Your feel-good 3rd-party vote could cost you the supreme court, for decades

[lindysalsagal]

http://thehill.com/blogs/ballot-box/presidential-races/289859-third-party-support-surging

Ralph Nader’s “2.5 percent in Florida was almost certainly the deciding factor” in the 2000 general election, Murray noted.

“This is why the national polling isn’t all that important anyways. It’s state by state: How close are these states, what are these candidates doing, and are they polling disproportionately in the state?”

Johnson and Stein will likely perform better in some heavily partisan states where voters don’t feel that their vote will actually matter, but Johnson specifically is showing traction in some closer ones.

If the 2-second gratification to stick it to HRC and fRump determines your entire decision-process, you're shooting yourself in the foot.

Depending on if you're in a swing state or not, you might lose your union, pension, social security, health insurance, medicare, and everything else middle and working class people depend on.

Is that one second of satisfaction worth putting the future of our country at risk? Really?

[LWolf]

1. I'd give you a substantive answer,

except that it would violate DU's TOS.

Since that's the case, why would you post this here where a rebuttal is not allowed? It seems kind of anti-democratic, and a stereo-typical bullying tactic, to accuse and attack those who aren't allowed to respond.

disclaimer: I am not suggesting in any way that any DUer ought to vote 3rd party; just that if people can't discuss reasons FOR that choice, then others should not be able to attack them for choices they haven't even expressed.

[ismnotwasm]

2. Perhaps it's rhetorical

Ad people posting on DU are presumed to be voting for Hillary.

[LWolf]

3. That's always the answer.

"It's rhetorical."

And yes, we are all presumed to be voting for HRC, which is exactly my point. Why ask a question of those who don't fit?

Rhetorical techniques are used to persuade those who don't agree. A rhetorical question here is usually nothing more than a rant, since there's nobody to persuade, or, if there are, they can't respond or rebut. A rant and attack against people who can't respond: again, stereotypical bullying.

[ismnotwasm]

5. No--because on this site, there is a level of frustration with third party voters

Who aren't posting here anyway. The third party vote is meaningless, other than a gesture, it changes nothing. The OP should be allowed to express this without being accused of bulling.

I think you can defend or explain, rather, peoples chioices of third party in such a way to create conversation, if that is your desire.

[LWolf]

9. So,

as I just pointed out, it's not "rhetorical." It's a rant. An attack that can't be answered.

And yes, I can defend and explain, whether I agree with it or not, but I cannot do so here because of the TOS. THAT's why it's bullying.

[lindysalsagal]

11. You can decide that stop signs are bullying, if you need to take everything personally.

However, since the race has actually tightened, and new people come on here who are looking for help with the finer details, I consider the supreme court the major detail that superscedes all other details.

But if you want to play kill the messenger, be my guest.

You will have missed the point: We cannot have fRump seating the supreme court, at any cost.

[LWolf]

13. lol

While I don't agree with the method, I certainly agree with this point: I don't want Donald Trump in the WH doing ANYTHING, let alone seating the Supreme Court.

I don't take it "personally." I just get sick of seeing people here attack those who can't respond in open, constructive, discussion. It is, imo, pusillanimous. Blaming 3rd party voters for losses instead of the party or candidate that couldn't earn the votes, or, in the case of 2000, election fraud, is a deflection that doesn't help anyone or anything.

[KG]

4. I lulz'd

[True_Blue]

6. As a Bernie supporter

I'll be casting my vote for Hillary. The thought of Trump as POTUS absolutely terrifies me! This isn't the first time my candidate didn't win the Democratic nomination and it probably won't be the last, but I'm a hard core Democrat and have always voted for whoever the Democratic candidate is.

[demmiblue]

7. Revisionist history.

Why don't Dems place the fault where it truly belongs? It is easier to blame Nader voters than to place the blame squarely where it belongs: election fraud by Republicans, Dems voting for Bush, voter caging, deplorable voting conditions aimed at minorities and the Supreme Court (which is the ultimate party to blame). Good lawd, grow a backbone already!



No, I didn't vote for Nader. No, I won't vote third party this election either. Any republican would be a nightmare, having Trump as president would be like living in Dante's Inferno (ok, slightly hyperbolic, but it would be awful).

[LWolf]

10. +1

[CBGLuthier]

15. Gee, I always felt the real reason the 2000 election was even close was because of

the unfortunate behavior of president Bill Clinton. Why will absolutely no one here admit that was a factor. That slack-jawed fucker Bush would not have had a chance without the ammunition provided by Bill Clinton's bad behavior. I blame that more than anything for the fucking Bush administration. That election should not have even been close.

[Sherman A1]

21. Agreed

and Gore did not run a really good campaign. I seem to recall he did not carry his home state of Tennessee.

[Arazi]

19. + another 1. Unfortunately the false revisionist story reigns here on DU

Perniciously. I didn't vote for Nader and am 100% with her in 2016 so no skin off my nose about third parties, I just hate us looking like idiots about history

[Oldem]

8. Michelle Obama,

in her speech at George Mason, said that the President's win over Romney largely rest on 9 votes per precinct in Ohio and 6 votes per precinct in Florida. I'd not heard that, and it stunned me. Nader's 2.5% was a huge factor compared to that; it swung the election. Mrs. Obama's point emphasized the need for every voter to vote, because the notion the one vote doesn't matter is obviously disproved. "Don't boo; vote!"

[LyndaG]

12. You're right

The nightmare of the 2000 election will never be forgotten. I love Senator Sanders, but spite is not an option for me - Too much to lose and too many would be hurt by a Trump presidency and a Republican Congress.

[CBGLuthier]

14. Some Americans have no respect for democracy. Extortion is no way to run a country

[Stuckinthebush]

16. Absolutely

Of course you will still find a very small contingent of closet Greens here who will try to tell you that Nader had nothing to do with it. Everyone else knows the truth. The greens caused a great deal of harm to their cause in 2000. The good news is their candidate this time is terrible and I think most have learned the lesson.

[Rocknrule]

17. These people infuriate me

"I'd rather see the whole world get nuked by President Trump than vote against my conscience and my precious sensibilities! Revolution takes sacrifice and I'm willing to throw my LGBT, female, and minority friends under the bus to accomplish that! If more blacks fall victim to another Dylann Roof or George Zimmerman, if my gay friends lose their right to marry, if my poor friends end up living in cardboard boxes, SO BE IT! I don't have anything to lose, I'll just smoke pot in Mommy and Daddy's basement for the next 4-8 years!"

And they complain when people call them out as the petulant, spoiled, self-righteous babies they are.

[lindysalsagal]

22. ^^^^THIS^^^^^

Thank you. Many fragile, vulnerable people will be hurt by a fRump regime. I'll personally be fine, because my circumstances allow me more independence than most. But it's selfish to forget that many depend on the government entitlements that the GOP want to repeal, like health care.

[Rocknrule]

23. Trump should promise to re-criminalize marijuana nationwide

They'll fly off their couches to vote for Hillary so fast they'll get whiplash

[Warren DeMontague]

18. Bernie Sanders: This is not the time for a protest vote

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/post-politics/wp/2016/09/16/bernie-sanders-this-is-not-the-time-for-a-protest-vote/

[Initech]

20. The third party candidates are worse than anything else.

I can't believe any sane person would vote for Jill Stein or Gary Johnston.