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Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsNSA: people are "normally selected for targeting" based on their "Facebook or webmail content."
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Snowden Interview: NSA 'In Bed Together with the Germans'
In an interview, Edward Snowden accuses the National Security Agency of partnering with Germany and other governments in its spying activities. New information also indicates close working ties between the German foreign intelligence agency and the American authority.
In an interview to be published in this week's issue of SPIEGEL, American intelligence agency whistleblower Edward Snowden criticizes the methods and power of the National Security Agency. Snowden said the NSA people are "in bed together with the Germans." He added that the NSA's "Foreign Affairs Directorate" is responsible for partnerships with other countries. The partnerships are organized in a way that authorities in other countries can "insulate their political leaders from the backlash" in the event it becomes public "how grievously they're violating global privacy." Telecommunications companies partner with the NSA and people are "normally selected for targeting" based on their "Facebook or webmail content."
The interview was conducted by American cryptography expert Jacob Appelbaum and documentary filmmaker Laura Poitras with the help of encrypted e-mails shortly before Snowden became known globally for his whistleblowing.
.........................
http://www.spiegel.de/international/world/edward-snowden-accuses-germany-of-aiding-nsa-in-spying-efforts-a-909847.html
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nadinbrzezinski
(154,021 posts)They fear the people
Octafish
(55,745 posts)The Nightmare Scenario for every owner.
awoke_in_2003
(34,582 posts)too many Americans haven't realized that wages are going down while costs are going up, education is being destroyed, and the media is nothing but a propaganda machine. By time they wake up it will be too late.
randome
(34,845 posts)If Snowden or anyone else would bother to detail what type of data sharing actually occurs, we would all be pretty much on the same page.
But it gets more attention to imply -without evidence- that something nefarious is occurring.
[hr]
[font color="blue"][center]The truth doesn’t always set you free.
Sometimes it builds a bigger cage around the one you’re already in.[/center][/font]
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kpete
(72,028 posts)that "something nefarious is (NOT) occurring?
I was NOT ok when we found out about this shit in 2006 and I am not ok now.
http://www.greenisthenewred.com/blog/nsa-domestic-spying-on-activists/7081/
peace, kp
randome
(34,845 posts)But calling to mind a Bush Era indignity does not automatically mean Obama is doing the same thing.
Again, let's unite on the things we agree on instead of making endless assumptions and recriminations.
* More transparency, less secrecy.
* Less privatization.
* More details about cases actually utilizing NSA.
* More details regarding the NSA's budget.
[hr]
[font color="blue"][center]The truth doesn’t always set you free.
Sometimes it builds a bigger cage around the one you’re already in.[/center][/font]
[hr]
snappyturtle
(14,656 posts)the transparency the patriotic whistleblowers disclose?
randome
(34,845 posts)Why do you think they never mention the safeguards and restraints in place?
It's because they don't know. They give us only one side of the story. Their side.
Now maybe there are insufficient safeguards and restraints in place. That's definitely something we should know. But if S&G aren't going to bother to do that research then why should I get all hot and bothered over their next 'dump'?
Do you know how many cooperative law enforcement operations we have with other countries?
Neither do I but I bet there are what most of us would characterize as 'a lot'.
But wording this as 'getting in bed with Germany' tells us right from the start that they have an agenda.
[hr]
[font color="blue"][center]The truth doesn’t always set you free.
Sometimes it builds a bigger cage around the one you’re already in.[/center][/font]
[hr]
snappyturtle
(14,656 posts)What I think is lacking is an adequate response to their accusations and findings from our
"transparent" gov't.
Insufficient safeguards? I think they're being ignored and gone around...enter Justice Roberts and those who hold no value in the Fourth Amendment.
I think our gov't is using other governments to circumvent our laws. I greatly object to that. I don't care how many programs we have with reciprocity features...who cares? It's this one that concerns me. "Getting in bed with Germany" only implies there is some quid pro quo going on, no "agenda". We're after the wrong people....don't kill the messengers.
Kurovski
(34,655 posts)The profit motive is always a disaster in things such as this.
Generally excellent post, randome. I can't think of a single pejorative to hurl at you! 
randome
(34,845 posts)
[hr]
[font color="blue"][center]The truth doesn’t always set you free.
Sometimes it builds a bigger cage around the one you’re already in.[/center][/font]
[hr]
treestar
(82,383 posts)something nefarious is suggested to be occurring, so it must be occurring. Is there a remote possibility it is not nefarious?
allin99
(894 posts)see anything inherently wrong with intelligence agencies helping each other. And nothing else they mention seems unacceptable. "targeting fb", okayyyy, ?? and then what?
I didn't find anything disconcerting in the article at all.
xtraxritical
(3,576 posts)and what about the "content" of all the other forms of communication? The possibilities for blackmail are endless, it's scarey and creepy. 
dixiegrrrrl
(60,010 posts)Isn't that what NSA was saying in response to the leaks...that they admitted they gather all kinds of data but do not actually read it without a warrant? So reading in "real time" was not happening, they "just" collect everything in case they need it?
randome
(34,845 posts)Somehow that point is always ignored.
[hr]
[font color="blue"][center]The truth doesn’t always set you free.
Sometimes it builds a bigger cage around the one you’re already in.[/center][/font]
[hr]
xtraxritical
(3,576 posts)Also, Snowden maintains that they can access content anytime they want to, which the secret FISA court ensures.
suffragette
(12,232 posts)Put together with Warren's point about how countries provide cover, it's possible that it's the other country going through content, then kicking it back to the 1st countries surveillance agency.
Which makes me feel not one iota more secure, just the opposite actually.
leveymg
(36,418 posts)
Amonester
(11,541 posts)I spy on UALL!
Shame on me! 
think
(11,641 posts)you've got nothing to hide....
Mojorabbit
(16,020 posts)looking for stuff then I am very concerned.
allin99
(894 posts)Th1onein
(8,514 posts)don't get? It's an invasion of our privacy. Is that okay with you?
randome
(34,845 posts)That is well under the purview of the NSA.
[hr]
[font color="blue"][center]The truth doesn’t always set you free.
Sometimes it builds a bigger cage around the one you’re already in.[/center][/font]
[hr]
fasttense
(17,301 posts)It was perfectly legal to murder a slave you owned too. It was perfectly legal for the banksters and corporations to crash the economy.
It's perfectly legal for Obama to pick you to aim a drone at and murder you, after he names you a terrorist.
Perfectly legal, move along, nothing to see except some corporate contractor sorting through all your personal data hand in glove with the NSA and foreign spy agencies.
treestar
(82,383 posts)Yes it was legal to own a slave, but that's not the extent of the question here.
Mojorabbit
(16,020 posts)reciprocal agreements so that foreign govts can sift thru our stuff and then share it with NSA? If they are using this to provide cover and get around laws in other countries, I am sure it is working the same way in the other direction to circumvent our laws.
randome
(34,845 posts)There are safeguards and restrictions in place that S&G conveniently leave out. I would think (although I don't know and we should know) that even the data stored by Germany, say, cannot be viewed without a legitimate warrant from the U.S.
Same as it is for any other foreign intelligence cooperative agreements.
If we have a foreign individual in America and Germany serves us with a warrant about information for that person, do you think we should ignore it?
The reason S&G don't mention safeguards and restraints is because they don't know. They have an incomplete picture.
[hr]
[font color="blue"][center]The truth doesn’t always set you free.
Sometimes it builds a bigger cage around the one you’re already in.[/center][/font]
[hr]
Mojorabbit
(16,020 posts)Do you "know" that they have an incomplete picture? No.
None of us knows yet but it does not look good from where I stand.
randome
(34,845 posts)Their last story about PRISM did not even address the fact (right there on the frickin' PowerPoint slide!) that it pertains only to foreign data, not American.
Yet they don't even mention that because they don't want us to consider it. They keep pushing the idea that the NSA has all the world's communications in one place.
A good journalist would present all facets of a story and let us make up our own minds. Yet they conveniently leave out the parts they want us to ignore.
We should know more about how the NSA operates. But we apparently can't trust S&G to tell us the full story.
[hr]
[font color="blue"][center]The truth doesn’t always set you free.
Sometimes it builds a bigger cage around the one you’re already in.[/center][/font]
[hr]
Skittles
(153,226 posts)can people possible be THAT naive in this day and age??? 
Th1onein
(8,514 posts)And, if you've been privy to the same information that the vast majority of DU has been privy to these past couple of weeks, you KNOW that you are wrong.
They asked for ALL of Verizon's business customers data. ALL of them, Americans and foreigners.
You know better.
Warren Stupidity
(48,181 posts)It is illegal for the Brits to spy on their people so we do it for them. In exchange the Brits spy on our people. Both nations conspire to circumvent their own restrictions on mass domestic surveillance, and then hide behind national security to avoid scrutiny. Snowden has disclosed that these agreements go beyond the us/uk agreement, which has been in place at least since the 80s, to include, for example, Germany and France. The National Security State is global in reach.
Carry on.
suffragette
(12,232 posts)randome
(34,845 posts)How would you handle such a situation? Pretend it doesn't happen?
As long as there are sufficient safeguards in place (and we don't know that there are), and if we can request data only with a demonstrably realistic need, then what's the problem?
[hr]
[font color="blue"][center]The truth doesn’t always set you free.
Sometimes it builds a bigger cage around the one you’re already in.[/center][/font]
[hr]
1monster
(11,012 posts)of impending terrorist actions or not...
randome
(34,845 posts)Although it's also clear the dots were not linked correctly for the Boston Bombers.
[hr]
[font color="blue"][center]The truth doesn’t always set you free.
Sometimes it builds a bigger cage around the one you’re already in.[/center][/font]
[hr]
Good point
treestar
(82,383 posts)1monster
(11,012 posts)
Warren Stupidity
(48,181 posts)randome
(34,845 posts)Why are S&G conveniently leaving out those parts? Probably because they don't know the full picture.
Which brings up the question of why they are publishing an incomplete picture.
[hr]
[font color="blue"][center]The truth doesn’t always set you free.
Sometimes it builds a bigger cage around the one you’re already in.[/center][/font]
[hr]
Warren Stupidity
(48,181 posts)GoneFishin
(5,217 posts)have a legitimate basis. Like the MSM giving equal time to both sides of the climate change debate even though 99.99% of climate scientists agree that climate change is real.
These guys are not real.
Amonester
(11,541 posts)Nice try.
GoneFishin
(5,217 posts)Amonester
(11,541 posts)trolling?
GoneFishin
(5,217 posts)Mojorabbit
(16,020 posts)treestar
(82,383 posts)They're in on this too!
randome
(34,845 posts)S&G give only enough to make us suspicious. They don't have any idea what the NSA is doing in cooperation with Germany and other countries.
They only know that it's that dreaded word 'cooperation'. Therefore it's automatically assumed to be nefarious.
Maybe it is but S&G don't tell us the nefarious part. They depend on their true believers to take up the ball for them.
[hr]
[font color="blue"][center]The truth doesn’t always set you free.
Sometimes it builds a bigger cage around the one you’re already in.[/center][/font]
[hr]
treestar
(82,383 posts)before jumping on the bandwagon! Then have to close their ears to any of the other side's story.
Countless times they have gone on an outrage in this manner, and object loudly to anyone who suggests listening to the other side first. In one, I said why don't you check out the President's side on this issue or his explanation for it. Well, only cool-aid drinkers will do that. Missing the irony that they are the cool-aid drinkers if someone can just suggest something nefarious.
JDPriestly
(57,936 posts)It gives a lot of details, but I don't have time to translate.
Above all, the article in ZEIT states that the US identifies suspects from Facebook and e-mails.
This translation is very loose and perhaps not accurate. It would be great if someone else could correct it if they wish.
Angela Merkel noted that the terrorist plans of the Sauerland-Group were discovered in time to prevent an incident thanks to information from the US authorities. "That doesn't justify, however, that both sides are bugging the ambassadors. And for that reason, I (Merkel) say, electronic eavesdropping between friends is really not acceptable.
Bei einem CDU-Landesparteitag in Bad Salzuflen erinnerte sie an die Sauerland-Gruppe, deren Terror-Pläne auch dank Hinweisen von US-Behörden rechtzeitig aufgedeckt wurden. "Das berechtigt aber nicht dazu, dass man sich auch noch gegenseitig die Botschaften verwanzt. Und deshalb sage ich, Abhören geht unter Freunden wirklich nicht", sagte Merkel.
http://www.zeit.de/politik/deutschland/2013-07/nsa-zusammenarbeit-bnd
I don't think anyone minds that terrorists can be identified and observed through this spy apparatus. The problem is that the program is far too broad and far too likely to end or limit positive communications, communications that we need in our society and that we want to encourage. Examples are the suicide-counseling services, journalists' interviews with whistleblowers, family discussions by the rich, famous or politically well placed, lawyers' research, even research by law enforcement if of employees of the NSA. The examples are endless of communications that we don't want to be caught up in this program.
As for Germany.
Apparently Snowden said in an interview given some time ago that Germany and the US have conspired in making this program work. Merkel is really trying to justify her cooperation with the US on it. Merkel faces a big election in September, so she is trying to make herself look good.
The problems with the program are not, of course, how this capacity has been used in the past. That may be all moderate and sensible.
The problems with the program (and these are just some of them) are:
it gives to the elite group of people who carry it out the ability to judge and make decisions about everyone else, in many cases, to determine the fates, legal, social, professional, etc. of people inadvertently or intentionally placed under surveillance. Think of the power to control elections by releasing damning information about one candidate but not about another.
the sense that the rest of us may have of vulnerability, of being violated in our most intimate, perhaps foolish, perhaps emotional states, of being watched in communications with family, loved ones, bosses, co-workers, merchants, etc. -- feeling that, when we call someone or communicate on the internet or check a book out of the library, we are in a cell and a jailer is watching us -- Kafka come to life.
the danger that this program on which so much money is spent and which absorbs an exorbitant amount of our national financial and human resources will give our "leaders" at the same time a false sense of security thus distracting them from the work they should be doing and a false sense of superiority and invulnerability because they alone can control which "leads" are followed and which are ignored.
most important -- the fact that this program deprives individuals and institutions like the press, lawyers, members of Congress, scientists, government officials and ironically even the FBI, people who, in our society serve the positive function of watching the government, watching the elite of the ability to do their job and thus deprives us of a free press and a functioning democracy.
I realize that this is poorly written. I'm just getting my thoughts down.
This spying program is very attractive to governments. It is a shortcut, but such a dangerous one.
One DUer posted that he has put everyone who posts against this program on ignore because he doesn't want to read about it any more. Certainly there are many more DUers who have done the same thing.
The problem is that putting people on ignore is an admission that you cannot counter their arguments, that you disagree but are not persuaded even by your own grounds for disagreeing. It is an evasion. It is an admission that your arguments, that your ideas have no merit and cannot stand up to the test of logic and reason.
Is it really so hard to admit being wrong?
randome
(34,845 posts)Why wouldn't S&G tell us about the safeguards and restraints put in place? Maybe it's because they don't know?
We should know those details, don't you think? Why would S&G leave them out?
They want to scare us. We shouldn't be so easily frightened, we should be pressing for more transparency and less secrecy.
But it would be much preferred if S&G gave us enough information to decide if we needed to be frightened on our own. Instead, they give us just a little and then editorialize by calling the NSA 'in bed with Germany'.
That's not journalism. S&G are still editorializing and leaving out the details.
[hr]
[font color="blue"][center]The truth doesn’t always set you free.
Sometimes it builds a bigger cage around the one you’re already in.[/center][/font]
[hr]
JDPriestly
(57,936 posts)we should be pressing for more transparency and less secrecy.
That is why I am posting so much against the program.
Every word you say about Snowden and Greenwald is, in my view, even more true about our government.
Do we need a strong defense and does that mean we have to have some secrecy and some effective intelligence about the dangers that may face us and our nation?
Yes.
But, the secrecy should be minimal. Information should only be kept from us when it absolutely must.
I'm not sure that Snowden and Greenwald are withholding so much information. That is a possibility, but it may be that our media is just afraid to print or speak about some of the information.
I understand that someone named, I think, Poiras, (something like that) is making a film on Snowden and that there are a lot of interviews of him. I got that information here but also from reading some German newspapers this morning.
The foreign press gives insights that we aren't getting in our news, but I notice that I get a fragment from this newspaper and then a fragment from something else. I just don't have the time to translate it all, post it all with links, etc.
I would like to start a group for posting from foreign news sources. If you know anyone who is interested, let me know. I asked Catherina and she would post on it, I believe, based on her answer. Think about it please.
randome
(34,845 posts)...will miss their deadline of Dec. of this year, although they will issue a report then.
It's because too damned many documents are still being marked 'Top Secret' and 'Classified' when they don't need to be!
The process is out of control and needs to be better managed.
[hr]
[font color="blue"][center]The truth doesn’t always set you free.
Sometimes it builds a bigger cage around the one you’re already in.[/center][/font]
[hr]
JDPriestly
(57,936 posts)We are cleaning closets today. The NSA needs to do the same thing. It should declassify stuff much faster. In addition to making our government more transparent, they could save space in their databases and money too. Besides they would keep historians and critics busy looking at the questionable practices of past administrations rather than picking fault with them.
Too many documents are being marked Top Secret and Classified.
Now that I am retired, I clean my closet every year. I have a lot of old, professional clothes that I never wear. I have a sentimental attachment to them. They were like a badge of honor, I suppose, at one time in my life. I have tremendous difficulty parting with them, giving them up. It's kind of crazy. I can't use them. I probably never will. I would look ridiculous wearing them to my exercise classes or digging in my garden. I can't even wear them to community meetings because they would make me look like some kind of snooty person. But it's like giving up a part of myself.
So, I understand what people in our government are going through. They don't want to give up junk because it makes them remember when they mattered more than they do today.
They should not have waited to clean house until Snowden started giving their junk, their trash away. And that is all most of it is. The few terrorist plots they discover would be more easily discovered if they focused their searches.
Dragonfli
(10,622 posts)If they have nothing to hide they have nothing to fear and they could tell us about all these safeguards you claim are all over this thing.
Maybe they are hiding why congress gets lied to by the NSA (using the most honest lie telling possible of course)
Lawyers for the Justice Department argued, according to Reuters, that releasing the opinions would expose the public to dangers that are "real and significant, and, quite frankly, beyond debate."
The Justice Department lawyers, however, did say that the surveillance court is free to release opinions as long as doing so does not violate specific rules.
The federal government might also release more records related to the surveillance program, Reuters reported.
http://thehill.com/blogs/blog-briefing-room/news/309433-justice-department-urges-surveillance-court-not-to-release-opinions#ixzz2YHnRWgAX
It appears Obama does not welcome the debate and in fact is fighting tooth and nail to avoid it.
Strang in a case where there is nothing nefarious going on don't you think?
ForeignandDomestic
(190 posts)If this is the case I'm pretty sure they know who I am!!
nadinbrzezinski
(154,021 posts)
1monster
(11,012 posts)treestar
(82,383 posts)You flatter yourself.
ForeignandDomestic
(190 posts) ForeignandDomestic
(190 posts)They really are afraid of "we the people" awakening to their shenanigans.
Le Taz Hot
(22,271 posts)"The partnerships are organized in a way that authorities in other countries can "insulate their political leaders from the backlash" in the event it becomes public "how grievously they're violating global privacy."
Sort of like illegally detaining another country's president and no one ever quite knowing where the order came from (like our fingerprints weren't all over it).
snappyturtle
(14,656 posts)noamnety
(20,234 posts)before we are targeted to have our webmail content read?
Agony
(2,605 posts)
Poll_Blind
(23,864 posts)PB
VanillaRhapsody
(21,115 posts)If you are sending emails to someone in Iran for example.
treestar
(82,383 posts)for all the hair on fire "they are reading our emails" I've never heard from someone who might actually be a target of this. Namely, ordinary immigrants from Muslim countries calling or emailing home. There actually could be innocent Americans having their emails inspected, and those are the most likely people to have it done.
And yet at the time of the Boston bombing, the government was trash for not spying enough on the Tsarnaevs.
Obama bad, is the only real principal these posters stand on. You can bet if there's another attack this will all be forgotten in favor of saying the CIA dropped the ball and didn't spy on someone enough.
noamnety
(20,234 posts)" I've never heard from someone who might actually be a target of this. "
"We deny your FOIA request asking whether you've been targeted" is not the same as "you haven't been targeted."
Seems like a big leap to state confidently that nobody you know has been targeted, when the govt. is refusing to confirm or deny it.
Mojorabbit
(16,020 posts)They deserved to be trashed because they did not follow up. Straw man.
noamnety
(20,234 posts)VanillaRhapsody
(21,115 posts)noamnety
(20,234 posts)If you email someone in another country, do you consider that consent to have all your phone calls from there on out listened to?
I don't live too far from Dearborn, MI - with one of the largest middle eastern population in the country (maybe the largest still). I would assume many many families there still have family back in the middle east. Do you think it's right to target all of them?
VanillaRhapsody
(21,115 posts)If you emailed someone in Iran it would be the same...so its based on email with certain foreign nationals...not necessarily ethnicity.
Mojorabbit
(16,020 posts)from all over the world who play hand drums. Many are from the middle east and play dumbek and tabla and or frame drums. I would be infuriated if that would be enough for someone to look at my communications. How many people from all over the world do most facebook people have friended esp those who play the games. Is that all it would take for them to get around the foreign country stipulation? It would be easy to scoop up a huge amt of people this way (friends of friends and then their friends). I can see unlimited ways this can be abused.
HardTimes99
(2,049 posts)recommend the film "The Visitor" to you, given your interest in hand drums and the middle east. The movie is way deeper than that and manages to capture my fury and grief at what Bush and his fascist cohort have done to this land in a few short years.
I don't have Netflix so not sure how you'd go about getting this, but am posting the Wiki link for it to help you find it if you are interested.
I cannot recommend this film highly enough.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Visitor_%282007_drama_film%29
Mojorabbit
(16,020 posts)HardTimes99
(2,049 posts)and this film reduces me to tears of impotent rage and grief each time I have seen it.
NaturalHigh
(12,778 posts)99Forever
(14,524 posts)Please tell me this was sarcasm.
dkf
(37,305 posts)All your words are basically as open as an Internet content search to these guys.
cantbeserious
(13,039 posts)eom
Safetykitten
(5,162 posts)from bad people that hate you for them.
bemildred
(90,061 posts)
Not even good liars.
HooptieWagon
(17,064 posts)Then catching the Boston Bombers before they acted would have been a lead-pipe cinch. They self-radicalized by visiting extremist Islamic websites. The US was warned about them by the Russians. They communicated by cell phones, texts, and email. How is it even possible they were over-looked? Simple. The NSA isn't looking at terror threats. They're too busy spying on activists. That's the 900 lb gorilla in the secret room that Obama is so panicked will escape.
think
(11,641 posts)A Simple Game
(9,214 posts)much was implemented before we had any significant terrorist problems. And when a possible terrorist threat was discovered prior to 9/11 it was ignored because that's not what the system was meant to monitor.
NightWatcher
(39,343 posts)Me thinks he's been watching to much tv.
According to him, some poor bastard surfs Facebook and email to determine who to target. To target for what? A Bourne Identity movie plot, or maybe Enemy of the State, or Die Hard with that guy who messed up the Internet...
A little paranoid and self aggrandizing???
totodeinhere
(13,059 posts)Facebook messages. They use a computer algorithm to do that. It scans our material and then kicks out certain messages for further scrutiny based upon certain criteria. But the point is that they are scanning everything and we have no privacy left. And if they want to they can tag for further scrutiny someone who posts messages at DU. Get it?
NightWatcher
(39,343 posts)And Snowden is a kid who got a PEEK behind the curtain and thought he'd become a Libertarian heroic Paul Revere. The only stuff of his that has been verified is old news. The rest is mostly BS that he's making up to try to add value to his name. He's stuck in an airport at his own making. He thought he was hot shit and now he's trying to stay relevant and get out of the hole he dug.
Breaking News: the government searches public information for key words. They've done it for years. Most of us have known this since Snowden was dropping out of highschool.
noamnety
(20,234 posts)
Oilwellian
(12,647 posts)baldguy
(36,649 posts)Most would think the cop is being perfectly reasonable.
Orrex
(63,234 posts)Hmm...
treestar
(82,383 posts)But I bet we have to believe every word he says if we are "progressive."
berni_mccoy
(23,018 posts)Because your headline infers the former, and if it's the latter, would indicate your headline is misleading.
Thanks.
bornskeptic
(1,330 posts)and yet most of the posters on this thread are treating it as an NSA pronouncement. Actually, Snowden had no way of knowing how the programs dealing with domestic communications are handled other than what he surmised from the documents he captured during an orientation session at NSA headquarters. The facility where he worked in Hawaii is involved in capturing and analyzing foreign intelligence. The only people who can access the domestic data are at NSA headquarters in Fort Meade, Maryland.
Rex
(65,616 posts)WHICH is it Snowblower, are they in bed with us or did we spy on them? Can't have it both ways!
polynomial
(750 posts)Whether many know it or not this has got to be the coolest topic that hit the Internet. The open consciousness that is developing does have many top tier one percenters sweating very hard.
This includes the top one percenters of the news journalist system totally connect to the public media that with all efforts will demonize any and all that take it on, as the courageous Mr. Snowden is doing right now.
Snowden is essentially challenging the constitutional violations here also challenging the very cable media that has screwed America for the past fifty years. Ladies and Gentlemen of America cable media should not be as expensive as it is.
Watching MSNBC Joe in the morning once in his cavalier way said do not challenge the media you will lose. The feeling that went through me was disgusting and sick, how nauseating that Joe Scar burgh appeared to be too big to fail. Too big to fail is tightly connected to the media.
From my view it is highly and likely true in what Snowden is defining as an International connection in the one percent group, is valid.
Please understand there are good people in the banking system, they call them the middle and the poor working class. Very soon my turn will be among those that retire into poverty. So you see my defense for the safety net is part of my Champaign here on DU.
The only thing left is the vote that can kill this contagion in corruption. The secret stuff appears more obvious spread out into legions of banking systems world over. Yes, data declassified considered useless for military use but hugely important for marketing, sold to the highest bidder in the trillion dollar derivative market that has no rules that is designed to be confusing.
It is not hard to fathom that the Carlyle group which sells military equipment could very well sell cool data, through Booz Allen and Hamilton black boxed and declassified secretly by the right wing judges. The coolest thing done secretly forever no one to know and too big to fail, all very compelling for anyone to sign on to the biggest parcel of corruption ever invented.
kpete
(72,028 posts)you betcha!!!
kp
sigmasix
(794 posts)And anyone that doesnt eat the word salad must be sheeple in need of the really real truth to be provided by the "Snowden is my hero" bunch.
As long as no one notices and reads the actual language and totality of Snowden's double agent spy documents. But it's much more important to attempt to destroy America's standing around the world as a beacon of freedom and secular liberties. America is not the force of evil that so many Snowden and Greenwald fans claim it is- and president Obama isnt an undercover agent of destruction and evil, at work spying on every American all the time.
I know that the ODS has got many DU members to jump headlong into talk of impeachment and other extremist right wing aims and attempts to destroy America and every gain we have earned since the civil war- understand that the agents of extremism wont thank you for your assistance in undermining and destroying the democratic principles that make America great- they will just shift their evil actions and intentions to include destruction of any politician you may support that isnt an extreme right wing reactionary. You'd think anyone with an IQ above 80 would remember all of the attempts to discredit and destroy this president by the right wing leaders and libertarian pretenders.
But as long as someone agrees with the matrix narrative, whack-jobs will welcome them.
marions ghost
(19,841 posts)
arcane1
(38,613 posts)
sabrina 1
(62,325 posts)
Live and Learn
(12,769 posts)mick063
(2,424 posts)The people that do the Face book "targeting" are the same people that do the drone "targeting".
Anyone their names? The people that decide which Face book accounts are deemed worthy of targeting?
I didn't think so.
Probably explains why Occupy likely consumes more server space than Al Qaeda. I'll stand by that statement until a "leaker" can prove otherwise, considering such information is classified for all except the multitude of nerds employed by some profit motivated intelligence contractor. Certainly, with the colossal magnitude and scope of gathering billions of Facebook data bits, important people would not waste their time with such mundane tasks.
A most "transparent" Administration.
WillyT
(72,631 posts)
