Trump had a shinning moment during the first debate

[livingonearth]

Well, not really. But, my town's local right- wing radio station seemed to think Trump was in command when he talked about NAFTA and trade last night. I find that quite interesting, and it makes me want to ask a question of the Trump supporters. Here it is:

Unions, often associated with Liberals and the Left, have historically been the ones against NAFTA. Does that mean Unions, and people on the Left have been right all along in their opposition to NAFTA?

I think this would be a good question to ask the Trump supporters, especially those that consider themselves conservative.

[forest444]

1. And lest we forget Poppy Bush proposed, negotiated, and drafted NAFTA.

Clinton merely signed it.

I mention that because Rethugs have done a very good job of shifting the blame for the rightfully-hated NAFTA onto Democrats by way of the fact that Clinton signed the damned thing - along with that crook Mulroney and Salinas the murderous narco, which certainly didn't help matters.

The problem, as always, isn't so much Democrats and Republicans, as it is the fact that corporate America has largely hijacked our democracy. NAFTA is probably one of the best examples of that problem.

[PeteSelman]

2. "Merely" signed it?

Signing it was everything.


Let's not pretend that wasn't a terrible thing to do.

[forest444]

6. That it was.

It was, second only to signing Gramm-Leach-Bliley in 1999, probably the best example of the kind of "New Democrat" capitulation that got Clinton in trouble with so much of his own Democratic base (and rightfully so).

Nevertheless, we should keep in mind that NAFTA was very much a Republican president's initiative - one, in fact, which Poppy Bush proudly considered part of his legacy at the time and regretted not being able to sign himself.

[livingonearth]

7. You got that right.

The problem, as always, isn't so much Democrats and Republicans, as it is the fact that corporate America has largely hijacked our democracy. NAFTA is probably one of the best examples of that problem.

I find it hard to believe that Trump will ever actually go against corporate America. Hell, he is corporate America.

[forest444]

9. Exactly.

That - your point at the end - would, above anything else, be what I would want our conservative friends to understand.

Even more than the fact he's a sleazebag, even more than his being a runaway crook. What they need to understand is that with friends like his, having Trump in the White House would be - barring the many differences - a little like having Fulgencio Batista as President of Cuba in his day:

He may have been the head of state; but Meyer Lansky called the shots (and we all know how that turned out).

[The_Casual_Observer]

3. He has nothing new to say on any issues that

Haven't been the standard gripe for the last 20 years. I don't know why any of this bluster is all of a sudden "winning"

As a matter of fact, the republicans have been in favor and pushed through every
One of these trade deals and have protected the interests of the multinationals every time.

Does Trump actually believe that the republican congress would reverse all that shit?

[PJMcK]

4. Donald Trump did have one moment of brilliance

When he sneaked in a plug for his new hotel, he said (I'm paraphrasing), "I'll get to Pennsylvania Avenue one way or another."

All of us burst out laughing at that one!

[livingonearth]

8. Yeah, that got a big laugh from the group I was watching with too.

[chowder66]

5. "The press thought Trump’s first 30 minutes were his best. They were his worst."

Snip...

"What was stylistically Trump’s best portion of the debate was substantively among his worst (I say among his worst because it is hard to beat the section where he said he both would and would not honor the NATO treaty, and then said he both would and would not adhere to the first-strike doctrine on nuclear weapons). Trump was arguing the central economic theory of his campaign — and he was just wrong. In a section that began with him demanding solutions for our economic woes, he showed himself completely confused as to the nature of not just our economic problems but the underlying labor market.

The tone of his voice and the confidence of his delivery shouldn’t distract us from the hollowness of his remarks."

http://www.vox.com/policy-and-politics/2016/9/27/13076848/trump-trade-debate

[standingtall]

10. The only reason Trump looked okay for the first 15-20 minutes

Of last nights debate was because Hilary was polite enough to let him take his time to say what he wanted. As she should've. Any body can look good if they can just blabber without anyone to respond to them. After Hilary began to respond Trump fell apart. Trump rudely interrupted her countless times. Interrupting and shouting over people probably works well in a 17 candidate debate format. Like the republican primary,because in that environment you probably need to resort to those tactics to get noticed,but it does not work when it is a one on one situation where your opponent has ample time to fire back. Either Trump does not listen to his advisers or his advisers were as delusional as him in thinking that what worked in the primary was going to work in a completely different environment facing a completely different demographic as the audience.