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upaloopa

(11,417 posts)
Sun Jan 4, 2015, 01:17 PM Jan 2015

This may be not the right place for this, but are the forums only for one side of a discussion?

This discussion thread was locked as off-topic by SYFROYH (a host of the General Discussion forum).

Is dissent not supposed to be a part of the forum? If so why is there a forum? If all you want is a place where everyone will agree with you and where you can criticize those who don't without any replies from them why not have your own blog why do we need a place like that here?

I guess I don't understand.

Like he OBG group criticizes those who are critical of OB but they don't want to hear from those they criticize.

24 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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This may be not the right place for this, but are the forums only for one side of a discussion? (Original Post) upaloopa Jan 2015 OP
you mean dissent in the first line el_bryanto Jan 2015 #1
I noticed that too. If they don't expect or want any opposing views then why post an OP GoneFishin Jan 2015 #2
Because PowerToThePeople Jan 2015 #9
Or Andy823 Jan 2015 #3
I've never seen any DUer OrwellwasRight Jan 2015 #10
You're joking, yes? Recursion Jan 2015 #11
Actually, you made my point. OrwellwasRight Jan 2015 #22
Not true, I use it all the time it represents the entire umbrella of corporate friendly conservative TheKentuckian Jan 2015 #21
You call people that name? OrwellwasRight Jan 2015 #23
I think it depends on the specific one? Erich Bloodaxe BSN Jan 2015 #4
This message was self-deleted by its author belzabubba333 Jan 2015 #5
Groups versus Forums: the forums are meant to allow for dissent and discussion, some groups, too. NYC_SKP Jan 2015 #6
They are still subject to the DU jury system, Ms. Toad Jan 2015 #13
That's a fact. No place is safe from a jury. NYC_SKP Jan 2015 #14
groups are not forums and are run differently belzabubba333 Jan 2015 #7
There are forums and groups. Assuming you meant "BOG" for "OBG"... Recursion Jan 2015 #8
Factual criticism should always be in. Falsehood never. Places to only praise are not forums, but on point Jan 2015 #12
"Factual criticism should always be in. Falsehood never." Nuclear Unicorn Jan 2015 #17
I agree with that. Discussion should leave both sides wiser on point Jan 2015 #19
Yep. treestar Jan 2015 #15
I've been banned from a group because of my outspokenness SheilaT Jan 2015 #16
You don't go into a vegan group and praise hamburgers. OKNancy Jan 2015 #18
We have an OB/GYN group on DU??? madinmaryland Jan 2015 #20
Locking aikoaiko Jan 2015 #24

el_bryanto

(11,804 posts)
1. you mean dissent in the first line
Sun Jan 4, 2015, 01:19 PM
Jan 2015

But I largely agree with the sentiment. The problem is that everybody on this board has an issue or two which they feel is black and white. If they see disagreement, that disagreement is evidence of bad faith.

To take an extreme example, we surely wouldn't tolerate someone arguing that blacks are inferior to whites - we would (rightfully) shout down such a person and ban them. There are other issues, which might well seem open to discussion for you, but for some one at DU they are the equivalent of claiming that blacks are inferior to rights, and should be treated equivalently.

Bryant

GoneFishin

(5,217 posts)
2. I noticed that too. If they don't expect or want any opposing views then why post an OP
Sun Jan 4, 2015, 01:20 PM
Jan 2015

that is guaranteed to attract them?

 

PowerToThePeople

(9,610 posts)
9. Because
Sun Jan 4, 2015, 01:30 PM
Jan 2015

"Your user name"

Those threads/posts fish for responses in kind to get those responses hidden. Do this enough times and the voices that stand up against what you are positing are banned from the board for 90 days.

This is the goal of such posts.

Andy823

(11,495 posts)
3. Or
Sun Jan 4, 2015, 01:20 PM
Jan 2015

Like the anti Obama, democratic party group that has only one way of seeing things, and if you don't agree you are an "authoritarian", Obama bot, "turd way", etc.

OrwellwasRight

(5,170 posts)
10. I've never seen any DUer
Sun Jan 4, 2015, 01:38 PM
Jan 2015

use the term "turd way" except those who claim it has been used against them.

OrwellwasRight

(5,170 posts)
22. Actually, you made my point.
Sun Jan 4, 2015, 08:50 PM
Jan 2015

In not one of those posts was one DUer calling another DUer, "Hey, you are turd way." No DUer has been called 'turd way' in any conversation I have every been in, though plenty of Third Wayers claim to have been called "Turd Way" and I have been in many of those conversations, because I am a progressive, and I have never seen it. We criticize DLC, New Dem, and Third Way as a failed philosophy that is killing the party. But you want to fail to acknowledge that it is a real issue.

Instead, you seem to want to call yourself a victim of name-calling, which I did not find on your links.

I think if any post like that existed, it would be hidden by a jury as in appropriate.

TheKentuckian

(25,035 posts)
21. Not true, I use it all the time it represents the entire umbrella of corporate friendly conservative
Sun Jan 4, 2015, 05:24 PM
Jan 2015

Democrats including Third Way but certainly not exclusive to it bringing in New Democrats, Blue Dogs, DLC, No Labels, or what have you. It is the ideology of the turd, waste to be flushed into the sewer.

OrwellwasRight

(5,170 posts)
23. You call people that name?
Sun Jan 4, 2015, 08:54 PM
Jan 2015

Or you simply use the term to describe the failed pro-corporate philosophy? Because there is a difference, and I don't think the corporate types are the victims they claim to be. I have not seen one post where one DUer calls another DUer a "turd."

Obviously, I have not read all posts on DU. And don't claim to. But I have never seen that term except when the DLCers say. "oh we're the victims, you're always calling us names like Turd Way, woe is us."

I'd rather debate the issues and not hear how put upon the poor New Dems are.

So that is my experience and what prompted my post.

Erich Bloodaxe BSN

(14,733 posts)
4. I think it depends on the specific one?
Sun Jan 4, 2015, 01:21 PM
Jan 2015

Or is that groups only? You mention forum, then jump down to BOG (group), so I'm not sure if you're using them interchangeably, and I thought there was a technical distinction between the two terms.

Response to upaloopa (Original post)

 

NYC_SKP

(68,644 posts)
6. Groups versus Forums: the forums are meant to allow for dissent and discussion, some groups, too.
Sun Jan 4, 2015, 01:25 PM
Jan 2015

Protected groups are run as hosts see fit and are allowed to block members who don't toe the line.

Not sure what you mean by "OBG group" and "OB" but if you mean the BOG then you should know the history.

On DU2, the Barack Obama Group languished and nearly died due to over moderation. It was forbidden to go there and vent, it drove off a few members.

On DU3, the BOG and other safe havens are allowed to call out other members, complain about DU, and do other things that were formally disallowed.

One might say it's gone from one extreme to the other, but I like the way the BOG is run.

I'm not delighted, in contrast, to how hosts manage a couple of the safe haven groups, but that's their business.

You take your chances, what hosts might not hide or block, juries might.

Ms. Toad

(34,188 posts)
13. They are still subject to the DU jury system,
Sun Jan 4, 2015, 01:47 PM
Jan 2015

So if you run to a group to "call out other members," or "complain about DU," being in a safe haven group won't save you from having your post hidden.

(On the other hand, if you wander into a safe haven group and violate the rules of the group, juries are likely to hide your posts - even if they would be perfectly acceptable elsewhere.)

 

NYC_SKP

(68,644 posts)
14. That's a fact. No place is safe from a jury.
Sun Jan 4, 2015, 02:00 PM
Jan 2015

And hosts are prohibited from locking except based on SOP, but if they want to they can abuse that rule.

DU2 is filled with abuses by hosts and by juries, the only "higher court" is the ATA, where Skinner has consistently ruled that, Oh well, you take your chances.

I'm not sure why the OP is concerned, it's pretty much the way it goes. In fact, the post is subject to being locked as a whining or meta post.

 

belzabubba333

(1,237 posts)
7. groups are not forums and are run differently
Sun Jan 4, 2015, 01:27 PM
Jan 2015

Recursion

(56,582 posts)
8. There are forums and groups. Assuming you meant "BOG" for "OBG"...
Sun Jan 4, 2015, 01:27 PM
Jan 2015

the Barack Obama Group is, not surprisingly, a place for supporters of Barack Obama and not the appropriate place to criticize him (that's GD and damn near everywhere else, it seems). Similarly, posts critical of Warren will not last long in the EWG, criticism of Sibel Edmonds will not last long in the "Sibel Edmonds" group, and praising Microsoft won't do well in the Open Source/Free Software group.

Forums, on the other hand, are much more open to differing views so long as they are within the fairly broad terms of use.

on point

(2,506 posts)
12. Factual criticism should always be in. Falsehood never. Places to only praise are not forums, but
Sun Jan 4, 2015, 01:43 PM
Jan 2015

alters.

Nuclear Unicorn

(19,497 posts)
17. "Factual criticism should always be in. Falsehood never."
Sun Jan 4, 2015, 02:21 PM
Jan 2015

It's the debate that sifts through fact and falsehood. Each side assumes itself to be right. It's only after their assertions are challenged and shown true or not can we be ore certain of who carries the argument.

on point

(2,506 posts)
19. I agree with that. Discussion should leave both sides wiser
Sun Jan 4, 2015, 04:32 PM
Jan 2015

I guess I probably meant already clearly debunked lies meant to poison discussion.

treestar

(82,383 posts)
15. Yep.
Sun Jan 4, 2015, 02:09 PM
Jan 2015

Those forums exist as safe havens. You have GD for the rest. Do you expect to go into the Feminist Groups with misogyny or the AA group with white racist talking points ?

You have GD so what's your complaint?

I'd expect DU to have an anti-Obama group, except for the fact the rule GD.

 

SheilaT

(23,156 posts)
16. I've been banned from a group because of my outspokenness
Sun Jan 4, 2015, 02:15 PM
Jan 2015

against its subject. Don't think that's right, but I get to express my opinion elsewhere, so it's not the end of the world for me. Or even the end of my time on DU.

OKNancy

(41,832 posts)
18. You don't go into a vegan group and praise hamburgers.
Sun Jan 4, 2015, 02:48 PM
Jan 2015

There are many places here at DU and on the net where you can criticize and slam whomever you want.

madinmaryland

(64,934 posts)
20. We have an OB/GYN group on DU???
Sun Jan 4, 2015, 05:02 PM
Jan 2015

Where's it located?


aikoaiko

(34,187 posts)
24. Locking
Sun Jan 4, 2015, 09:52 PM
Jan 2015

The SOP prohibits complaints about DU or in this case a DU group. Perhaps ask your question in Ask the Admins
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