I don't think Ariel Castro should receive the death penalty

[Samantha]

Should he decide to avoid a trial and just plead guilty, I think he should be imprisoned for life, with no possibility of parole. He should be confined in a below-ground dark cell, where the only human he sees is whoever tosses him some food periodically. He should additionally have leg irons attached to his legs. Every ten years he serves, he should be allowed out of the cell to see the daylight for a short period of time.

He is only 52 years old. With any luck, he could possibly live 30 years. That would amount to a ten-year sentence for each of the hostages he held.

I think of myself as a compassionate person, and I really try to be kind to my fellow human beings. Not this time.

Sam

[Squinch]

1. Seems fair to me.

[Samantha]

2. I am against the death penalty but in this case it would end his suffering too soon

I think he should have a long time to think about the damage and the hurt he did to so many people, especially his three hostages. It would also serve as a great example to any other demented people thinking of doing the same thing.

Sam

[Squinch]

4. Also, the death penalty is so damn expensive. Ohioans should take the money for all his

dealth penalty appeals and give it to the victims.

[FarPoint]

3. I don't believe it's even a death penalty case.

No life or shall I say physical body was lost...Not a murder case...so no death penalty.

[Squinch]

5. I read another thread that said it would be applied on the basis of the miscarraiges

he beat into Michelle Knight.

Though my heart breaks for her, and I think he needs to be punished for what he did to her, to apply the death penalty for a fetal death is a really, really bad precedent.

[FarPoint]

25. Fetal death?

Not sure there is a law for this in Ohio ...

[rollin74]

29. actually there is

under Ohio Revised Code 2903.01 (Aggravated Murder)

"No person shall purposely, and with prior calculation and design, cause the death of another or the unlawful termination of another's pregnancy."


http://codes.ohio.gov/orc/2903.01

[FarPoint]

39. This must be a new law... probably established by anti-abortion groups.

Well...it will be hard to prove....based on alleged or hear say information.

I imagine it may indeed be true...

[Samantha]

8. One commentator said they were still mulling over murder charges for the beatings

when the hostages were pregnant. The other side of the argument is can the prosecution prove it was the beatings that caused the miscarriages (words of the commentator, not mine). So they may be adding additional charges if they decide he can be held responsible for those deaths of the unborn.

Sam

[Generic Brad]

23. Can they prove their were miscarriages without bodies?

I am not trying to be insensitive because none of us have any reason to doubt the women's stories. And I certainly am not casting doubt that it happened as stated.

It just seems to me that murder is an extremely difficult thing to prove without a body.

[Samantha]

27. This isn't my area of expertise but from what the commentator said

the issue under discussion was proving the beating caused the miscarriage. The defense could say it could have been caused by something else and the prosecution has no evidence that it was the beating. I am not saying I agree with this; I am just repeating what the commentator said the debate was among attorneys in the prosecutor's office. I don't know what they will decide, but they did say they might add more charges later.

Sam

[WeekendWarrior]

6. I think he should be

the slave of the girls he kept in captivity, publicly humiliated and led around on a leash.

Seems fair to me.

[Samantha]

9. I thought about the leash thing too but

his lawyer could probably sue saying it was cruel and unusual punishment. I don't think solitary confinement in a below-ground cell can be called that; letting him outside only once every decade might not make it past that rule either. However, it would be fitting, right?

Sam

[WeekendWarrior]

43. This may be my "conservative" side coming out, but

I think the punishment should match the crime.

[Samantha]

44. Maybe it is not the conservative side of you but the compassionate side which

commiserates with the pain and the horror those young girls must have endured for ten years. This is a very complicated issue which strikes at the heart of all of us, but depending upon who we are, it seems each of us has tended to funnel our anger at the details on one focal point. I cannot sympathize with the perpetrator of these crimes and appeal for any sympathy being awarded him when the time comes to arrive to a decision as to his punishment. Of course, I assume he will be found guilty since he has already admitted it but these things are very unpredictable.

I have been a longstanding opponent of the death penalty in any case, but for some reason I feel if he is given it, I will feel no regret. However, again, in this case, I think he should be given decades in prison to think about all of the heinous acts he has performed on these young women (and who knows who else?) and I do think he should be in solitary confinement.

If you have read much more on this thread, you will have seen some oppose this on the basis of torture. It doesn't really matter what our beliefs are on this issue because it will simply be the law as written when the decision is reached what his punishment will be. As I said below, there are high profile criminals who are serving their sentences in solitary confinement, Charles Manson for one comes to mind. I have no problem with that either considering the nature of his crimes. But in the case of child molesters, they are most despised of criminals among the prison population so solitary confinement is justified by prison officials as a protection for the criminal convicted of this crime. So if Castro is spared the death penalty, that probably will be his situation as he lives out his life in prison. He deserves it.

I saw a former prosecutor discussing yesterday who said Castro in effect tortured these young women. So for those who say solitary confinement in his case would be torture, perhaps they should consult the victims and the victims' families as to what constitutes justice for them if in fact the prosecutor makes a deal with the accused, taking the death penalty off the table in exchange for information about other crimes he has committed. I am thinking in particular of that fourth young woman who went missing at the same time who has yet to be found.

Thank you for posting on my thread.

Sam

[Guy Whitey Corngood]

7. I agree. Why do him any favors? nt

[Honeycombe8]

10. As far as I know, we don't put people in below ground dark cells with leg irons.

It's either a state of the art, clean cell with light..and hour outside every day for exercise or whatever...communication availability (letters, phone calls)...or mixed in with the rest of the population.

People don't plead guilty for a death sentence.

He's an animal. I can't find any sympathy in my heart for that animal. He actually hit a woman's pregnant stomache and starved her so she'd miscarry....he did that for five pregnancies. What kind of person could do that? Only an animal.

Animals should be treated like ... animals?

[Samantha]

12. He might plead guilty to avoid a trial and the State might make a deal with him

that they would take the death penalty off the table in exchange for the guilty plea and (of course) saving the expense of a trial.

Yes, I know we don't put people in below ground dark cells with leg irons, but I would think some prisons have basements and that is where I hope he would land -- in a basement cell.

I just discussing what I think should happen to they guy but I am sure he could not be denied the ability to go out for ten years either. It is just what I think the guy deserves to have happen to him.

Sam

[frogmarch]

11. On CNN some legal expert said

that death penalty inmates have way more prison benefits than do lifers. DPers have full library privileges, for one thing. I don't recall what else, but it was a lot more privileges than lifers get.

I'm not a torture advocate, unless putting him in the general prison population would be considered torture for a monster like him.

[Samantha]

13. I think there is no doubt they would keep him segregated from the rest of the prison population

because child molesters who are commingled with the other prisoners often do not live very long.

Sam

[frogmarch]

16. I've heard that.

Regardless of what his sentence is, I don't think he'll enjoy life from here on out. Creep.

[gvstn]

14. Yes, Let's set a good example to our young ones on how to treat others.

Oh, wait we don't have to set the example we will just use this creep's actions as the model of the behaviour we want to emulate and have our children aspire to meting out themselves someday. Great plan!

[Luminous Animal]

15. So you are okay with torture.

How far, we as a nation, have sunk where torture is not only tacitly accepted but boldly advocated.

[Samantha]

18. I think that is a little bit of an overstatement there

That is not literal physical torture; if you want to take the position it is mental cruelty, I will not deny that. But do I think he deserves a taste of what he inflicted on those young women, yes I do.

Sam

[Luminous Animal]

24. No it is not an overstatement. From Amnesty International to Human Rights Watch to

the UN to the ACLU. And even George Will of the Washington post for fucks sake. Prolonged solitary confinement (beyond a few weeks) is torture.

We are an incredibly mean Christian nation admires the fire and brimstone of the old testament for ethical guidance rather than the possibility of rebirth and reconciliation of the new.

http://www.un.org/apps/news/story.asp?NewsID=44365

Clearly, what you are advocating is torture. An eye for an eye makes the whole world blind.

[Samantha]

33. There is zero chance of what I stated I would like to see happen to this man will happen

It is beyond the limits of the law (the part about seeing the light of day once a decade). But I think that man deserves to have a lot of time to think about what he did to those 3 women, and I do hope that means decades in prison. I absolutely do not want to see him be executed.

He probably will not be commingled with the rest of the population because as a child molester, his life would be endangered, so chances are to some extent he will be held outside of the larger population for his own protection. So if he spends a lot of his time in solitary, I certainly will lose no sleep over it.

I am not one who governs my life on the principles contained in the Old Testament. I am simply a human being who becomes more and more outraged everyday with the details of this man's crimes and the suffering his hostages endured. There are a few high profile criminals who are held in solitary confinement 23 hours a day, who can receive no packages, telephone calls, contact visits or normal human interaction. And I do believe you are correct that the ACLU would regard this as torture. But at this moment in time when this man is facing justice and this type of punishment is legal in this Country, it could very well happen to Castro. If it does, you will not see me out there protesting.

Sam

[Luminous Animal]

38. "So if he spends a lot of his time in solitary, I certainly will lose no sleep over it."

I suggest you read this article about a U.S. citizen, held in solitary in Iran, who is now an activist for U.S. prisoners. We keep well beyond just "a few" human beings under torture conditions. Well beyond. Which is why THE U.N., AND AMNESTY INTERNATIONAL condemns us for these practices.

So really. Read this U.S. citizen's experience suffering solitary confinement in Iran for 4 months and the mental toll that resulted and his subsequent advocacy to stop this torture in the U.S. and come back and let me know what you think.

I Thought Solitary Confinement in Iran Was Bad -- Then I Went Inside America's Prisons
http://www.alternet.org/investigations/i-thought-solitary-confinement-iran-was-bad-then-i-went-inside-americas-prisons

[former9thward]

17. He is not going to receive the death penalty.

The prosecutors are just throwing it out there to scare him into a plea bargain so they avoid a messy trial. It is not serious.

[Samantha]

30. On the other hand, they might try to make an example of him

Human trafficking is a problem that really needs a much higher profile and lot more resources.

I don't know what the prosecutors will decide, but I think the death penalty is not the punishment he receives.

Sam

[former9thward]

41. To make an example of him ...

The prosecutors would have to make those women and the child relieve the horror of the past ten years on the witness stand. Of course they would be cross-examined by the defense. They will not do that.

[backscatter712]

19. At least let me fantasize about breaking him on the Catherine Wheel. n/t

[dembotoz]

20. nobody should and this include the boston bomber

we are supposed to be better than this

[Nye Bevan]

21. Sorry, I disagree. Because we are better than him.

I don't think murderers should be executed. I don't think rapists should be sentenced to be forcibly raped. And I don't think this guy should be punished in the medieval way that you propose.

Life without any possibility of parole is the appropriate punishment. Let him rot for the rest of his life and reflect on his evil crimes.

[Samantha]

28. Well, one of two things will probably happen to him

If they are successful in pursuing the murder charges (and I do not pretend to know how this will go), he's vulnerable to receiving the death penalty.

If they are not, he will get life in prison. Despite the fact some people think he should be commingled with the rest of the prisoners, this has a good chance of not happening because child molesters do not last very long when mixed with the rest of the prison population. They are among the most despised type of criminal and they often are subjected to having their life taken because of the nature of the crimes they have committed.

Sam

[Luminous Animal]

32. There are methods for keeping a prisoner from mingling within the general population

without putting that prisoner in solitary.

[Samantha]

35. You and I are not going to agree on this issue

and neither of us is going to budge.

Sam

[sadbear]

22. Death penalty is a back-door attempt to ban abortion.

I also think that if found guilty, he should be treated like every other person in the prison in which he resides. That's what we're supposed to do in America.

[Taverner]

26. Neither do I - he needs to suffer

And nothing like soul suffering....

Leave him alone for at least 8-10 hrs a day and he will

[Warpy]

31. He needs to be locked in a cage

so he can't do this to anyone else, ever again.

I see no reason to do more to him except send FBI psychiatrists to dismantle every sick, twisted thing in his head to find out what makes him tick in the hope they can spot the next squirrel sooner.

[Niceguy1]

34. either way

I really dont care...as long as he is behind bars.

[tblue]

36. I am anti-DP even though

I feel like I could clobber him for what he did, even though I consider myself non-violent. That's why we have a legal court system and not Cowboy Justice. Doesn't matter how we feel, the law is all that matters.

[cpwm17]

37. Torture won't do him or anybody else any good

It's just wrong.

Personally, I'd prefer him and many other selfish parasites in this world to be dead. That doesn't mean anyone should murder him.

We have a justice system and he should be kept safe in prison for the rest of his life.

[cali]

40. do you realize what your post says.... about you?

At the best, it says you haven't really thought this through and you're speaking out of anger, which is understandable. At the worst, it says you're gung ho on torture as long as the "right" people are tortured. And that's majorly fucked up and pretty grotesque.

Furthermore, torture reflects on all of us.

[HappyMe]

42. So torture is just fine with you.

Yeah, I would rethink that "compassionate" thing if I were you.