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Tue Jun 23, 2015, 03:02 PM

What ever happened to DU's H2O Man?

[A] Strength vs. Power: What is Behind Them

National Geographic: “What is the greatest power?”

Tadodaho Leon Shenandoah: “I myself have no power. It’s the people behind me who have the power. Real power comes from the Creator. It’s in His hands. But if you’re asking about strength, not power, than I can say that the greatest strength is gentleness.”


Sometimes when I read a number of OP/threads on DU:GD, I imagine this forum as a model of the human brain. Various forum members make contributions that I apply to various sections of that brain, including from the most evolved layers that distinguish our species from all of our relatives on earth. Others contribute thoughts or feelings that I attribute to the various other sections, right down to the bulb of our brain’s stem.

When that joyous season we call “the presidential primaries” come around, it is if they “waking brain” and the “sleeping brain” (highly technical terms, I know) are both turned on and highly active, both simultaneously and at the same time (one descriptive term for each level). The tensions between the two are charged by the various electrical impulses that energize the forum/brain.

Often, one section of the community will say, “But DU does not represent the United States electorate.” I say, “Thank goodness!” Could you imagine if we were condemned to spend time inside a republican party brain? Yikes! Far more pleasurable to be here.

Even in this DU brain, we note that some segments, or sub-systems, are convinced that they are the “real” form of high consciousness, and thus attempt to silence what they view as annoying thoughts that keep popping up. Thus, we see that a lot of the primary debates tend to be less about the individual candidate, and more about the individual(s) behind them. And that’s good, for we should know who supports what candidate, and why.

In fact, when we are deciding upon who will be president, we should consider who is behind their campaigns, and why.


Respect

Onondaga Chief Paul Waterman: “It’s hard for people from one culture to really understand another. There’s a site in West Virginia, where I have been asked to rebury 664 remains. But they are held in an Ohio museum. The people in Ohio asked me why I want to rebury people in West Virginia. And here I was wondering why they want to dig them up?

“I’m not sure everything can be explained. Some things you either understand, or you just don’t. Maybe the goal should be to teach respect for other people, even if you don’t fully understand them.”


When I read something on DU:GD, no matter if I agree or disagree with it, I tend to try to assign it to some reference point -- or, “file” -- in my brain. Frequently, I’m able to do that with some degree of accuracy. I “know” some people here, and am familiar enough with certain topics, that I am comfortable in doing that. I assume that I know what they are “really saying.” The problem in doing that -- both here and in real life -- is that sometimes I’m wrong. That’s part of being human, of course; the only people who honestly believe they approach every person and topic with a completely open mind are those incapable of being fully honest with themselves.

No matter if I am fully correct, totally incorrect, or somewhere in that wide range found in between, I have the constant option of having respect for the other person ….if not his or her opinion or actions. That, of course, can be difficult. Sometimes, very difficult -- for example, there are some issues that I think are really clear-cut, and that strike an emotional reaction. Usually, these are issues in which a person’s opinion is closely related to actions that cause some type of injury to others. These can range from people who attempt to justify violence -- from adults who hit kids, to those who advocate war -- to those who seek financial profit from engaging in the destruction of the living environment. “Fracking,” for example, poisons the water that sustains life on earth.

Yet there are many areas where disagreements are not so clearly defined, where there is not only one “correct” answer, or where there really isn’t a “wrong” answer. Thus, because other forum members have had different life-experiences than me, they are going to process some of the same information as me in a very different way. They have different “files” or reference points built into their gray matter. We all do, and that’s a good thing.

Recently, while discussing an area where I have disagreement -- strong disagreement -- with a small group of people who live in my area, my younger son reminded me of something. He said that I have to remember that most people did not grow up with mentors such as Leon Shenandoah, Paul Waterman, or Rubin Carter. Much less all three. So the chances of them viewing the issues in the same way, were rather small. And that even if I was convinced that I was 100% correct, I needed to listen closely to those other people. That I might even learn something.

Peace,
H2O Man

56 replies, 3092 views

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Replies to this discussion thread
Arrow 56 replies Author Time Post
Reply What ever happened to DU's H2O Man? (Original post)
H2O Man Jun 2015 OP
mmonk Jun 2015 #1
H2O Man Jun 2015 #2
mmonk Jun 2015 #4
H2O Man Jun 2015 #23
kentuck Jun 2015 #3
mmonk Jun 2015 #5
H2O Man Jun 2015 #24
kentuck Jun 2015 #36
H2O Man Jun 2015 #40
NRaleighLiberal Jun 2015 #6
H2O Man Jun 2015 #25
RobertEarl Jun 2015 #7
H2O Man Jun 2015 #26
AuntPatsy Jun 2015 #31
G_j Jun 2015 #8
H2O Man Jun 2015 #27
randome Jun 2015 #9
H2O Man Jun 2015 #28
kentuck Jun 2015 #41
H2O Man Jun 2015 #42
Hoppy Jun 2015 #10
H2O Man Jun 2015 #29
Hoppy Jun 2015 #47
sabrina 1 Jun 2015 #11
H2O Man Jun 2015 #32
Gidney N Cloyd Jun 2015 #12
calimary Jun 2015 #21
H2O Man Jun 2015 #34
calimary Jun 2015 #46
H2O Man Jun 2015 #49
H2O Man Jun 2015 #33
Capt. Obvious Jun 2015 #13
H2O Man Jun 2015 #35
panader0 Jun 2015 #14
H2O Man Jun 2015 #39
Flying Squirrel Jun 2015 #15
H2O Man Jun 2015 #43
zeemike Jun 2015 #16
mmonk Jun 2015 #17
H2O Man Jun 2015 #50
zeemike Jun 2015 #56
MisterP Jun 2015 #18
H2O Man Jun 2015 #51
annabanana Jun 2015 #19
H2O Man Jun 2015 #52
byronius Jun 2015 #20
H2O Man Jun 2015 #53
malthaussen Jun 2015 #22
H2O Man Jun 2015 #54
malthaussen Jun 2015 #55
AuntPatsy Jun 2015 #30
seveneyes Jun 2015 #37
lovemydog Jun 2015 #38
kickysnana Jun 2015 #44
Hekate Jun 2015 #45
Ghost in the Machine Jun 2015 #48

Response to H2O Man (Original post)

Tue Jun 23, 2015, 03:06 PM

1. Hi and thanks.

Real wisdom should always be followed as a guide.

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Response to mmonk (Reply #1)

Tue Jun 23, 2015, 03:07 PM

2. Hey!

I think that we were each responding to each other's OP at the same time!

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Response to H2O Man (Reply #2)

Tue Jun 23, 2015, 03:12 PM

4. Well that's how me and you are you know.

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Response to mmonk (Reply #4)

Tue Jun 23, 2015, 05:08 PM

23. That's what

people say .....and I think they're sincere! (grin)

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Response to H2O Man (Original post)

Tue Jun 23, 2015, 03:08 PM

3. To paraphrase a line from a movie...

"I'll have what he's having."

FRACKING MUST STOP !!

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Response to kentuck (Reply #3)

Tue Jun 23, 2015, 03:16 PM

5. Amen

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Response to kentuck (Reply #3)

Tue Jun 23, 2015, 05:11 PM

24. Thanks, Brother Kentuck!

In my opinion, you are --based upon your contributions on DU:GD -- of the part of our community's brain that creates logical insights, based upon rational thought. I always enjoy reading the things you post on DU ....and absolutely appreciate when you add your thoughts to one of my posts.

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Response to H2O Man (Reply #24)

Tue Jun 23, 2015, 05:28 PM

36. How ya doin' ?

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Response to kentuck (Reply #36)

Tue Jun 23, 2015, 05:34 PM

40. I'm good!

Thanks for asking. And how are things your way?

(I have been involved in a few communities' events in a manner which, already today, has resulted in two friends calling to say that they are upset by some peoples' (verbal) attacks on me. I understand why they are upset. But I assure them that I don't feel that stick. I'm comfortable in doing that which I am convinced is right.)

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Response to H2O Man (Original post)

Tue Jun 23, 2015, 03:17 PM

6. as always, thanks, kick and rec

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Response to NRaleighLiberal (Reply #6)

Tue Jun 23, 2015, 05:13 PM

25. Thank you!

It's a strange time in social-political life in our nation. But we can keep DU:GD at a calmer, more open to disagreement place. And your contributions to just that are appreciated!

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Response to H2O Man (Original post)

Tue Jun 23, 2015, 03:22 PM

7. There are two ways of looking at water bodies

 

One is to see just the reflection; The sun or other light shining on the surface.

The other is to look into. To look into one must get around the reflection. And when one does, the realization that there is life in that water, indeed, a whole 'nother world that lives in water, often comes as a great surprise.

Given our bodies are made up mostly of water, are we not looking at a water body when we look at each other?

I'd write more but I have to go pee. <grin>

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Response to RobertEarl (Reply #7)

Tue Jun 23, 2015, 05:16 PM

26. Outstanding!

I love it!

The symbolism of a pond (lake, ocean, etc) is fantastic. And surely, insightful people throughout time have used it this way, to illustrate the various levels of human consciousness.

I'm really happy that you posted this on this OP/thread. It is certainly the stuff of an outstanding OP. (I'll be looking for it!)

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Response to RobertEarl (Reply #7)

Tue Jun 23, 2015, 05:21 PM

31. Recommending this post as well, perfect

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Response to H2O Man (Original post)

Tue Jun 23, 2015, 03:24 PM

8. amen

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Response to G_j (Reply #8)

Tue Jun 23, 2015, 05:17 PM

27. Thanks!

Keep on fighting that Good Fight, my Good Friend!

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Response to H2O Man (Original post)

Tue Jun 23, 2015, 03:27 PM

9. RIP, H20 Man. You will be missed.

 

Oh. Wait. That's not...I didn't...never mind.
[hr][font color="blue"][center]"If you're bored then you're boring." -Harvey Danger[/center][/font][hr]

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Response to randome (Reply #9)

Tue Jun 23, 2015, 05:17 PM

28. I miss him already!

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Response to H2O Man (Reply #28)

Tue Jun 23, 2015, 05:35 PM

41. Time will heal all wounds...

Through the chaos and confusion, his memory lingers still...

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Response to kentuck (Reply #41)

Tue Jun 23, 2015, 05:38 PM

42. And, as John Lennon said,

"Time wounds all heels." I think he meant Nixon and Cheney.

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Response to H2O Man (Original post)

Tue Jun 23, 2015, 03:34 PM

10. I recall reading he was moving to Ireland

 

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Response to Hoppy (Reply #10)

Tue Jun 23, 2015, 05:19 PM

29. November.

I did get a call from my normal brother on Sunday; he said that I need to hurry up and meet him over there. He is finding the Old Sod transformational.

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Response to Hoppy (Reply #10)

Wed Jun 24, 2015, 05:57 AM

47. What is the status of the road rage murder trial?

 

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Response to H2O Man (Original post)

Tue Jun 23, 2015, 03:39 PM

11. I wonder sometimes if there were no political parties how people would respond to certain issues.

When they had no reason to defend a politician, their team, would they look more closely at the issue?

I believe a few of the FFs warned against political parties accurately predicting what would happen once they were established, which happened pretty quickly airc.

Imagine a country where a politician did not have a party machine with all its trappings, pundits, advisers, political 'experts' testing the 'waters' to see what would 'sell' in an election?

My observations, and I was once very much part of it, are that many people will ignore the consequences of decisions being made if the politician and/or party they support are making them.

Great observations, as usual, H20 Man.

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Response to sabrina 1 (Reply #11)

Tue Jun 23, 2015, 05:22 PM

32. Right!

Very good. And exactly on target.

Sometimes, when enough people think in a good way, and are thus influenced to act in that way, it can move mountains. I think that your post, like Lennon's song "Imagine," is about the benefit to human-kind, in moving in that direction.

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Response to Gidney N Cloyd (Reply #12)

Tue Jun 23, 2015, 04:41 PM

21. Yay! I was getting worried.

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Response to calimary (Reply #21)

Tue Jun 23, 2015, 05:26 PM

34. I think that

all of us on DU:GD are stuck with that crusty old character, H2O Man. Such a mean old man. But his sister calimary can always be counted upon to bring rational, up-beat contributions to his forum.

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Response to H2O Man (Reply #34)

Tue Jun 23, 2015, 08:50 PM

46. Awww...

Hugs, bro!

Here. Have some birdies!

[img][/img]

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Response to calimary (Reply #46)

Wed Jun 24, 2015, 09:48 AM

49. Very nice!

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Response to Gidney N Cloyd (Reply #12)

Tue Jun 23, 2015, 05:23 PM

33. Thank goodness!

If I had seen that posted on here before I wrote & posted my OP, I wouldn't have had to write and post it. I already would have.

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Response to H2O Man (Original post)

Tue Jun 23, 2015, 03:44 PM

13. Great power

Great responsibility

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Response to Capt. Obvious (Reply #13)

Tue Jun 23, 2015, 05:26 PM

35. Exactly!

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Response to H2O Man (Original post)

Tue Jun 23, 2015, 03:45 PM

14. "but if you're asking about strength, not power, then I can say that the greatest strength is

gentleness." Truer words were never spoken.

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Response to panader0 (Reply #14)

Tue Jun 23, 2015, 05:31 PM

39. Uncle Leon was

an amazing human being. It was funny: in his later years, he liked to work as a grounds-keeper at Syracuse University. I know this is speculation on my part, but I don't think that many people there knew who that old fellow working with the plants on the campus's lawn really was. But, those who did, counted themselves lucky.

There's a great book that I know you would appreciate, "To Become a Human Being: The Message of Tadodaho Chief Leon Shenandoah."

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Response to H2O Man (Original post)

Tue Jun 23, 2015, 03:52 PM

15. Four letters on his gravestone...

 

TL;DR

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Response to Flying Squirrel (Reply #15)

Tue Jun 23, 2015, 07:28 PM

43. He was an odd fellow .....

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Response to H2O Man (Original post)

Tue Jun 23, 2015, 04:03 PM

16. I think you hit on something there.

The lack of mentors with wisdom.

In this time our only wise men appear in TV screen or on a stage as an image or a show. There is nothing real about it...and the wisdom is questionable.

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Response to zeemike (Reply #16)

Tue Jun 23, 2015, 04:06 PM

17. +1

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Response to zeemike (Reply #16)

Wed Jun 24, 2015, 09:58 AM

50. Right.

Your response got me thinking .....the last time that I can recall a serious televised series on people with wisdom to offer was a series by Bill Moyers, that I believe was called "A World of Ideas." For Moyers had learned of what is known as the Power of Ideas.

My favorite interview, not surprisingly, was with Leon and Paul's nephew, Chief Oren Lyons, a Faith-Keeper at Onondaga. I remember how impressed Mr. Moyers was that the collective wisdom of the Iroquois was an unbroken chain, that went far, far into humankind's past. And that it offered nourishment for hungry minds today -- for, as Oren says, great truths are constant.

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Response to H2O Man (Reply #50)

Wed Jun 24, 2015, 01:48 PM

56. I never got a chance to see that series.

It may have been a time when I did not have TV...but Bill Moyer is a rare intellect on TV.

But I looked it up. it is on you tube and so is chief Chief Oren Lyons...now I have something new to watch.

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Response to H2O Man (Original post)

Tue Jun 23, 2015, 04:16 PM

18. pshaw--even sheep have a neocortex! (KnR)

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Response to MisterP (Reply #18)

Wed Jun 24, 2015, 09:59 AM

51. Even Richard Nixon has got soul.

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Response to H2O Man (Original post)

Tue Jun 23, 2015, 04:32 PM

19. It seems your younger son

did not fall far from the tree....

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Response to annabanana (Reply #19)

Wed Jun 24, 2015, 10:11 AM

52. Thank you!

Even at his young age, I have more regard for his insight and advice on social-political issues, than for that of those I've worked with for longer than he's been alive. Obviously, I've had some influence on him, but not only did he grow up knowing the three gentlemen he mentioned, but he's had formal (and informal) educational opportunities very different from my own. I learn a lot from him!

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Response to H2O Man (Original post)

Tue Jun 23, 2015, 04:40 PM

20. Always the Voice Of Reason. Thank you.

And may nothing ever happen to you that is not Good.

Wait -- on edit -- nothing bad happened to H2OMan, right?

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Response to byronius (Reply #20)

Wed Jun 24, 2015, 10:15 AM

53. Thanks!

(The "title" to this essay was a tongue-in-cheek commentary on some of the negative undercurrents on the forum. Likely one of those sad attempts at humor that is only a giggle for me. But I'm fine. Enjoying life.)

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Response to H2O Man (Original post)

Tue Jun 23, 2015, 05:05 PM

22. I think Aretha agrees with you.



-- Mal

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Response to malthaussen (Reply #22)

Wed Jun 24, 2015, 10:16 AM

54. Beautiful!

Thank you!

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Response to H2O Man (Reply #54)

Wed Jun 24, 2015, 10:23 AM

55. I'm always puzzled by lack of respect...

... well, that's not accurate, I'm not puzzled by it at all, it comes from ignorance (if we are being generous) or the simple desire to put others down (if we are being realistic). But logically, I'm puzzled how anyone can justify telling someone they are not experiencing/have not experienced what they say they have. How do I become the authority on your life?

-- Mal

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Response to H2O Man (Original post)

Tue Jun 23, 2015, 05:19 PM

30. Writing thought provoking honest and sincere ops for us to enjoy, last. Heard

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Response to H2O Man (Original post)

Tue Jun 23, 2015, 05:28 PM

37. Makes me remember D. Ray White

 

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Response to H2O Man (Original post)

Tue Jun 23, 2015, 05:30 PM

38. Thank you H2O Man.

I listen to you and appreciate your thoughts. Sometimes I learn something. Sometimes it's nice knowing there are good hearted people out there. I appreciate reading from all here who have compassion toward the earth and other beings on our often whacky planet.

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Response to H2O Man (Original post)

Tue Jun 23, 2015, 08:14 PM

44. Mentors, routinely have been marginalized, defamed or silenced for many years.

Some notably murdered. We are living in "interesting times".

The total control of the media, the rise of anti-democratic politics in communities, Churches, schools and workplace have made living in America a nightmare for far more than the dream promised by our Bill of Rights and Constitution.

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Response to H2O Man (Original post)

Tue Jun 23, 2015, 08:17 PM

45. KnR, H2O Man. I always read your posts.

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Response to H2O Man (Original post)

Wed Jun 24, 2015, 06:51 AM

48. I mentioned you in a reply a couple of days ago.. see it here...

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