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Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsGlenn Greenwald blasts Hillary Clinton: “The ultimate guardian of bipartisan status quo corruption”
Salon
2/23/15
Calling Hillary Clinton the ultimate guardian of a broken political system, The Intercepts Glenn Greenwald on Monday lamented that her likely nomination as the Democratic Partys 2016 presidential candidate will prevent a real debate on issues like National Security Agency spying.
...When the leadership of both parties join together as they so often do, despite the myths to the contrary those issues disappear from mainstream public debate, Greenwald wrote, noting that President Obama, House Democratic leader Nancy Pelosi, and House Speaker John Boehner joined forces to block legislation killing the NSAs metadata program after whistleblower Edward Snowden laid bare the scale of the agencys surveillance operations.
That legislation, Greenwald pointed out, was introduced by Tea Party conservative Rep. Justin Amash (R-MI) and liberal stalwart Rep. John Conyers (D-MI), underscoring that the debate boils down more to insider v. outsider than Democrats versus Republicans.....
...Thats why the Dem efforts to hand Hillary Clinton the nomination without contest are so depressing, Greenwald continued. Shes the ultimate guardian of bipartisan status quo corruption, and no debate will happen if shes the nominee against some standard Romney/Bush-type GOP candidate. Some genuine dissenting force is crucial....
http://www.salon.com/2015/02/23/glenn_greenwald_blasts_hillary_clinton_the_ultimate_guardian_of_bipartisan_status_quo_corruption/
SidDithers
(44,228 posts)Sid
Greenwald has received awards including the first Izzy Award for independent journalism, in 2009,[19] and the 2010 Online Journalism Award for Best Commentary.[20] In June 2013 Greenwald became widely known after The Guardian published the first of a series of reports detailing United States and British global surveillance programs, based on classified documents disclosed by Edward Snowden.
msanthrope
(37,549 posts)in April. For money.
I wonder if you will add that to his resume.
Scuba
(53,475 posts)msanthrope
(37,549 posts)raindaddy
(1,370 posts)She speaks in front of Goldman Sachs executives for money!
msanthrope
(37,549 posts)Veilex
(1,555 posts)I wholeheartedly agree.
msanthrope
(37,549 posts)Veilex
(1,555 posts)I'd disagree. I think he should be complaining more. And if HRC wants to expose his supposed corruption, then more power to her.
Either way, I'd rather see a light shown down on it and have it exposed, rather than covered it up. And that goes for anyone in the political spectrum.
deurbano
(2,895 posts)20 years ago... and that somehow makes him the very "LAST" person who should ever complain about Goldman Sachs.
Veilex
(1,555 posts)A friend of mine often says, albeit jokingly, "Don't confuse the issue with the facts!"
There's not a person alive who doesn't own a skeleton or three, and a roomy closet for more.
That Greenwald has so few evident skeletons is telling. Nearly as much as the desire of some to demonize him.
sabrina 1
(62,325 posts)Especially since Bank of America was willing to pay for something, ANYTHING to try to shut him up.
And still, nothing.
The banksters have an awful lot of corruption they'd like to keep from prying eyes... which means going out of their way to silence people such as Greenwald.
sabrina 1
(62,325 posts)campaign. They clearly didn't know him, lol. They said 'these types' meaning Greenwald, or blogges 'will back off' or words to that effect, assuming that when people started attacking him, he go hide somewhere.
Had they just spent a little time reading his blog comments where he was constantly attacked by Right Wingers and watched he seemed to enjoy shredding them to pieces, they might have been prepared for his reaction when he found out what they were up to.
Veilex
(1,555 posts)There's few things more enjoyable than a bully getting served up proper.
But then, I'm the type of person who loves Shane Koyczan's
To This Day Project:
and Troll:
Oh yeah...and this:
http://www.mtv.com/news/2087859/trolls-sjw-laci-green/
sabrina 1
(62,325 posts)blocked them, but he seemed to enjoy taking apart their ditto head nonsense. AND I think he used them to get clicks to his blog and to attract an audience. They had no idea they were helping him! Lol.
His comment sections used to get hundreds of responses which helped him get more views.
They really hated him and he appeared to 'welcome' their hatred.
Thanks for the links, I haven't watched them yet, but will.
kfreed
(88 posts)How about we begin here, Glenn Greenwald is lying about his politics: he's a right-wing Libertarian who smeared left-wing anti-war protesters in defense of the Iraq war:
[ Note: I backed all this up and spread it around, so there will no disappearing act ]
Glenn Greenwald: Unclaimed Territory:
"Friday, November 04, 2005
"The reality of Latin American reaction to Bush
George Bush is here in Latin America this week, visiting Brazil and Argentina, and the standard reports of the American media are trying to depict a handful of isolated, juvenile socialist-organized "demonstrations" as some sort of sweeping, popular mass protest against Bushs visit, thereby suggesting, yet again, that the Administrations policies are flawed because people in other countries dislike Bush. As usual, the truth is vastly different than what the U.S. media is reporting (see UPDATE below) .
It is true that in this region (as is true for the U.S.), there remains a small, fervent band of left-wing fanatics with crazed enthusiasm for the worn-out, socialist/collectivist policies which have condemned millions upon millions of people throughout Latin America to poverty unimaginable to even the poorest Americans. These putative "mass demonstrations" in Argentina and Brazil are, in reality, nothing more than a few isolated spray-painting incidents of trite pacifist slogans in Brasilia, and a Cindy Sheehan-like "rally" of hard-core Socialists in Argentina led by an obese, Castro-idolozing, retired soccer player who found time away from his decade-old cocaine addiction to show up wearing an oh-so-clever t-shirt showing Bush's name spelled with a swastika.
Hardly the stuff of mass demonstrations and popular anti-Bush uprisings, New York Times reports and breathless television correspondents notwithstanding.
In some countries, most notably Venezuela, this vintage left-wing, anti-American fervor is not small, but is predominant, which is what has led that country to be under the repressive thumb of Fidel Castro-copy Hugo Chavez, whose primary interest in attending this Latin American regional summit seems to be to lure Bush and the U.S. into some sort of game of childish taunts rather than doing something constructive to aid his impoverished, unstable country."
http://glenngreenwald.blogspot.com/2005/11/reality-of-latin-american-reaction-to.html
Greenwald is also lying about Ron Paul's fake "anti-war" record and his fake "socially liberal street cred because Ton Paul also happens to be a whacked out Christian fundamentalist who doesn't accept the Constitutional principle of church/state separation. First of all, Ron Paul, like almost everyone else, voted for the Authorization to Military Force in the War on Terror. Second: Ron Paul isn't "anti-war, he's anti-Jew as his white supremacist conspiracy theories indicate (and his racist newsletters indicate):
http://dneiwert.blogspot.com/2007/11/dark-side-of-paul-phenomenon.html
Ron Paul's actual legislative record tells a horrifically grim tale: http://dneiwert.blogspot.com/2007/11/ron-pauls-record-in-congress.html
Note to our Netroots "progressive" mouthpieces. You would have known all of this had you listened to those of us who told you repeatedly that Libertarian Glenn Greenwald is a lying sack and that Ron Paul is a white supremacist. The enitire point of the fact-challenged NSA "reporting" was the total privatization of the NSA. You should know by now not to listen to Libertarians:
"Another David Koch project, Citizens for a Sound Economywhich launched the effort to repeal Glass-Steagall protections keeping banks from gambling in securitieshelped fuel the fight for free trade, an unpopular policy in the 1980s."
http://www.thenation.com/article/alec-exposed-koch-connection/
I could go on... but how long do you want this to be? I could write a book at this point. Don't think I don't know that DU is infested with Libertarians So I don't expect you lying sacks to change your tactics, but I do want to ensure that progressives stop falling for far right BS.
markpkessinger
(8,401 posts). . . very clever sleight-of-hand, there.
Scuba
(53,475 posts)BeanMusical
(4,389 posts)nikto
(3,284 posts)He must be bucking to be the Jonah Goldberg of this board.
IMO, he qualifies perfectly (tee hee).
BeanMusical
(4,389 posts)raindaddy
(1,370 posts)Just as I won't be voting for Hilliary..
thesquanderer
(11,991 posts)Attacking the messenger does not say anything about whether or not the message is true.
Ad hominem attacks are what you do when you can't dispute the facts.
Fawke Em
(11,366 posts)If you argue what HRC did many years ago doesn't matter, then what Greenwald did before he saw the light doesn't matter, either.
Oh - and Warren was a Republican at one time, too.
msanthrope
(37,549 posts)Yo_Mama_Been_Loggin
(108,192 posts)See we both can play that lame assed game.
kfreed
(88 posts)Ron Paul's actual "anti-war" record, not the one Greenwald pretends he has: http://dneiwert.blogspot.com/2007/11/dark-side-of-paul-phenomenon.html
Ron Paul's pro-Wall Street, theocratic legislative record: http://dneiwert.blogspot.com/2007/11/ron-pauls-record-in-congress.html
Ron Paul's racist John Birch Society "New World Order" conspiracy theory video (1998): http://newsone.com/1754815/ron-pauls-new-world-order-conspiracy-theory-video/
History Commons: John Birch Society: white supremacy and other general Libertarian obscenities: http://www.historycommons.org/entity.jsp?entity=john_birch_society_1
Here's another short history, including the whacked Religious Right element: Koch. Ron paul, Phyllis Schlafly, Tim LaHaye ("end times" guru): http://thepoliticalspectator.com/tag/ron-paul/
"she speaks for herself", and of course bush* !!
Enthusiast
(50,983 posts)kfreed
(88 posts)Libertarian Glenn Greenwald and his Koch-funded/white supremacist cohorts on this video here (Cato Fellow Radley Balko):
...want the NSA privatized (for-profit; no public accountability) - so it's a good thing that Democrats don't take his word on anything:
http://shameproject.com/profile/radley-balko/
Koch-funded Reason/another Koch-funded Cato Fellow pushing NSA privatization: https://reason.com/blog/2013/06/12/matthew-feeney-talks-privatization-and-t
"Exposed: How a Lot of the Libertarian Outrage Over Govt. Spying Is Just Shilling for the Private Surveillance Biz"
http://www.alternet.org/civil-liberties/meet-libertarians-spying-free-market
Pro Tip: "Found: Libertarians 'Lying to Liberals Guide Book"
"All of that is stunning enoughand something to keep in mind if you find yourself getting all dewy-eyed as you take your place on the bottom of the "strange bedfellows" at the StopWatching.us rally, topped by such rancid libertarian outfits as FreedomWorks, the Kochs climate denial front Competitive Enterprise Institute, the Kochs new anti-Obamacare Astroturf front Generation Opportunity, Students For Liberty (funded by CIA/NSA contractor Peter Thiel), Ron Pauls Young Americans For Liberty, the Libertarian Party....
[snip]
So yeah, deciding whether or not to join with the libertarian far-right in another "strange bedfellows" coalitionwithout having the politics completely worked out, or knowing what the angles arerequires much more serious thought. Its not merely a facile moral choice, an exam in a school civics class or a Sunday School catechism. In the strange bedfellows coalition to kill the TSA, the Left had nothing worked out beyond their own moral egosand that made them accomplices in a crime against tens of thousands of struggling non-unionized workers, and the untold numbers of passengers who stood to be victimized by for-profit racial profiling.
The Left willed themselves into self-protected ignorancebut if the TSA was privatized, and replaced with airports run by private racial profiling contractors, it would be at least as much the fault of the leftist dupes who fell for the anti-TSA idiocy.
So this Saturday, as leftists join hands in righteous ignorance with their libertarian strange bedfellows to protest government surveillance, the rest of us will have to wait and see what the more sophisticated and cynical libertarian-right has planned to take advantage of today's anti-NSA outragewhat opportunities does it create? Already some are floating the idea of completely privatizing the NSA more than it already has been. I think we can assume theyve already got a program worked out, and that its not something any of us would like. Until that time, heres an idea for a counter-protest movement: "StopKoching.us" no strange bedfellows allowed."
https://www.nsfwcorp.com/dispatch/lying-to-liberals/
Scuba
(53,475 posts)So, is he wrong or just someone we shoudn't like?
sabrina 1
(62,325 posts)'distract, smear, look over there' tactics, at this point only make people take a closer look at the subject of these tactics.
He is absolutely correct regarding the broken system in this country.
Which is why he is now looked to for his informed opinions by people who actually care about these issues.
Thanks to you and Sid for helping me find this OP btw.
msanthrope
(37,549 posts)sabrina 1
(62,325 posts)Lol, hoping people won't read beyond that are you?
msanthrope
(37,549 posts)sabrina 1
(62,325 posts)Oops, in the interests of not risking being 'pithy' like O'Reilly let me add something of substance to this discussion.
Greenwald is one of the best and most courageous journalists in this country today, and thankfully has survived all the efforts to smear and destroy him, mainly because he tells the truth.
There, no O'Reilly 'pithiness' for me. I prefer 'substance' to 'pithiness'.
The only place I ever heard that word was from O'Reilly btw. Gave me a bad taste for it.
Veilex
(1,555 posts)Add to all that, a wonderful saying: "If you have enemies, it means you stood up for something." Clearly Greenwald has enemies... and I, for one, am glad for it. There's enough corporate sycophants in our politics as is... the last thing we need is another one vis-à-vis HRC.
George II
(67,782 posts)Veilex
(1,555 posts)Living, breathing, writing and making commentary enough to elicit response from an array of people...and in general, having an impact.
sabrina 1
(62,325 posts)Why don't you search the site and you will have an answer to that question that has been asked and answered here numerous times.
It won't work as a smear as his reasons for being in Brazil are very legitimate unless you don't think Gays should have the same rights as everyone else.
Maybe Skinner should pin the answer to this despicable attempt to smear someone who is gay, at the top of the forum so we don't have to keep repeating the reasons why.
George II
(67,782 posts)....do NOT try to pin the crappy "despicable attempt to smear someone who is gay" on me, you are WAY off base. You know nothing about my background, family, surroundings, or position on that issue.
Edit - further information:
Greenwald used the fact that the Defense of Marriage Act prevented him from returning to the United States.
However, Attorney General Holder announced four years ago from yesterday, that President Obama considered the DOMA as unconstitutional and directed the Justice Department to stop defending the law in court.
Further, the United States Supreme Court in 2013 declared the DOMA unconstitutional.
Greenwald's reason (aka "excuse" for not living in the United States hasn't existed in practice for four years, and hasn't existed in law for almost two years.
Trying to use his bogus reason for not living in the US (even while he continually takes pot shots at the country of HIS citizenship) to accuse me of a "despicable attempt to smear someone who is gay" is even more despicable.
sabrina 1
(62,325 posts)try to discredit Greenwald. His reasons for being there have not changed. Obviously he loves his partner and is not going to leave him.
I am sick to death of this 'question' being used as a smear. If you don't want people to make assumptions, and I assume you WERE trying to discredit the man, then attack him on the substance of his WORK, not his personal life.
It isn't against any law to live where you choose to live, that I know of, and has zero to do with his work.
If you have any criticism of his WORK, then offer it, but these constant personal attacks on messengers grew old long, long ago.
All it says is that his work is unassailable, so let's go after him personally.
Which is EXACTLY what the Anonymous leaks revealed about HB Gary, the 'private security' corp that was bidding on a SMEAR CAMPAIGN against Liberal organizations, AND Greenwald.
Their emails revealed they were 'searching' for some 'personal' stuff to smear him with. Such as 'where his children go to school'. Disgusting, to think that these weasels are making MONEY to smear people simply because they DARE to threaten their 'employers by TELLING THE TRUTH.
Bank of America I believe was the potential 'contractor' for the Greenwald smear campaign.
I guess someone else got that contract after HB Gary was exposed for the dishonest, for profit smear merchants that they are.
George II
(67,782 posts)It was not my reason, or anyone else's reason, it was HIS.
sabrina 1
(62,325 posts)I don't know him personally, don't know the intimate details of anyone's personal relationships. Maybe his partner doesn't feel comfortable moving to a country that views HIS partner as a 'traitor' for reporting on issues of importance.
I'm sure Greenwald considers his partner before making decisions FOR him.
We saw what happened in London where his partner was detained wrongfully under the Terrorist Act.
He is safer where he is, clearly, where he can freely move around without being arrested for 'terrorism'.
However, his reasons are his business, not yours or mine.
His WORK is our business, nothing else.
Veilex
(1,555 posts)http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Glenn_Greenwald
Added emphasis is mine.
The Government wants to prosecute Greenwald as an example to other whistleblowers.
In other words: Shut them up and shut them down.
Thespian2
(2,741 posts)for taking the time and expending the effort to stand up to people who are several sandwiches short of a picnic. I am with you all the way!
sabrina 1
(62,325 posts)I know that many DUers have simply put those who spend their time here personally attacking Liberals, on ignore. I understand their reasons, but I also think that so many of them are on ignore now that they are under the impression people do not disagree with them.
I don't get the hatred for some of the people who are doing the most work, risking so much themselves, to protect this Democracy. It certainly never was the case that some of the targets of this hatred, were ever anything but deeply admired by Liberals until relatively recently.
So how is it that so many credible reporters, it isn't just Greenwald, suddenly became 'not credible' once Bush was gone?
Greenwald has expressed his opinion on the reason for that sudden 'change', and that is another reason why they hate the man, because he exposes the hypocrisy and tells the truth no matter how inconvenient it may be.
Thespian2
(2,741 posts)we can, for we have a large investment in TRUTH. Makes many people squirm. I will keep listening, thinking, writing...hoping that one day we can save America from the Greedy Bastards who now own it.
LiberalLovinLug
(14,176 posts)"All it says is that his work is unassailable, so let's go after him personally."
Well retorted. I too am getting sick of these posters scraping and clawing for any personal quibble they can find to deflect the conversation away from his work or the implications of Snowden's revelations.
They use three methods easy to see:
1. Red Herring...Like this time, But but but but he lives in Brazil! (Snowden lives in Russia fer gawds sake!) We can't possibly take serious anything that is said from outside our borders!
2. Straw Man...Start the argument off by predefining the characters...Greenwald is a pretentious asshole, he just wants fame and fortune, or he is a stone cold Rand Libertarian. I guess they do this to justify their following diatribe which is then colored with some form of: "why would you ever listen to someone like this? Obviously everything someone with this kind of character is not to be trusted"
3. Personality flaws...Anything they can find to paint him as not a perfect human being. Or anything different, like where he lives, his sexual preferences, gawd forbid his is ever snappy to a reporters questions!
The same can be applied to their tired predictable reactions to Snowden, Manning and Assange.
sabrina 1
(62,325 posts)on Liberal Organizations for smear Campaigns, couldn't find a thing. HB Gary was bidding on that contract when Anonymous leaked their emails. And we got a real look into how these smear campaigns are done.
For Greenwald, eg, they 'suggested' that 'we find out where his children go to school' and 'what Church he attends' also 'who his wife is' etc etc
For this kind of grade school level 'work', apparently they get paid MILLIONS.
HB Gary probably lost the contract after the embarrassing exposure, but SOMEONE got it.
How do I know? Because the level of the 'work' is about as low as HB Gary's.
And if they paid millions for this, they were robbed.
Apparently no one who dares to speak their minds on politics, as they have a right to do still in this country, including us DUers is too insignificant for them not to smear.
They go around searching for your comments, then in that 'third party' tactic they use, they post links to years old comments, implying there is something nefarious in them. Hoping people won't click the links, because of course, there never is.
But it gives you an idea of how hard people work to try to smear innocent people who are doing NOTHING other than not agreeing with them.
Another tactic is to post made up stuff, 'What do you have to say aboutGreenwald supporting bigot' eg, in the Title Box. The hope is that people won't read beyond that.
Why are they so desperate, is what I want to know. If their candidates are so great, then they should have nothing to worry about.
BOA definitely has stuff to hide which is why, in their desperation they hired a 'security contractor' to try to smear jounalists and even bloggers.
msanthrope
(37,549 posts)DisgustipatedinCA
(12,530 posts)Now where have I run into that exact topic recently? Oh yeah...it was you getting your feelings bent out of shape when I let you know that using the word "credulous" in place of the word "credible" completely changed the meaning of your statement. But this one must be different because of the reason you'll provide in your reply below.
sabrina 1
(62,325 posts)us Liberals who are capable of absorbing more than the one line sentences his Fox educated followers are unable to do, and whose eyes are likely to glaze over after the fifth word in a sentence!
Clinton, in his opinion, was 'long-winded' not 'terse' or 'pithy' like him!
msanthrope
(37,549 posts)pick a fight.
Later on, I'll be on other threads--will you follow me there?
sabrina 1
(62,325 posts)who are, in his limited capacity brain, 'long-winded, you know like Clinton eg, because they tend to use more than one sentence at a time, which apparently he can't handle.
OilemFirchen
(7,143 posts)I am going to compile all those Right Wing smears against Liberals and post them so that people instantly recognize them and avoid using them so they do not run the risk of ever being associated with those for whom they intended for to use against Liberals.
Are you now, or have you ever been, an etymologist?
sabrina 1
(62,325 posts)who seem to follow me around, collecting my comments, and reposting them, apparently in the hope that there is something I have said on this forum that would be embarrassing.
It's been tried so often now, I'm beginning to wonder, is there some secret place where people are collecting DUers' comments, searching, as HB Gary was doing, for SOMETHING, ANYTHING to try to undermine him with? And FAILED because when you have nothing to hide, you have nothing to worry about.
That's an AMAZING find you have there. I probably wouldn't have been able to find it myself if I tried, so thank you.
Because every word of it is true. Many of us were there when these 'words' and 'phrases' were compiled to use AGAINST LIBERALS, both by right wing think tanks AND by the Third Way think tank.
I am reminded of those days when we discovered the source of these verbal attacks on Liberals, when I see these words dredged up here by a few people.
And yes, one day when I have the time, I WILL compile a list so that other people can recognize them AND know the sources.
Exposing the tactics of the right, helps arm people against them.
I am FOR people being armed with the knowledge of WHO they are dealing with and there is no better way to do that, than to watch for their Think Tank 'talking points for liberals'.
Did you have something you wanted to say TO me? The third person tactic is another one that tells me a whole lot about a person.
Eg, if you were so deeply concerned about that old comment, why did you not address ME and ask what I meant? I would have been very happy to respond to you.
Doing what you just did, that is another tactic I will add to that list when I get around to writing it down.
OilemFirchen
(7,143 posts)sabrina 1
(62,325 posts)Number23
(24,544 posts)OilemFirchen
(7,143 posts)Such angst and vituperation over a Rambler! I could understand if the poster had actually owned one...
Hey, look what I found:
http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=2067969
Narrative? Narrative? Ya know who uses that world ALL THE TIME?
Sean Hannity.
The nerve!
sabrina 1
(62,325 posts)Is that old has been still around?
Who knew there were people here who pay so much attention to old right wing hacks like Hannity, they even know what 'words' he uses 'all the time'.
Well, that explains a lot!
And that was a terrific thread!! There is nothing funnier than people who don't know when they are being played. People got so many laughs out of that. You guys should lighten up, you might see when people are just having fun with you!
OilemFirchen
(7,143 posts)You listen to Bill O'Reilly? Golly!
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10026272319#post89
89. That's Bill O'Reilly's favorite word, 'pithy', describing how 'terse' he is as compared to Liberals
Another for your list. Use it in good health:
sabrina 1
(62,325 posts)hacks.
I learned about old Billo's use of the word 'pithy' from Al Franken among other great Dems who constantly went after the old 'combat hero'.
Didn't have to, and couldn't stand to franlky, tune in to any of these morons.
Others did it for us back then, so 'we didn't have to'.
Hannity isn't even on the radar of anyone important, unlike O'Reilly who was a constant target of great Democrats like Franken.
So HIS, Hannity's, garbage is known only to those who actually listen to the moron.
Nice try though. I'll give you that.
My advice to you is to just turn off those idiots. They tend to cause people to end up not being interested in issues, but in going after LIBERAL DEMS.
See your comments in this thread eg.
I have noticed that those who spend their time here attacking Democrats never do discuss the issues. They attack PEOPLE.
This thread is a perfect example.
So let's try to not allow Faux to influence this thread anymore and stick to the topic of the OP.
What is Greenwald wrong about? You know, NOT his personality or anyone else's here, the ISSUES he raised in the OP.
And remember, only Faux viewers ignore CONTENT and focus on PEOPLE.
OilemFirchen
(7,143 posts)sabrina 1
(62,325 posts)ISSUES.
Keep on truckin' and thanks AGAIN for a perfect demonstration of my point about Rush/Hannity/O'Reilly viewers.
Btw, why you do so dislike Democrats on this forum?
Number23
(24,544 posts)sabrina 1
(62,325 posts)You have no idea the laughs we had over that thread!
Sometimes things are just too easy!
Never figured it out, did you?
Number23
(24,544 posts)rofl guy grows more the more you realize how completely and utterly pwned you've been by somebody.
So please keep up the really stupid denials and the stalking of this thread. It's really proving the point that you didn't have your ass handed to you then. For like the 5 billionth time.
sabrina 1
(62,325 posts)And stop STALKING ME. I've asked you before to ignore me, as have others I've noticed.
My posts are not meant for you. You really didn't have to read them.
They are for the majority of DUers here, whose opinions I respect.
I'l go with the opinion of the MAJORITY here, and continue to address them in a manner they are capable of reading and understanding.
If your only purpose here is to 'pwn' DUers, you're not doing a very good job of it.
No one seems to have noticed.
Have you ever posted at the cave btw? Something familiar in your comments related to something someone sent me about two years ago.
Never mind, I really am not interested where you post.
I hope you refrain from talking to me through your third party method from now on. I have no interest at all in communicating with you, as I have told you before.
Number23
(24,544 posts)And yes, I mean EVERYONE here knows your MO. You think you're not obvious?
And no one has asked me to ignore them. That's something else that you've pull out of your hindquarters. I am the one who had to REPEATEDLY ask you to ignore me. And seriously -- please, GOD don't stop doing so now.
sabrina 1
(62,325 posts)my 'MO' as you call it. But if you say so! Lol! Everyone agrees with me, I like that!
I and others HAVE asked you to stop speaking TO them/me and making false statements about them/me by using a third party to do so.
I won't say 'everyone' because that would be a bit hyperbolic, but a majority of DUers are very familiar with THAT MO and have asked you to ignore them.
Number23
(24,544 posts)I was thinking "oh my god! For the first time ever this one didn't have to have the last (incoherent and rambling) word" but you have of course proven me wrong.
Darling, you can try to spin this any way that you like. I was the one who REPEATEDLY asked you to buzz off and leave me be. And then you bafflingly started telling me to stop responding to you when a) I would NEVER waste my time and b) if you'd done WHAT I WAS ASKING YOU TO DO that would have been the end of everything. I'm only responding to you now because of your WELL KNOWN propensity for slinging crap and twisting the truth, which you are trying to do now.
As for others asking me to leave them alone, please put up or shut up. Lord knows, I've seen countless people telling you that they refuse to engage you, will not answer your asinine questions, just laughingly respond with emoticons to your 8-42 paragraph screeds or just flat out tell you to go away. And I laugh my ass off every time I see it. Which is to say, that I laugh ALOT.
sabrina 1
(62,325 posts)Yes, a poll would be the best way to sort this out. That way DUers could speak for themselves, rather than you speaking for them.
And I'm so sorry it took me so long to get back to you. I had so many other people to respond to. Got here as fast as I could.
And those here, who are incapable of reading more than two or three lines, are people I would never want on my side. That would make me wonder what I was doing wrong.
I am grateful for all the support I get here from the majority of DUers, for whom I DO have respect.
I am more than happy with the 'haters' you refer to.
Btw, do you know anyone named 'Karin'?
Number23
(24,544 posts)So utterly and totally and completely expected from you. Like I said, you fool NO ONE.
sabrina 1
(62,325 posts)I wouldn't even think of trying to fool people which 'everyone' knows. So again, thank you.
Definitely a poll is needed to let DUers speak themselves. You really should stop trying to speak for others, other than the small group I am happy to have as 'enemies'.
Do you know anyone named 'karin'?
Number23
(24,544 posts)years here.
PUT ME BACK ON IGNORE or whatever you were doing that spared me your inanity for those blissful, wonderful months that I had it. Please GOD put me BACK on ignore and be gone.
sabrina 1
(62,325 posts)once again, chose to lie about me to a third party. I told YOU I would correct any lies told about me even if that tactic was used to try to avoid a response.
So here's my standard response to your not so unique personal attacks, do not lie about me to third or fourth parties, because I will correct those lies. Just forget I exist and you will not get any attention from me whatsoever. It is not hard to ignore you unless you choose to use your particular brand of personal attack. THEN I will respond and correct you.
There is nothing I would like better, and I know for a fact this sentiment is shared by so very many other DUers, than not to have any interaction with you at all.
I notice you have not said whether or not you know anyone named 'karin', but don't bother, I want no interaction with you at all which I have told you before.
BlueCaliDem
(15,438 posts)against a Democrat - on DEMOCRATIC Underground - and won't hold him to the same strict standard they hold both President Obama and Secretary Clinton. It's NUTZ.
How do they expect us to read anything they say - even when justified - against Secretary Clinton without a pound of salt??
Bugenhagen
(151 posts)nt
sabrina 1
(62,325 posts)Greenwald is all about issues. And the sooner every Democrat, like Feingold, and Sherrod Brown among others, begin to focus on issues rather than politics, this country will finally get the changes it so badly needs.
Blue_Tires
(55,445 posts)And what "issues" are Greenwald about other than self-promotion and enrichment?
MADem
(135,425 posts)kfreed
(88 posts)Can't you tell? Learn to speak tea bag. Read their BS Tea Party/Libertarian blogs and websites, sign up for their email lists, and you'll get the hang of it in no time. That way when you see them using the talking points/lingo put out by the Koch network, you'll not mistake them for liberals.
After 7 years I'm fluent in teabag I can pick them out of a lineup at a thousand paces... blindfolded
BlueCaliDem
(15,438 posts)These "DUers" attack Obama, excoriate Hillary Clinton, fawn abundantly over Glenn Greenwald, Snowden, white supremacist/fascist Assange, and are now 110% behind Bernie Sanders.
These people claim (although no one believes them) that their attacks of President Obama is a way to "keep his feet to the fire" but then they're childishly intolerant of even the tiniest criticism of the GOP's preferred candidate for the 2016 G.E. - Sanders - and quickly alert on that post and getting it hidden. This tells me all I need to know about them. These usual suspects no longer enjoy the benefit of the doubt from me, and they shouldn't from any other Democrat (or as they call them, "Party loyalists", because, you know, Democrats being united is a BAD thing - for Republicans, that is) who is concerned about the SCOTUS and about this country.
nikto
(3,284 posts)sabrina 1
(62,325 posts)joshcryer
(62,276 posts)There would be at least 20 posts about it. Hundreds of recs.
wildbilln864
(13,382 posts)99Forever
(14,524 posts)Speaking truth to corrupt power. Excellent.
DesMoinesDem
(1,569 posts)sabrina 1
(62,325 posts)MrMickeysMom
(20,453 posts)Enthusiast
(50,983 posts)uhnope
(6,419 posts)I was much younger then
Progressive dog
(6,918 posts)all that needs to be said about Greenwald's opinions for pay.
grahamhgreen
(15,741 posts)MADem
(135,425 posts)who supplies the bread and butter, too!
sabrina 1
(62,325 posts)that.
MADem
(135,425 posts)sabrina 1
(62,325 posts)funds our elected officials and then expect 'favors' from them in return.
I guess all the people who work for Walmart should not take their stipends or be accused of some kind of nefarious deeds.
Journalists have to eat so if he can extract some money from the bad guys while defending the good guys, that's fine by me.
But taking money from Wall St, that IS a problem as we have seen so clearly.
MADem
(135,425 posts)OOOOOH, Walmart!!
You'll need to "guess" better than that. Hell, Walmart was decades before a certain progressive 'firebrand' last voted Republican (and even though I've never voted for a Republican, I got over that "transgression" and voted for the firebrand in question).
If you've got to go back that far, you've not got anything.
Wall Street gives money to both sides. And the other team's haul makes Dem pickings look lean. Dems from NY tend to do a little better than from some other states, but their take is anemic compared to the GOP. Nice try, no cigar.
GG has made MILLIONS off ES. He schlepped a book about him, he has a piece of that film, and he has all that Guardian dough. The Koch money is pure pay for play--he's going to show up at a conservative organization funded by Koch, run by that nutty Allen West, at a lecture series named after a pro-lynching racist, and he's going to speak to, and be applauded by, a bunch of insane conservatives who are slightly to the right of Attila the Hun. This is a matter of record, and it is not the first time he's done it. He and the Koch lads go back a long, long way (see CATO Institute--put his name in their search engine and you'll get pages of hits). It's not a marriage of convenience. It's an ideological love match. He thinks like they do, and he gives them what they want--for this, they pay him. Quite well, most likely.
We provide sources:
http://postonpolitics.blog.palmbeachpost.com/2014/11/07/allen-west-leaving-florida-to-head-dallas-based-think-tank/
http://www.ncpa.org/events/glenn-greenwald
sabrina 1
(62,325 posts)take money from Goldman Sachs who can influence policies.
And my reference to Walmart was that private individuals, those who work on a daily basis, are taking money from one of the worst Corporations in the country. Should they quit their jobs so as not to be viewed as you would like us to view Greenwald?
But now that you mention it, yes, Hillary was on the board of Walmart. She seems to get how bad that is on her record though now that she's contemplating a run for the WH.
She has made a point of using Costco, a far more progressive Corporation as a back drop for one of her book signings I believe.
Not impressed much by people who make wrong decisions then try to appear to be making better decisions when it's already too late. Like her Iraq War Vote.
We need leaders who get these things right the first time. A vote like that was so important, a good leader should have know right off the bat they were lying. WE KNEW. And if she didn't, what kind of judgement is that?
Anyhow, Greenwald ISN'T running for anything, so he's free to do whatever he chooses to do.
MADem
(135,425 posts)And collecting his pay for it. He's very cozy with these libertarian and right wing think tanks.
Uh, YOU mentioned that Hillary was on the Walmart board--not me. And that was back when my Senator (Warren) was stupidly voting for Republicans. She sure didn't get THAT right the first time (or the first few decades as a voter, for that matter). People can change. Some do.
Some, like Greenwald, keep going back to the Koch well.
Yo_Mama_Been_Loggin
(108,192 posts)The guy who when on Bill Maher's show endorsed Rand Paul.
Autumn
(45,120 posts)Comrade Grumpy
(13,184 posts)truebrit71
(20,805 posts)...in either case he's not wrong...
RiverLover
(7,830 posts)laundry_queen
(8,646 posts)tridim
(45,358 posts)And no Glenn I'm not voting for Rand Paul. Ever.
Fumesucker
(45,851 posts)RiverLover
(7,830 posts)grasswire
(50,130 posts)sabrina 1
(62,325 posts)the Bush era.
2banon
(7,321 posts)I wanted so badly for him to run for POTUS, then so disheartened when he lost hist Senate seat, but it wasn't unexpected. Russ Feingold threatened TPTB's precious Golden Goose aka the National Security State, (which just keeps laying more and more golden eggs vis a vis Homeland Security).
Greenwald is spot on..
DeSwiss
(27,137 posts)sabrina 1
(62,325 posts)pennylane100
(3,425 posts)I believe that Clinton is our only hope for the White House. I did think of one such person, Russ Feingold. I believe he is thinking of running for senate in his own state but that could change.
Regardless of all the negatives liberals find in her, she would at least protect women's control of their own bodies and I am pretty sure she would support Obamacare, medicare and social security. That is more than any current repug candidate would offer.
The only other candidates to do that would be Bernie Sanders. who is thinking of running as an Independent. which would not be good if it split the democratic vote. My personal favorite is Howard Dean but that is a non starter. I really believe that Elizabeth Warren is not going to run and what I thought was a lighthearted poem about it got me into a lot of trouble so I will just say that I believe she really does not want to run.
Alan Grayson would make the contest very interesting and quite entertaining but I do not think he will run nor do I think he could run, but I would vote for him if he got the nomination. Does anyone one else have any suggestions of viable candidates that we could get behind if we do not think it should be Hiliary.
CoffeeCat
(24,411 posts)Hillary Clinton ran in 08, and all it took was a junior Senator to knock her off her "anointed" block.
It really didn't take much.
Support for her is lukewarm, at best, in the Democratic party.
She's too much of a neocon. Her banging the war drum for Iran, while Bush was President--nearly sent me over the edge. She knows damn well what these neocon bastards are up to. They all asked her husband for war with Iraq when he was President. Then-President Bill Clinton refused. She can't pretend not to know.
She's a corporatized powerbroker.
I hear next to nothing from her about policies that matter.
If she's our nominee, I will be politically homeless. I wish her well, but I do not want her as our nominee at all.
And, "But do you want Jeb to win?!?!" is a pretty pathetic response. We MUST nominate someone else!!!!
Scuba
(53,475 posts)TBF
(32,090 posts)be sent to Malaysia.
TPP sucks.
RiverLover
(7,830 posts)Very well said. Thank you!!!
wildbilln864
(13,382 posts)sabrina 1
(62,325 posts)randys1
(16,286 posts)So we work tirelessly to get somebody else to be the nominee...
Agreed.
And if we are unsuccessful?
kristopher
(29,798 posts)...Dems will lose.
randys1
(16,286 posts)in that case.
DemocratSinceBirth
(99,711 posts)It would stand everything we know about mid term and presidential elections on its head.
Dems to Win
(2,161 posts)Low turnout elections are won by the Repubs. I can't imagine a more surefire recipe for the lowest turnout election in history than a Clinton - Bush mashup. Disgusted anti-dynasty voters will stay home in droves.
NYC Liberal
(20,136 posts)And Obama was far from just some random junior Senator in 2008. He was a nationally-known figure with name recognition and had been for nearly four years by the time he ran. Saying "It really didn't take much" contradicts what really happened. In actuality, the primaries in 2008 were tooth-and-nail and contest to the very end. We didn't have a nominee until June; McCain clinched the Republican nomination 3 months earlier in March.
I support Hillary Clinton because not only is she a liberal, she is tough as nails, she's a fighter, and she will do whatever it takes to combat the right-wing assholes of this country. She also has the support of some other great Democrats, like Elizabeth Warren and Howard Dean.
If you think there's a better candidate who is not only a liberal like Hillary, but who also has a viable chance at winning, let's hear it.
betterdemsonly
(1,967 posts)CanadaexPat
(496 posts)What do you think will change in the future?
Yo_Mama_Been_Loggin
(108,192 posts)Rudy Giuliani won the NY Senate race against her.
Try again.
MrMickeysMom
(20,453 posts)Every time I read another, "Do you want Jeb to win?", spines curl up a little more Pretty soon they'll all be Mr. Loopner.
BeanMusical
(4,389 posts)Very true.
closeupready
(29,503 posts)Period. I also would say that I don't have strong feelings about her, except that she is NOT a candidate I can support.
Katashi_itto
(10,175 posts)840high
(17,196 posts)zeemike
(18,998 posts)When the American people are presented with a repeat of a Clinton or a Bush they will just stay home...because it reinforces the notion that the game is rigged to make sure no change is going to happen...and many of them had voted for change in Obama and were disappointed with the results. Now they will be asked to go back to what they rejected before.
If the Democrats don't offer someone we could have faith in to change things the Democrats will lose...as they did in the last election.
red dog 1
(27,849 posts)if he gets in the 2016 race.
http://www.upi.com/Top_News/US/2015/02/09/Sen-Bernie-Sanders-considers-a-run-for-president-in-2016/4891423514119/
I agree that his running as an Independent would split the Democratic vote; and I hope he doesn't do that
I, too, like Rep. Alan Grayson (D-FLA), who is a "populist" like Elizabeth Warren.
Grayson also is very wealthy, and could spend his own money running against a GOP opponent.
He would make a great VP candidate.
He's very smart & would probably win any VP debates against a Republican.
mopinko
(70,208 posts)i have never seen that reported. i have heard him say, w my own ears, that he wants to run to prevent a coronation.
if he runs i have no doubt it will be as a dem.
sabrina 1
(62,325 posts)is going to 'crash' the party and by now, he's probably figured out since he has sent many signals, that they are not going to ask him.
They have chosen their candidate, that appears to be a fact in spite of the opposition of many voters.
Maybe they don't mind losing. They sure didn't try very hard to win the mid terms.
After all the work people did to get them the House, Senate and the White House, it's pretty damn disgusting to watch them lose it rather than support candidates who are most likely to win.
Progressives won in the mid terms. Their Third Way candidates lost. It's not as if the voters didn't tell them in the last mid terms.
So what are we to think? If you want to win, you do what you know it will take to win. But that would mean handing the party back to those who most represent the PEOPLE over CORPORATE interests I suppose. .
MADem
(135,425 posts)My God if you run for president, youre going to need a gazillion dollars, Sanders said. I will not run for president if I cant do it well and if I cant run to win.
Read more: http://www.politico.com/story/2015/01/bernie-sanders-billionaire-class-114747.html#ixzz3TIxHWYNu
MisterP
(23,730 posts)act like Dems. Blue links at 11"
uponit7771
(90,363 posts)... yeah... fuck him.
Be glad when Hillary wins and the rights head explodes
pennylane100
(3,425 posts)sabrina 1
(62,325 posts)Greenwald lives in Latin America and his partner is Latino.
At this point they are just making stuff up they are getting so desperate.
pennylane100
(3,425 posts)It seems like there are more hostile exchanges these days. It does not make sense. What happened to the "We can agree to disagree" mentality. I was looking at the the snarky comments in this thread. In another thread, one poster suggested I go piss on a rope because I had the nerve to disagree with his assessment of my comment. This place is getting to be more like a wingnut hangout. However, keep up the good work.
sabrina 1
(62,325 posts)'wingnuts' or there are wingnuts here pretending to be Dems trying to divide the party. Some have been shown the door, but not before spending way more time here than they would have in the past.
I know that the Third Way thinking is very similar to wingnut thinking when it comes to the Left. And I know that these supposed Dems whose Think Tank now determines the policies of OUR party, did invent many of the insults, words and phrases, intended for the LEFT.
DemocratSinceBirth
(99,711 posts)Citation
sabrina 1
(62,325 posts)Where do you come up with this garbage?
But keep doing what you are doing, it is most likely the reason for Greenwald's unprecedented success as a journalist.
Put it this way, when I see comments that have zero basis in fact, aimed at a journalist, a politician or any public figure, I assume that who ever is uttering them, is not the side I want to be on.
So, yes, keep up the good work!
uponit7771
(90,363 posts)Capt. Obvious
(9,002 posts)bigwillq
(72,790 posts)SoapBox
(18,791 posts)Oscar's didn't you enough time in front of the camera, eh?
sabrina 1
(62,325 posts)Can't tell from your comment.
As for creds, a Pulitzer AND two Academy awards, British AND US, says you couldn't be more wrong. Oh, and a Directors Guild award also.
What are your 'creds' that tell us we should give credibility to your opinions?
JonLP24
(29,322 posts)Fabrications (Latinos?) -- behavior that further proves his claim.
sabrina 1
(62,325 posts)he lives in Brazil and his partner is Latino. I guess you can live in a country you 'hate' and love someone you 'hate' or something??
Do they just make this stuff up as they go along? And WHY? Clearly the objective is to SILENCE him. That was HB Gary's theory, when on the contract to smear him, and other Liberal organizations.
They suggested digging up information on Greenwald, such as 'where does he to to Church, who his wife might be, where does SHE go to Church. His children, if any, what schools do THEY go to?
THIS is what they hoped to get paid millions for. Clearly then knew nothing about him, just that he was writing FACTS about Bank of America.
I have to say, I thought that if you got paid millions for something you needed to have some standards. But reading the HB Gary emails was amazing. It was like some 12 year old kid trying to get someone to pay him money if he said 'bad things' about someone else.
And THIS is how this country is run, from top to bottom it appears, in the political world. STUPID smear campaigns, and if they can't find anything, twist what they know, make it up, whatever it takes.
But what stuns me the most is that it DOESN'T work. So what is the purpose?
'Greenwald hates Latinos' ~ Amazing, in the depth of dishonesty.
JonLP24
(29,322 posts)that he couldn't be with because of the courage from the highest powers in the world to expose the issues that concern us all -- People more angry with those that expose the "dirty laundry" of government officials than the people with the dirty secrets have their priorities out of wack.
I'm reminded of the Sociopath-apath-empath triangle once again.
sabrina 1
(62,325 posts)in the pursuit of power and money, IF they ever had any.
But it's our fault also, we enabled them in many ways. The Left when their 'team' was in power, the right when it their 'team', ignoring often things that should not have been ignored.
I guess it takes a while to figure it all out, and when your 'team' is being attacked sometimes you are blind to everything other than defending them.
And those in power know this. So now I wonder, are all these 'battles' between right and left STAGED to keep the little people busy fighting each other, and too busy to notice what they are up to?
It did work, for a while. But I see a huge shift on all sides away from the 'team' game as people ARE waking up and realizing how much of their democracy they have allowed to be stolen from them.
And there are fewer enablers now. Not yet enough perhaps to bring about change, but far more than there were just a few years ago.
Tierra_y_Libertad
(50,414 posts)Ambitious, power hungry, and unprincipled.
"History has tried to teach us that we can't have good government under politicians. Now, to go and stick one at the very head of government couldn't be wise." Mark Twain
RiverLover
(7,830 posts)blm
(113,091 posts)Since I'm a well known non-fan of HRC's larger record, I'd like to hear your full review of Rand Paul.
msanthrope
(37,549 posts)RiverLover
(7,830 posts)That was easy. That's the first one that popped up with a search. Don't have time for more.
blm
(113,091 posts)Well
.guess we'll have to wait and see how much love has been lost, eh?
DisgustipatedinCA
(12,530 posts)blm
(113,091 posts)GG's disappointment in Paul last month may have an expiration date.
We'll see, eh?
LiberalLovinLug
(14,176 posts)Whereas others learn to learn and advance their thinking.
Snowden realizing his opinions of "leakers" was presumptuous when faced with his conscience and what would happen if he just let what he found out go and remain silent. Same can be said for Chelsea Manning.
Greenwald who has skirted with many political points of view but that has evolved to take the best from all and not be beholden to any particular party.
Even Obama can "evolve" in his opinions about gay marriage, Warren can change from a Republican to a Democrat, but lord help the increasingly unhinged stubborn authoritarian soldiers that will cling to their never changing biases and talking points that were carefully crafted by the corporate media for them.
blm
(113,091 posts)Couldn't possibly be any reason at all for not blessing GG with 100% fealty, eh? Pretty stubborn of you to insist any lack of fealty to GG has to be a corporate media narrative and couldn't have anything to do with personal distrust of some of his political motivations.
BTW - As a longtime corpmedia critic, I am absolutely certain that their narrative has never been mine, that GG's motives are suspect because they are usually directed personally against Obama and that he is a Rand Paul fan. You are welcome to prove me wrong, of course. Please do. But, I, for one, would challenge the corporate media to lay out and scrutinize the entirety of GG's positions, including his flawed indulgence of Rand Paul. You know that will never happen, but, it is just SO easy to claim that any conclusion that doesn't match yours must belong to corporate media and NOT from a comprehensive observer.
LiberalLovinLug
(14,176 posts)But you mirror their hand wringing about the dire consequences of actually informing the public of the lies about citizen wiretapping, especially if it was revealed using not-so-legal methods from a whistleblower. And by extension, the journalist that published his revelations. At the very least you are catering to the same tactics of personal destruction in order to dampen the message as the corp. media.
What "political motivations" can you be distrustful of?. He's a journalist, he's not running for office. Putting aside for a moment the very real human reality of maturing and evolving on political positions, as far as I'm concerned a good journalist should be knowledgeable with all political positions. And they should not have blinders on for just one party ie. Fox News & Repukes. If he agrees with certain platforms of the Libertarians, or of the Democrats, or even of the Republicans...what difference does that make on the credibility of his award winning journalism? This messenger bashing should be, frankly, beneath anyone that cares about transparency, accountability, especially in regards to our elected officials.
Do you agree with stopping spending MIC money on wars of aggression? How about ending the war on drugs? Rand Paul and his father both believe these positions. You too...may be a Paulite! What exactly are YOUR "political motivations" for agreeing with them on this, if you do?
But what do say you to the GG twitter post here, in response to Rand voting to cut funding to the Palestinians: "Rand Paul is a panderer and a fraud"
https://twitter.com/ggreenwald/status/552831600199995392
doesn't sound like he has any kind of exclusive "fealty" to him.
blm
(113,091 posts).
LiberalLovinLug
(14,176 posts)And putting not only politicians but journalists as well through some kind of purity test.
You have strange bedfellows. You use any praise he gives for selective Ron Paul positions and paint him as a Paulite. You imply he has been 'a real long time' in the Paul camp exclusively. Which is totally untrue. Like a good journalist he makes himself familiar with many political points of view.
Meanwhile the Right use any affiliation with more left of center groups to paint him as a Marxist.
http://www.aim.org/aim-column/glenn-greenwald-regularly-attends-marxist-leninist-conferences/
The article ends with:
The evidence of Greenwalds involvement with the international Marxist movement puts his attacks on the NSAs terrorist surveillance programs in a new light.
But will those who jumped on the Snowden bandwagon reevaluate their support for him now that the involvement of Marxist groups and hostile forces in Snowdens cause has become impossible to ignore?
blm
(113,091 posts)I do not.
Move on.
LiberalLovinLug
(14,176 posts)If its a matter of trust. Yes I'd trust a Pulitzer Prize winning journalist and an NSA whistleblower who is paying a huge personal price over government voices that have been proven liars. Clapper had to return to Congress and basically say he lied the first time, and that Snowden revealed the truth, which was published by Greenwald, and that indeed the NSA was in fact collecting mass data on American civilians.
Sorry for hanging on to the thread, but I just don't get folks like yourself. I suspect that your irrational distrust and dislike have nothing to do with his past or even present agreements with a few positions of the Libertarians. After all, most Dems share those views as well. So I haven't a clue where you are coming from.
Marr
(20,317 posts)sabrina 1
(62,325 posts)he was a supporter of Rand Paul? Have you ever read his work? Greenwald has always supported Democrats like Russ Feingold, and has many friends among Dems in Congress. Where is all this made up nonsense coming from?
Yo_Mama_Been_Loggin
(108,192 posts)From him saying so on Bill Maher's show a few months back.
sabrina 1
(62,325 posts)stand to even look at Bush the Lesser, but I did support what he said once about immigration. It angered his supporters so much, so that was a bonus. But no way could anyone say I 'supported Bush'.
blm
(113,091 posts)that his VERY recent outburst in disagreement with Paul is all that matters.
sabrina 1
(62,325 posts)I just don't understand why there is a need to put down others IF you yourself are confident that you are on the right track and have nothing to hide.
What IS it they are so angry about? What are they trying to cover up? Greenwald is doing what journalists do, telling the truth to the best of his ability, about matters of great interest to the American people.
The ONLY reason anyone would object to the work he does, is if they have something to hide.
Renew Deal
(81,871 posts)BeanMusical
(4,389 posts)YoungDemCA
(5,714 posts)Blue_Tires
(55,445 posts)Greenwald sure does burn up a lot of energy talking about them instead of his home nation of Brasil...It figures that he'd have nothing else, after his pissy-whiny public breakup with Rand Paul; but seriously -- Does Brasil not have it's own political system worthy of coverage? Or is this another quid pro quo deal that he has with the power brokers in Brasilia?
RiverLover
(7,830 posts)OKNancy
(41,832 posts)Blue_Tires
(55,445 posts)truebluegreen
(9,033 posts)Blue_Tires
(55,445 posts)DisgustipatedinCA
(12,530 posts)As many bookmarks as you maintain on Greenwald, you should have already known he was a citizen.
Blue_Tires
(55,445 posts)I don't want some ivory-tower multimillionaire celebrity journalist who only comes to the states to make speeches and probably doesn't even fucking vote telling me who I should or shouldn't vote for
deurbano
(2,895 posts)Blue_Tires
(55,445 posts)Maybe he'll open his fucking eyes sooner or later to the corruption and human rights abuses going on down there and God forbid he start writing about that...
Of course even the "fearless" Mr. Greenwald who always speaks truth to power knows he's getting a bullet through the dome if he starts kicking over the wrong rocks down there -- So yeah...In retrospect it's much better for his health to bravely play it safe and just keep telling the world how inept and evil America and specifically the Beltway Democrats are, and how there are less press freedoms here than in Russia...
deurbano
(2,895 posts)that Greenwald wrote extensively about Libya in 2011 (and as events have unfolded, his concerns seem to have been justified) in response to your comments on his recent piece about the Libya situation, when you called him a "Monday morning quarterback" who never says anything before or during a crisis, but writes an "I told you so" piece later.
Blue_Tires
(55,445 posts)Please let me know when Greenwald grows a sack big enough to turn his investigative eye towards Brasilia...
OKNancy
(41,832 posts)Hillary Clinton has spoken out that she IS for reform
That was an important and challenging task that he took on, Clinton said.
Clinton has previously signaled some support for NSA reform, alluding this summer to changes that needed to be made in order to secure that privacy, that constitutional right to privacy that Americans are due, hastening to add that she views it as a really difficult balancing act.
http://www.salon.com/2014/10/21/hillary_clinton_makes_big_statement_on_nsa_spying/
--------------------
Then we have the well-respected Guardian reporting: http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/jun/18/hillary-clinton-overhaul-nsa-surveillance-powers
Former secretary of state calls for the restoration of constitutional privacy protections weakened after 9/11 attacks
Hillary Clinton has thrown her weight behind political efforts to rein in US surveillance powers in her most forthright criticism yet of the National Security Agency (NSA).
The former secretary of state, who has hitherto largely stayed out of the debate sparked by leaks from NSA whistleblower Edward Snowden, called on Congress to restore constitutional privacy protections weakened after terrorist attacks on the World Trade Centre.
"We are finally taking stock of the laws that we passed after 9/11," she told Fox News interviewer Greta Van Susteren. "We did all of this in an a hurry because we were worried and scared and now we need to take a step back and figure out how we make sure that the balance between liberty and security is right."
Dems to Win
(2,161 posts)Hillary: "We did all of this in an a hurry because we were worried and scared and now we need to take a step back and figure out how we make sure that the balance between liberty and security is right."
It was never, ever reasonable to limit our constitutional freedoms and make war on the entire world as a response to 9/11. The Patriot Act and AUMF 1 and 2 were horrible mistakes made by fearful people. So how about we don't look to the people who voted to authorize those catastrophic mistakes when we're trying to dig ourselves out of this hole?
Draft Barbara Lee!
Congresswoman Barbara Lee never voted for rights-abusing laws like the Patriot Act or stupid wars like the Afghanistan, Iraq, and drone wars just because she was worried and scared.
As Democrats, let's elevate the wise woman who has proven she can maintain her principles even in hectic, scary times.
Barbara Lee for President 2016
Number23
(24,544 posts)Which is particularly remarkable when you consider the really complimentary things he's had to say about RON PAUL over the years. RON PAUL.
And that's just the tip of the iceberg with that man, his shiny new honorary Oscar notwithstanding.
geek tragedy
(68,868 posts)equality, and climate change.
elias49
(4,259 posts)geek tragedy
(68,868 posts)Not ideal, but no one who's electable will be.
betterdemsonly
(1,967 posts)Her loss actually helps them in four years. She is Martha Coakley the second as far as I am concerned. I am willing to sacrifice to shake out the the corruption in Government.
geek tragedy
(68,868 posts)That's asinine, to the point of being a troll.
If she loses in 2016, that means Republicans control both houses of Congress plus the Presidency and the Supreme Court.
betterdemsonly
(1,967 posts)and got a much better candidate later on. It was assinine for establishment dems to support Lieberman over dem nominee Ned Lamont but they did it anyway. http://www.cbsnews.com/news/bill-clinton-campaigns-for-lieberman/
geek tragedy
(68,868 posts)betterdemsonly
(1,967 posts)I am honest about only supporting progressives and the establishment are dishonest about being pragmatists when in fact they are conservadems, who'll vote for republicans and idependents over the dem nominee if the dem nominee doesn't support the war.
geek tragedy
(68,868 posts)still_one
(92,394 posts)They obviously don't care about the makeup of the SC, which effectively will set the course of the country for the next decade.
The good news is, most Democrats and progressives will vote for whoever the Democratic nominee is
Some of the sentiment on DU is definitely not reflective of most Democrats, so let them spew away. However, if Hillary does become the nominee, which is probable, at least those expressing the desire not to vote or support the Democratic nominee, will not be occurring here according to the TOS
RufusTFirefly
(8,812 posts)In a sense, he already has:
Glenn Greenwald Responds to Widespread Lies About Him
It's pretty obvious why there's a concerted effort to smear Greenwald. His messages are deeply unsettling and difficult to refute. What's less clear is how many of these attackers are true believers and how many are simply parroting propaganda because they're too lazy (or too afraid) to do their own digging.
valerief
(53,235 posts)blkmusclmachine
(16,149 posts)JDPriestly
(57,936 posts)hrmjustin
(71,265 posts)Blue_Tires
(55,445 posts)throw his own fucking hat into the ring and run himself, since he knows so goddamned much...It's not like he doesn't have the money to get his campaign off the ground....
TerrapinFlyer
(277 posts)We have a select few here on DU that reject reality.
I wonder how DU will react if Hillary wins...
betterdemsonly
(1,967 posts)and invent the claim that pointing out the Clinton is dynastic by marriage is sexism.
pnwmom
(108,994 posts)Perhaps Greenwald should stick to his investigative reporting. A rigid dogmatist, the journalist is an intellectual follower of MIT professor Noam Chomsky. In a recent column in the Guardian, Greenwald favorably quotes his mentor who recommends that the international left focus solely upon the crimes of the U.S. government. As a purely tactical matter, Greenwald may be correct in assuming that American journalists stand to have more of an impact on the course of U.S. foreign policy than political developments in other countries, yet such assumptions can easily lead progressives down a slippery slope.
SNIP
Questionable Response to Russia and Its Satellites
Having bought into the authoritarian left's dogmatic playbook, Greenwald is ill-equipped and compromised when it comes to discussing anti-U.S. despots. Bizarrely, he criticizes media outlets which attack Bashar al-Assad, whose regime is "said to be slaughtering its own citizens" [emphasis mine]. Come again? Is Greenwald actually questioning whether Assad has launched a genocidal offensive against the Syrian people? Like other axiomatic left commentators, the journalist seems to be soft-pedaling Assad simply because the Syrian leader happens to be on the receiving end of U.S. foreign policy [we've been here before with Greenwald, who has also been evasive when it comes to addressing the role of repressive former Soviet satellites like Belarus].
Not surprisingly, Greenwald also hems and haws when it comes to Russia, a nation which has backed up the brutal Assad regime in Syria, not to mention the likes of Alexander Lukashenko in Belarus. In his Guardian column, Greenwald at first condemns Putin for his clamp down on punk rock group Pussy Riot. True to form, however, the journalist cannot help but pivot reflexively once again, remarking that the western media is hypocritical. Even as it condemns repression in Russia, Greenwald writes, the media turns a blind eye to clamp down on the likes of the Occupy movement at home. Committing a key mistake, Greenwald then writes that U.S. abuses are "much more consequential" than violations in Russia. For good measure, Greenwald then seems to venture down a slippery slope, implying that Pussy Riot may have gotten what it deserved since the rock band engaged in culturally provocative acts.
Some of Greenwald's fellow journalists seem to be growing weary of such somersaults. Take for example reporter Thomas Ricks, who asked Greenwald to comment over Twitter about Vladimir Putin's aggressive acts. Nonsensically, Greenwald again changed the subject and invited Ricks to denounce Peruvian police corruption and American drone strikes. Exasperated, Ricks remarks "I am no longer going soft on Greenwald," adding that if his colleague has any moral beliefs, then now would be the time to speak out against Putin.
SNIP
betterdemsonly
(1,967 posts)Maybe you guys are former Bush supporter?
pnwmom
(108,994 posts)betterdemsonly
(1,967 posts)The Ukrainian revolutionaries were mostly right wing austerians who want to eliminate all social programs to pay off bankers.
Did you support George Bush and the Iraq war a decade ago?
geek tragedy
(68,868 posts)they currently want a Democrat to win.
Unlike you, who has expressed a desire for the Republican to win in 2016.
And who thinks Obama is victimizing Putin.
http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=5260582
and who pimps Rand Paul:
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10025439690
Troll, troll, troll your boat, gently down the stream.
betterdemsonly
(1,967 posts)not supporting Putin. Pointing out that Rand Paul is less likely to support the neocon cause of starting a war with Iran, than Hillary, is not an endorsement of Rand Paul.
Pointing out that a neocon would be more likely to support Hillary than the republican is not an endorsement of the republicans. Asking if the person supported Bush is understandable.
It is a practical recongnition that most people care about issues more than party including the people who support Hillary and her neocon foreign policy ways.
geek tragedy
(68,868 posts)betterdemsonly
(1,967 posts)I just don't care one way or another. They are both too conservative for my liking. I care about progressive policies only.
geek tragedy
(68,868 posts)Funny that you're going again now that Ramses is on permanent hiatus.
betterdemsonly
(1,967 posts)How come you have an unlimited right to smear by association but people can't return the favor when it is obvious you support neocon foreign policy views?
geek tragedy
(68,868 posts)off letting Rand effing Paul win the White House over Hillary Clinton, or that progressives have a hard choice between the two, they open themselves up to the obvious commentary.
betterdemsonly
(1,967 posts)as well.
geek tragedy
(68,868 posts)betterdemsonly
(1,967 posts)and many neocons are happy as clams about Clinton's nomination particularly Vicky Nuland and her husband Robert Kagan.
geek tragedy
(68,868 posts)betterdemsonly
(1,967 posts)Clinton and Obama supported Lieberman who ran and won as an indepedent against the dem nominee Lamont. Than the democrats supported Charlie Crist over the Dem nominee in Florida.
geek tragedy
(68,868 posts)betterdemsonly
(1,967 posts)publically praised, Lieberman on Letterman a Larry King even after Lieberman lost the nomination. None of them campaigned for Lamont after Lamont's win which registers the impression they didn't care whether Lieberman beat Lamont, in the general election. When Liberman won, the Democrats gave him a standing ovation, and let him remain in the Dem caucus at Obama's behest. http://www.rawstory.com/news/2008/Obama_to_Reid_Dont_make_Lieberman_1111.html
sabrina 1
(62,325 posts)a mission, as Greenwald has, against those who he once trusted?
He was NEVER a neocon. He was an American who, like many of our Democrats after 9/11, ALSO SUPPORTED BUSH, like Hillary eg.
Bush's approval ratings in 2001 were in the 'nineties. That includes a whole lot of Democrats doesn't it?
How come it's ok for Hillary to support Bush with a VOTE in the past and STILL support many of his policies?
pnwmom
(108,994 posts)And I didn't support the Iraq war, either.
geek tragedy
(68,868 posts)to Obama and Clinton are NEOLIBERALCONSERVATIVEINTERVENTIONISTDLCers.
sabrina 1
(62,325 posts)But he was right when he exposed the crimes being committed against the Constitution by the Bush gang.
Airc, that wasn't an issue on the Left, because he was telling the truth.
Let me ask you, if someone is telling the truth, does the truth change because of their political affiliation? Let's say they are a witness in a murder trial, eg. Should the jury be told to consider their Political Affiliation before they decide on a verdict, EVEN IF the witness IS telling the truth?
I never understood this response to issues as important as this. Either Greenwald is wrong, or he's not. You haven't said whether you agree or disagree with him, just 'he's a libertarian' as if that in any way relates to the subject of the OP.
Btw, I think Greenwald's preference for Presidential candidate when Hillary was running before, was Feingold initially, then he supported Obama. Since all this is of interest to you.
TerrapinFlyer
(277 posts)Maybe you should ask yourself... does he support the Democratic Candidate?
betterdemsonly
(1,967 posts)but prefers progressive democrats, like Feingold, just as many of the cold war dems probably preferred independent Lieberman over Ned Lamont.
pnwmom
(108,994 posts)betterdemsonly
(1,967 posts)Phlem
(6,323 posts)Nice.
sabrina 1
(62,325 posts)a reference to the Far Right's simplistic, Rush/Fox generated attack on anyone who opposes Neocon Foreign Policies?
uponit7771
(90,363 posts)davidpdx
(22,000 posts)BeanMusical
(4,389 posts)geek tragedy
(68,868 posts)Major Hogwash
(17,656 posts)The guy is a clown.
treestar
(82,383 posts)Of course he does not like Hillary. Next case.
AzDar
(14,023 posts)stupidicus
(2,570 posts)the vacuousness of that is only exceeded by the pain of the burn (GGDS) for which there is no known cure
And also because he's entirely correct imo
BeyondGeography
(39,379 posts)What an odd statement. She's winning it, man. Fair and square, I might add.
TerrapinFlyer
(277 posts)Even when it is the majority?
ReRe
(10,597 posts)Thanks for the article link, RiverLover.
whatchamacallit
(15,558 posts)Many of them unwitting.
JonLP24
(29,322 posts)Where are those 2003 Iraq war speeches again?
betterdemsonly
(1,967 posts)libodem
(19,288 posts)Has been my problem all along. The shear presumption of all of it has been hard to swallow. But that's how it seems.
WillyT
(72,631 posts)nikto
(3,284 posts)Exept for social issues, Hillary makes a pretty good Reagan Republican.
True, 'dat.
cantbeserious
(13,039 posts)eom
whereisjustice
(2,941 posts)you know, getting her hands dirty
L0oniX
(31,493 posts)Bobbie Jo
(14,341 posts)...and dupes the same people.
sabrina 1
(62,325 posts)his work as a journalist on one of the most important stories of our time, the destruction of the US Constitution. One Pulitzer.
This country should be proud of people like this, well they are in fact.
He does, and always has, 'pissed off all the 'right' people though.
But they never address the substance of his work.
Isn't that interesting? And it's getting harder and harder to do so with all the awards and recognition of that work.
Cryptoad
(8,254 posts)and this is Breaking News???????
Makes my ass want a pinch of snuff!
McCamy Taylor
(19,240 posts)Senator in 2004. A really silly lie that accomplishes nothing.
randome
(34,845 posts)[hr][font color="blue"][center]Don't ever underestimate the long-term effects of a good night's sleep.[/center][/font][hr]
Spitfire of ATJ
(32,723 posts)Enthusiast
(50,983 posts)Yay, Bernie!
stonecutter357
(12,697 posts)GoneFishin
(5,217 posts)2banon
(7,321 posts)the con job aspect of our political system is so often transparent as glass, it's amazing the charade succeeds at all.
Madmiddle
(459 posts)Hillary Clinton. She was a big influence on William Jefferson Clinton and he deregulated the banking industry
just like a nice Dempublican. She would keep up the same programs now in place and the working and middle-class would not benefit from it. I would not vote for her or anyone that doesn't fix what is broken in Washington DC.
lewebley3
(3,412 posts)The only way democrats take back the houses and the White House
is to stick together.
RiverLover
(7,830 posts)nt
Marr
(20,317 posts)Kinda funny when they rage.
Blue_Tires
(55,445 posts)but he's been in the tank for Rand Paul since the beginning -- So his opinion matters little...
And since Paul has no chance, all Greenwald can do is shit in the punchbowl for the rest of us, from his pleasure compound down in Rio...
Marr
(20,317 posts)Blue_Tires
(55,445 posts)Go read his earlier tweets before that....And see how often he was promoting Paul and spinning his fuckups
I'd post them myself, but Greenwald blocked me like the cowardly lowlife ratfuck scumbag that he is...(Which I still intend to pay him back for...)
Marr
(20,317 posts)Blue_Tires
(55,445 posts)Apologia:
https://twitter.com/CarlGWoodward/status/534905315561865216
http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2013/mar/10/paul-filibuster-drones-progressives
Shameless Pimping/Promotion:
https://twitter.com/Umfuld/status/504989562406703104
https://twitter.com/ggreenwald/status/504982041805733888
https://twitter.com/ggreenwald/status/505001941173538816
https://twitter.com/ggreenwald/status/465804521034117120
https://twitter.com/ggreenwald/status/448458206281732096
https://twitter.com/ggreenwald/status/433609999118372865
https://twitter.com/ggreenwald/status/413786750259961856
https://twitter.com/ggreenwald/status/384355575233912832
https://twitter.com/ggreenwald/status/380361712643219456
https://twitter.com/ggreenwald/status/375587403697647617
https://www.minnpost.com/eric-black-ink/2013/03/glenn-greenwald-rand-paul-may-have-been-right-even-if-he-republican
One of numerous times Greenwald and Paul have been at the same event:
http://littlegreenfootballs.com/article/42436_The_Convergence_of_Glenn_Greenwald_and_Rand_Pauls_Southern_Avenger
https://twitter.com/lonewolf7771/status/480964503895822336
Noted Greenwald butt buddy Conor Friedersdorf takes his turn, with lots of pro-Rand comments from Greenie:
http://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2013/03/how-the-establishment-press-got-rand-paul-wrong/273880/
A "too-interesting-to-just-be-a-coincidence" connection:
http://www.aim.org/aim-column/snowden-lawyer-close-to-senator-rand-pauls-office/
His "non-endorsement endorsement" of Ron Paul in 2012:
http://www.salon.com/2012/01/05/democratic_party_priorities/
Greenwald in 2012 shows once again how much he hates Dems and wishes for a "third way":
http://blog.reidreport.com/2011/04/re-rise-of-the-naderites-glenn-greenwalds-third-party-dreamin/
While this has little to do with Greenwald (although he is mentioned), this Emoprog love letter to Rand is too good to pass up:
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/h-a-goodman/5-reasons-liberals-tired_b_6197694.html
More on the "unholy alliance" here:
http://thedailybanter.com/2013/07/the-convergence-of-the-glenn-greenwald-left-and-the-alex-jones-right/
http://shoqvalue.com/why-libertarian-organizations-like-the-cato-institute-love-the-nsa-outrage/
Marr
(20,317 posts)I see nothing there but commentary on the US political landscape, and a whole lot of 'guilt by association'.
Still, it's interesting to see that the word 'emoprog' has somehow lived on in some circles.
It seems to me that you simply don't like criticism of the Democratic Party, and equate that with active support of it's stated opposition. More of that 'with us or against us' mentality.
Blue_Tires
(55,445 posts)Especially how it has been run in my state of Virginia...
It's fucking GREENWALD and his libertairan fanboyism that I simply don't like...
randome
(34,845 posts)[hr][font color="blue"][center]I'm always right. When I'm wrong I admit it.
So then I'm right about being wrong.[/center][/font][hr]
TheSarcastinator
(854 posts)I think you misunderstand why progressives appreciate Mr. Sanders and Ms. Warren, and you project onto progressives your own personality and perspective, including the powerful psychological and emotional comfort you receive when having your opinions reflected through the leaders of the status quo.
I have said it before and I will say it again: even when you are right, you are wrong. Every time.
randome
(34,845 posts)I'm saying that two politicians that we all agree are admirable (and arguably better Presidential fodder) will likely vote for Clinton for President.
The opinions of those we look up to can -and probably should- influence our own thinking on the matter.
[hr][font color="blue"][center]All things in moderation, including moderation.[/center][/font][hr]
Skittles
(153,193 posts)*QUANDARY*
Blue_Tires
(55,445 posts)So let's ask ourselves why in fuck's name do we care about his opinion of Hillary Clinton? Anyone who reads his twitter TL would know he absolutely loves trolling Dem voters or anyone who doesn't think Obama and Clinton are minions of Satan...
In short, I humbly suggest Mr. Greenwald fuck himself with a spiked bat...Repeatedly...
Blue_Tires
(55,445 posts)randome
(34,845 posts)[hr][font color="blue"][center]"If you're bored then you're boring." -Harvey Danger[/center][/font][hr]