Oklahoma Police Uses New Device To Seize Money from cards

[n2doc]

You may have heard of civil asset forfeiture.

That's where police can seize your property and cash without first proving you committed a crime; without a warrant and without arresting you, as long as they suspect that your property is somehow tied to a crime.

Now, the Oklahoma Highway Patrol has a device that also allows them to seize money in your bank account or on prepaid cards.

It's called an ERAD, or Electronic Recovery and Access to Data machine, and state police began using 16 of them last month.

Here's how it works. If a trooper suspects you may have money tied to some type of crime, the highway patrol can scan any cards you have and seize the money.

more
http://www.news9.com/story/32168555/ohp-uses-new-device-to-seize-money-used-during-the-commission-of-a-crime
They'll be pulling teeth next.

[Eko]

1. Wow,

That seems so unconstitutional, hope that goes away real quick.

[Ilsa]

2. This is so disgusting. One person, not a judge or jury,

Can call you guilty and take your last buck. Shameful.

[dhill926]

3. what in the fuck?

how is this constitutional? Talk about highway robbery...

[dixiegrrrrl]

4. THIS is why:

"It shows the state is paying ERAD Group Inc., $5,000 for the software and scanners, then 7.7 percent of all the cash the highway patrol seizes".

And pre-paid debit cards are used mostly by people who cannot/do not have banking accounts, usually minorities.

Privatizing law enforcement has resulted in false arrests/tickets for speeding, parking, bail, and prison terms, etc all over the country, and when you trace what happened, it is because a private company has contracted with the state for the deeds.
Esp heinous is the now infamous Corrections Corporation of American which has contracts that the state MUST guarantee a minimum number of prisoners
to be provided.

[NutmegYankee]

7. The police/industrial prison complex is the whole reason the War on Drugs remains

Every time a bill to end Civil Asset Forfeiture or the War on Drugs is introduced law enforcement agencies all over the country oppose it and scare law makers to drop the bill. It's a gravy train.

Does anyone think the DEA wants legalization?

[dixiegrrrrl]

28. "Does anyone think the DEA wants legalization? "

No more than doctors /Big Pharma want healthy patients.

[jtuck004]

32. So your statement got me wondering...

http://www.pewtrusts.org/~/media/legacy/uploadedfiles/pcs_assets/2014/prepaidcardssurveyreportpdf.pdf

...
Who uses general purpose, reloadable prepaid cards?

The prepaid cards discussed in this report are debit cards that are not attached to a traditional individual bank
account, can be reloaded with funds, and can be used anywhere that accepts debit cards.

In Pew’s survey, 5 percent of adults (implying roughly 12 million people) used these prepaid cards at least monthly, answering “yes”
to the question “In the past 12 months, have you used a prepaid card that works like a bank debit card but is not
attached to an actual bank account?” and giving a numerical answer of “one” or more to “How many prepaid
cards do you have that you use at least once per month? Please do not include gift cards or rebate cards.”

American consumers from various parts of the demographic spectrum use prepaid cards instead of—or more
commonly in addition to—traditional debit cards linked to checking accounts. Prepaid card users (meaning those
who use the cards at least monthly) have lower incomes than the general population, although 14 percent earn
$75,000 or more annually.Prepaid card users appear to be demographically different from the general population
in several ways. They are:

• More likely to be renters.

• Less likely to be married.

• More likely to earn less than $25,000.

• More likely to be African-American.

• More likely to be younger than 50 years of age.3

See Exhibit 1 for a demographic profile of prepaid card users.

Even after accounting for income, homeownership, marital status, and retirement status, the odds of using a
prepaid card are higher for African-Americans, parents, and those under age 50. This result suggests that these
demographic characteristics are more strongly associated with prepaid card usage than the others tested in the
sample. This analysis also confirms that retired people and married people are less likely to use prepaid cards.
The results of the regression analysis are reported in the appendix. These results should not be understood to
imply that any of these characteristics causes prepaid card usage.
...

Huh. Wonder if they knew this?

Seems like it would be a great way to finance a plantation. Or a piece of a state budget.

[dixiegrrrrl]

47. Excellent find!

Also, those on Disability, food stamps, unemployment insurance income and even Soc. Sec. who do not have a banking account,
are paid in a debit card, and have to pay fees for using it.
JP Chase is the maker of the majority of debit cards, and gets the money from the fees.
A LOT of money.

[spanone]

39. republican wet dream, privatization...making crime really pay

[SamKnause]

5. This country is imploding.

All citizens in this country are viewed as criminals, or future criminals.

The justice system is racist, corrupt, and violent.

Citizens are being abused by their government financed with their tax dollars.

I will like to see these machines used on Wall Street, K Street, C Street, and D.C.

That is where the real crimes are being committed and where all the ill gotten lout is.

My nephew graduated Sunday.

He is going to college to get a Criminal Justice Degree.

He wants to be a police officer.

[GummyBearz]

16. And yet we wonder...

I agree with everything you just said. And yet we wonder why anyone gravitates toward the libertarian party. Duh. There are aspects of our government that are fucked up beyond belief.

[NutmegYankee]

6. What an absolute Police State Act!

This is literately highway robbery! An armed man is stealing money from people on the highway.

[SamKnause]

8. The highway that the people's taxes paid for.

If people don't think the U.S. is a police state, they have not be paying attention.

[NutmegYankee]

9. It's been steadily getting worse, and people keep backing it.

But then again, indicators have been trending away from belief in Liberty and Democracy for the last few decades. In fact, a full third of Americans want a dictatorship with a strong leader.

Terrifying!

[SamKnause]

10. This will only escalate if the citizens become more divided.

Bernie always talks about unity.

Trump always talks negatively about the 'others'.

I think the Republican party should be changed to The All White Party.

[annabanana]

14. ,,

"“The illusion of freedom will continue as long as it's profitable to continue the illusion. At the point where the illusion becomes too expensive to maintain, they will just take down the scenery, they will pull back the curtains, they will move the tables and chairs out of the way and you will see the brick wall at the back of the theater.”
~~ Frank Zappa

[Jim Beard]

24. Very good logic

[Lancero]

11. Robbery in the 21st century folks.

It's no longer the guys breaking into your house to lift valuables that are the biggest threat - They, at least, leave a person enough to live on. No, now we've got the cops who are all the willing to take any and everything you have, without care for your survival.

These days, I'd sooner trust a admitted robber than I would a cop. The robber is, at least, honest.

[Jerry442]

12. You can't win.

If you manage to conceal your cash and cards where they can't find them, they'll notice you're traveling without spending money and rip your vehicle apart looking for the "evidence" and when they find it, they'll use the concealment as evidence of your "guilt".

[JonathanRackham]

13. Bullshit.

The police state should be disbanded.

Where's the due process?

[Delmette]

15. The moral of the story is...

Don't travel to Oklahoma. And move out ASAP.

Maybe a boycott is in order.

[lpbk2713]

17. So just one LEO can basically not like the way you comb your hair ...

and ruin your whole life.

Tell me these gorillas are not out of control.

Okla won't ever see me as a tourist. Not even passing through.

[GummyBearz]

18. Holy balls

What if you only carry a credit card? Can they use their scanner to just max that out? Shit... I pay my mortgage through electronic wire transfers, wtf happens when they drain my bank account and the next bill is due? This is crazy.

Call your congressman RIGHT FUCKING NOW!!!!!

[moondust]

19. wow

I wonder how hard they're working to track down and collect the unpaid taxes on the millions that their wealthy tax evaders are likely parking offshore. But that might anger the rich guys who own them so they'd better just stick with robbing nailing the poor who make easy targets and can't afford to fight back. Reminds me of Ferguson, MO.

[SCVDem]

20. Sorry Sooners!

Oklahoma is NOT Ok!

I will avoid anything from there, college football included.

What would Merle say?

[Stonepounder]

21. And it gets even better.

If you are subject to 'civil asset firfeiture', YOU have to go to court to try and prove that you AREN'T involved in a crime. In other words, you have to prove a negative. And, of course, they will try and tie you up in court forever until either your lawyer gets all your money or you give up and settle with them for pennies on the dollar. And you have no recourse.

I don't understand why someone like the ACLU hasn't managed to get this before the SCOTUS as a clear and obvious violation of the Fifth Amentment - no person shall be deprived ... of property ... without due process of law.

No way is a state trooper, by himself, according you due process when he take your money and tells you you need to prove yourself innocent to get it back. Whatever happened to 'innocent until proven guilty'?

[ReRe]

22. Oklahoma is one of those states...

... that you just really don't want to travel through, much less stop for the night. This story right here sounds like the Highway Patrol is the MOB.

[tclambert]

25. This is a clear violation of the 5th amendment.

No person shall be held to answer for a capital, or otherwise infamous crime, unless on a presentment or indictment of a Grand Jury, except in cases arising in the land or naval forces, or in the Militia, when in actual service in time of War or public danger; nor shall any person be subject for the same offence to be twice put in jeopardy of life or limb; nor shall be compelled in any criminal case to be a witness against himself, nor be deprived of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor shall private property be taken for public use, without just compensation.

The bolded part is where the violation of civil rights occurs. The authorities cannot take your property without due process of law. That doesn't mean the process of swiping your card through some kind of scanner. It means a court has to get involved.

Don't any of these people believe in the Constitution any more?

[elehhhhna]

27. Also, now that $ = speech, this violates 1A

Right?

[Omaha Steve]

26. Stay out of Oklahoma!

K&R!

OS

[sinkingfeeling]

29. Agree. I live about 20 miles from Oklahoma and have

vowed never to cross the border.

[pennylane100]

30. So if you are going to carry credit cards and bank debit cards with you,

make sure they have been stolen from someone in law enforcement. Although that might show up when the card is scanned.

However once we have lost the right to keep our own money from being legally stolen, we will eventually reach a tipping point where we will view the police as predators and feel entitled to treat them as such.

[Hulk]

31. How can they even rationalize this is being something for the common good ?

This sounds unreal like something you would expect in a country with no laws are no protection for the citizen. How do they justify this kind of action ?

[nilram]

33. I suspect your kidney was tied to a crime! Hand it over!

And hand over those corneas, too, buster.

[MadLinguist]

34. well shit, if these dumb fuqqs are using this device, its clear

this damn e-robbery device is out there for thieves of all kinds. The OK Highway Patrol trooper looting just the beginning of this kind of stick-up.

[Shandris]

35. Mmm, love me some status quo.

By the way, remember: your vote, and your opinion, matters! Anyone saying otherwise is a conspiracy theorist and you should reject those voices because they always claim tyranny is right around the corner but everyone knows there is NO tyranny.

I can't imagine why anyone would have a problem with this. Only criminals don't mind if cops can take their money. If your money is legally earned, what do you have to fear? Sounds like a tinfoil hat problem to me.

Do I really need the tag?

[Live and Learn]

37. +1000 nt

[gregcrawford]

36. And we thought the Nazis were bad... n/t

[Odin2005]

38. WTF happened to the 5th Amendment protections against authorities taking our stuff?

[awoke_in_2003]

41. Guilty until proven innocent

And even then, fuck you. USA!!!

[eppur_se_muova]

42. To repeat: I will NOT be going to OK anytime soon,for ANY reason. Total travel boycott. nt

[Octafish]

43. It's how they stop terrorists.

In addition to taking one's dough, ERAD shreds the Constitution and sets afire the Bill of Rights.

Win for Fascism!

[NaturalHigh]

44. I read this story earlier. It's scary that they have this much power.

[Johnny2X2X]

45. Sickening

To those talking about unconstitutionality, all this asset seizure stuff have been law for decades now, they'll keep this too.

And you know how it will be used, the police will threaten people with it to get them to admit to crimes. Or the police will simply want to teach an uppity minority a lesson.

This says "all cards" I assume that means credit cards too. Can you imagine how devastating this could be? You're driving to grandma's house with your kids, you get pulled over in a bad neighborhood and the officer doesn't like your attitude so he takes your wallet and processes every card in it. Your bank account is now empty, your credit cards are now maxed out, the prepaid phone card you had for your daughter at college is no maxed out. The officer lets you drive away, but you run out of gas because you literally are worth zero cents now. Your mortgage was being debited from your bank account so now you'll miss a house payment, several other bills will be taken out, so your account will no be overdrawn and you'll pay $hundreds in bank fees. Maybe you had some money set aside for your kid's birthday party next week, well, the police now have that too. And of course you'll have no money to pay a retainer for a lawyer to try to get your assets back. Your credit is ruined, you're penniless and now hearing from the bank about your missed mortgage payment. A total nightmare.

Of course the police are going to abuse this much much worse than I've described, they are always creative when it comes to abuse. Oklahoma is the reddest of states so I bet this flies there because they know the police will use this almost exclusively on minorities.

[Blue_Tires]

46. No way this survives a court challenge...

[Johnny2X2X]

49. See above

It's no different than forfiture laws that have survived since the 80s.

[Initech]

48. And that's why I will never sign up for Samsung Pay or Apple Pay, ever. EVER.

[NaturalHigh]

50. Kick for visibility.