what is in the torture documents we didn't already know ?

[NM_Birder]

[NightWatcher]

1. The forced ass feeding was one I hadn't heard of prior.

So there's that nugget of a gem that we did in the name of "Murica"

[NM_Birder]

3. fair enough, I hadn't heard that either. But.....

I guess I should have been more clear.

What, other than some additional gore porn details, are included in the release of the documents ? Overall, (other than ass feeding as you put it) what is different now from then ?

For what it's worth, there are probably numerous as you say "nugget of a gem" details that could be described in as gruesome a detail as possible. How gory does the description need to be, and what is the reason for this release ?

By "what is the reason", I mean what new direction do you honestly think this will take ? Not what you want to happen, what do you think WILL happen with the latest descriptions of torture ?

[marym625]

9. Well now,

They can say, "see how great drones are? We can kill and maim without ever touching anyone. "

[clydefrand]

2. Did it mention

the fact that Cheney personally went to the CIA and talked, in secret, to analysts - not managers or the director, but the workers themselves. Hmmmmmm makes you wonder how much of the torture was 'directed' by Cheney. Guess we will never know.
(I don't think Bush had enough common sense to ever know what was going on even if he was told.)

[NM_Birder]

4. I think we all might be shocked what discussions

take place "in secret".

What is the end game to this release now ?

[99Forever]

6. End game?

Seems pretty clear already.

Evil has won. The spineless will do nothing, because "The Big Club" rules are more important than the Law of the Land or the World. Scratching each others backs is more important doing the right thing.

[marym625]

10. +1000

[NM_Birder]

26. If anybody was going to be prosecuted, they would have been by now.

So I'm curious what the point, reason or "end game" is regarding the additional document release ........now ?

in three weeks, Obama is going to be at odds with a Republican Senate and House. When he had the chance to bring a prosecution into play ........ he didn't. Now that prosecutions are all but a "no way", ..... This is the time to release detailed descriptions of what we already knew ? To what end ?

this is playing political games, .....with consequences to American lives , as well as lives of our allies, for no gain other than a pointless news cycle. This is bait and switch" politics,..... the same kind of crap that cost the Senate and the House.

Whose back is being scratched ?

[LanternWaste]

28. What is the end-game in keeping the truth secret?

"What is the end game to this release now ?"

In three weeks, Senate Intelligence Committee Chairman Dianne Feinstein won't have the committee chairmanship anymore, and the report would then be buried for years. What would be the end-game in keeping the truth secret?

Possibly, she realizes the truth is simply not a game, people worldwide have earned the report's release, and keeping it hidden fuzzy only hurts the US in the long run.

If one argues that its release will hurt people, one should argue even louder that it's the actions being reported that are what actually hurts, hurt, and will hurt people.

[NM_Birder]

29. I think the time to release was back when there was a snowballs chance in hell,

of a prosecution.

Now I'm left asking why didn't it get released then, instead of now ?

[LanternWaste]

30. Moving the goalposts so to speak.

"Now I'm left asking why didn't it get released then, instead of now ?"

You are moving the goalposts so to speak in redefining your question from A (answered) to A&B. I'm rather certain you're bright enough to do a quick Google search to satisfy your query-- but then I imagine the goalposts will be moved again.

1. " was released by Feinstein's committee despite a last-minute pleas from Secretary of State John Kerry and members of Congress not to release the information to the public at this time..."

2. " Feinstein argued, "There's no perfect time to release this report."

3. "Insiders hint that she (Feinstein) had been pressured by members of both parties to sit on the report, but she was reportedly frustrated by a lack of action..."

You, being much more clever than I, can easily find these and many, many more answers to your questions in less time than the four minutes it took me to find these (unless of course, you're simply being disingenuous, and are simply attempting to advance an idiotic meme... and that certainly can't be true)

Have a great day, Tom, Bert or William! (no doubt, it's one of the three)

[NM_Birder]

32. curious,

You are correct, I am a certified google master. But .......
I've tried a conversation with Google in the past,...... and found it unable to carry on a conversation. kinda what I thought a message board was about, you know conversations. If Googling is all that is required, then what's the point of a message board ?


Answered ? OK, justice on the way ! let me keep an eye on google and see what it thinks about the chances of a prosecution.

[LanternWaste]

33. Google doesn't respond well to questions being redefined in mid-sentence.

Google, as well as rational people don't respond well to questions being redefined in mid-sentence when the answer given invalidates a preconceived, simplistic and unsupported bias.

[NM_Birder]

34. This "redefining" of my question as you say,

didn't seem, .... to me,... to be all that difficult to understand, nor comprehend, guess I was wrong, must have been more difficult to follow than I thought.

Meh, just my irrational, and simplistic, preconceived, unsupported biased questions,.......as you so smoothly and effortlessly describe.
With depth like that, I understand why you can't engage my question. I bow to your literary superiority.
Take care.

[NM_Birder]

5. "gues we will never know"

Pretty direct shot to my question. What is the point of this release ?

Do you honestly think anything new so far as prosecutions will come from this release ?

[marym625]

17. I can just picture

That sorry excuse for a human being, watching the torture and becoming giddy.

[marym625]

7. I think it is just in the detail

The overall we knew. I didn't know about keeping it from Powell. And some details obviously weren't known.

I believe that mainstream merikkka didn't know and didn't care. Although I am sure that hasn't changed much because of the report, I hope it has changed a little. Though when people on Fox are congratulating the CIA and Cheney, while saying they hope nothing changes (see how informed they are) I would guess that some that are now aware probably are thrilled about what we did.

Man, just thinking about this sucks. Sick to death of idiocy, ideology and greed winning out over everything else. Just sucks.

[merrily]

8. Let's assume we knew it all and the rest of the world knew even more. And?

[marym625]

11. Another +1000 n/t

[marym625]

12. It seems from your responses on the thread

What you are really asking is, what good does the release of this report do?

Since I could never say it as well, perhaps Lawrence O'Donnell can answer. The "Rewrite" is especially important

http://www.msnbc.com/the-last-word

[merrily]

14. Thanks. If nothing else, the CIA has been all over TV the last few days, getting

questioned, getting exposed, being on the defensive, having to explain itself.

Today, on CBS This Morning, Jose Rodriguez got asked on national TV why he destroyed interrogation tapes.

At the very least, the CIA is finally on notice that the entire government isn't going to cover its ass, no matter what.

[marym625]

15. I hope it's more than that

I hope this government does much more than just not cover for the CIA. I hope that they convict, all those responsible and all those that "just followed orders" and carried out the torture, for war crimes.

[suffragette]

13. Official acknowledgement that these things were done

[Bragi]

20. What's important? Torture happened and produced no intelligence results

We no longer have to debate with torture fans a) whether it happened, or b) if it achieved any positive intelligence results.

Both of these conclusions are no longer disputable, other than by illiterate idiots.

This is a good thing for those of us who care about facts.

[suffragette]

25. Exactly so, Bragi

You said it well.

[Bluenorthwest]

16. I learned that Obama knew about the rectal rape when he was saying 'we tortured some folks'

in an aw shucks, so what sort of way. Don't be sanctimonious about it! I learned that he and Bush, who claim to be massive Christians are fairly comfortable with rape as a device of intelligence gathering. God is in the mix, I thought when I read 'forced rectal hydration'.
I also learned that Bush and Obama use some Bible I have never heard of, the one I read said that anything done to any prisoner is done to Jesus Christ personally. God is in the mix. We tortured some folks.

[leftyladyfrommo]

18. Didn't everybody know this stuff was going on?

I sure figured it was so this report isn't any kind of a real surprise.

War is awful. Horrible stuff goes on every day. We all know it. Regular morality just goes away and all this sick stuff takes over.

Humans are just basically awful sometimes.

[Bragi]

21. Your lame apologetics are pathetic

Seriously, think about what you wrote.

This report shows that Americans representing you broke international and national laws by engaging in dreadful, inhuman crimes, and then tried and failed to cover up their crimes.

And all you can do in response us to wring your hands while bleating: War us hell, ain't it awful.

[leftyladyfrommo]

23. No. What I was saying is that we all knew that this was happening.

Nobody did anything to stop it when it was happening.

Were you actually surprised by this report? Honestly?

Were you around after Viet Nam? Jesus. We were throwing live people out of helicopters. Why on earth would you think it was going to be any different this time. Especially with someone like Cheney running things? Seems like war is a time when all the worst people in the world get in charge of stuff.

[Bragi]

24. Evidence matters

You should applaud the report, since we now have evidence, not speculation, about what happened. Evidence matters.

[NM_Birder]

27. Evidence amounts to squat, unless something is done with it.

if no charges were filed before, during the last release, what has changed to force them now ?

[Iggo]

19. Ah! I've been waiting for an "old news" post.

Thanks.

[Bragi]

22. A pathetic response indeed!

See my comment above.

[951-Riverside]

31. It is old news.

We knew they were doing this stuff a decade ago just like we knew they were raping children in Abu Ghraib but the thing is nothing is done and no one is ever held accountable.

All that happens is we go out and march while being herded like cattle by the police or we sit at our computers like dumb animals and feign outrage on internet forums, facebook and twitter OR sign some stupid online petition at change.org that goes nowhere and say "well, something is better than nothing".