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George Zimmerman is part black. (Original Post) dkf Apr 2012 OP
Oh my... marshall Apr 2012 #1
That doesn't mean he still can't be racist or prejudice. I know a Cuban woman who despises Justice wanted Apr 2012 #2
Dude go one step further...I know Black Cubans who despise White Cubans vaberella Apr 2012 #8
White Cubans despise Black Cubans as well... CherokeeDem Apr 2012 #64
I had heard anecdotally that one of the advances in Castro's Cuba was coalition_unwilling Apr 2012 #89
They say that many of the American Cubans are white looking. craigmatic Apr 2012 #101
Not really Taverner Apr 2012 #134
I believe I stated "vice versa." vaberella Apr 2012 #161
And from living in S Texas Gman Apr 2012 #14
I'm beginning to see that. Justice wanted Apr 2012 #25
Thank you! bearded clam Apr 2012 #166
Isn't it always the whites who say that the blacks are far more racist than any white? zbdent Apr 2012 #56
...and Hitler was part Jewish. eShirl Apr 2012 #3
Thank You. Or like Trujillo of Dominican Republic had a Haitian grandmother... vaberella Apr 2012 #7
And Charles Manson thought he might have a black ancestor treestar Apr 2012 #81
my first thought when I read the OP- Bluerthanblue Apr 2012 #91
I don't care if has has a heritage of being LeftofObama Apr 2012 #4
Right! Cosmocat Apr 2012 #11
The "child" thing is a bit disingenuous pipoman Apr 2012 #24
Your point being? marmar Apr 2012 #35
Referring to a 17 yo as a child is disingenuous.. pipoman Apr 2012 #40
No. It's not disingenious lunatica Apr 2012 #62
We are talking about how he LOOKED that evening. 6'3"? bearded clam Apr 2012 #167
No the hell it's not. Because the law still sees him as a minor. vaberella Apr 2012 #65
A 17 year old is still a minor treestar Apr 2012 #82
"Teenager" would be more accurate, but "child" generates more sympathy. ZombieHorde Apr 2012 #138
A 17-year-old is a child obamanut2012 Apr 2012 #37
A child is generally considered someone who pipoman Apr 2012 #42
Didactic silliness.......Was he out of high school? Was he living independently of his parents? marmar Apr 2012 #46
None of those things define a "child" pipoman Apr 2012 #48
Oh. So pubic hair does. Happyhippychick Apr 2012 #55
Then there are a lot of toddlers committing serious crimes..17 falls in the pipoman Apr 2012 #58
You have just proven my point. 17 year olds are the demographic most likely to commit violent crime Happyhippychick Apr 2012 #60
well, then maybe Georgie-poo should have considered how his victim would be portrayed uncle ray Apr 2012 #88
So when a 9 year old gets her period she's no longer a child. vaberella Apr 2012 #66
clearly that IS what the poster is saying etherealtruth Apr 2012 #157
and none of your contortions define him as anything other CatWoman Apr 2012 #114
I'm getting the feeling that DevonRex Apr 2012 #121
A 17-year-old is a child obamanut2012 Apr 2012 #74
your pointless digression is distracting from the pointless purpose of the OP CreekDog Apr 2012 #129
Young man just doesn't hold the same sympathy. Life Long Dem Apr 2012 #145
Ask Trayvon Martin's mother about that. Vanje Apr 2012 #85
The "black" thing is a bit disingenuous Capt. Obvious Apr 2012 #95
In case you didn't know, people don't like to use the word "boy" DevonRex Apr 2012 #117
17 is still a child to me. MrScorpio Apr 2012 #137
Post removed Post removed Apr 2012 #5
And that means what? Many White Americans today have Black roots. vaberella Apr 2012 #6
I was about to say the same CatWoman Apr 2012 #113
Which part? LuvNewcastle Apr 2012 #9
You are always true to form, dkf Nostradammit Apr 2012 #10
I aim to inform... dkf Apr 2012 #12
But what does this information mean? Tell us? At least what does it mean to you?! n/t vaberella Apr 2012 #13
If you read the entire piece I think you will see a picture with a little more dkf Apr 2012 #19
No it is not nuanced and who besides you and his defense team thinks this is important information? LaurenG Apr 2012 #63
Alas the history of 911 calls, even before this nadinbrzezinski Apr 2012 #107
Yes it does. DevonRex Apr 2012 #119
Oh fine, reading legalese for a proposition nadinbrzezinski Apr 2012 #124
Ugh. DevonRex Apr 2012 #127
Well Zimmerman also has white roots lunatica Apr 2012 #26
eally depends on if the information is relevant, or irrelevant and meant... LanternWaste Apr 2012 #57
"allow us the precise relevance of the information as it relates to the story as whole" Chan790 Apr 2012 #79
What difference does it make? LaurenG Apr 2012 #61
Signal vs. Noise. Chan790 Apr 2012 #73
Ha! LaurenG Apr 2012 #83
Well said... Spazito Apr 2012 #103
Trayvon WAS part white. GeorgeGist Apr 2012 #15
I sincerely doubt the OP will offer anything. Most of his/her posts are in defense of Zimmerman. vaberella Apr 2012 #16
dkf = OMC Dogtown Apr 2012 #20
Sorry but dfk won't have a thing to say to you about that. Rex Apr 2012 #106
This changes everything Capt. Obvious Apr 2012 #17
"black" is as much a socio-political term Anarcho-Socialist Apr 2012 #18
No he was probably perceived as Hispanic. dkf Apr 2012 #22
With that last name nadinbrzezinski Apr 2012 #108
HOLD ON!!! White, now has a look? Hahahaha...Bless. n/t vaberella Apr 2012 #162
Totally not worth responding to LaurenG Apr 2012 #21
This page left intentionally blank LOL cherokeeprogressive Apr 2012 #102
Heh, I changed my mind further down or up.. LaurenG Apr 2012 #120
And in your opinion that makes him non racist? lunatica Apr 2012 #23
Personally, I never saw it as a racial Shankapotomus Apr 2012 #27
The SYG law is fine. LAGC Apr 2012 #34
I agree Shankapotomus Apr 2012 #47
I agree that SYG is stupid, but...... marmar Apr 2012 #39
There was certainly, at the very least, Shankapotomus Apr 2012 #93
I'm not sure what the motivation pipoman Apr 2012 #28
The Black Panthers haven't been involved in this obamanut2012 Apr 2012 #41
Really? They didn't offer a "dead or alive" bounty on Zimmerman? pipoman Apr 2012 #44
No. That was a group called "The New Black Panthers" that have nothing to do with the Starry Messenger Apr 2012 #49
mea culpa pipoman Apr 2012 #50
It's about the institutionalized racism of profiling, ronnie624 Apr 2012 #92
Anyone who refers to the New Black Panthers (all 5 of them) as anything even worth mentioning... CreekDog Apr 2012 #131
My family are minorites TZ Apr 2012 #29
Lol - so now it's St George the biracial altar boy... ananda Apr 2012 #30
My dog is part Alaskan Malamute but he doesn't like Sarah Palin. undeterred Apr 2012 #31
ROFL...you made me piss on myself! Fuck! n/t vaberella Apr 2012 #68
So Al Sharpton DID protest black on black crime?! Go figure... ejbr Apr 2012 #32
Sorry, but who the hell cares and why is that relevant? a la izquierda Apr 2012 #33
Thanks for this explanation kwassa Apr 2012 #90
No worries. a la izquierda Apr 2012 #118
So Jorge is a white, black, hispanic, Peruvian jew Baclava Apr 2012 #36
What an OP to wake up to obamanut2012 Apr 2012 #38
There are no words...n/t vaberella Apr 2012 #69
Seriously obamanut2012 Apr 2012 #76
And...? Iggo Apr 2012 #43
The 'racism' element is institutional. TahitiNut Apr 2012 #45
This has reached absurdities totally undreamed of. Starry Messenger Apr 2012 #51
The least relevant fact yet found! GOTV Apr 2012 #52
Animal control told Zim to buy a gun... Iggo Apr 2012 #59
This bullshit hearkens back to the "One Drop" rule... stlsaxman Apr 2012 #53
I think having a father who was a magistrate had something to do with him getting away with murder. Crowman1979 Apr 2012 #54
Like the OP, that is another irrelevant fact ProgressiveProfessor Apr 2012 #67
so? spanone Apr 2012 #70
So? a young man is still dead. WI_DEM Apr 2012 #71
He also suffers from a dangerous hero complex. Go figure. JoePhilly Apr 2012 #72
I Don't Think Zimmerman Was Any More Or Less Racist Than Your Average American DemocratSinceBirth Apr 2012 #75
So is Herman Cain snooper2 Apr 2012 #77
LOL! n/t ProSense Apr 2012 #98
I see... Just for clarity, what's your point? BklnDem75 Apr 2012 #78
Not enough for racists to see him as black when he's walking down the street treestar Apr 2012 #80
Holy shit!!!! Cali_Democrat Apr 2012 #84
STFW? He still followed an unarmed teen, confronted and killed him rustydog Apr 2012 #86
So? Your point is? Is this sh!t stirring in the "one drop" assumption? myrna minx Apr 2012 #87
Great-grandfather? What a stretch. n/t Gormy Cuss Apr 2012 #94
That makes me part white. ProSense Apr 2012 #97
And it makes me racially mixed Gormy Cuss Apr 2012 #100
my great grandmother wasn't white, so I guess I'm not white either CreekDog Apr 2012 #135
Yet another stupid douchebag race baiting thread - Drudge, Beck, Hannity and Rush shit stirring jpak Apr 2012 #96
We're all part black. Life started in Africa. It doesn't excuse what he did. craigmatic Apr 2012 #99
Thread winner nadinbrzezinski Apr 2012 #110
ding ding ding ding ding jpak Apr 2012 #111
Thank you. DevonRex Apr 2012 #123
And your point is? Arkana Apr 2012 #104
And how does that change the fact that he murdered a kid in cold blood? Rex Apr 2012 #105
Post removed Post removed Apr 2012 #109
This message was self-deleted by its author devilgrrl Apr 2012 #112
This message was self-deleted by its author Cali_Democrat Apr 2012 #125
so it's really black on black crime. I get it. librechik Apr 2012 #115
And? nt MrScorpio Apr 2012 #116
Everyone is free to do their own analysis on what it means to them. dkf Apr 2012 #130
Here's my answer then MrScorpio Apr 2012 #143
Your title was your own creation based on a form of the "one drop rule" CreekDog Apr 2012 #148
Wow, now that is sad. Rex Apr 2012 #163
phew, that gets the white race off the hook! Enrique Apr 2012 #122
I didn't know the "white race" was on the hook 4th law of robotics Apr 2012 #133
Dude, the "white race" is always on the hook. MrScorpio Apr 2012 #136
According to the US Census bi-raclal people have the choice as to declare how snagglepuss Apr 2012 #126
have you ever commented on "black on black" crime? CreekDog Apr 2012 #128
thanks for stepping us through each rationalization you internalize CreekDog Apr 2012 #132
HAHAHA... oh my fascisthunter Apr 2012 #139
Pretty insulting OP. stevenleser Apr 2012 #140
and Strom Thurmond had a black daughter he took care of financially JI7 Apr 2012 #141
And I hear his "Afro-Peruvian great-grandfather" thinks you're a racist bigotted asshat troll RetroLounge Apr 2012 #142
ROFL Cali_Democrat Apr 2012 #149
So what?? Practically EVERY white person in America has black ancesters Raine Apr 2012 #144
The controversy even on this left-of-center forum is "Exhibit A" as to why the hate crime cr8tvlde Apr 2012 #146
This OP is part red herring Bruce Wayne Apr 2012 #147
Zimmerman is black! STOP EVERYTHING!!! A Simple Game Apr 2012 #150
I rarely miss unrec. For this I do. However, is interesting to see who rec'd this, wonder why? uppityperson Apr 2012 #151
OOh some of those names I recognize. vaberella Apr 2012 #160
He is bicultured. Baitball Blogger Apr 2012 #152
why does his race matter? tnvoter Apr 2012 #153
It matters to white supremacists, who are pushing this pinboy3niner Apr 2012 #158
and trayvon martin is fully dead arely staircase Apr 2012 #154
Maybe someone should have told him this varelse Apr 2012 #155
DKF is part asshole as we all are Ichingcarpenter Apr 2012 #156
Sometimes, when we are forming and Rex Apr 2012 #164
I'm curious to your angle JonLP24 Apr 2012 #159
Trying to stir up a shitstorm F5. Rex Apr 2012 #165

Justice wanted

(2,657 posts)
2. That doesn't mean he still can't be racist or prejudice. I know a Cuban woman who despises
Thu Apr 26, 2012, 05:44 AM
Apr 2012

Mexicans. Both are Latino nationalities.


Thinking more--I don't know what to make of this story... Just strange.

vaberella

(24,634 posts)
8. Dude go one step further...I know Black Cubans who despise White Cubans
Thu Apr 26, 2012, 05:57 AM
Apr 2012

(there is some validity there though--especially when I read about how Batista treated Black Cubans) and vice versa.

CherokeeDem

(3,709 posts)
64. White Cubans despise Black Cubans as well...
Thu Apr 26, 2012, 08:14 AM
Apr 2012

I lived in Miami for 10 years and a White Cuban woman who worked in my office told me she could care less about the people left in Cuba...they were all black. Yeah...racism takes a variety of forms. She also hated Puerto Ricans...called them scum.

Fortunately, she was not a good employee and I had to terminate her for cause. While I kept my serious face on as I fired her...my secret happy face was grinning. Karma...


Edited to identify the woman as a White Cuban..

 

coalition_unwilling

(14,180 posts)
89. I had heard anecdotally that one of the advances in Castro's Cuba was
Thu Apr 26, 2012, 09:55 AM
Apr 2012

that racism had been pretty much eliminated. Since this white Cuban was an emigre, maybe it was the racists who fled the island?

 

craigmatic

(4,510 posts)
101. They say that many of the American Cubans are white looking.
Thu Apr 26, 2012, 11:37 AM
Apr 2012

This is mainly because they had all the money before Castro then came here. PBS did a nice documentary on it called "Black in Latin America".

Gman

(24,780 posts)
14. And from living in S Texas
Thu Apr 26, 2012, 06:30 AM
Apr 2012

I can tell you the feeling is mutual from Mexicans toward Cubans. Just because people are Hispanic doesn't mean there is any solidarity. That's a big misunderstanding.

 

bearded clam

(3 posts)
166. Thank you!
Sun Apr 29, 2012, 01:53 PM
Apr 2012

Mexicans towards Puerto Ricans, also. It's the "Black" thing... And Mexico doesn't exactly broadcast their Afro-roots either.

vaberella

(24,634 posts)
7. Thank You. Or like Trujillo of Dominican Republic had a Haitian grandmother...
Thu Apr 26, 2012, 05:54 AM
Apr 2012

That didn't stop his massacre of thousands to millions of Haitians in Dominican Republic around the same time Hitler was having his own massacre on Jews. But I guess that was Trujillo's way of showing love and he most certainly did not associate or consider himself to be part Haitian.

treestar

(82,383 posts)
81. And Charles Manson thought he might have a black ancestor
Thu Apr 26, 2012, 08:47 AM
Apr 2012

The worst racists may often be working out some sort of rejection of themselves. After all, they are often the same ones who think one drop of the undesired blood "taints" the person as the undesired race.

Bluerthanblue

(13,669 posts)
91. my first thought when I read the OP-
Thu Apr 26, 2012, 10:27 AM
Apr 2012

It's been said somewhere that the things that we dislike in others the most are often ones we ourselves, share.

a kind of self-loathing.

LeftofObama

(4,243 posts)
4. I don't care if has has a heritage of being
Thu Apr 26, 2012, 05:50 AM
Apr 2012

purple with pink polka dots. He murdered that child plain and simple!

(responding to the article, not you personally)

Cosmocat

(14,529 posts)
11. Right!
Thu Apr 26, 2012, 06:11 AM
Apr 2012

it got turned into a national clusterscrew because the moron locals did not deal with it properly at the time.

End of the day, the lunatic stalked and executed some poor kid minding his own business.

lunatica

(53,410 posts)
62. No. It's not disingenious
Thu Apr 26, 2012, 08:10 AM
Apr 2012

17 is not a grownup by a long shot. It's closer to being a child than a grown man or woman. Try to think back to when you were 17 and then convince anyone that you were a grown man or woman.

 

bearded clam

(3 posts)
167. We are talking about how he LOOKED that evening. 6'3"?
Sun Apr 29, 2012, 01:54 PM
Apr 2012

Who would think a boy that young could be that tall?

vaberella

(24,634 posts)
65. No the hell it's not. Because the law still sees him as a minor.
Thu Apr 26, 2012, 08:15 AM
Apr 2012

Therefore he is a child. He has no money to support himself, he still bows to the authority of his parents. Hell in order for Trayvon to even go to the 7-11 that night he had to ask permission from his father. What adult has to ask their dad for permission? He is therefore a child and had years and years ahead of him.

I don't understand why you think it's disingenuous...it's disingenuous for you to suggest otherwise.

ZombieHorde

(29,047 posts)
138. "Teenager" would be more accurate, but "child" generates more sympathy.
Thu Apr 26, 2012, 01:35 PM
Apr 2012

When a 17-year-old commits a terrible crime, few call that teen a "child," unless they are arguing against trying minors as adults.

marmar

(76,878 posts)
46. Didactic silliness.......Was he out of high school? Was he living independently of his parents?
Thu Apr 26, 2012, 07:23 AM
Apr 2012

Was he old enough to vote?


Happyhippychick

(8,379 posts)
55. Oh. So pubic hair does.
Thu Apr 26, 2012, 07:40 AM
Apr 2012

He was absolutely a child in that his brain is not fully formed to make adult decisions. In fact a 17 year old is closer to a toddler than an adult in the way they think.

12 year old girls menstruate, they are still children.

 

pipoman

(16,038 posts)
58. Then there are a lot of toddlers committing serious crimes..17 falls in the
Thu Apr 26, 2012, 07:47 AM
Apr 2012

age demographic which is most likely to commit murder. I would just like this case to move forward on the merits of the case without the inflammatory nonsense. Seventeen isn't a "child" in the eyes of the law nor in most people's mind. It is used in this case to make this tragedy seem worse, and the accused to seem more like a monster.

Happyhippychick

(8,379 posts)
60. You have just proven my point. 17 year olds are the demographic most likely to commit violent crime
Thu Apr 26, 2012, 07:52 AM
Apr 2012

and suicide because they don't understand permanence and they lack frontal cortex closures. Hence why they are closer to toddlers than adults.

The only inflammatory nonsense is the kind coming from people who want to pretend that George Zimmerman was in fear for his life from a child who was armed with skittles.

uncle ray

(3,146 posts)
88. well, then maybe Georgie-poo should have considered how his victim would be portrayed
Thu Apr 26, 2012, 09:48 AM
Apr 2012

before he fucking killed him.

oh, and BTW, Zimmerman himself said he thought Trayvon was older when he shot him. apparently even he thinks Trayvon was too young to die.

vaberella

(24,634 posts)
66. So when a 9 year old gets her period she's no longer a child.
Thu Apr 26, 2012, 08:17 AM
Apr 2012

I developed early because I have a pre-existing condition called PCOS I produce more male hormones means hair in certain parts. I had hair at 11...are you saying I was no longer a child?

Because then you're full of crock.

etherealtruth

(22,165 posts)
157. clearly that IS what the poster is saying
Sun Apr 29, 2012, 11:39 AM
Apr 2012

A person that experiences puberty at 9 or 10 is not a child ... a person that doesn't experience puberty until they are 14 remain a child until that time.

Clearly, complete idiocy. We tend to recognize two groups of people: children and adults.

The age of 18 (acknowledging the arbitrariness of this line) is the accepted demarcation.

I can't imagine anyone insisting that Trayvon Martin wasn't a kid ... unless of course they have an agenda.

DevonRex

(22,541 posts)
121. I'm getting the feeling that
Thu Apr 26, 2012, 12:43 PM
Apr 2012

some people might rather see the word boy used instead of child. But we do not use that word for obvious reasons.

obamanut2012

(25,840 posts)
74. A 17-year-old is a child
Thu Apr 26, 2012, 08:33 AM
Apr 2012

At least in the USA.

Someone who legally cannot sign themselves out of school is a child.

DevonRex

(22,541 posts)
117. In case you didn't know, people don't like to use the word "boy"
Thu Apr 26, 2012, 12:33 PM
Apr 2012

when talking about black males. So we use the world child, which still fits, since he was 17 years old.

MrScorpio

(73,604 posts)
137. 17 is still a child to me.
Thu Apr 26, 2012, 01:34 PM
Apr 2012

Hell, I still call my over 18 yet under 25 nieces and nephews "child".

And they always call me "uncle".

Trayvon was still a minor

Response to dkf (Original post)

vaberella

(24,634 posts)
6. And that means what? Many White Americans today have Black roots.
Thu Apr 26, 2012, 05:52 AM
Apr 2012

Like ALL Black Americans and Afro Caribbean peoples have White roots...what does that mean. I'm sure many of the White Power freaks in the US may have some Native American, African, East Asian, Mexican, or all of the above in their "roots" -- yet it means shit in how they are identified in the US and how they themselves. Your post means nothing by and large. Don't justify his actions and find ways to marginalize the racial impact by suggesting he has Black roots.

vaberella

(24,634 posts)
13. But what does this information mean? Tell us? At least what does it mean to you?! n/t
Thu Apr 26, 2012, 06:30 AM
Apr 2012

That's like telling me blood is blue before it becomes oxygenated...Okay and what can I do with that information?

 

dkf

(37,305 posts)
19. If you read the entire piece I think you will see a picture with a little more
Thu Apr 26, 2012, 06:41 AM
Apr 2012

Nuance than charges that it was a racially based hate crime.

LaurenG

(24,841 posts)
63. No it is not nuanced and who besides you and his defense team thinks this is important information?
Thu Apr 26, 2012, 08:11 AM
Apr 2012

In my opionion it was a hate crime, he hated that some stranger was in his "yard" and like a big shot thought he knew better than the police. Not only was it a racist crime it is sexist. Do you think he would have shot a white female with tea and skittles?

DevonRex

(22,541 posts)
127. Ugh.
Thu Apr 26, 2012, 12:53 PM
Apr 2012

Well, at least they haven't snapped shut in protest yet. Good luck finishing it with your sanity intact.

lunatica

(53,410 posts)
26. Well Zimmerman also has white roots
Thu Apr 26, 2012, 06:48 AM
Apr 2012

What's your point? That he can't possibly hate Black people?

 

LanternWaste

(37,748 posts)
57. eally depends on if the information is relevant, or irrelevant and meant...
Thu Apr 26, 2012, 07:41 AM
Apr 2012

"Would you rather not know?"

Really depends on if the information is relevant, or irrelevant and meant simply to minimize the relevant aspects of a story.

Although I am certain that you can elucidate us all and, with the "more info" you supply, you also allow us the precise relevance of the information as it relates to the story as whole...

 

Chan790

(20,176 posts)
79. "allow us the precise relevance of the information as it relates to the story as whole"
Thu Apr 26, 2012, 08:43 AM
Apr 2012

Of course not, it's noise. It has no value; there is no "precise relevance of the information".

It's as irrelevant as the content of Trayvon's Facebook page or the occupations of the witnesses.

LaurenG

(24,841 posts)
61. What difference does it make?
Thu Apr 26, 2012, 08:06 AM
Apr 2012

Seriously why is it important to know Zimmerman's ancestry? Why is this information relevant to you?

 

Chan790

(20,176 posts)
73. Signal vs. Noise.
Thu Apr 26, 2012, 08:32 AM
Apr 2012

When we talk about informatics and even semiotics from a communications standpoint, one of the key distinctions we need to make is that between signal and noise. Signal is that message or content that is relevant, cogent and of value or utility. Noise is the static and piles of irrelevant data intentionally or unintentionally broadcast which muddy the water, make the facts less-clear and distort reality.

More information is not useful when that additional information is of no value or utility. Noise can be incredibly valuable as a tool to the activist or professional however. Bury the opponent's signal in minutia and you can drown them out.

Jeez, they teach that the first week of most communications, marketing and PR programs.

More info is not better info. As my partner always says: "If you can't astound them with brilliance, baffle them with bullshit."

Spazito

(49,500 posts)
103. Well said...
Thu Apr 26, 2012, 11:46 AM
Apr 2012

The OP strikes me as being of the "noise" quality rather than of the "signal" quality. Major noise factor.

vaberella

(24,634 posts)
16. I sincerely doubt the OP will offer anything. Most of his/her posts are in defense of Zimmerman.
Thu Apr 26, 2012, 06:33 AM
Apr 2012

S/he seems to exhibit no real concern over knowing more about Trayvon--except if Trayvon did something to warrant his own death.

 

Rex

(65,616 posts)
106. Sorry but dfk won't have a thing to say to you about that.
Thu Apr 26, 2012, 11:55 AM
Apr 2012

This is programming afterall and your information goes against that programming.

Anarcho-Socialist

(9,601 posts)
18. "black" is as much a socio-political term
Thu Apr 26, 2012, 06:39 AM
Apr 2012

Was Zimmerman ever perceived as "black" in day-to-day life? I doubt it.

lunatica

(53,410 posts)
23. And in your opinion that makes him non racist?
Thu Apr 26, 2012, 06:44 AM
Apr 2012

Trayvon must have been a real threat?

What is your point? That skittles are deadly? That a black teenager with a hoodie is an automatic deadly threat? That Zimmerman is innocent of murder? Really, what's your point?

Shankapotomus

(4,840 posts)
27. Personally, I never saw it as a racial
Thu Apr 26, 2012, 06:52 AM
Apr 2012

encounter. This was always about a young boy encountering stupid. George Zimmerman was just stupid and so is the SYG law.

LAGC

(5,330 posts)
34. The SYG law is fine.
Thu Apr 26, 2012, 07:11 AM
Apr 2012

It offers no protection if you go out of your way to provoke a confrontation as Zimmerman did.

It will be ruled to be inadmissible in court. Watch.

Shankapotomus

(4,840 posts)
47. I agree
Thu Apr 26, 2012, 07:23 AM
Apr 2012

I don't think SYG will or should have any influence on this case.

But I think the SYG law can be taken advantage of and used as an excuse to kill anyone.

For instance, I once walked into the wrong house by mistake because I wasn't paying attention. Can the owner of the house just shoot me? People make wrong assumptions about the activities of other people all the time.

marmar

(76,878 posts)
39. I agree that SYG is stupid, but......
Thu Apr 26, 2012, 07:16 AM
Apr 2012

.....I'm sorry, but if he hadn't been a young black male, I suspect he'd still be alive. He was clearly profiled.

Shankapotomus

(4,840 posts)
93. There was certainly, at the very least,
Thu Apr 26, 2012, 11:15 AM
Apr 2012

an unconscious racial component to it. But most of the tragedy was born out of pure stupidity on Zimmerman's part.

 

pipoman

(16,038 posts)
28. I'm not sure what the motivation
Thu Apr 26, 2012, 06:57 AM
Apr 2012

Last edited Thu Apr 26, 2012, 07:33 AM - Edit history (1)

is to proclaim this a race crime (hate crime). Isn't it bad enough being what it is? Where do these accusations of racism gain their truth? I think the media and racist orgs (like The New Black Panthers) have worked up a bunch of people into a lather about racism, bringing out the "string him up, it'll teach him a lesson" crowd..

Edit for accuracy..

ronnie624

(5,764 posts)
92. It's about the institutionalized racism of profiling,
Thu Apr 26, 2012, 10:28 AM
Apr 2012

not about whether Zimmerman himself was racist.

CreekDog

(46,192 posts)
131. Anyone who refers to the New Black Panthers (all 5 of them) as anything even worth mentioning...
Thu Apr 26, 2012, 01:20 PM
Apr 2012

is probably not the person to tell me what is and isn't important about the story.

TZ

(42,998 posts)
29. My family are minorites
Thu Apr 26, 2012, 06:59 AM
Apr 2012

And sadly a lot of them utter racist garbage. Should that excuse them? No. This is even less relevant than the "he's Latino he can't be racist" bullshit. I'm sorry but people's behavior is not linked to what race they are or aren't. And its also racist trash to assume that since he has that heritage he can't behave badly towards AA's.

ananda

(28,698 posts)
30. Lol - so now it's St George the biracial altar boy...
Thu Apr 26, 2012, 07:03 AM
Apr 2012

That's some orchestrated character remake, I must say.

reminds me of Animal Farm --

Guntoting neighborhood guy good --- Black teenage robbers bad.

See?


ejbr

(5,850 posts)
32. So Al Sharpton DID protest black on black crime?! Go figure...
Thu Apr 26, 2012, 07:11 AM
Apr 2012

What will the wingnuts grasp onto now?

a la izquierda

(11,774 posts)
33. Sorry, but who the hell cares and why is that relevant?
Thu Apr 26, 2012, 07:11 AM
Apr 2012

My sister-in-law is 100% Mexican. And she hates Mexicans. She's joked that we should switch ethnicities. I have been told countless times "Don't go over by that Walmart, that's where all the wetbacks, narcos, and border jumpers hang out." She doesn't know Spanish, nor does she allow her kids to learn it. Yet, I've asked her if her kids will check the "Latino" box, or whatever the hell it's called, when it's time for college.
Her answer, of course, is yes. Ridiculous.

In Latin America, FYI, you are what you identify with. Example: one can be an indigenous person by blood, but in no way identify or be identified as such; case in point with "Mayan" members of the Guatemalan military slaughtering Mayan peasants during the Civil War. Those members of the military likely did not in any way identify with an indigenous ancestry or culture. In many (not all) parts of Latin America, your skin color is really not that relevant. This has a long history that most Americans do not fathom because it's very different up here.
This is especially true of people of mixed ancestry, and especially true of indigenous folks.

kwassa

(23,340 posts)
90. Thanks for this explanation
Thu Apr 26, 2012, 10:22 AM
Apr 2012

I've seen Latin and South Americans who have disliked each other based on country of origin. I've also heard of much discrimination against those of perceived indigenous heritage in different countries. A friend was appalled on a visit to Ecuador by racist statements by his relatives there against indigenous peoples. I've met very indigenous-looking immigrants here who immediately denied having any such heritage at all.

 

Baclava

(12,047 posts)
36. So Jorge is a white, black, hispanic, Peruvian jew
Thu Apr 26, 2012, 07:16 AM
Apr 2012

He still pulled the trigger so the court will have to decide if he's innocent.

TahitiNut

(71,611 posts)
45. The 'racism' element is institutional.
Thu Apr 26, 2012, 07:22 AM
Apr 2012

It's a red herring to constantly narrow the focus of racism on Zimmerman. Clearly, Zimmerman has LOTS of "issues" ... authoritarian, seeing people in terms of "types" and categories, cowardice, etc. But the appalling aspect of this whole sorry debacle is the institutional racism that casually gave Zimmerman a "pass" and failed to treat Trayvon and his family as being worthy of the ordinary concern and respect that would be (unquestionably!) afforded if Trayvon were white.

stlsaxman

(9,236 posts)
53. This bullshit hearkens back to the "One Drop" rule...
Thu Apr 26, 2012, 07:34 AM
Apr 2012

is the defense gonna hold a paper bag next to Zimmermans skin to prove his innocence next?

DemocratSinceBirth

(99,675 posts)
75. I Don't Think Zimmerman Was Any More Or Less Racist Than Your Average American
Thu Apr 26, 2012, 08:33 AM
Apr 2012

But he did a hatbor a suspicion of young black males that cost Trayvon Martin his life and him his liberty. If it wasn't for lax gun laws this tragedy could have been avoided.

BklnDem75

(2,918 posts)
78. I see... Just for clarity, what's your point?
Thu Apr 26, 2012, 08:39 AM
Apr 2012

Are you saying because these roots exist, Zimmerman wasn't really racial profiling Trayvon?

treestar

(82,383 posts)
80. Not enough for racists to see him as black when he's walking down the street
Thu Apr 26, 2012, 08:46 AM
Apr 2012

Also, racism could be his way of avoiding his own black heritage.

 

Cali_Democrat

(30,439 posts)
84. Holy shit!!!!
Thu Apr 26, 2012, 08:53 AM
Apr 2012

You need to email this to Angela Corey. Maybe she'll drop it to a manslaughter charge or maybe even dismiss charges altogether.

This is highly relevant information to this case.

rustydog

(9,186 posts)
86. STFW? He still followed an unarmed teen, confronted and killed him
Thu Apr 26, 2012, 09:14 AM
Apr 2012

Black, White, Brown and any shade or percentage of minority doesn't mean shit.
He killed an unarmed teen for no reason other than the teen being Black...

jpak

(41,706 posts)
96. Yet another stupid douchebag race baiting thread - Drudge, Beck, Hannity and Rush shit stirring
Thu Apr 26, 2012, 11:25 AM
Apr 2012

yup

 

Rex

(65,616 posts)
105. And how does that change the fact that he murdered a kid in cold blood?
Thu Apr 26, 2012, 11:54 AM
Apr 2012

It does not. Wow...that article does everything to help Zimmerman and flat out lies in parts. When will they be doing a 'fair and balanced' story on Martin...you know the kid they let rot in a morgue and the SPD helped cover up the murder?

Fluff stories do nothing but entrench a persons belief that they are right, so thanks for posting it!

Response to dkf (Original post)

Response to Post removed (Reply #109)

Response to Post removed (Reply #109)

 

dkf

(37,305 posts)
130. Everyone is free to do their own analysis on what it means to them.
Thu Apr 26, 2012, 01:17 PM
Apr 2012

If its irrelevant to you then fine.

MrScorpio

(73,604 posts)
136. Dude, the "white race" is always on the hook.
Thu Apr 26, 2012, 01:30 PM
Apr 2012

At least that's what people who try disregard the relevance of white privilege are always telling me.

Right after that, they tell me that it's unfair.

snagglepuss

(12,704 posts)
126. According to the US Census bi-raclal people have the choice as to declare how
Thu Apr 26, 2012, 12:49 PM
Apr 2012

they identify themselves so if GZ identified himself as White then his having Black ancestors is immaterial.

CreekDog

(46,192 posts)
132. thanks for stepping us through each rationalization you internalize
Thu Apr 26, 2012, 01:23 PM
Apr 2012

it's fascinating to watch the progression of ideas needed to maintain your opinion on the Zimmerman case.

 

stevenleser

(32,886 posts)
140. Pretty insulting OP.
Thu Apr 26, 2012, 03:05 PM
Apr 2012

There are self hating people in all the minority communities whether that community is the LGBT community, the Jewish community, Hispanics, women, African Americans, etc., even when someone is 100% part of that background.

It's obvious that Zimmerman had a problem with black people.

RetroLounge

(37,250 posts)
142. And I hear his "Afro-Peruvian great-grandfather" thinks you're a racist bigotted asshat troll
Thu Apr 26, 2012, 03:26 PM
Apr 2012

I have no idea myself of course, it's just what I heard, you know.



RL

Raine

(30,455 posts)
144. So what?? Practically EVERY white person in America has black ancesters
Thu Apr 26, 2012, 03:54 PM
Apr 2012

just this week Ratigan had a guest who was an expert and talked about it. This man had done a study and said KKK memebers have black roots too.

cr8tvlde

(1,185 posts)
146. The controversy even on this left-of-center forum is "Exhibit A" as to why the hate crime
Thu Apr 26, 2012, 04:15 PM
Apr 2012

statute will be near impossible for a fair and impartial jury to determine in this case, IMHO, particularly in light of the article above. It would be easier if GZ had been a member of some neo-nazi group. But then again, he wouldn't have qualified.

Bruce Wayne

(692 posts)
147. This OP is part red herring
Thu Apr 26, 2012, 04:28 PM
Apr 2012

Zimmerman didn't self identify as black. He shot a kid who he thought was black. He felt like he had the right to confront this kid in part because he was black kid. As a result of that confrontation, he shot that kid.

This isn't really about race. It's about Americans' attitudes toward race.

A Simple Game

(9,214 posts)
150. Zimmerman is black! STOP EVERYTHING!!!
Thu Apr 26, 2012, 07:20 PM
Apr 2012

This changes everything!!! No need for an investigation! And certainly no need for a trial!

Zimmerman is automatically guilty of whatever charges are against him. Isn't that how it usually works for black people?

uppityperson

(115,672 posts)
151. I rarely miss unrec. For this I do. However, is interesting to see who rec'd this, wonder why?
Sun Apr 29, 2012, 11:04 AM
Apr 2012

5 members have recommended this thread (displayed in chronological order):

Sienna86 ananda jpak horseshoecrab Queasy Rider

vaberella

(24,634 posts)
160. OOh some of those names I recognize.
Sun Apr 29, 2012, 12:29 PM
Apr 2012

The first, second and third. Huh...they kind of support each other I guess.

Baitball Blogger

(46,413 posts)
152. He is bicultured.
Sun Apr 29, 2012, 11:08 AM
Apr 2012

I said it from the beginning. The question is where has he been getting his indoctrination?

pinboy3niner

(53,339 posts)
158. It matters to white supremacists, who are pushing this
Sun Apr 29, 2012, 11:41 AM
Apr 2012

They went ballistic over media references to Zimmerman as a 'white Hispanic' (they can't abide the idea of his being classified as a 'white' anything).

Initially, white power blogs responded with protestations that, "technically, Zimmerman is a 'mestizo.'" While they take his side, they go to great pains make it clear that he is not one of them. Apparently, the 'mestizo' idea wasn't good enough, so...

Now this.

arely staircase

(12,482 posts)
154. and trayvon martin is fully dead
Sun Apr 29, 2012, 11:14 AM
Apr 2012

what's your point? that he couldn't be racists toward blacks? if so, that is quite naive.

varelse

(4,062 posts)
155. Maybe someone should have told him this
Sun Apr 29, 2012, 11:24 AM
Apr 2012

he doesn't seem to be aware of it. Perhaps a tragic stalking and murder could have been averted if only he had known the truth about himself.

 

Rex

(65,616 posts)
164. Sometimes, when we are forming and
Sun Apr 29, 2012, 12:41 PM
Apr 2012

both holes open up (anus and mouth) our bodies decide we should talk from the opposite end and then BAM out we come. I believe that might be what happened to dfkcbcbc.

JonLP24

(29,322 posts)
159. I'm curious to your angle
Sun Apr 29, 2012, 12:12 PM
Apr 2012

Especially with your numerous posts bemoaning the fixation of race. Anyways, whether Zimmerman is racist or not doesn't disprove that he is if he is. I knew someone who had a grandfather that is black (IIRC, wasn't biologically related) that he pretty much considered the greatest man in the world as he responded to his grandmother's very difficult behavior with love and understanding. Took the worst kinds of verbal abuse and would not react with anger. This was before I knew the prejudices he held even though there were hints I misread like the time he asked me if I would have a problem watching Blazing Saddles which I said I didn't, he said something like, "A lot of white people complain and say 'I thought racism was dead'" I said it satirizes racism he didn't say anything to that but later I found he enjoyed Blazing Saddles because of the racial remarks such as "The sheriff...". Anyways, when I learned of his true feelings I quit hanging around him and it was interesting but not surprising he didn't show his racism in the presence of black people.

Also black people can be racist against black people as evidenced by editorials by Rev. Jesse Lee Peterson which I won't link to the hate site that features them.

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