The US government did not kill investigative journalist Michael Hastings

[Cali_Democrat]

Last edited Thu Jun 20, 2013, 01:14 PM - Edit history (1)

What happened to Michael Hastings was a tragic accident. His current investigations into the NSA and CIA had nothing to do with his death.

It's important that any conspiracy theories are quashed before they spin out of control and tarnish his legacy.

This is a tragedy and he most definitely will be missed. He was one of the best investigative reporters out there.

------------------------------------

Edit to add post from zappaman:

After the Weekly reported today that LAPD traffic investigators believe the car tied in reports to journalist Michael Hastings was going faster than 60 miles per hour before a fatal crash in Hollywood, we were tipped off to new video showing a vehicle blasting through a red light just moments before that collision.
The video, by freelance TV news crew LOUD LABS NEWS, shows a vehicle blazing through a red light on Highland Avenue and Santa Monica Boulevard, only four blocks from the crash:
The video appears to have been taken from a LOUD LABS vehicle awaiting the night's news.

Freelance videographers work the night shift in L.A. because local TV stations don't budget enough for expensive, three-person news vans to work overnight. The freelance crews listen to police scanners and sell their footage to the stations.

http://blogs.laweekly.com/informer/2013/06/michael_hastings_red_light_video_speeding.php

[The Link]

1. Because the government has never killed anyone, or...

because the government had no vested interest in Hastings' death?

[Liberal Veteran]

8. Motive does not equal guilt.

[avaistheone1]

16. The question on whether their was government involvement is legitimate

since we do not know whether they had some role or not -particularly given our government has not has a great history regarding how it handles its critics, opposition, truth-tellers or whisteblowers. imo

My mind is open on this one.

[forestpath]

21. +1

[Agschmid]

43. -1

So then it's 0 right?

[bahrbearian]

47. +1

[stopbush]

102. Sounds like your mind is made up to me.

[avaistheone1]

104. Having an open mind and asking a question does Not equal having made up my mine. I haven't.

[Smarmie Doofus]

105. +1 more.

Why some DUers are so anxious for this topic to disappear is truly a puzzler.

They won't be able to sleep if someone on the internet thinks it might have been a gov't hit?

Or a hit from some other source.

[EOTE]

17. It doesn't equal innocence, either.

And to immediately claim that there is no foul play involved in his death is jumping to conclusions in a much more insidious way than any CTer could.

[Liberal Veteran]

28. Presumption of innocence.

Evidence is required for establishing guilt.

[EOTE]

31. Presumption of innocence is not the same thing as declaring innocence.

And then denigrating those who might believe otherwise. Especially when so little is known about the accident. Dismissing wrong doing right off the bat is especially stupid considering the government's penchant for going after ones they deem a threat.

[Liberal Veteran]

36. You are free to believe what you will.

It is all Vince Foster stuff in my mind until actual evidence is put forward.

[markpkessinger]

113. Presumption of innocence has to do with an accused person's status . . .

. . . before a court of law, and nothing more.

[geek tragedy]

54. the fact is that there is zero evidence that there was foul play involved, let alone

when of those scary government conspiracies Alex Jones is always warning us about.

[EOTE]

58. There is also zero evidence it wasn't involved.

Yet people feel the need to make bizarre proclamations that they know the truth of the situation and immediately dismissing anything resembling a conspiracy because it makes them uncomfortable. TPTB count on this very behavior. Those wacky "Grassy knoll conspiracy theorists" need to be put in their place, you know. We all know the conspiracies never occur, so best to simply mock those who believe they can at every opportunity.

[geek tragedy]

74. There is zero evidence Justin Bieber wasn't involved. Should we treat his involvement as

a serious possibility?

Those making the allegation/suggestion have the burden of providing proof. Otherwise, they're just making shit up.

[BainsBane]

25. Get a grip

[Katashi_itto]

26. Whew! I am glad thats settled.

Thats like thinking our Govt would even spy on us.

[Art_from_Ark]

96. "Government spying on citizens is only done in countries like the USSR,

East Germany, Red China and North Korea. We live in a free society where it would never be condoned, much less accepted."*

*Quote is from my 1970s American Government teacher

[treestar]

37. What's the point of killing a journalist?

Ten more will pop up.

[pnwmom]

61. Right. And no one with a history of alcohol and drugs

ever fell off the wagon and had another DUI.

[think]

106. I'm sure the first thing they'll test for is Scopolamine

That'll put all the conspiracy theories to rest.

In 1910, it was detected in the remains believed to be those of Cora Crippen, wife of Dr. Hawley Harvey Crippen, and was accepted at the time as the cause of her death, since her husband was known to have bought some at the start of the year.[19]

In 2008, Vice News aired an episode called "Colombian Devil's Breath" recounting the use of scopolamine by Colombian criminals as a suggestion drug. The two-part investigation contains multiple first-hand accounts of its use.[20]

A 2012 example claims small amounts are blown into victims' faces on the street to turn the victims into "mindless zombies".[21]

Scopolamine has been used under the name burundanga in Venezuelan and Thailand resorts in order to drug and then rob tourists. While there are unfounded rumors that delivery mechanisms include using pamphlets and flyers laced with the drug, not enough is readily absorbed through the skin to have an effect. However, spiked alcoholic drinks are occasionally used.

In recent years the criminal use of scopolamine has become an epidemic. Approximately half of emergency room admissions for poisoning in Bogotá have been attributed to scopolamine.[22]

Victims of this crime are often admitted to a hospital in police custody, under the assumption that the patient is experiencing a psychotic episode.[citation needed] A telltale sign is a fever accompanied by a lack of sweat.[citation needed]

Scopolamine is used criminally as a date rape drug and as an aid to robbery,[23] the most common act being the clandestine drugging of a victim's drink.[23] It is preferred because it induces anterograde amnesia, or an inability to recall events a certain amount of time after its administration or during the time of intoxication.[citation needed]

Per the United States State Department (March 4, 2012):

"One common and particularly dangerous method that criminals use in order to rob a victim is through the use of drugs. The most common has been scopolamine. Unofficial estimates put the number of annual scopolamine incidents in Colombia at approximately 50,000. Scopolamine can render a victim unconscious for 24 hours or more. In large doses, it can cause respiratory failure and death. It is most often administered in liquid or powder form in foods and beverages. The majority of these incidents occur in night clubs and bars, and usually men, perceived to be wealthy, are targeted by young, attractive women. To avoid becoming a victim of scopolamine, one should never accept food or beverages offered by strangers or new acquaintances or leave food or beverages unattended. Victims of scopolamine or other drugs should seek immediate medical attention."[24]

~Snip~

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scopolamine#Criminal_use

[premium]

2. +1000.

I know that the U.S. govt. has ordered the assassination of people, but that's not the case here, it was a tragic accident not related to what he was investigating.

[cali]

3. you can't quash cts and how on earth would this one "tarnish his legacy"?

the problem with most cts is that there is virtually no way to convince the believers that it is a ct. it's pointless to try. for instance, if Hastings has a high blood alcohol content, the response will be that "they" could have arranged that.

That said we don't know anything yet about what happened.

your op, btw, will do the opposite of quashing this.

[DevonRex]

51. So, you're open to thinking Obama had Mr Hastings killed?

Just asking.

[cali]

84. No. And I've made that crystal fucking clear.

and nothing in the post I wrote that you are responding to indicates any fucking such thing. so screw your nasty, silly gotcha question

I have never disrespected President Obama with that kind of dogshit and you know it.

[DevonRex]

107. Oh really. Odd reaction to the OP then since

you effectively told him that he couldn't post the video of Mr. Hastings running a red light 2 minutes prior to his accident without spreading the conspiracy theory that Obama had Mr. Hastings murdered. Seriously? Anyone who has been accused of anything has to STFU? AND anyone who would defend someone ELSE who's been accused of something has to STFU and if they don't it's their fault the accusations happened in the first place?

Your reply to the OP contains a fair amount of negativity. Never once did you express any exasperation that idiots would start these kinds of rumors about Obama. But you did say there's just no use in even trying to combat the conspiracy theories. And you were just horrified that the OP mentioned that those CTs can also harm the original victim, as if conspiracy theory freaks give a shit who they have to drag through the mud when they have to change course - as they always do when one bizarre theory hits the inevitable dead end.

So, in my opinion, your post was just a way to say STFU. As is the way you talked to me just now. But I won't be intimidated. Not when people on this very site are insinuating administration involvement in Hastings' death. Oh yeah, and speaking up against that stupid RW CT bullshit isn't the CAUSE of the Hastings CT bullshit. The Hastings conspiracy theorists have to bear that responsibility all by themselves. See, his name is already linked to something he never intended. And it sure as fuck isn't the fault of people trying to dispel the crazy.

[cali]

110. bullshit. how dare you. You have a lot of fucking nerve,

Here's my post. Then let's examine the crap YOU fucking make up and fling at me:

you can't quash cts and how on earth would this one "tarnish his legacy"?

the problem with most cts is that there is virtually no way to convince the believers that it is a ct. it's pointless to try. for instance, if Hastings has a high blood alcohol content, the response will be that "they" could have arranged that.

That said we don't know anything yet about what happened.

your op, btw, will do the opposite of quashing this.



I didn't even fucking mention a video, let alone tell the op that he couldn't post it. and you know what, genius? I

Yeah, my reply was negative. So the fuck what? It's was a silly OP for the very reasons I mentioned. duh. try reading for comprehension.

YOU need help with your reading skills. You read into my post so much shit that wasn't there, it's like you read another post entirely. It's paranoid and none too swift. sad, dear.

[Rex]

4. But you don't actually squash any CTs, you just reinforced them

with your instant disclaimer. Funny how that works.

[EOTE]

5. Wow, I hope you are alright.

Things must have been awfully scary in that crash. I'm so glad you made it out in one piece and you're able to relay the story to us.

[railsback]

6. Who said the government killed Hastings?

Are these the same people who say the government is listening to every single person in the U.S.?

[Recursion]

15. Pretty much

Also the people who are worried they're going to assassinate Assange.

[giftedgirl77]

52. Did InfoWars take over DU

over the last few days I have begun to wonder.

[NoOneMan]

82. The same loons that thought the government was lying about WMDs to start a war

[bemildred]

7. If the Gov't insists on "investigating" reporters they will also have to put up with

theories that they might have done something more. It's not exactly an original idea or an uncommon occurrence for some reporter to get offed for sticking his nose in the wrong place, and anyone paying attention knows reporters are unusually prone to "accidents".

[Floyd_Gondolli]

9. This topic will provide endless infotainment on DU

Not just this thread but the many that will come after it. I suspect there will be a lot of burning hair.

[DevonRex]

55. It's making me sick. Like I'm in the company of the

Vince Foster conspiracy theorists. This has gone way too far.
I am not entertained.

[geek tragedy]

56. Best solution is to make fun of them rather than insulting or debating.

Eventually, they'll decide it's not worth the mockery.

[MNBrewer]

80. The purpose of the whole world is to entertain you?

[DevonRex]

98. Did you notice "infotainment" in the post to which I replied? Part of which comes from

"entertainment" you might or might not know. If not, then you've learned something - gotten some information - the "info" portion of the aforementioned word. See how that works? Thus far, I've found every single person who believes that the Obama Administration might have had Hastings killed to be lacking in any accurate information and certainly none of their nutty conspiracy musings are even slightly entertaining. Just as none of the Clintons' stalker-serial-conspiracy theorists were entertaining in the 90s. But at least none of them claimed to be liberal.

[FSogol]

92. Same here. When is "enough is enough" time, Skinner and Co.?

[DevonRex]

97. Nothing

ever crosses the line. You noticed that, too?

[WilliamPitt]

10. Hillary Clinton had him killed via automobile for asking hard questions about Libya.

Read that one yesterday on Facebook.

Y'know...I'm sure there were just as many batshit crazy fever-dream nutbag people in America before the internet. Isn't it great that they all have a place to meet each other now so they can make little crazies out of their big crazies? Progress, y'all.

[Orrex]

14. Vince Foster was the second gunman who killed Hastings from the grassy knoll.

[Cali_Democrat]

23. I wonder if they will chalk up another victim in the "Clinton body count"

[quinnox]

11. I prefer to wait for the facts

But, a quick google search turned up this interesting article from the New Yorker magazine. There were some odd details about his death.

Anyone who is interested - http://nymag.com/daily/intelligencer/2013/06/michael-hastings-fbi-wikileaks-death-conspiracies.html

[Bluenorthwest]

27. That's not the New Yorker. Its NY Magazine, also a decent publication but it is not

the New Yorker. Easy mistake to make....

[quinnox]

99. Yea, thanks, I missed that

heh, I'm not familiar with East Coast stuff (never been very far East), so I assumed it was the New Yorker, I didn't know about the "NY Magazine".

[mountain grammy]

108. Odd details, but this quote from the article says it for me: let's wait for the facts.

Mother Jones editor Clara Jeffery put it plainly: "Ugh, the people posting Vince Foster style comments re Hastings death do a disservice to his no BS truth telling." Let's wait for the facts.

[whatchamacallit]

12. Quashed!

[randome]

13. I don't know, the picture's still a bit murky on this.

When I Google 'Snowden magic', this is the first image that appears. Now try to explain that!



[hr]
[font color="blue"][center]You should never stop having childhood dreams.[/center][/font]
[hr]

[TheKentuckian]

71. Seems like a map of one of the PvP areas from Dark Age of Camelot, I think the Keep was called

Snowden's for the Norse area.

[Logical]

18. No one knows yet. But I would tend to agree. n-t

[avaistheone1]

19. And you know this because...?

[Cali_Democrat]

66. See my update

It appear s he was speeding. It was caught on video.

[dkf]

20. This is certainly going to put more attention on his call for the press to go to "war" with the Gov.

Hastings actually said that..the Press needs to go to war against the government and they should not cooperate in any manner with the government when doing national security stories.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/10023051146

Prior to your post I was thinking it was a ridiculous notion and what could Michael Hastings possibly say or do that would make him a target. Now that you bring it up, I can see why they would have not wanted to deal with him if he made this a crusade.

So I don't seriously entertain the idea that the Government had him killed...yet...but thanks for bringing this to my notice.

[Cali_Democrat]

70. You're welcome

Let me know any additional information you find out as you research this.

Thank gawd you're on top of this.

[snot]

22. I think we should wait for more facts before deciding one way or another.

F.w.i.w., per http://www.nsc.org/news_resources/injury_and_death_statistics/Documents/Injury_Facts_43.pdf , as of 2009, if I've done the math correctly, the lifetime odds of any particular individual's dying in a car accident were ca. 0.24%.

[Bluenorthwest]

24. Your post is just declaration of your opinion, and as I rarely agree with your opinions I'll have to

go read up on the story, assuming that you are 100% incorrect because you offer zero support and preach a faith based sort of sermonette, I tire of the sermonette society and prefer those who persuade with fact and that sort of thing.
That fact free faith crap is how centrists sell everything.

[still_one]

35. And each side doesn't do that? Funny accusation run rampant, though no one

needs proof if it justifies their position

[Cali_Democrat]

53. I think we agree on more things than you might imagine

[kestrel91316]

29. He killed himself driving recklessly like so many other folks in SoCal do.

He may have been a good journalist, but on the road it seems he was a menace to society.

[adric mutelovic]

34. Did he have any speeding tickets

in the past?

[zappaman]

42. He certainly had a violation that night.

http://blogs.laweekly.com/informer/2013/06/michael_hastings_red_light_video_speeding.php

After the Weekly reported today that LAPD traffic investigators believe the car tied in reports to journalist Michael Hastings was going faster than 60 miles per hour before a fatal crash in Hollywood, we were tipped off to new video showing a vehicle blasting through a red light just moments before that collision.
The video, by freelance TV news crew LOUD LABS NEWS, shows a vehicle blazing through a red light on Highland Avenue and Santa Monica Boulevard, only four blocks from the crash:
The video appears to have been taken from a LOUD LABS vehicle awaiting the night's news.

Freelance videographers work the night shift in L.A. because local TV stations don't budget enough for expensive, three-person news vans to work overnight. The freelance crews listen to police scanners and sell their footage to the stations.

[struggle4progress]

57. "... In his first book, I Lost My Love in Baghdad: A Modern War Story, Hastings says that he crashed

a car in a drunk driving accident when he was 19 ...
Michael Hastings Crash: Car Was Speeding, Engine Flew 100 Feet, Cops Say
By Dennis Romero
Wed., Jun. 19 2013 at 4:37 PM
http://blogs.laweekly.com/informer/2013/06/michael_hastings_crash_engine_flew_speeding_recovery.php

[pnwmom]

63. Or he simply drove recklessly

after falling off the wagon. It's not unheard of. And it's not unheard of to simply have a heart attack or stroke while driving -- it happened to a thirty-something friend of ours while he was playing tennis.

But the most common cause of an accident like that, late at night, involves substance abuse of some sort.

[still_one]

30. It is much easier to pile on to the president especially since there are no facts to back up the

Assertion that the government was involved

Much of these innuendos is perfect joe McCarthy tactics, they don't need proof

[NoOneMan]

88. The president has much more important citizens to drone kill

Why would he waste his time with Hastings? Where is it implied this has anything to do with Obama? Why the knee-jerk defense? Do you even evaluate what happens anymore, or just how it could reflect on Obama? Can you perceive any even close to reality if all you are thinking about is how it relates to the president?

People can certainly be suspicious if a renegade reporter with enemies in a corrupt, intrustive Government dies without so much as thinking about the guy behind the podium being involved.

[still_one]

94. Whatever

[adric mutelovic]

32. Thanks for your opinion

I respect it.

[HooptieWagon]

33. You don't know that.

Although a lower probability than other possible causes, it has not been eliminated as a possible cause. Wishful thinking or blind obedience doesn't change that fact.

[alcibiades_mystery]

38. This place has truly become unbelievable

[bunnies]

39. This site is just too funny sometimes.

Ive seen people questioning Snowdens connections called 'truthers' on DU. And yet... days later this CT floats around.

edit: clarity

[Vinnie From Indy]

40. How in the hell would you know?

Unless you provide DU with your inside knowledge of this matter, why would anyone take your comments seriously? I really miss the unrec button sometimes.

Cheers!

[zappaman]

41. Absolutely right.

and now we have video of his car before the wreck.

After the Weekly reported today that LAPD traffic investigators believe the car tied in reports to journalist Michael Hastings was going faster than 60 miles per hour before a fatal crash in Hollywood, we were tipped off to new video showing a vehicle blasting through a red light just moments before that collision.
The video, by freelance TV news crew LOUD LABS NEWS, shows a vehicle blazing through a red light on Highland Avenue and Santa Monica Boulevard, only four blocks from the crash:
The video appears to have been taken from a LOUD LABS vehicle awaiting the night's news.

Freelance videographers work the night shift in L.A. because local TV stations don't budget enough for expensive, three-person news vans to work overnight. The freelance crews listen to police scanners and sell their footage to the stations.

http://blogs.laweekly.com/informer/2013/06/michael_hastings_red_light_video_speeding.php

[Cali_Democrat]

44. Thank you. n/t

[RobertEarl]

48. Are you saying they made his gas pedal stick?

You know it all, can you give us ANY details about the crash? Please?

[cascadiance]

49. This still doesn't exclude the possibility that his accelerator and brakes might have been failing..

... which might have been due to someone screwing up his car. This video perhaps might dismiss the possibility that he was being chased by someone though. I do hope they check his transmission (that looks like it flew away so that it wasn't damaged as much by fire) and his car to see if it might have been tampered with. And if the cops are doing their job, they'll try to track back when he was with his car and when he wasn't to see if there was any opportunity for someone to have done such a tampering too. Don't know how badly his body was burned, but hopefully not so much that they could do enough of a study on it to verify if he had or hadn't been affected by drinking or using other inebriating substances.

We should not be out there saying someone killed him, but at the same time, we shouldn't dismiss the possibility of foul play yet until those who are investigating it have the chance to finish their jobs. Any abrogation of officials responsibilities in doing a thorough investigation should be watched for and not accepted.

[Cali_Democrat]

45. OP has been updated with evidence. n/t

[Octafish]

86. Evidence from zappaman?

The blog entry from LA Weekly he quoted adds that a car sped through a red light.

That doesn't add evidence to whether the government is in the clear or not.

[Cali_Democrat]

87. Yes it appears the car was speeding.

[zappaman]

90. The car matches the car that hit the tree.

And a witness reported it going 100mph.
That's called evidence.
You got any that the government was involved?
Bring it.

[MindPilot]

46. Not directly, I agree. But...

My first thought is that it was a Aaron Swartz suicide because he was being investigated.

OTOH, maybe he just got really drunk and drove crazy until he hit a tree.

[Progressive dog]

50. The government drugged him, loaded him up with

alcohol, and put him in a remote control car. They destroyed all non flammable evidence after the crash. They've done this hundreds of times. Mostly they mange to erase all evidence of their existence, but this is the one they screwed up and is proof that it is a government conspiracy.
Thanks for the sane post.

[BainsBane]

59. I got two ignores today

After asking what the OP's point was in that other thread.

[Progressive dog]

60. Wear them with pride

and don't let it bother you.

[Cali_Democrat]

64. You don't even wanna know how many I picked up recently

[BainsBane]

65. someone told me I was in denial

for not recognizing the fact the journalist was murdered by the govt. I told him for me to be in denial, there would need to be evidence for me to deny. I also pointed out that I do not under any circumstances consider a tweet evidence.

[geek tragedy]

69. I'm up to 70.

I think everyone in Creative Speculation has me on Ignore.

[treestar]

111. Now, now, "the government" is presumed guilty

Which is funny because it would be OK if they controlled the economy in any way or nationalized the banks or prosecuted "the corporatists."

[starroute]

67. It's not a binary "the government did it" vs. "simple accident"

He'd already pissed off the military with the McChrystal business. He was supposedly working on a story about Barrett Brown, which brings defense and intelligence contractors into the mix. He may have had other things on the back burner and have started sticking his nose into places where he wasn't welcome.

Right now, if I was a cop I'd be flagging this as suspicious -- if only because who drives down a residential street at 100 miles an hour, no matter how drunk? And if I did find indications of foul play, I'd conclude that the field of possible suspects was wide open.

I'd say that what's called for is to sit back, wait to see how this develops, and not jump to premature conclusions of any kind.

[Cali_Democrat]

68. It was a tragic accident. n/t

[Smarmie Doofus]

112. Correct: "suspicious". The difficulty w. "sitting back and waiting"...

...is that no one has confidence in any entity that might conduct an "official" investigation.

LAPD, FBI... the rest of the nat'l security state alphabet soup.

That is the difficulty and the paradox.

[Deny and Shred]

72. One thing about murderers ...

... they don't want to leave behind evidence of their crime. Some even plan ahead meticulously and make sure there is no evidence. Some are even so adept that they can fool investigators into believing it was an accident, or suicide.

Smoking gun proof is a high hurdle, and will probably not be forthcoming here, nor in many other murders. State-sponsored political murders are as old as mankind, rarely admitted, and those responsible rarely celebrated. I doubt this is a government hit, but we'll never know anything beyond a fiery car crash. That doesn't completely rule out suspicion. To say otherwise is akin to the same faith that CTers have in the falsity of the cover story.

[warrprayer]

73. As long as we don't blame Obama

... it's ok right?

"It's important that any conspiracy theories are quashed before they spin out of control and tarnish his (Obama's) legacy."

fixed that for you!

[Cali_Democrat]

75. What are you talking about?

[warrprayer]

76. nothing at all. n/t

[Cali_Democrat]

77. Go sell crazy some place else

We're all stocked up here.

[warrprayer]

81. and the masks

are falling like leaves in Autumn!

[Cali_Democrat]

85. I've noticed you've been following me around lately since I called you a board nanny

Your feelings still hurt from that?

[warrprayer]

89. follow you around? Really? LMAO

quite a feat considering I am on a library computer and only have 1.5 hours of time on line any day of the week. Even more incredible considering I don't come here every day. But yes, I do remember the "board nanny" taunt. And no, I don't hold a grudge.

p.s. - The death of Michael Hastings bothered me especially since there is such an effort to smear him posthumously. Let alone the seemingly desperate attempts to write his death off as non-suspicious.

[Cali_Democrat]

91. " I don't hold a grudge"

riiiiiiiiight.

I thought it was a pretty effective taunt actually. So effective that it still obviously bothers you to this day.

[warrprayer]

93. OK.

whatever makes you happy!

[HangOnKids]

109. Taunting people is cute? And enjoying it?

Jebus. You are just such a peach.

[MNBrewer]

78. How the hell do YOU know?

[NoOneMan]

79. Its as unlikely that he was killed as the theory that the government is spying on us

Gosh guys. If you want to know the truth just ask the government what happened

[warrprayer]

83. yes

That's certainly the sensible thing to do!

[tritsofme]

95. Oh lordy, some people truly are stuck on stupid.

[Fire Walk With Me]

100. OH GOOD GOD, you're taking LAPD's word? The Rodney King/Rampart/Macarthur Park LAPD????

There are not enough emoticons.

[Trajan]

101. Ridiculous thread

in what has become a ridiculous forum ....

[dennis4868]

103. This is truly

A crazy place.

[reusrename]

114. Obama is not the government.

I don't think anyone here believes that Obama had Hastings killed, so you can take a deep breath and relax.

There is a shadow government that exists. And they are always suspect, of everything, and with good reason.

Just relax and try to come to grips with reality.

[cbdo2007]

115. So your opinion is that it must have been a suicide?

[Eddie Haskell]

116. I watched the video ...

There's no way to make a positive ID from that video.

[Eddie Haskell]

117. The damage is consistent with a bomb.

It's obvious, the damage is consistent with a bomb under the dash. The witnesses describe an explosion that shook their house. Another witness saw the car jackknife and parts flying in all directions ... that doesn't happen in a crash. It's basic physics. Look at the pictures.