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Mon May 11, 2015, 05:20 PM

 

Worker fired for disabling GPS app that tracked her 24 hours a day

A Central California woman claims she was fired after uninstalling an app that her employer required her to run constantly on her company issued iPhone—an app that tracked her every move 24 hours a day, seven days a week.

Plaintiff Myrna Arias, a former Bakersfield sales executive for money transfer service Intermex, claims in a state court lawsuit that her boss, John Stubits, fired her shortly after she uninstalled the job-management Xora app that she and her colleagues were required to use. According to her suit (PDF) in Kern County Superior Court:

After researching the app and speaking with a trainer from Xora, Plaintiff and her co-workers asked whether Intermex would be monitoring their movements while off duty. Stubits admitted that employees would be monitored while off duty and bragged that he knew how fast she was driving at specific moments ever since she installed the app on her phone. Plaintiff expressed that she had no problem with the app's GPS function during work hours, but she objected to the monitoring of her location during non-work hours and complained to Stubits that this was an invasion of her privacy. She likened the app to a prisoner's ankle bracelet and informed Stubits that his actions were illegal. Stubits replied that she should tolerate the illegal intrusion…..


Intermex did not immediately respond for comment.

The suit, which claims invasion of privacy, retaliation, unfair business practices, and other allegations, seeks damages in excess of $500,000 and asserts she was monitored on the weekends when she was not working.

Arias' boss "scolded" her for uninstalling the app shortly after being required to use it, according to the suit. Her attorneys said the woman made $7,250 per month and that she "met all quotas" during a brief stint with Intermex last year.

"This intrusion would be highly offensive to a reasonable person," the filing said.

Arias' attorney, Gail Glick, said in a Monday e-mail to Ars that the app allowed her client's "bosses to see every move the employees made throughout the day."


<snip>

http://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2015/05/worker-fired-for-disabling-gps-app-that-tracked-her-24-hours-a-day/

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Reply Worker fired for disabling GPS app that tracked her 24 hours a day (Original post)
villager May 2015 OP
treestar May 2015 #1
malthaussen May 2015 #9
Warpy May 2015 #2
arcane1 May 2015 #4
LisaL May 2015 #6
arcane1 May 2015 #11
LisaL May 2015 #12
GeorgeGist May 2015 #20
LisaL May 2015 #21
Renew Deal May 2015 #23
arcane1 May 2015 #24
Art_from_Ark May 2015 #33
fasttense May 2015 #48
RoccoR5955 May 2015 #109
appalachiablue May 2015 #120
meow2u3 May 2015 #106
Omaha Steve May 2015 #29
arcane1 May 2015 #57
Hekate May 2015 #81
Sherman A1 May 2015 #5
bvar22 May 2015 #16
dixiegrrrrl May 2015 #42
awoke_in_2003 May 2015 #47
TheKentuckian May 2015 #116
JI7 May 2015 #10
99Forever May 2015 #14
LisaL May 2015 #18
Chan790 May 2015 #35
fasttense May 2015 #49
groundloop May 2015 #52
BlancheSplanchnik May 2015 #111
TheKentuckian May 2015 #115
99Forever May 2015 #140
Joe Chi Minh May 2015 #44
LisaL May 2015 #17
ablamj May 2015 #30
Chan790 May 2015 #36
fasttense May 2015 #51
leveymg May 2015 #28
Warpy May 2015 #73
RiverLover May 2015 #75
Warpy May 2015 #77
RiverLover May 2015 #80
BlancheSplanchnik May 2015 #113
jeff47 May 2015 #97
LisaL May 2015 #3
Arkansas Granny May 2015 #7
LisaL May 2015 #8
ohnoyoudidnt May 2015 #22
Snarkoleptic May 2015 #50
SusanCalvin May 2015 #61
appalachiablue May 2015 #123
petronius May 2015 #13
LisaL May 2015 #15
jeff47 May 2015 #99
progressoid May 2015 #19
Manifestor_of_Light May 2015 #25
Chan790 May 2015 #37
Major Nikon May 2015 #63
randys1 May 2015 #26
Jamastiene May 2015 #27
1939 May 2015 #31
Ed Suspicious May 2015 #34
Lonusca May 2015 #94
FLPanhandle May 2015 #32
Chan790 May 2015 #38
FLPanhandle May 2015 #53
tularetom May 2015 #39
alfredo May 2015 #40
TheKentuckian May 2015 #117
alfredo May 2015 #130
TheKentuckian May 2015 #134
alfredo May 2015 #135
Locrian May 2015 #41
appalachiablue May 2015 #129
2naSalit May 2015 #43
Munificence May 2015 #76
2naSalit May 2015 #139
druidity33 May 2015 #85
Sheepshank May 2015 #91
druidity33 May 2015 #132
2naSalit May 2015 #141
stevenleser May 2015 #89
2naSalit May 2015 #138
secondvariety May 2015 #45
Major Nikon May 2015 #64
blackspade May 2015 #46
ladjf May 2015 #54
Hoyt May 2015 #55
brooklynite May 2015 #59
Hoyt May 2015 #62
LisaL May 2015 #68
Hoyt May 2015 #74
alfredo May 2015 #131
Hoyt May 2015 #136
appalachiablue May 2015 #125
Hoyt May 2015 #128
B Calm May 2015 #56
EL34x4 May 2015 #65
B Calm May 2015 #79
whatthehey May 2015 #90
B Calm May 2015 #110
RiverLover May 2015 #58
FLPanhandle May 2015 #69
RiverLover May 2015 #71
Lonusca May 2015 #93
20score May 2015 #60
KT2000 May 2015 #70
Mariana May 2015 #96
meow2u3 May 2015 #108
RedCappedBandit May 2015 #118
Spitfire of ATJ May 2015 #66
PowerToThePeople May 2015 #67
Faryn Balyncd May 2015 #72
diabeticman May 2015 #78
Hekate May 2015 #82
appalachiablue May 2015 #126
eridani May 2015 #83
eridani May 2015 #84
dembotoz May 2015 #86
patricia92243 May 2015 #87
RiverLover May 2015 #88
jeff47 May 2015 #98
druidity33 May 2015 #133
malaise May 2015 #92
hunter May 2015 #95
appalachiablue May 2015 #124
Stinky The Clown May 2015 #100
jeff47 May 2015 #101
Hoyt May 2015 #103
LisaL May 2015 #105
Hoyt May 2015 #112
Stinky The Clown May 2015 #122
jeff47 May 2015 #137
jeff47 May 2015 #102
Liberal_in_LA May 2015 #104
olddots May 2015 #107
PCIntern May 2015 #114
TheKentuckian May 2015 #119
PCIntern May 2015 #121
villager May 2015 #127

Response to villager (Original post)

Mon May 11, 2015, 05:22 PM

1. Like being on probation

I don't think even that has 24 hour monitoring.

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Response to treestar (Reply #1)

Mon May 11, 2015, 05:33 PM

9. They have those leg monitors they put on now...

... for some cases, anyway.

-- Mal

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Response to villager (Original post)

Mon May 11, 2015, 05:22 PM

2. Solution: leave the stupid phone at work

I know I'd do it if an employer got that nosy.

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Response to Warpy (Reply #2)

Mon May 11, 2015, 05:24 PM

4. Or turn it off. Then, if they retaliate for THAT, here comes the lawsuit :)

 

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Response to arcane1 (Reply #4)

Mon May 11, 2015, 05:29 PM

6. Isn't that exactly what allegeldy took place here.

She claims she was fired after she un-installed the app so she is now suing.

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Response to LisaL (Reply #6)

Mon May 11, 2015, 05:34 PM

11. Slightly different, as the company issued the phone.

 

If it's their property, they might have a case since she's basically modifying it by removing that app. But they would NOT have a case for turning the phone off when not in use.

It sucks all around though

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Response to arcane1 (Reply #11)

Mon May 11, 2015, 05:38 PM

12. Doesn't sound like she could just turn off GPS tracking feature of the app.

Without un-installing the app.

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Response to LisaL (Reply #12)

Mon May 11, 2015, 05:54 PM

20. She could have turned the phone off ...

and used her own. Problem solved.

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Response to GeorgeGist (Reply #20)

Mon May 11, 2015, 05:55 PM

21. She claims she was required to keep the phone with her 24/7 to answer calls from clients.

How would she answer calls from clients if her phone was off?

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Response to LisaL (Reply #21)

Mon May 11, 2015, 06:06 PM

23. Forward all calls to a different phone.

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Response to LisaL (Reply #21)

Mon May 11, 2015, 06:13 PM

24. A very good point!

 

But unfortunately, they can still claim "tampering with company property". But I'd like to think a case could be made to forbid employers from installing the apps in the first place.

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Response to LisaL (Reply #21)

Mon May 11, 2015, 06:55 PM

33. I'd hate to have a job like that

There's no way I'd want to be woken up at 3 in the morning just to take a call from a client.

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Response to GeorgeGist (Reply #20)

Mon May 11, 2015, 07:32 PM

48. They can still track your GPS, even with your phone off.n/t

 

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Response to fasttense (Reply #48)

Tue May 12, 2015, 03:53 PM

109. not if it's in a Faraday Cage!

 

Simply wrap it in tin foil!

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Response to fasttense (Reply #48)

Tue May 12, 2015, 05:35 PM

120. I've heard that also. And even if the phone is off it can be turned on remotely,

including the audio microphone. Same deal with internet TV that has voice commands; even turned off it can hear you. Creepy, you can't make this stuff up. Thom Hartmann had an expert on his program discussing smart televisions. The end of privacy as we've known it they say.

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Response to arcane1 (Reply #11)

Tue May 12, 2015, 03:23 PM

106. The company had no business installing the Big Brother app to begin with

This is the principle. Company phone or no company phone, invasion of privacy is illegal.

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Response to arcane1 (Reply #4)

Mon May 11, 2015, 06:52 PM

29. Remember the guy that traveled in Europe with a dead battery in his I phone?


He was shocked to learn even though the battery was dead, it tracked his location all over his travels.


Apple can track you even AFTER your iPhone battery dies: Sensors use built-in chip to collect data when the 5S is 'dead'

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-2573761/Apple-track-AFTER-iPhone-battery-dies-Sensors-continue-collect-data-phone-dead.html#ixzz3ZsRjz700

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Response to Omaha Steve (Reply #29)

Mon May 11, 2015, 07:49 PM

57. Well shit! I didn't need to hear that today :(

 

Reason number 47,236 why I'm keeping my dumb phone.

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Response to arcane1 (Reply #57)

Mon May 11, 2015, 10:08 PM

81. You and me both. A very very dumb phone. nt

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Response to Warpy (Reply #2)

Mon May 11, 2015, 05:29 PM

5. Yup!

Seems pretty simple. Leave the work phone at the workplace at the end of the day or if that is not possible leave it in a drawer at home and use your own phone for your own business.

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Response to Sherman A1 (Reply #5)

Mon May 11, 2015, 05:49 PM

16. Better yet,

toss the phone in the back of a truck headed to Tierra del Fuego and points beyond!

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Response to bvar22 (Reply #16)

Mon May 11, 2015, 07:16 PM

42. That was my thought...

different variations, same idea.

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Response to Sherman A1 (Reply #5)


Response to Sherman A1 (Reply #5)

Tue May 12, 2015, 04:59 PM

116. How do you do that when you are on call? Forwarding would be the same

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Response to Warpy (Reply #2)

Mon May 11, 2015, 05:34 PM

10. he might get angry if she doesn't answer

especially if she is just at "home" so doesn't have an excuse for not answering.

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Response to JI7 (Reply #10)

Mon May 11, 2015, 05:43 PM

14. So what?

She's an employee, not his personal property.

Fuck him if he doesn't like it.

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Response to 99Forever (Reply #14)

Mon May 11, 2015, 05:51 PM

18. Doesn't sound like he liked it.

After she un-instaleld the app, she got fired.

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Response to 99Forever (Reply #14)

Mon May 11, 2015, 07:01 PM

35. Typically jobs of this type in this sector...

 

include signing a contract that specifies that you are "all on-call" meaning you are never allowed to be not potentially called into work or to fulfill work duties from one moment to the next 24/7/365 unless you're on vacation.

People in these positions get paid an arm and a leg because they sign away their right to off-work time.

Yes, that is perfectly legal if you were wondering because it's voluntary and because you can quit at any time or opt to self-terminate by failing to meet the terms of contract by being available.

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Response to Chan790 (Reply #35)

Mon May 11, 2015, 07:33 PM

49. Gives a whole new meaning to wage slave. n/t

 

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Response to Chan790 (Reply #35)

Mon May 11, 2015, 07:39 PM

52. $87K per year is hardly "an arm and a leg"


I also wholeheartedly disagree with the argument that it's ok to abuse the privacy of employees 'because they can quit at any time'. Nobody should have to make the choice between tolerating an invasion of privacy (or any unethical work conditions) and quitting their job.

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Response to groundloop (Reply #52)

Tue May 12, 2015, 04:43 PM

111. ^^^ this^^^ n/t

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Response to Chan790 (Reply #35)

Tue May 12, 2015, 04:58 PM

115. Shit, I've been 24/7 365 on call for as low as 29k in the late 90's and never made over 42 on call.

with the same responsibility plus I had the fucking Nextel chirping with matters of such gravity as "what are you doing?" and "I'm bored".

My point is don't think this is all about high rollers of any sort.

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Response to Chan790 (Reply #35)

Sat May 16, 2015, 09:02 AM

140. I'm fairly certain slavery might still be illegal in the USA...

.. however, with the shit-4-brains Congress we have, fully corrupted "justice" system, and the capitulating, spineless administration, who knows, I could be wrong.

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Response to 99Forever (Reply #14)

Mon May 11, 2015, 07:24 PM

44. Yes. What a bloody nerve!

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Response to Warpy (Reply #2)

Mon May 11, 2015, 05:49 PM

17. She claims in her lawsuit she was required to keep the phoen with her 24 hours a day to answer calls

from clients.

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Response to LisaL (Reply #17)

Mon May 11, 2015, 06:54 PM

30. did he pay her

for being on call 24/7?

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Response to ablamj (Reply #30)

Mon May 11, 2015, 07:03 PM

36. In theory, yes.

 

It's a term of the contract of the position and factored into her salaried compensation.

I turned down a similar position years ago because I didn't want to be under these conditions.

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Response to Chan790 (Reply #36)

Mon May 11, 2015, 07:36 PM

51. In the military, many of the officer positions require you to be available 24/7.

 

but we certainly didn't get $80,000 plus a year for doing it.

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Response to Warpy (Reply #2)

Mon May 11, 2015, 06:51 PM

28. Many bosses demand 24/7 access to employees, particularly of Chiefs of Staff & Admin Assts

Reference made to "The Devil Wears Prado." The first time they can't reach you at 2 am, you're no longer loyal enough.

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Response to leveymg (Reply #28)

Mon May 11, 2015, 08:51 PM

73. I know there are jobs like that

I would simply never accept those terms no matter how high the salary.

Nursing was bad enough, being called in on days off.

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Response to Warpy (Reply #2)

Mon May 11, 2015, 08:52 PM

75. In territory sales, you work from your home & your car.

There is no leave it at work option.

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Response to RiverLover (Reply #75)

Mon May 11, 2015, 09:10 PM

77. Funny, my dad did that while working his way up the ladder

back in the 1950s. While he was on the road, he relied on land lines in hotels and pay phones and the US mail. Sending a telegram was unusual. He made appointments and distributors kept them.

There is no fucking reason in the world for this shit except creeping serfdom.

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Response to Warpy (Reply #77)

Mon May 11, 2015, 09:24 PM

80. I agree! I feel like a serf. A scared serf.

Its why I'm highly motivated for change. The corporations & Moneyed Interests wield too much destructive power over People.

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Response to RiverLover (Reply #75)

Tue May 12, 2015, 04:47 PM

113. I have a couple friends doing this.

And I really feel for them. Pay is crap, too. And the idiots higher up the ladder.....ugh. god.

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Response to Warpy (Reply #2)

Tue May 12, 2015, 01:57 PM

97. Solution: Read the damn story before replying, and you won't say something dumb

She was required to carry the phone 24/7, and keep it on 24/7. And not in airplane mode 24/7.

And the article could take the same advice. The actual lawsuit says it was her personal phone, not a company issued phone.

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Response to villager (Original post)

Mon May 11, 2015, 05:24 PM

3. Big brother is watching.

Wow.

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Response to villager (Original post)

Mon May 11, 2015, 05:31 PM

7. Since it was company issued phone and not her personal phone, did she have

to carry it outside her regular working hours? I didn't see anything at the link that addressed that issue.

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Response to Arkansas Granny (Reply #7)

Mon May 11, 2015, 05:32 PM

8. I don't see anything mentioned either, but sounds like her job involved traveling to customer's

locations.
So I don't know if it would be possible for her to leave it in the office when she was not in the office.

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Response to Arkansas Granny (Reply #7)

Mon May 11, 2015, 05:57 PM

22. Yes, it is in the lawsuit.

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Response to Arkansas Granny (Reply #7)

Mon May 11, 2015, 07:34 PM

50. My neighbor works for OfficeMax/OfficeDepot/Staples, or whatever the new monstrosity is called.

He uses his personal cell phone for work and they require him to have the "Airwatch" app on his phone.
Airwatch has "jailbreak" detection, GPS tracking (which cannot be shut off), plus they can also see any photos on the phone, read all of his personal emails and texts.

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Response to Snarkoleptic (Reply #50)

Mon May 11, 2015, 07:57 PM

61. I wouldn't take a job like that

if I had any choice. So many people don't nowadays.

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Response to Snarkoleptic (Reply #50)

Tue May 12, 2015, 06:08 PM

123. Prison, virtual style. I remember reading that 19th c. textile factory workers were charged

if a needle broke, and their pay was docked. At many places employees were also charged for using the chair they sat in to work. The last one about did me in.

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Response to villager (Original post)

Mon May 11, 2015, 05:40 PM

13. Hope she wins. I can't tell from the suit, though, if it was a company-issued

phone or her personal phone. The suit just says "their phones" and "her phone" as far as I can tell. This would be even more offensive, IMO, if it was a personal phone...

http://cdn.arstechnica.net/wp-content/uploads/2015/05/Intermexcomplaint.pdf

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Response to petronius (Reply #13)

Mon May 11, 2015, 05:47 PM

15. Company issued.

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Response to petronius (Reply #13)

Tue May 12, 2015, 02:05 PM

99. Lawsuit seems to say it was a personal phone

At least, when it mentions the demand to install the software, it does not say they were company-issued phones. It implies personal ownership.

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Response to villager (Original post)

Mon May 11, 2015, 05:54 PM

19. Manager said he was using the program to continuously monitor her, during company AND personal time.

Her manager made it clear that he was using the program to continuously monitor her, during company as well as personal time.


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Response to villager (Original post)

Mon May 11, 2015, 06:42 PM

25. If she was forced to keep it on, then that should be paid overtime.

Any time you have to be on call, that is counted as work.

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Response to Manifestor_of_Light (Reply #25)

Mon May 11, 2015, 07:05 PM

37. It's in the contract.

 

Her pay is based on the premise of 24-hour on-call workdays and she was paid as such...(edit: ) over-$7k/month.

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Response to Manifestor_of_Light (Reply #25)

Mon May 11, 2015, 07:58 PM

63. This is only true for those covered by the FLSA

Many workers are exempt and the employer has no obligation to ever pay them overtime. Accepting a position that is exempt from the FLSA and has no contract, collective or otherwise, means you've just sold part of your soul to the company.

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Response to villager (Original post)

Mon May 11, 2015, 06:47 PM

26. Psychopaths run american corps these days, nothing surprises me

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Response to villager (Original post)

Mon May 11, 2015, 06:50 PM

27. That is damned creepy.

I hope it is against the law. I never know any more. It seems we are losing more and more of our privacy, whether we want to or not.

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Response to villager (Original post)

Mon May 11, 2015, 06:54 PM

31. For $7,250 a month

You can monitor my movements all you want to.

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Response to 1939 (Reply #31)

Mon May 11, 2015, 06:59 PM

34. That's your price, not sure if you're implying that it should be hers.

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Response to Ed Suspicious (Reply #34)

Tue May 12, 2015, 10:06 AM

94. I think the larger implication is

that there is "a price". Lots of people would agree (and do agree) to these conditions. Millions probably already do in one form or another.

Whether her suit has merit - I don't know but I am doubtful.

There is always (at least now) a price to pay to make a high salary.

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Response to villager (Original post)

Mon May 11, 2015, 06:54 PM

32. Interesting...two good sides to this

On one side, it's company property so she shouldn't be modifying it.

On the other side, if not during work hours, she shouldn't be required to carry it.

I suspect, the company will settle this long before the court gets involved.

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Response to FLPanhandle (Reply #32)

Mon May 11, 2015, 07:08 PM

38. They have no need to settle unfortunately.

 

This is why you always read contracts before you sign them...so you don't sign something that specifies that your work-hours are whenever a client or supervisor calls you 24-hours/day unless you're on vacation.

Because she voluntarily agreed to not have non-work time...they can legally demand she carry it all the time.

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Response to Chan790 (Reply #38)

Mon May 11, 2015, 07:44 PM

53. I wonder if the app was part of her work contract.

Even if so, is it legal?

The company might settle just to stop the risk from having to uninstall it.

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Response to villager (Original post)

Mon May 11, 2015, 07:08 PM

39. Technology shall make you free!

Next step, RFID chips under the skin of all employees.

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Response to villager (Original post)

Mon May 11, 2015, 07:15 PM

40. Republicans want to run our government like a business. This is one reason to oppose them. She

Should have left the company phone at home, and carried her own phone.

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Response to alfredo (Reply #40)

Tue May 12, 2015, 05:05 PM

117. You don't get 24/7 on call, it isn't the same as simply having a company phone.

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Response to TheKentuckian (Reply #117)

Tue May 12, 2015, 07:20 PM

130. When clocked out it should have stopped monitoring her movements, but it didn't.

"From the article: The app had a "clock in/out" feature which did not stop GPS monitoring, that function remained on. This is the problem about which Ms. Arias complained. Management never made mention of mileage. They would tell her co-workers and her of their driving speed, roads taken, and time spent at customer locations. Her manager made it clear that he was using the program to continuously monitor her, during company as well as personal time."

This is industrial espionage.

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Response to alfredo (Reply #130)

Tue May 12, 2015, 08:33 PM

134. I'm not down with it at all. I'm responding to the calls to leave the phone and all that.

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Response to TheKentuckian (Reply #134)

Tue May 12, 2015, 08:47 PM

135. There are times when you don't want to be found. If she is not paid to be on call, then

why should she keep her leash on? Yes, she should keep the phone with her while on the clock. I didn't see anything about her being required to have the phone on 24/7. I think the company will argue that if she didn't want to be monitored off the clock, she should use a personal phone at those times.

She did alter a company phone, but they should have been honest about tracking her when off the clock. That's creepy.

I hope she wins, but I have a feeling they will have a good case in defense of their actions. Still, the creepiness and the dishonesty of the company could help her.

The Postal Service is also micromanaging employees, but only on the clock.

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Response to villager (Original post)

Mon May 11, 2015, 07:16 PM

41. obidience collar

I hear the new model is out next June

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Response to Locrian (Reply #41)

Tue May 12, 2015, 06:56 PM

129. Good one- Slave collar for real.

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Response to villager (Original post)

Mon May 11, 2015, 07:23 PM

43. $7,250./mo = $1.28 approx/HR @ 24x30.4 days in a month. n/t

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Response to 2naSalit (Reply #43)

Mon May 11, 2015, 09:03 PM

76. Math FAIL!

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Response to Munificence (Reply #76)

Sat May 16, 2015, 08:57 AM

139. It is too!

I blew it it in my calculation, thanks for catching that!

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Response to 2naSalit (Reply #43)

Tue May 12, 2015, 05:16 AM

85. $7,250 divved by 30.4 by 24 = $9.94/hr

Which is not quite a buck twenty eight, but it's still not that great.



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Response to druidity33 (Reply #85)

Tue May 12, 2015, 09:16 AM

91. I would love to get paid $9+/hr to sleep, eat, grocery shop, & paid while cleaning my house etc.

 

BUT....I would not like the intrusivness that was going on here

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Response to Sheepshank (Reply #91)

Tue May 12, 2015, 07:27 PM

132. As a Union Steward...

i tell all my new shop employees to READ THEIR CONTRACT! If you can't abide by it, the Union can't support you. The flipside is of course that if you're being subjected to demands/terms beyond that contract, you have recourse. I don't think geotagging was in her contract, regardless of whether she was employed 24/7.



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Response to druidity33 (Reply #85)

Sat May 16, 2015, 09:02 AM

141. Yeah, something went

wrong while I was trying to work it out. Still, I agree, it isn't much of a wage. While on call 24/7, one also bears additional expense due to traveling frequently... sundries and food cost a lot when one is on the road, so to speak.

Just give me another badge on my math dunce sash.

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Response to 2naSalit (Reply #43)

Tue May 12, 2015, 09:04 AM

89. I think you didn't include the decimal point in the 30.4 when you multiplied. nt

 

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Response to stevenleser (Reply #89)

Sat May 16, 2015, 08:55 AM

138. Ooops!

I confess, I have always been something of a math dunce... dyslexia has it's downsides!

Thanks for the correction.

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Response to villager (Original post)

Mon May 11, 2015, 07:25 PM

45. Why would

they need to monitor her location in the first place? Sounds like a shit company to work for - at any price.

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Response to secondvariety (Reply #45)

Mon May 11, 2015, 08:02 PM

64. I can think of a few reasons

If they needed someone at a certain location as fast as possible, it would help to know who is where. That doesn't mean the company isn't shit to work for. If I'm going to sell my privacy to the company, it ain't gonna be cheap.

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Response to villager (Original post)

Mon May 11, 2015, 07:32 PM

46. I would have locked it in my desk at the end of my work day and walked away.

This shit has gotten intolerable.

On edit, and forwarded the calls to my personal phone.
Actually, I think I would do this 24/7.

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Response to villager (Original post)

Mon May 11, 2015, 07:44 PM

54. Set up your company phone to forward all calls to your

personal business phone then leave the business phone at the office in the ON mode.

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Response to villager (Original post)

Mon May 11, 2015, 07:46 PM

55. If you turn your phone off, does the GPS still work?

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Response to Hoyt (Reply #55)

Mon May 11, 2015, 07:53 PM

59. No, and more importantly, neither does the App

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Response to brooklynite (Reply #59)

Mon May 11, 2015, 07:58 PM

62. Sounds like the answer. Instead she'll end up blaming the evil corporation for firing her from her

$85K job.

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Response to Hoyt (Reply #62)

Mon May 11, 2015, 08:21 PM

68. Answer to what? Her phone had to be on so she could take calls from clients, even

when she wasn't in her office.

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Response to LisaL (Reply #68)

Mon May 11, 2015, 08:51 PM

74. Late at night? I'm sorry, she was making enough to make a few sacrifices.


Not sure why the employer required it, but I would have sat down with them and asked is there was something we can do because I just didn't feel comfortable.

I haven't read this closely, so maybe she did. Or maybe they harassed her. That's are different.

I'm one who has the opinion that at that level of salary, if you don't like things, you do yourself and the employer a favor and quit if you just can't put up with something. Besides, it's satisfying to tell them to stuff it.

I don't feel like that for people making a lot less.

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Response to Hoyt (Reply #74)

Tue May 12, 2015, 07:22 PM

131. Sounds like he was cyberstalking her.

The app had a "clock in/out" feature which did not stop GPS monitoring, that function remained on. This is the problem about which Ms. Arias complained. Management never made mention of mileage. They would tell her co-workers and her of their driving speed, roads taken, and time spent at customer locations. Her manager made it clear that he was using the program to continuously monitor her, during company as well as personal time.

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Response to alfredo (Reply #131)

Tue May 12, 2015, 09:19 PM

136. Cybetstalking would be different. Still think she should have just quit, or thrown the thing in a

drawer after hours.

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Response to Hoyt (Reply #55)

Tue May 12, 2015, 06:35 PM

125. # 48. says GPS still works if the phone is off.

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Response to appalachiablue (Reply #125)

Tue May 12, 2015, 06:49 PM

128. Then I would have stuck it in a drawer when I got home and left to do whatever I wanted if

concerned about tracking.

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Response to villager (Original post)

Mon May 11, 2015, 07:47 PM

56. Truck drivers have had GPS on their company owned trucks for years.

 

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Response to B Calm (Reply #56)

Mon May 11, 2015, 08:15 PM

65. That's different.

 

When they're in the company truck, presumably, they're working. When they park the truck, hop in a cab and head to the bar, they're not working. And they're not being tracked.

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Response to EL34x4 (Reply #65)

Mon May 11, 2015, 09:21 PM

79. Actually, it's not a bit different.

 

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Response to B Calm (Reply #79)

Tue May 12, 2015, 09:10 AM

90. Unless they are required to be in the truck 24/7 it is.

Her contract required her to be available for calls 24/7

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Response to whatthehey (Reply #90)

Tue May 12, 2015, 04:40 PM

110. You are responsible for company property and yes you are suppose to be available for dispatch 24/7.

 

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Response to villager (Original post)

Mon May 11, 2015, 07:51 PM

58. I have one of those too, same occupation category...

Its great.

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Response to RiverLover (Reply #58)

Mon May 11, 2015, 08:23 PM

69. Ouch

Was this known when you were hired?

Is this even legal?

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Response to FLPanhandle (Reply #69)

Mon May 11, 2015, 08:29 PM

71. I've been with them almost 7 years. Started with a Blackberry then upgraded to iphone.

I think its been 2 years now with the full 24 hour tracking installed on the iphones. But in ours, they disabled the ability to disable the tracker.

I don't know if its legal. They have an enormous legal department, so I imagine they've found a way to make it so.

But they don't have to worry about firing someone for disabling it....

I'm not proud. Just middle-aged and know if I lose my job, I'll have trouble finding a new one. I get in line.

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Response to RiverLover (Reply #71)

Tue May 12, 2015, 09:50 AM

93. I remember getting my first pager

and thinking how cool it was. Until it started beeping. That was the beginning of 20+ years of basically being on call 24/7.

What I think a lot of people miss is that - yes this sucks - but if you don't agree to the conditions, someone else will. The train is not turning back.

I also think the next generation doesn't have the same basic concept of "privacy" that we did. It's not that big of a deal for people to know where you are an what you are doing at any hour of the day.

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Response to villager (Original post)

Mon May 11, 2015, 07:55 PM

60. There would be at least two, if not three more zeroes added to the penalty if I'm on that jury.

I've been warning people for three decades that this kind of shit would happen once the country changed its views on worker's rights. It started with piss tests and moved onto a mindset where employers have every right to know who they were hiring. And that meant knowing how they behave outside of work.

No they fucking don't. One does a job and gets paid for a job well done. That's the beginning, middle and end of the deal. Fuck all the fascists who think otherwise.

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Response to 20score (Reply #60)

Mon May 11, 2015, 08:24 PM

70. Agree!

I could imagine a woman going to a women's clinic after work and having to answer as to some asshole supervisor whether she was there for birth control or an abortion because the corporations "religion" forbids such things.

Jeez ---let me out of here......

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Response to KT2000 (Reply #70)

Tue May 12, 2015, 11:06 AM

96. Or being treated badly for going to the "wrong" church

(or for not going to church at all), or attending the "wrong" political events, or basically doing anything your supervisor disapproves of.

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Response to 20score (Reply #60)

Tue May 12, 2015, 03:33 PM

108. If I were on the jury, she'd be freakin' OWNING that company

I'm sick of fascists who think they can pry into their employees' private lives and order them around 24/7!

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Response to 20score (Reply #60)

Tue May 12, 2015, 05:08 PM

118. Yup yup yup. This!

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Response to villager (Original post)

Mon May 11, 2015, 08:20 PM

66. I wonder if he could access the camera too.

 

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Response to villager (Original post)

Mon May 11, 2015, 08:20 PM

67. Good for her

 

hope she takes them to the cleaners.

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Response to villager (Original post)

Mon May 11, 2015, 08:38 PM

72. If California made this illegal, could a corporation sue California in TPP-ISDR tribunals for loss



... of profits, assuming The corporation adopting the 24 hour surveillance was from a TPP member state, and the TPP passes in a form similar to what has been leaked?

(This sounds like an easier way for corporations to make money than "the old-fashioned way".)











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Response to villager (Original post)

Mon May 11, 2015, 09:18 PM

78. I find it very disturbing the way Employers are trying to control employees off the clock.

You can't complain to your facebook friends about your bad day or tip because you can get fired for speaking Ill of the company. This article. Hell, employers are demanding peoples facebook/twitter and the like --passwords.

Thanks Right-To-Work crap that keeps us under the thumb nail of corporations.

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Response to villager (Original post)

Mon May 11, 2015, 10:17 PM

82. Oh brave new world, that has such people in it. Ugh. nt

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Response to Hekate (Reply #82)

Tue May 12, 2015, 06:37 PM

126. Brave new Hell.

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Response to villager (Original post)

Tue May 12, 2015, 02:43 AM

83. Contact information

Email contact form
http://intermexonline.com/contact/

My message which did not go through--
Rehire Myrna Arias of Bakersfield! What in bloody hell business is of yours where she is when she isn't at work? If the Xora app can't be adjusted to function only during work hours, get rid of it. Her supervisor John Stubits should be fired instead

Regulatory Compliance Department
1.800.792.8017
compliance@intermexusa.com

Customer Service Department
1.800.670.8611
cs-mexicosupervisors@intermexusa.com

International Headquarters

9480 S. Dixie Highway
Miami, FL 33156
United States
Tel: 305-671-8000
1.800.670.8611

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Response to eridani (Reply #83)

Tue May 12, 2015, 03:34 AM

84. You need to be fluent in Spanish to use the 800 numbers n/t

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Response to villager (Original post)

Tue May 12, 2015, 06:00 AM

86. brave new world

2 phones with call forwarding

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Response to villager (Original post)

Tue May 12, 2015, 07:24 AM

87. I thought in a "right to work" state a person could be fired with no explanation. In other words

the other side of right to work is "right to fire you."

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Response to patricia92243 (Reply #87)

Tue May 12, 2015, 08:47 AM

88. That's an interesting point.

It'll also be interesting to see how this plays out in court.

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Response to patricia92243 (Reply #87)

Tue May 12, 2015, 02:03 PM

98. Yes, but that doesn't mean they can not provide an explanation.

And they foolishly did provide an explanation.

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Response to patricia92243 (Reply #87)

Tue May 12, 2015, 07:37 PM

133. Discrimination of a protected class or

violation of civil rights would make it actionable. I'm not sure where this case would fall... privacy rights? What does her contract for employment stipulate and what are her rights in relation to those stipulations? Can an employment contract legitimize 24 hour unwilling tracking of employees? This sound like a landmark legal case to me....

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Response to villager (Original post)

Tue May 12, 2015, 09:41 AM

92. Well she should collect enough retirement money for a good life

after she dues the pants off that fascist.

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Response to villager (Original post)

Tue May 12, 2015, 10:30 AM

95. I can't think of many jobs where this sort of thing might be acceptable...

... and they are all life-or-death sorts of things.

Is anyone going to die? Is anyone going to suffer permanent injury?

If not it can wait until the morning.

True 24/7 work, say the electric company or the hospital, simply ought to hire enough people to cover all the shifts. Even sparse on-call work should be split between at least two people, preferably more. People ought to be "off leash" most of the time otherwise they are some sort of slave.

It's not like there's any shortage of people looking for work.

We the People ought to declare war on these sorts of scummy employer practices and outlaw them.

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Response to hunter (Reply #95)

Tue May 12, 2015, 06:31 PM

124. Agree this is abusive, but unlikely to change in a very loose labor market. Employers call

the shots and know it. They're also into using data, computers and tracking a lot. There are cases when people have missed car loan payments and their vehicle is remotely 'killed' (Chris Hayes, MSNBC). It's a very crazy world.

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Response to villager (Original post)

Tue May 12, 2015, 02:06 PM

100. Stupid is carrying your work issued cell phone while off duty

My vote, if on a jury, would be "tough shit, lady."

My sentence would be a term in Remedial Thinking class.

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Response to Stinky The Clown (Reply #100)

Tue May 12, 2015, 02:07 PM

101. Stupid is not bothering to read the article

and thus discovering the company required her to carry it 24/7. Powered on. And not in airplane mode.

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Response to jeff47 (Reply #101)

Tue May 12, 2015, 02:36 PM

103. Fine quit, and go find another job with an $85+K annual salary.

I'm serious, at that level of salary, you quit if you really don't like something. At a lower salary, I think it's a different situation.

Personally, I'm not sure why the employer does this. I bet they don't do a lot of checking, if any, after normal business hours.

I'm even less certain why the lady doesn't just put her phone in the bathroom when she gets home and go do whatever she thinks might be an invasion of privacy. I would, or I'd walk in and ask the employer to bend over while I give them their phone back.

Again, if the employer is digitally stalking or harassing people, that's different.

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Response to Hoyt (Reply #103)

Tue May 12, 2015, 03:21 PM

105. She didn't quit. She was fired.

She un-instaleld the app and was fired.

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Response to LisaL (Reply #105)

Tue May 12, 2015, 04:45 PM

112. She should have just quit rather than breaking the rules, as stupid as rules were.

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Response to jeff47 (Reply #101)

Tue May 12, 2015, 05:40 PM

122. Rude is stating your disagreement in that manner

Nice personalizing.

I should say Fuck you. But I won't. So I am not saying fuck you to you.

Now go alert on me.

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Response to Stinky The Clown (Reply #122)

Wed May 13, 2015, 08:15 AM

137. So Hoyt calling someone stupid is just fine, but Hoyt not bothering to

read the story and thus erroneously calling them stupid means he's great?

Suuuurre.

And no, I'm not going to alert on you. I want everyone to see your brilliant writing.

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Response to villager (Original post)

Tue May 12, 2015, 02:10 PM

102. While Ars is going to focus on the "tech" part of the story, we're ignoring something

I think we shouldn't ignore that her boss called up her second job and got her fired.

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Response to villager (Original post)

Tue May 12, 2015, 03:15 PM

104. unacceptable

 

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Response to villager (Original post)

Tue May 12, 2015, 03:25 PM

107. its not a guestion of taking a job like this

 

its a guestion of there being a job like this .Our need for conveniences creates slavery plain and simple ........ooooh remember that cash stuff ?

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Response to villager (Original post)

Tue May 12, 2015, 04:54 PM

114. She COULD have had some "fun" with her boss...

She should have taken her phone and placed it in a magnetic box like a Hide-a-key and attached it to his car and let him drive around with it for the weekend or evening. Add this up over time, prepare the report which shows an absolute coincidental placement of him and her and threaten to show it to the soon-to-be-aggrieved spouse/partner to "prove" that they'd been having an affair during the off-hours.

Or even better, she could put it on the car of the spouse/partner when the boss is at work and when the report shows that she's hanging around at all weird hours with that individual...uh-oh!

Hilarity Ensues!!!

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Response to PCIntern (Reply #114)

Tue May 12, 2015, 05:11 PM

119. Not really, she'd then just be fired for not being available or responsive.

It seems many or even most have not a clue of actual 24/7 on call.

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Response to TheKentuckian (Reply #119)

Tue May 12, 2015, 05:40 PM

121. It was a JOKE...

remember those?

I know what 24/7 on call means...I've LIVED it for 35 years.

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Response to PCIntern (Reply #114)

Tue May 12, 2015, 06:44 PM

127. Suddenly "American Beauty" is brought to mind...

 

...when one thinks of Kevin Spacey's "negotiation" when leaving his job...!

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