I had a seventeen year old son

[lillypaddle]

His adam's apple almost bigger than his neck, he had an oily forehead, and some remnants of acne. He had an attitude, too. He expressed it in his torn jeans and Rolling Stones tee shirt. We didn't get along much, back then. I found pot in his closet, and magazine of "biker chicks." Damn, he was such a baby. I recognize it now even more than I recognized it back then. And he irritated the hell out of me. He's forty-five now, a husband, a father. The best human being I have ever known. Thank God he made it this far. Thank God he survived me. But lucky for him, he was white. He at least had that going for him.

Had he been approached under the same circumstances as Trayvon Martin, by George Zimmerman, he would be dead, too. He was only a kid. He wouldn't have been able to cope with that. He lifted weights back then, but he didn't have any real meanness inside him to show him what to do.

Trayvon was a baby, too. He was my son. I am tired of hearing from juror B-what-ever-fucking number. I come to DU to escape the insanity, and find ... insanity.

God Fucking DAMN them! God Fucking DAMN. I am so tired. This is our child we are talking about. This is our child. And he is dead.

I cry.

[Happyhippychick]

1. +1

[lillypaddle]

2. Thanks

I needed that.

[Happyhippychick]

3. This case is the sickest example of blaming the victim since rape victims were vilified for wearing

Miniskirts. With a healthy dose of racism.

[yardwork]

4. Yeah. I had two seventeen year old sons.

Same exact thing. I'm in tears.

How could those fucking evil racist moron jurors acquit Zimmerman.

[lillypaddle]

5. they are oblivious

amazingly so.

[lark]

90. Evil racist moron judge made it easy to acquit.

They wouldn't allow any talk about race or allow voice experts, etc. etc. Every decision was in favor of the defense, so it made it easier for the bigots to vote in favor of the clear murderer. I about puked when I heard part of an interview with one of the jurors, she was crying fake crocodile tears. I ranted & raved then turned it off because it made me so sick at heart I was crying.

[amuse bouche]

6. I know

[lillypaddle]

7. Thanks

[Boom Sound 416]

8. "But lucky for him he was white"?

You should be ashamed of yourself.

[JI7]

10. ashamed of what ? that she isn't ignorant of how race plays a part in this ?

[lillypaddle]

11. Why

do you say that? It's the truth.

[Scootaloo]

13. Didn't you know? It's racist to mention racism

[HangOnKids]

15. BINGO!

[Boom Sound 416]

14. I'm so furious

That I'm just going to say something mean and I don't want to do that. You're probably a nice person and a good mother.

So I'm just going to say nothing. But I think you should read what you wrote and ask yourself if you are contributing to the suffering of this nation right now. You probably won't think so, but I ask you to really try.

[Scootaloo]

17. I think you should go into detail here. n/t

[lillypaddle]

19. WTF

can you possibly be talking about?

[WinkyDink]

21. I think you misunderstand. It was implied "lucky for him he was white IN THIS RACIST NATION."

Of course, if you think pointing out that America is racist is "contributing to the suffering of this nation right now," IMO you have a misguided sense of both racism and righteousness.

[Boom Sound 416]

26. I appreciate your genuineness

I think I'm having trouble dealing with the concept that being born white is to be born lucky.

I'm happy to elaborate, but later.

If I misunderstood something, then I'm glad I took a little break to cool down.

[Maedhros]

89. White privilege is not an obscure concept.

We white people are shielded from a whole raft of bullshit that so many others have to deal with on a daily basis.

[Boom Sound 416]

93. I started to disagree with you

But you are right. Starting with the real estate industry and many others that one could just throw a dart at. Their is certainly a problem with integration. I'd like to continue, but duty calls now.

[Spitfire of ATJ]

99. My big question is wondering if there were 415 Boom Sounds before you.

[Boom Sound 416]

29. Furthermore

Since the verdict it has become quite clear here and elsewhere that the folks most upset with this trial are those that know very little of the facts.

[Spazito]

32. What facts are being missed?

I am upset about the verdict so what facts don't I know?

[Boom Sound 416]

34. How do I know what you don't know

What do you know?

[Spazito]

35. Trayvon Martin was profiled, followed, confronted and then shot by a cop wannabe....

and the jury decided that was perfectly fine with them and Zimmerman had the perfect right to do that to one of those "other people".

What do you know?

[Boom Sound 416]

40. I know you agree with the prosecution's opening statements

[Spazito]

41. Where are these facts you say we don't know...

I eagerly await, to be educated by your knowledge of the facts.

[Boom Sound 416]

42. I'm sure the entire trial is available

To watch. I watched several hours a day. I was pretty consumed by it. I disagree with a lot of the laws, but I agree with the verdict.

What I've found and it should be no suprise to anyone reading and posting is that a lot of people do a lot of firing from the hip. I wish everyone as interested as me had the luxury of watching each day. A lot of people also do a lot of embellishing one way or the other. But I'm not really talking about those folks.

I don't present myself as any master of the facts or to know any more than what actually happened in court, but don't tell me everyone who is so enraged actually watched a significant amount of the trial unfiltered.

[Spazito]

43. Ahhh, so no facts to offer...

to back up your previous post. No surprise. And no surprise you agree with the verdict, I assumed as much.

I had the luxury of watching it, watching it all.

[Boom Sound 416]

44. Do I really need to

List out the points of the trial. Those are the facts and the shall we say alleged facts.

Then their is the law. Why are you assuming I don't care about Trayvon. Because it feels as such. The whole pile on does. Is this a tragedy yes. Is the verdict a tragedy? I'm sorry I still believe that if you go looking for trouble, you will find. Damn, look at me now. I steel feel the way I felt and I waded into something when I should have kept my trap shut. So, I went looking for it and I found it. So did both of them. So many things could have shut this down from the point of where it began. And tragically for Trayvon, he brought fists to a gun fight. And indisputably Zimmerman would not have got out of his car without his gun. No way.

So what are we left with?

How do we react?

Who pays?

Who do we indict?

It's craziness. And the woodwork comments like "I'm so happy I'm white, but it's a damn shame life is like that and our country sucks because it pro-ports racism. But I live here so I'll try to change it. But at the end of the day I've got the advantage universally. And furthermore the other guy is blah blah blah."

I think foremost lay-expert to this verdict are African American members of law enforcement. Specifically city cops.

I'd like the crappy media to ask just one.

[Spazito]

45. "I'm sorry I still believe that if you go looking for trouble, you will find."

That statement coupled with your post agreeing with the verdict says all I need to know about your grasp of facts in this case, you have none.

I'm done with this.

[sabrina 1]

79. Zimmerman went looking for trouble after being told not to.

And he found it.

Coward that he is, after having stalked and harassed someone who was most likely in FEAR of his LIFE (rightly so as it turned out) he used a deadly weapon rather than speak to the teenager.

Why, eg, when he was asked by the teenager, Trayvon 'why are you following me' why didn't he say something like 'sorry, I thought you were someone else' or 'are you lost, I live in the area and wondered if you were lost, can I help you'?

What DID Zimmerman say when he was asked 'why are you following me'? We don't know because the only eye witness is dead and cannot speak for himself.

Did it ever occur to you that Trayvon Martin was frightened for his life? Or that HE had a right to defend himself from what appeared to be (AND turned out to be) a real threat to him?

Seems to me that Trayvon's instincts were correct, he was afraid of this creepy stranger who had been following him for no apparent reason (he was just walking home from the store) and he has been proven to be correct, tragically.

Have you ever been stalked by a stranger in the dark? Did you ever, while you spent hours watching this trial, empathize at all with a teenager who had done nothing wrong being followed by a complete stranger?

To me, if you take it upon yourself to stalk someone for whatever reason you should expect 'trouble'. Obviously the dispatcher who told Zimmerman to stay in his truck was a whole lot smarter than Zimmerman and knew that even an innocent person might be alarmed if they saw someone following them so to avoid any trouble, he gave Zimmerman the right advice.

Zimmerman ignored it, he went looking for trouble instead, and he found it. And he killed a completely innocent human being and got away with it. He was the initiator, the direct cause of everything that happened that night and made himself, judge, jury and executioner because he is without judgement, and a threat to society who should never have had a gun, considering his record of past violence.

[Boom Sound 416]

83. Well I'm certainly with you on some points

There is no question Zim went looking for trouble. There is no question he would have stayed in his car had he not had a gun. No question.

I'll submit Zimmerman has never really had his ass kicked too. Something I've always and seriously believed should happened before you can get a conceal carry.

Where we disagree is about Trayvon. I don't believe he feared for his life. I do think he threw the first punch. I do believe he could have got home after the initial question by Zimmerman. It's what I think. It's not what I know. But I think this after watching the trial.

However I don't believe "Trayvon got was coming..." or any shit like that (my quotes not yours). But I do think they both could have quelled it. Zimmerman could have announced his concerns. Trayvon could have belayed them. It's not like it was 2am. It was 7pm. Hardly a scary hour.

The dispatcher also said to tell him if trayvon does anything else. The dispatcher admitted in court to the inconsistency. However as much of zimmerman's story I do believe I've had the most trouble with the "didn't know which street" part. That always been troubling.

And then again on the other side. Trayvon, I don't think was going home. He had left about an hour previously to go to the store. He spend a lot of time working his way back. It wasn't that late. He was on the phone. Why are we to assume he was so determined to be back home.

The whole thing is a shit storm. I just don't accept that one side bears all the blame.

[Boom Sound 416]

47. On the luxury

I'm an acting stay at home parent. I'm not heading to work (or looking for it) like the rest of my world. I'm home with my kids. Yes, it's a luxury.

[SeaLyons]

76. Yes, I watched every minute of the trial and I'm enraged by the verdict. nt

[Boom Sound 416]

84. That's fair

I accept i may have spoken in general terms, but certainly not universally.

I'm interested to know your thoughts

[lark]

91. All the facts were not presented at trial

Judge cherry picked and kept out a lot of information that would have made the jury more likely to convict.

[Boom Sound 416]

92. You are referring to Zim's past?

[JI7]

22. you are the one who doesn't get it, she is saying he is lucky to not be targeted the way trayvon was

because he is white.

a white kid can dress up any way and one wouldn't be suspicious.

[amuse bouche]

24. You are furious?

That's ridiculous. The OP didn't say anything wrong. Take a breath and get over the faux rage

You want to see some really awful threads and dumb people? Go read The View Message Board.

I don't understand why there are so many right wing bigots there

[laundry_queen]

25. I think you need to explain yourself

Hopefully it's just because you are confused and not something less flattering.

[JI7]

37. no, it's a wingnut troll, check it's other posts

[laundry_queen]

38. I suspected as much. nt

[Boom Sound 416]

46. That's the first time

I've been called a troll since I've been posting. So what do I do? Do I defend myself or just not dignify it. I realize I'm dignifying it now, but I keep going in circles.

[HangOnKids]

53. Keep going in circles

It is really amusing. Your luxury stay at home status, watching a trial NOBODY else is qualified to comment on, being pissed because someone dared to say being white is a privilege. This is a hoot. Circles oh gosh darn those circles.

[Boom Sound 416]

55. Luxury stay at home status.

That's a twist. What is a stay at home parent to you?

[Hekate]

97. Those were pretty much your own words in Post #47

47. On the luxury
I'm an acting stay at home parent. I'm not heading to work (or looking for it) like the rest of my world. I'm home with my kids. Yes, it's a luxury.


Nothing wrong with being at home. It's all in how you allocate your time.

[Boom Sound 416]

100. I think I'm missing your point

[Skittles]

107. that is not a big surprise

you're missing it with the trial verdict too

[HangOnKids]

98. Oh Good Gawd YOU Brought Up The Luxury

Please do not ask me to explain your logic. I'm really sorry you are so confused by the words you say.

[Hekate]

96. You are very new

Indeed part of a flood of newbies. Not that we weren't all new once ourselves, but were you redirected here from someplace else? And just out of curiosity, which channel did you "watch every minute" of the trial on?

[Boom Sound 416]

101. Redirected, no

I started reading the site back during the '08 election. Part of my decision process between Hillary and Obama. I also never really had time to dedicate to positing. Now that's changed as I'm a stay-at-home.

I watched the trial online at wftv.com which is a local affiliate in Orlando.

[heaven05]

27. Her

heart is in the right place. Thank you lillypaddle.

[RedCappedBandit]

31. Are you just playing stupid, or are you actually that stupid?

You should be DISGUSTED with yourself for attacking this OP

[msanthrope]

39. Your concern is noted. Please feel free to share more of your concerns and enjoy your stay. nt

[Lex]

50. Whoosh----right over your head. The point, that is. nt

[Boom Sound 416]

56. It must be great to be so smart

Thank god my ignorance insulates me

[ProfessorGAC]

61. You Sewed It. Now Wear It

GAC

[Boom Sound 416]

65. Nice try

Actually it's a pretty weak try from the another member of the enlightened narcissist pile on crew that can't accept the reality of both the trial and the forced narrative

[Lex]

85. Gibberish much?

[vaberella]

63. Oh because she knows White privilege exists in America?!

Which it does.

[Boom Sound 416]

66. Keep it up

Another enlightened member of the guilted

[Thor_MN]

68. Usually, the lone voice is out of touch.

There are exceptions, of course, but when one finds themselves arguing against everyone, it's time for some soul searching.

[Boom Sound 416]

69. Profound

[Thor_MN]

70. It is, isn't it?

[vaberella]

72. Keep what up. I'm stating a fact.

Here's a wake up call:

[Boom Sound 416]

73. I'm not denying inequality

And haven't througout this torrent.

Put the pitchfork down and take a look at what I've written.

But I'll save you a click or two and say it again. Perpetrating white privledge as it relates to the Zimmerman trial is my objection.

[vaberella]

75. Racial profiling because the kid is Black is the issue.

Therefore, if he was white and wearing a hoodie, unlikely he would be profiled. It's similar to saying that Blacks are underprivileged----yet no one talks about the over-privileged. Because if there is an under then there is an over. And this kid was racially profiled, that is undeniable. However, you do seem to be denying it here. And this is the reason i think you need to watch the video in full.

[Boom Sound 416]

78. The only thing that is undeniable

About the whole situation is that it could have been avoided and both share that responsibility.

As to the rest. I think we all agree fundamentally.

[etherealtruth]

77. Oh you poor soul

You don't appear capable of understanding My heart goes out to you.

[Boom Sound 416]

80. Thank you. That was really considerate

Some people you know can be pretty harsh. Thanks for taking time. I know you didn't have to. Wow. I'm just, really thankful

[cliffordu]

87. Not really.

You should.

[duhneece]

104. I'm white, recognize I'm privileged for that 'whiteness'

I recognize I'm lucky that I was born white in this still-too-racist-too-often nation. I did nothing to 'earn' that whiteness.
It's not fair, it's not right, I hate the racism that makes it easier for me to succeed (and even live) than if I was born with black/brown skin.
I agree with the poster that we recognize it was mere luck, mere fortune that we were born into this skin.

I hate that I am privileged for something I didn't do, didn't earn, but I recognize that I am privileged and I will work to change this racist system until I die.

[Boom Sound 416]

105. I guess my struggle is

To feel that way is to perpetuate the notion. Maybe I'm wrong or naive. Trust me its not from a lack of perpective. I guess because I feel we all have hurdles and I see so many people white, black, etc. overcome those hurdles, whatever they may be. On the otherside there are those that use the hurdles as an excuse for failure or to not even try.

Don't get me wrong. Like i said, I know the deck is stacked, but at the same time to extrapolate or compare it to Trayvon's tragedy. Well, so far I just can't.

It could be because I think NBC Miami really put a distorted lens on the situation from the outset. Hell, until i heard the whole call i felt very differently.

[rurallib]

9. At the same time, I am so glad my daughters survived

without some "funny" uncle or an attempted rape or a pregnancy that resulted in a unwanted child.

Not trying to steal your thread - I think about the dangers that are out there for children and teenagers and I am so happy that we avoided the troubles. As a 13 year old I was stalked, jumped and beat up. Never found out who or why. Thank goodness he didn't have a weapon.

Among all the other emotions that went through my mind Saturday was that thank goodness my kids made it through.
We knew a couple of kids that died in my kids classes. So sad.

To lose a son in the way Trayvon died and then to see justice so miscarried. What punch in the gut.

[lillypaddle]

12. Yeah

I have a granddaughter now ... I cry for all the children who hurt. So much cruelty and unnecessary pain. It is overwhelming sometimes.

[RebelOne]

16. I have a 17-year-old grandson, but luckily he is white.

We live in Georgia and I have lectured him about racism. He is 6 foot 2, plays basketball and I am fairly sure he will be able to defend himself in any confrontation that does not involve a lethal weapon.

[lillypaddle]

18. good for both of you

I'm in Georgia, too - Atlanta, to be exact. Best to you both ...

on edit: something silly.

[RebelOne]

33. Thanks. I am just northwest of Atlanta in Woodstock.

My grandson lives in Canton.

[WinkyDink]

20. "All My Sons."

[Hekate]

23. I had a 17 year old son. When he was 16 he got in a big verbal fight with his stepdad...

The two of them had been butting heads for several months, and one morning it was "Fuck you," and "Leave this house," and "Fuck you, I will do that," and next thing we knew his backpack was on and he was gone. I choke up just remembering it.

He wouldn't come back, either, until school started again, and his school meant a lot to him. He lived under a bridge and sneered at older men who offered him $10 or $20 for sex. I made him take his fiercely protective 90-pound dog once I tracked him down. "What am I gonna feed her?" "Well you know where the 50 pound bag of kibble is." "No." "Well then I'm sure you'll figure it out."

Fate made him white, though, and luck gave him a medium-size city to live in instead of a megalopolis like Los Angeles.

I almost lost my boy. Then that fall, back at school, he was in a terrible accident and we almost lost him again.

And now he is 35 years old, married, and a wonderful man. Gets along great with his stepdad. He just needed time to grow up.

Most boys just need time. To grow up. Yes, Trayvon was our child too.

Rest in Peace in the Summerlands, Trayvon, and may your family find the justice you were denied. All you needed was time to grow up, and that time was taken away.

[lillypaddle]

58. Thanks for sharing

[heaven05]

28. your

heart is in the right place. I just know it. Stay as you are. Try to overlook the anger, I feel it's misplaced.

[malaise]

30. Nice post

Rec

[lillypaddle]

59. Thanks, malaise

good to see you.

[LWolf]

48. Every mother's son.

I have 2 sons.

The son who never got in trouble left home after high school to find trouble, and did. He also left trouble behind and became a wonderful man. I am thankful every day that he survived that trouble.

The rebel son continued his rebel ways. He's still a rebel, but a rebel who learned some lessons in self-preservation along the way. Finally. He is also a wonderful man.

My grown sons are my life's greatest blessings.

Every boy who is taken is my son.

[David Zephyr]

49. K&R.

Absolutely.

[Liberal_in_LA]

51. kick

[Omnith]

54. When are you going to understand that race had nothing to do with what happen between Zimmerman and

Martin. The FBI said race was not an issue, but I suppose you performed more investigating then the Federal Bureau of Investigation.

[lillypaddle]

60. Why am I not surprised

2 posts. Signed up to defend Zman? Enjoy your stay.

[ProfessorGAC]

62. Not Really What Any Investigation Concluded

But, you are obviously ok with extrapolating to make a point.

[vaberella]

64. Yes. Because "racial profiling" is not race related.

if unrecognizable.

[uponit7771]

67. This is false, the FBI never said that only wingers are sayin that

[Hekate]

95. Wow. Another newbie. Please proceed.

I think I'll welcome you all individually.

[Rowdyboy]

57. I was a 17 year old son and I was a pain in the ass to my parents.....

I was worse at 18, even worse at 19 and progressively more of an asshole until around 26. That when I apologized to my mom and admitted to myself that she was smarter than me. Its pretty much when I began to grow up.

I won the sperm lottery too-I was a white boy who flirted with drugs and attracted the negative attention of the local police as a teenager. How I skated by is a mystery to me but I did. Otherwise I would have been buried decades ago.

[GTurck]

71. Our sons'.....

are the same age and all you wrote about yours is also true of mine. He is my youngest, we moved to Texas to be close to his children, our only grandchildren. He is a fine husband and father. And is he, and my 13 and 17 year old grandsons, are who I think about in these instances.

[Frytruk33]

74. I WAS a 17 yo son

Seriously OP, your 17 year old son " wouldn't have been able to cope" with an adult approaching him and asking " what are you doing in my neighborhood?" I'm amazed he made it to his 40's. If you had been talking about a 17 yo daughter I would understand, but I was a 5'4" 120lb (small) 17 yo young man once, and I would have had no problem running away from GZ( the fat or skinny version) or physically defending myself from him, and I didn't even have a cell phone. I sure as hell wouldn't have physically assaulted him(I have a hard time believing a coward like GZ would throw the 1st punch, and evidence supports his story of events). Let's get some perspective here folks. This is why assholes like Rush Limbaugh and Ted Nugent call us emotional, knee- jerk reacting, irrational bleeding hearts. Maybe we should try harder not to reinforce ugly stereotypes. I cry harder.

[lillypaddle]

82. Tell it to his parents

tough guy.

[Hekate]

94. One of our flood of newbies weighs in

[mountain grammy]

81. We lived in Houston when my wild son was a teenager.

He interacted with law enforcement many times. He's white. He got to outgrow it.
My second son grew up in Denver. Not Houston but same mindset from law enforcement. He attended a racially mixed high school and had many black friends. The biggest shock to my son; even the black cops were racist.
My sons both got to outgrow their teenage years.

A black teenager doesn't have to do anything to have his life taken.

I honestly do not get the feeling here that so many support this verdict, regardless of their position on gun rights. The outrage in America and on DU is real. The facts are the facts and are indisputable by anyone except the Nugents, Limbaughs and Coulters of the world who are celebrating. I see no celebrating here.

I think we all know that racism won in this case, but the whole world is watching. We won't stay in this place forever. We will continue to move forward.

[disillusioned73]

86. I have a hispanic 5 year old..

right now, and I fear for his future safety.. living in red country PA has been tough lately - the insanity is all around me.. I come here for posts like yours, thank you..

[lillypaddle]

88. Hang in there

[Scurrilous]

102. K & R