability. The injuries/illness which disable people are not means tested. Rich and poor are afflicted.

Despite that, the only test is and should be........is this person disabled?

[Kencorburn]

84. ........

I don't think I spoke of anything to invalidate your situation. That may be your personal experience, but for the most part, people without the obvious disabilities often have to resort to lawyers in order to get approved. Instead of anecdotal evidence, here is a bit of empirical evidence, if you don't think the application process has become dependent upon lawyers, i bet you can name more than a few commercials for disability lawyers you have seen.

[Glitterati]

86. That proves nothing

disability lawyers have been advertising on TV for years.

Your point is what????? The legal profession contains some ambulance chasers who advertise on TV?

Not new. Not a valid point.

[Kencorburn]

91. I have no point,

except that disability law has become such a viable industry that, firms are dedicating their whole practice to it, that firms are spending tons of money to advertise nationally. Otoh, this also proves we have the same point, that SSDI fraud is not prevalent, that the process is generally arduous, except in a few cases, so much so that a cottage industry has formed solely to expedite the process.

[Glitterati]

93. But it doesn't expedite the process

Another fallacy.

[Kencorburn]

96. I didn't say that they actually expedite

the process, what i said was that an industry has formed to--meaning, with the aim to, or to portray themselves a having that aim.
The degree of success does not coincide with the validity of that statement. All of the posts on this thread are offering points to support what our shared opinion, but your vociferous objection to anyone whose experience does accurately align with the paradigm of your experience is seen as wrong. You cannot redact the opines of others because it doesn't match. I'm of the opinion that SSDI fraud is not rampant, but in fact rare, mainly due to the inherent defenses already present in the system. Can this system be improved, absolutely, we cannot assume we have the perspicacity to foresee all exploits, but we do not need to raze the system to fix a crack. There is the fallacy you were looking for.

[Glitterati]

97. Sadly

You're trying to argue something with which you have no experience.

That, in a nutshell, is the problem.

You are posting generalities, rumors, he said, she said BS.

I have direct, first hand knowledge and experience of which we speak. I'm certain that upsets you because I can refute every talking point you've been assigned.

[Kencorburn]

102. The funny part is,

I do. I have had two kidney transplants since 1998. I have had to deal with all of the wrinkles in the system, from local offices, to the national level. To assume someone doesn't have experience, because that person's experience is different from yours, doesn't mean you can refute that person's point, just means you can try to reinforce your own. Ask someone with Lupus about the disability application process, or you could just ask me. I will tell you about my extensive experience with the system.

[Glitterati]

104. Aha! Someone gave you a case file, huh?

ROFL, don't believe a word you type.

Not. one.

[Kencorburn]

108. you don't have to,

there are some things in this world that you have to admit you just can't fix. I have arrived at that decision. Sometimes it takes me a while.

[plethoro]

76. I am not suggesting anything. I am telling you point-blank that obtaining

SSDI in this day and age is HIGHLY dependent on whom is representing you and the amount of money you are willing to pay. It gets worse every year. You need to quit confusing the SSDI application and matriculation process now in effect with your personal situation and the unfairness of it all. I know things are unfair. My wife now works at an Alzheimers facility where the residents and/or their families are all rich. They get claim forms for all kinds of stuff processed faster than she has ever seen in SNFs. This is the way it is. Good luck to you.

[Glitterati]

78. Again, generalizations that are not true

More I know this guy who.........knows this guy who......

Just not true.

[duffyduff]

114. Sorry if some of us are skeptical.

It's next to impossible to qualify for SSI or SSDI, especially the former. I am trying to get my brother SSI and it is very difficult and time-consuming.

[Recursion]

121. Why do you call "agreeing with me" "skeptical"?

I don't know what button I pushed here.

[dionysus]

124. lack of reading comprehension, perhaps? there's like 3 people going off on you unhinged...

for no reason whatsoever...

[randome]

2. I used to work for Social Security.

The financial determinations are made at the local office. Then the file is reviewed at medical centers. By MEDICAL personnel. To even imply that a substantial number of people are 'faking' their illnesses is absurd. The medical determination has to be supported by the facts.

[duffyduff]

115. The argument seems to be made that you can "game" the system if you have the right attorneys

I say b.s. to that. You'd better have proof you are unable to be gainfully employed, including having medical proof.

[Arcanetrance]

3. Tell that to my friend who only gets $789 a month

If he didn't have his family he would be homeless but yeah he's living like a fucking king. Now excuse me while I throw up

[madrchsod]

4. disability takes a long time to be approved

the biggest problem the conservatives face in their quest to destroy social security programs is guys and gals like me....baby boomer's who are retiring in the coming years and those who have retired. we are not going to take it lying down and for dam sure we will vote against anyone who want`s to take away the little we get from social security. we have children of voting age that won`t vote for anyone who would take our money into privation or deny our benefits.

anyway medicare fraud is ....wait a minute ....was`t the republican governor of florida convicted of one of the biggest medicare frauds in the programs history?

[meow2u3]

62. Disability is NEVER approved the first time

You have to keep applying and appealing to prove to the system that you're really too disabled to hold a job. Social Security will make you jump through hoops in order to qualify. I know because I went through the wringer when I was 24.

Those billionaire assholes are trying to tell me I scammed the system almost 30 years ago for just over a grand a month, while they're continually scamming the government out of billions, even trillions, of dollars. They don't need to look at disabled people to see con artists--they need a freakin' MIRROR!

[Glitterati]

67. Never say never

my husband's disability claim was approved on the first attempt.

We went from filing the SSA application to getting the first check in 4 months.

[meow2u3]

71. I stand corrected. Disability is seldom approved the first time

His disability must have either been obvious, i.e., physical or youse applied in a blue state whose agents didn't act as if their personal pockets were going to be picked.

I applied in Texas back in 1985. There, you have to go through hoops because some of the agents think a disabled person is faking it or take it personally, as if you were trying to con them.

[Glitterati]

75. ROFL, red as you

Georgia. 2008. But, yes, his disability was obvious with one look at his medical records.

As for the language, I'd give you "rarely" without debate.

[Wednesdays]

89. According to Oklahoma tax law,

(Unless you're blind) if you can dress and feed yourself, you have no disabilities.

Nice, huh?

[pipi_k]

72. Same here

Granted, I had been out of work over a year, but it still only took me one time and my claim was approved within 90 days.

As for people within my circle who know about it but think I might be a scammer, here's what I say to them...

In two years my disability will roll over/morph into regular SS retirement.

Guess what...I will STILL be disabled. Unable to do what I can't do now.


But anyway, yeah. One time. Approved. I suppose it depends on the nature of the disability and the length of time one has been out of work, how long and what kind of medical services the disabled person has used, etc.

[Glitterati]

7. Bullshit, bullshit, bullshit, bullshit

This is straight up lies.

And anyone who has been through the disability application process knows these are straight up lies.

B U L L S H I T

[sorefeet]

16. BULLSHIT?????????

I got my SSDI in 3 months so did this fraud.

[Glitterati]

18. Yes, BULLSHIT

you're a liar.

Once again with your attempt to re-create St. Ronnie's Welfare Queen, this time SSDI recipients.

It's a lie. A bald faced lie.

B U L L S H I T

[DUgosh]

47. 3 months?

This isn't fox news here, you just can't make up a number and write it. You have to be out of work at least six months before you can even apply.

[xchrom]

13. you're not very believable. nt

[Glitterati]

28. Yeah, you do that

put it down in writing and go pawn it over at Freerepublic.

Then, you'll lose your "disability" because you're working, so you would be committing fraud.

Why, yes, you'd become your very own St. Ronnie Welfare Queen!

[Z_I_Peevey]

46. You're Frank Gallagher, aren't you?

Frank, get back to drinking and lying about your son having cancer. We're not buying what you're selling.

[Soundman]

66. It is way too easy if you know what you are doing and have patience.

I can think of six people I know off the top of my head that have gamed the system. All are hooked on "pain medication." And their relative life of luxury depends on two things; The quality of job they had at the time of their cough, disability and their knowledge of the game. I didn't come quick for them though, and they had to suffer through a lot of lean times. But in the end they all got a nice fat check for the back pay. The attorneys got their share of course, and they all had attorneys. I don't believe I know anyone that has ever gotten disability with out one. I know one person who was doing very well selling their meds until they got busted, can't say that it bothered me.

Not that it matters, but all of these folks are white and suffer back problems. It has never made any sense to me why people would seek out disability, but then again I have seen pain meds kill off so many people that I have met over the years it sickens me. Of course when you live in a drug induced haze your paltry existence seems more palatable, and the option of giving up the drug and a guaranteed income for the unknown isn't as easy as it seems. And for all those whom I know, it started with the pain killers. Once they got hooked the pain never got better only worse and worse.

I could easily qualify for disability but the thought doesn't even cross my mind. Maybe when the day arrives that I can't get to the bathroom without crawling I will finally give it some consideration. But until that day. I will suck it up and carry on.

I don't know the answer to the problem, but if you deny that there is one or even could be one, you are helping no one.

[Glitterati]

70. It is NOT easy. Under any circumstance

to get approved for SSDI. Not now. Not ever.

Nothing but more right wing BS, posted by yet another low post count newbie.

[Kencorburn]

80. You are partially right.

Besides the fact that you have had to have worked and paid into the system for 5 consecutive quarters to qualify, there are a few conditions that qualify you for instant approval, such as kidney failure. There are other conditions that should be scrutinized more closely, such as obesity and and some psychiatric disorders. On another note, most disability determinations are not considered permanent.

[Glitterati]

82. Well..........unless....

You didn't pay in.....then you qualify for SSI.

In addition, there are now several more "instant approval" conditions including some cancers.

[duffyduff]

117. And it has to be recent, too. Yours truly can't qualify for SSDI because of it.

I worked in a state agency that didn't pay into SS, so I don't have any recent substantial SS-covered earnings.

[Soundman]

83. What I am saying is a fact.

So why is the truth right wing? I have been a die hard dem all of my adult life. I am sorry if my post count isn't high enough for you, should I just blather on In every thread to add to it? Would that some how make me more credible? Do you want me to spell it out for you? I will be happy to explain step by step how they did it. If you could take objective look at some of the posts here they are no different than the gun nuts posting about the 2nd amendment.

[Glitterati]

85. There wasn't a single provable fact in your post

Just more I know this guy, who knows this guy, who saw this welfare queen........

[Soundman]

92. Well I suppose I could name names.

But naming names isn't quite right either. Besides a court has already ruled on their conditions. Why is it so hard for you to believe me? I refuse to name names but I can clearly explain step by step how they did it. It took them on the average about 5 years as I recall. I probably should not have used the term gamed the system, as only on of them really gamed it. The others started off with a mild/insignificant pain that got them on the pain meds and it was all over after that. As for me I suffer severe coronary artery disease had an M.I. And have a brand new scar from just below my breast bone to my pubic bone from a recent surgery to remove half my colon. I imagine I am a wonderful candidate for disability. If you can explain how I can post a photograph I will be happy to show you my scar and my heart surgeons report. I have no reason to lie about anything.

[easttexaslefty]

127. Well aren't you special..

"I could easily qualify for disability but the thought doesn't even cross my mind. Maybe when the day arrives that I can't get to the bathroom without crawling I will finally give it some consideration. But until that day. I will suck it up and carry on. "

I guess you're just that bad ass.

[Glitterati]

23. He's really working hard on that "Welfare Queen" story isn't he?

Quite frankly, given these "neighbors" he keeps talking about, I'm glad I don't live anywhere near him. Sounds like a place contaminated with something.

[KG]

25. y'know, this one time, I saw a black lady get out of a Cadillac and buy junk food with food stamps!

horrors!

[xchrom]

32. i know a guy - who knew this other guy - who knew this guy

who he SWEARS faked something or other.

[Glitterati]

33. Uh uh.......you forgot

a BRAND NEW Cadillac.......

[MindPilot]

35. And in another thread...

she was growing and selling medical marijuana making 50k a year!

[Hekate]

120. And liquor and a birthday cake, too

Zowie.

Not.

[Fumesucker]

26. Have you considered moving? You seem to have somehow located in a nest of thieves and vipers

I thought I had friends in low places.

[MindPilot]

30. You just happen to know all these people scamming SSDI

and the details of their supposed scams?

Please excuse me if you seem not very believable.

[marble falls]

34. Explain why its so quick and easy for scammers and why it takes so long and is so difficult .....

for the legitimately disabled?

[Union Scribe]

37. Lol you sure do know a lot of scammers!

Tip: If you return and try this again, keep it simple. Just one scammer next time, and drop all the wild stuff about "living like a kind" and the pot kingpin and all that.

[LeftishBrit]

11. This has reached nightmarish proportions in the UK

The Government, especially Work and Pensions Secretary Iain Duncan-Smith, are obsessed with kicking people off disability benefits, and forcing people to 'prove' that they are genuinely disabled. One of the main organizations that they are using to test claimants' 'genuineness' is ATOS, which has been shown not be at all fit for purpose. A number of people have been declared 'not disabled' or 'fit for work' despite the fact that they were terminally ill, and died shortly afterwards.


http://www.guardian.co.uk/politics/2012/nov/30/sick-disabled-work-benefits-programme

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-19437785


The tabloids, especially the Daily Mail, have been carrying out a vicious campaign against 'fraudulent' disability claimants (despite the fact that benefit fraud is much less common and costly than tax fraud, and that only a tiny proportion of benefit fraudsters are false disability claimants - most are people who claim the dole while also working). This has contributed to the recent increase in hate-crimes against disabled people:


http://zelo-street.blogspot.co.uk/2012/12/daily-mail-kicks-disabled-again.html

[2pooped2pop]

36. I'm thinking for the most part, the only people who have a chance

at a successful scam are the people complaining of the back problems. You know, the ones that don't show up on xrays. Thing is they really have to play this out for years to get on any kind of disability.

I do know someone who supposedly is trying just this. Now, I don't know the truth, but I have been told that he is faking and has even allowed back surgery that the person telling me says was not needed. I don't know. I'm not his doctor. He still has not won his case yet and it's been a couple of years. I told the person who told me about him to let it go. She wanted to report it but it is a member of her husbands family. I told her she should not be the one to report it and to let it go that karma would probably get him first. And it has. Right now he is floating from place to place, his marriage has crumbled, a woman he was seeing od'd and died while with him. I think he is miserable. And still not on disability.

It takes a long long time to get on it even if you have a legit claim. So yeah, there probably are some people who do get by with faking it but not as many as you would imagine. There always will be abusers of any program like this. There are also a lot of people who think that if they see someone who is able to walk and on disability that they are faking it, when they are not. So there is probably a bigger perception of it than actually occurring.

Probably more real than the republicans so called fraudulent voter, but abuse of the social security disability program seems to be a bit harder to get away with.

There have always been stories of somebody faking it and getting caught on camera doing things they have sworn they could not do, lifting, working on side jobs, etc. I wonder just what the number of people who have been caught faking really is. Those numbers should be available somewhere shouldn't they?

It would be a crappy life to be getting money for being disabled and having to fake it everywhere you go. Always having to worry about someone turning you in or taking a picture of you doing something too active.

This is just a ploy by the republicans to weaken the system. Let them show us the fakers and we will show you a republican. Because we here all know that faking the system is not something that most dem leaning people would find acceptable. If it is being done, it is republicans mostly doing it.

[liberalmike27]

57. Even your story

In no way says this guy doesn't have back problems. Back pain is one of the injuries that people always dismiss as scamming, unless you're piled up on the ground in a heap, not even able to move. They are real--I had a temporary injury ones, that thank God improved where I just pinched something. It was undiagnosed, as are most of my injuries, since I can't really afford to go to the doctor. But I know my pain was real, and that I had to nearly drag one of my legs along, and there is no way I could work. I didn't get any compensation, but I think people seem to dismiss all people with back problems as "slackers," or "fakers." They aren't.

So many people seem to be on this site now, infiltrating, trying to get members of the DU to feel the envy of benefits receivers. Sucks. I have no doubt a "few" are scamming. It happens. But the real argument they are trying to make, that we need to get rid of all SS insurance, disability or whatever, because one or two out of a thousand are scamming? Ridiculous. Figure out how to stop it, but don't get rid of it.

[2pooped2pop]

60. I said I didn't know if he was faking or not

that I am not his doctor. Everything else he does makes me tend to believe that he is faking but I have no final decision. There are things about what he is able to do, that tend to confirm he is not nearly as disabled as he pretends. But I have not seen these things myself.

I also mentioned how people tend to think that if someone can walk, they are faking when they are not. I understand this. I had an injury at work in my shoulders. Heaven help me if I were to raise one arm up. Everyone at work would go, "I thought you were injured?" I would have to tell them that I never said I could not lift my arms, just that I could not do it repeatedly over a thousand times in a row like my job required. But many immediately became crappy to me. Like I was getting something they could not have (light duty) and that pissed them off. They knew they would have to work there for decades more while I would be out the door eventually.

I also said that the republicans need to show us a faker and we will show them a republican. It is not in the majority of dems mindset to cheat the system like that. But getting money for nothing is right up the republican alley.

I'm glad you got better by the way.

[gollygee]

38. "The economy is struggling due to neoconservative policies . . .

"But let's blame poor people and disabled people and throw them all to the wolves!"

Poor people are not the problem in our country. Disabled people aren't the ones causing the income disparity.

I did know one person who got disability fraudulently, and he was investigated due to it and had his property seized to recover what he'd received. Hmm or maybe he was fined and ended up having his house foreclosed on? Anyway he lost his house.

There will always be a small number of people who cheat any system that exists, but that doesn't mean that most people who use the system don't need it. It is wrong to hurt a great number of people because of the actions of a few.

[Glitterati]

41. Let's separate the issues, please

There's insurance fraud - you know, Worker's Compensation Insurance, for when you're hurt on the job. And this is VERY different from Social Security disability.

The story you are telling here, sounds like INSURANCE FRAUD. For one simple reason - they "took his house." SSDI doesn't even investigate like you are describing.......SS disability review involves a doctor's visit, not a guy in the bushes with a hidden camera.

Those PIs with the hidden camera are hired by insurance companies, not the government and they involve insurance fraud.

[gollygee]

48. Ah, could be

He worked for the government so it was governmental, but you're probably right.

[Glitterati]

50. Yeah, I think so

Because the Social Security Administration can just "garnish" future benefits......they have no need to seize the guy's house for re-payment. An insurance company, on the other hand, has a need to do so.

[loyalsister]

44. There has to be an "other"

They have been called out in racism and misogyny to a point where it is a universally accepted reason for their defeat. They've got to have a new scapegoat.

From Welfare Queens to Disabled Deadbeats
http://krugman.blogs.nytimes.com/2013/01/27/from-welfare-queens-to-disabled-deadbeats/


Disability Rolls and the Makers/Takers/Fakers Nonsense
http://jaredbernsteinblog.com/disability-rolls-and-the-makerstakersfakers-nonsense/

[littlemissmartypants]

52. This is a wonderful catch

which I probably would have never seen if it weren't for Meta. Thanks for posting. Peace. lmsp


http://www.democraticunderground.com/1240212946

[sadbear]

58. My local AM radio morning knuckleheads mentioned this yesterday morning.

They quoted Bill Maher and suggested he's now a critic of it. I don't have HBO, so I don't know, but I suspect he was probably talking about something else entirely.

[Glitterati]

61. Yes, it's the new meme

The right wingers are trying to establish that SSDI recipients are the new welfare queens.

They've been working hard on it for a while, but the big push started this week.

[LeftishBrit]

99. The equivalent started two and a half years ago in the UK

There seems to be a frightening degree of collaboration between the right-wingers of our two countries.

[Glitterati]

103. Actually, I think it's more

that the US right wing watches what happens over there and tries to mimic it. Sadly, they don't seem to make the transition between the program differences well, thus their bombs, when thrown, seem to fall apart.

If you'll note, around here, they make their point, get refuted, then say, well, that's not what I meant! And then proceed to refute their own invalid point as well.

[libodem]

63. Isn't am morning radio

Amazingly awful. We have Kevin Miller, who came into town, after Obama won the first time. He did a big gun rights conference yesterday. Gag. Saw him on tv. He has a physique and face for radio. I shouldn't be do uncharitable about the things he can't help because the main deficit is in his demented mental status.... And he looks like, Shriek.

Last fall, I saw his face on a bus bench, and someone had magic markered in a Hitler moustache. Fit him perfectly.

[sadbear]

69. Mine aren't that bad, but they do tend to pander to the area's lowest common denominator.

And that LCD listens to boortz, limbaugh, hannity, and ingraham later on in the day.

[libodem]

113. I used to listen to Coast to Coast at night

And be assaulted by the am dj, then Glenn Bleck. The station up the dial has the Limp-one and Hannity.

Coast to Coast has gone off the rails as far as I'm concerned. Art Bell, kept religion and all the last days, end times, crap, out of the discussion. Now 5 times a week its the Bible, all night, every night.

You can find that bs all over every other channel at night. If I want religion I'll find a religious channel. I hate what it has become.

[DebJ]

73. It took 2 years for my Mom to get SSDI after she was crushed in an auto accident

at the age of 60. The accident was in 1986; she got her first SSDI check in 1988.

She was forced into a wheelchair for the rest of her life when some drunk (in his 30s but driving his Dad's
car I am guessing because he couldn't get his OWN car insurance; so many are repeat offenders)
did a 180 degree turn on 355 in Montgomery County, Maryland, and drove at 55mph right under
her truck, through the drive shaft.

Of course the driver and his passenger were fine...they were airlifted to Baltimore shock trauma and
released one hour later. Their car was littered with beer cans. No tests for alcohol levels were done.

My mother, just before her 60th birthday, had to be cut out of her vehicle. Her left eye socket was
crushed (and she later suffered cancer in that eye). Her jaw was crushed and had to be rebuilt.
The dashboard smashed into her body and her legs. A two inch piece of bone just disappeared from
one leg; likely pulverized to dust from the impact. Every major bone in her body had a compound
fracture. She had majory surgery every week for 12 weeks,
and her blood was completely transfused 11 times, leaving her now with severe immune issues and
healing of any injury takes forever (a bee sting took 2 years to heal). She was in a coma for a long time.
We all were visting her daily for many weeks, and even though she spoke to us, she doesn't remember the
visits.

The passenger in the other car sued my MOTHER, and just a few weeks after leaving shock trauma where
she had been for months, she had to be wheeled into the courtroom and face the accuser....case was tossed
out, but the stress on my very ill mother was enormous.

Suffering from compulsive responsibility, my mother actually attempted to return to her clerical job for
a few weeks, but it was way too much.

She has suffered repeatedly for the last almost 30 years because of the ramifications of this accident.
Among the suffering, my Dad was forced to retire early, cutting out hundreds of dollars a month of
retirement benefits he WOULD have had, so a loss of income for the rest of their lives...so far almost
30 years....for every single month for forever, hundreds of dollars of lost income.

IT TOOK SOCIAL SECURITY TWO YEARS TO APPROVE HER DISABILITY.
Even though on top of the injuries, she already suffers from some genetic disorders, causing
heart and bone problems (like a collapsing spine).

[KamaAina]

107. As usual, California was a bit ahead of its time

Ahh-nuld ran this same number on us when he wanted to slash our In-Home Supportive Services program, which helps people with disabilities stay in their homes and out of (outrageously expensive) nursing homes. He rammed through a fingerprinting requirememnt for IHSS caregivers -- the $70 to be paid out of their pockets! (In some counties, IHSS pays minimum wage; even in L.A. and Orange counties, it's a whopping $9 an hour.)

The result? The program cost the state more to implement than it ended up saving them in fraud.

[B Calm]

111. If republicans hadn't cut jobs that use to

watch over fraudulent claims, maybe there wouldn't be so many on social security disability. . . Just sayn. . .

Most of the people that I know who I think are screwing us by getting social security disability, are well known as republicans!

[GeorgeGist]

112. One of my best friends is a Disability King.

SSDI since he was 45.

He doesn't expect to see 65.

[otohara]

123. Why Do You Call Him

A disability king?

[otohara]

130. It's Good To Be King

and alive.

He may live longer than he expects. Still wondering why he's called a "king" for being disabled.

[Common Sense Party]

128. Thankfully, my son's SSDI was relatively easy to get. It took a few months for the paperwork

to go through, but when they began paying benefits he got them back to the date of filing, IIRC.

I realize everyone has different situations. For some, the process is easy. For some it takes quite a while.

What I really don't understand about this thread are some of the nasty, vitriolic attitudes and caustic remarks thrown at certain DUers for having different opinions or different experiences. Wow. Some people really need to take a breath and think before they type.

Life is too short to be so angry.

[s-cubed]

129. I had a friend with severe physical and mental disabities.

It took a long time, and $5000 to a disability specialist lawyer to get approval. One of the oddest things was the lawyer insisted on using only one disability reason. He said using both mental and physical would make it harder. Weird! Her depression was so bad she tried electro shock treatment, and her pain caused her to become addicted to (and abuse) pain killers. I'd be surprised if there is much fraud.