HomeLatest ThreadsGreatest ThreadsForums & GroupsMy SubscriptionsMy Posts
DU Home » Latest Threads » Forums & Groups » Main » General Discussion (Forum) » Wow, the Deplorables real...

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 09:55 AM

Wow, the Deplorables really don't like us






Why Rural America Voted for Trump


Knoxville, Iowa — One recent morning, I sat near two young men at a coffee shop here whom I’ve known since they were little boys. Now about 18, they pushed away from the table, and one said: “Let’s go to work. Let the liberals sleep in.” The other nodded.

They’re hard workers. As a kid, one washed dishes, took orders and swept the floor at a restaurant. Every summer, the other picked sweet corn by hand at dawn for a farm stand and for grocery stores, and then went to work all day on his parents’ farm. Now one is a welder, and the other is in his first year at a state university on an academic scholarship. They are conservative, believe in hard work, family, the military and cops, and they know that abortion and socialism are evil, that Jesus Christ is our savior, and that Donald J. Trump will be good for America.

They are part of a growing movement in rural America that immerses many young people in a culture — not just conservative news outlets but also home and church environments — that emphasizes contemporary conservative values. It views liberals as loathsome, misinformed and weak, even dangerous.

...

While many blame poor decisions by Mrs. Clinton for her loss, in an environment like this, the Democratic candidate probably didn’t matter. And the Democratic Party may not for generations to come. The Republican brand is strong in rural America — perhaps even strong enough to withstand a disastrous Trump presidency.

Rural conservatives feel that their world is under siege, and that Democrats are an enemy to be feared and loathed.
Given the philosophical premises Mr. Watts presented as the difference between Democrats and Republicans, reconciliation seems a long way off.



http://tinyurl.com/zp4hfea




183 replies, 19472 views

Reply to this thread

Back to top Alert abuse

Always highlight: 10 newest replies | Replies posted after I mark a forum
Replies to this discussion thread
Arrow 183 replies Author Time Post
Reply Wow, the Deplorables really don't like us (Original post)
DemocratSinceBirth Jan 2017 OP
ShaquantaBrown Jan 2017 #1
panader0 Jan 2017 #87
secondwind Jan 2017 #128
Hortensis Jan 2017 #139
Ligyron Jan 2017 #161
yallerdawg Jan 2017 #2
DemocratSinceBirth Jan 2017 #4
Eliot Rosewater Jan 2017 #27
pangaia Jan 2017 #77
Missn-Hitch Jan 2017 #134
alfredo Jan 2017 #34
Dawson Leery Jan 2017 #158
alfredo Jan 2017 #170
hadEnuf Jan 2017 #88
Mc Mike Jan 2017 #113
Chasstev365 Jan 2017 #3
stevenleser Jan 2017 #30
mountain grammy Jan 2017 #54
ProfessorGAC Jan 2017 #86
Yo_Mama_Been_Loggin Jan 2017 #132
Horse with no Name Jan 2017 #5
Bettie Jan 2017 #13
Horse with no Name Jan 2017 #17
notdarkyet Jan 2017 #123
Ligyron Jan 2017 #162
Tom Rivers Jan 2017 #175
Hortensis Jan 2017 #176
Duppers Jan 2017 #39
3catwoman3 Jan 2017 #43
Bettie Jan 2017 #98
OldRedneck Jan 2017 #150
Maru Kitteh Jan 2017 #160
riversedge Jan 2017 #58
Bozvotros Jan 2017 #159
Raster Jan 2017 #61
Amishman Jan 2017 #38
Horse with no Name Jan 2017 #41
TexasBushwhacker Jan 2017 #154
LT TX Jan 2017 #163
Freedomofspeech Jan 2017 #81
liberaltrucker Jan 2017 #119
Rhythm Jan 2017 #148
Bettie Jan 2017 #100
progressoid Jan 2017 #112
Bettie Jan 2017 #126
Runningdawg Jan 2017 #121
yeoman6987 Jan 2017 #44
Kingofalldems Jan 2017 #97
spin Jan 2017 #101
NewJeffCT Jan 2017 #56
brush Jan 2017 #70
herding cats Jan 2017 #116
tanyev Jan 2017 #6
DemocratSinceBirth Jan 2017 #7
democratisphere Jan 2017 #8
DemocratSinceBirth Jan 2017 #10
LonePirate Jan 2017 #24
uponit7771 Jan 2017 #26
Yo_Mama_Been_Loggin Jan 2017 #135
democratisphere Jan 2017 #147
Initech Jan 2017 #9
whathehell Jan 2017 #46
Yo_Mama_Been_Loggin Jan 2017 #136
whathehell Jan 2017 #142
lapfog_1 Jan 2017 #111
LittleGirl Jan 2017 #174
Orrex Jan 2017 #11
Bettie Jan 2017 #14
Cosmocat Jan 2017 #15
DemocratSinceBirth Jan 2017 #19
Initech Jan 2017 #52
yardwork Jan 2017 #83
ProfessorGAC Jan 2017 #92
Initech Jan 2017 #95
Cosmocat Jan 2017 #117
Initech Jan 2017 #125
Cosmocat Jan 2017 #127
jmowreader Jan 2017 #146
JHan Jan 2017 #55
Different Drummer Jan 2017 #107
libtodeath Jan 2017 #12
treestar Jan 2017 #16
3catwoman3 Jan 2017 #62
Different Drummer Jan 2017 #108
Joe941 Jan 2017 #18
Baitball Blogger Jan 2017 #20
Va Lefty Jan 2017 #21
n2doc Jan 2017 #22
uponit7771 Jan 2017 #25
uponit7771 Jan 2017 #23
Loge23 Jan 2017 #28
Paladin Jan 2017 #29
lunasun Jan 2017 #65
Paladin Jan 2017 #67
progressoid Jan 2017 #115
raging moderate Jan 2017 #31
heaven05 Jan 2017 #32
ileus Jan 2017 #33
MichMary Jan 2017 #66
christx30 Jan 2017 #74
dionysus Jan 2017 #89
Maynar Jan 2017 #172
GeorgeGist Jan 2017 #35
Kingofalldems Jan 2017 #36
Feeling the Bern Jan 2017 #143
RussBLib Jan 2017 #37
47of74 Jan 2017 #167
CanonRay Jan 2017 #40
ToxMarz Jan 2017 #47
Freethinker65 Jan 2017 #59
pstokely Jan 2017 #105
Freethinker65 Jan 2017 #114
Dawson Leery Jan 2017 #155
ProudLib72 Jan 2017 #42
hurple Jan 2017 #45
Girard442 Jan 2017 #48
kimbutgar Jan 2017 #49
BigDemVoter Jan 2017 #50
JNelson6563 Jan 2017 #51
DeminPennswoods Jan 2017 #53
tenderfoot Jan 2017 #57
maddiemom Jan 2017 #60
Raster Jan 2017 #63
LeftinOH Jan 2017 #64
OKNancy Jan 2017 #79
Ghost OF Trotsky Jan 2017 #68
forjusticethunders Jan 2017 #110
Ghost OF Trotsky Jan 2017 #133
Squinch Jan 2017 #166
Ghost OF Trotsky Jan 2017 #179
SammyWinstonJack Jan 2017 #69
JCMach1 Jan 2017 #72
JCMach1 Jan 2017 #71
orleans Jan 2017 #73
leftyladyfrommo Jan 2017 #75
OKNancy Jan 2017 #76
yardwork Jan 2017 #85
47of74 Jan 2017 #165
GoCubsGo Jan 2017 #78
muntrv Jan 2017 #80
Hassin Bin Sober Jan 2017 #82
Locrian Jan 2017 #84
OKNancy Jan 2017 #91
Locrian Jan 2017 #109
bettyellen Jan 2017 #102
WillowTree Jan 2017 #90
DemocratSinceBirth Jan 2017 #93
Bettie Jan 2017 #137
DemocratSinceBirth Jan 2017 #138
rainlillie Jan 2017 #122
Guilded Lilly Jan 2017 #94
hunter Jan 2017 #96
47of74 Jan 2017 #168
mtngirl47 Jan 2017 #99
Lint Head Jan 2017 #103
Blue_Tires Jan 2017 #104
Bradical79 Jan 2017 #106
lark Jan 2017 #118
ananda Jan 2017 #120
BlancheSplanchnik Jan 2017 #124
EvolveOrConvolve Jan 2017 #129
bucolic_frolic Jan 2017 #130
guillaumeb Jan 2017 #131
haele Jan 2017 #145
guillaumeb Jan 2017 #180
Tikki Jan 2017 #140
Feeling the Bern Jan 2017 #141
Darkhawk32 Jan 2017 #144
Iggo Jan 2017 #149
Dawson Leery Jan 2017 #151
baldguy Jan 2017 #152
Maru Kitteh Jan 2017 #153
dubyadiprecession Jan 2017 #156
Jetboy Jan 2017 #157
47of74 Jan 2017 #164
Dawson Leery Jan 2017 #169
LarryNM Jan 2017 #171
Skittles Jan 2017 #173
no_hypocrisy Jan 2017 #177
Vinca Jan 2017 #178
MountCleaners Jan 2017 #181
iluvtennis Jan 2017 #182
GreenEyedLefty Jan 2017 #183

Response to DemocratSinceBirth (Original post)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 09:57 AM

1. Scary Times Ahead

 

I am going to miss Obama.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to ShaquantaBrown (Reply #1)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 01:12 PM

87. Welcome to DU!

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to ShaquantaBrown (Reply #1)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 05:12 PM

128. welcome to DU!

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to ShaquantaBrown (Reply #1)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 06:13 PM

139. Yes, but we only became their #1 enemy when the

Soviet Union collapsed. I saw it with the tremendous ramping up of hostility conservatives turned on Democrats when Bill Clinton was running, to unprecedented levels. When the existential threat strong conservatives always know exists disappeared from without, they focused within.

Putin, ISIS, North Korea, etc., are nothing to be wished for, but hopefully these very real existential threats will help shift the focus of their inevitable hostility and aggression outward again.

Right now people like Bannon are trying very hard to develop an international movement against liberalism and secularism in which our conservatives are joined with Russia's, and even potentially Islam's conservatives, against liberalism and secularism. At least that's the grand idea, but they've only gotten this far by hiding what they're really up to.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Hortensis (Reply #139)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 11:06 PM

161. You know what? You're right now that I think back on it.

This is why I love DU!

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to DemocratSinceBirth (Original post)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 10:01 AM

2. "You can't fix stupid."

Truth is, the feeling is mutual.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to yallerdawg (Reply #2)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 10:08 AM

4. "Rural conservatives feel that their world is under siege, and that Democrats are an enemy..."

"Rural conservatives feel that their world is under siege, and that Democrats are an enemy to be feared and loathed", not Putin or the Russians , for instance.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to DemocratSinceBirth (Reply #4)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 10:51 AM

27. Exactly, and I hope people here realize the only thing preventing them from violence

is the fear of being arrested, otherwise you would see a very different country.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Eliot Rosewater (Reply #27)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 12:44 PM

77. And trump will have his own Waffen SS,

wants to cut the CIA and FBI and NSA budgets... and.......

wants a 'stronger military!' and............

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Eliot Rosewater (Reply #27)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 05:54 PM

134. +1. They would be more than happy to have a "round up" of all sorts.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to DemocratSinceBirth (Reply #4)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 11:04 AM

34. Islam feels under siege and blame the west.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to alfredo (Reply #34)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 10:12 PM

158. Very much alike.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Dawson Leery (Reply #158)

Fri Jan 6, 2017, 01:12 AM

170. Both Christian and Islam conservatives feel they are losing control.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to DemocratSinceBirth (Reply #4)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 01:13 PM

88. It's what they have been brainwashed into believing by the Right Wing propaganda,

while the opposite of that is what is the actual truth.

"the people can always be brought to the bidding of the leaders. That is easy. All you have to do is tell them they are being attacked and denounce the pacifists for lack of patriotism and exposing the country to danger. It works the same way in any country"


Hermann Goering

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to DemocratSinceBirth (Reply #4)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 03:18 PM

113. Yep. Dems are the enemy. But they love Putin. nt.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to DemocratSinceBirth (Original post)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 10:05 AM

3. Yes, I'm sure many young Germans loved the Fatherland in the 30's as much as tbe love "Merica"

 

It seems to me you will never change their minds on the social issues, but we might be able to show them in time how they are being fucked economically.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Chasstev365 (Reply #3)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 10:55 AM

30. Perhaps but its a heavy lift if they currently see Liberals as the article suggests. Which they do.

 

They see any attempt to help workers or the poor as lazy Liberals looking for handouts and they will fight that hard. It's as simple as that.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to stevenleser (Reply #30)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 12:03 PM

54. And it really is "as simple as that"

One dollar of their "hard earned money" might go to someone undeserving, and by undeserving they mean not like them. I'm contually shocked by people who have benefited from government programs railing against others doing the same.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to mountain grammy (Reply #54)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 01:11 PM

86. Problem Is, Granny

That they send in a hundred in taxes, 99.75 goes to people who really need it, 25 cents goes to someone undeserving, and the government sends them back $105. And they think they're the people getting ripped off by the quarter.

They're not going to do the math and they won't take their focus off the quarter.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to stevenleser (Reply #30)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 05:21 PM

132. While many of them collect farm subsidies

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to DemocratSinceBirth (Original post)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 10:09 AM

5. This. This is where I live.

We won't change them. They are indoctrinated.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Horse with no Name (Reply #5)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 10:32 AM

13. They are and most of it comes

directly from the pulpit of their churches.

Oh, I hate this place more every day. Not having had my family here for more than three generations makes me and my kids (who were born here) unwelcome unless they need us to do something for them.

After this election, I don't want anything to do with the horrible people they have demonstrated themselves to be.

I should have known when the Kindergarten teacher told the kids (when coloring a picture of police and fire fighters) that they need to color carefully, she didn't want to see any black or brown faces! Happened when my oldest son was in K, he's a sophomore now.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Bettie (Reply #13)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 10:39 AM

17. Yes. I was planning on getting out this year

But not sure a move is smart on the trump economy.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Horse with no Name (Reply #17)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 04:40 PM

123. Paradise

I've been thinking lately about a bunch of like minded people pooling reources, Buy an island and Have our own country. At least we have ethics. Too Jim Jonestown? Feeling like I need to get out of here.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to notdarkyet (Reply #123)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 11:09 PM

162. lemme know!

I'm down.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to notdarkyet (Reply #123)

Fri Jan 6, 2017, 04:17 AM

175. Since the Election I've thought a liberal/progressive homestead movement would help in resisting

Not on an island but in different communities all across the nation. Basically it would be individuals/families going more sustainable living/off the grid, while getting help from and helping others that are doing the same. Basically producing our own food, clean water, natural building, energy, heating, refrigeration/storage, etc. in a consumers revolt the helps the environment and takes back control against corporate power. It would be different from the religious communes because people of all religions (or none), races, genders, orientations, ages, etc. would be allowed to join in, the only requirements is that everyone respects the rights of each other and the environment. There will be none of the whacko brainwashing far right religion crap and 80 people won't be living together in one house LOL.

It is untelling how big of a disaster Trump is going to unleash on our economy, military (MANY wars are coming, get ready), and how people will be allowed to treat each other when it comes to protections for women/minorities/LGBTQ. I really think that we need to start preparing for the worst and having a plan in place as a progressive community on how to rally together not just in protests/marches, but in life and our survival in general. Progressives everywhere at the very least need to begin downloading PDFs/videos and learning science, learning sustainable agriculture techniques, learning how to build things from Earth materials, learning how solar and wind energy work, learning ways of obtaining and purifying our own water, learning different ways to produce energy and heat, learning alternative ways of refrigeration and cellar storage, and learning how to get by with less.

I'm hoping for the best, I really am, but I just think that there are going to be many scary days ahead and we must be prepared.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Tom Rivers (Reply #175)

Fri Jan 6, 2017, 06:23 AM

176. We really, really need to be chatting with our neighbors.

THAT is how we fight this corruption of their minds. Appealing as an island is right now (my version is returning to California and seceding!), we have to rebuild and reunite America's broken center.

Not by running and abandoning our neighbors and coworkers to Infowars and Breitbart. We need to chat casually, and very courteously, about issues, about ourselves. They won't be able to believe all that hate trash about liberals if they know us. We need to share information that's not getting to them. All without a word of criticism about what we think are their views, and definitely no argument.

We can do it. The typical conservative is not nearly as far right as the wealthy extremists who are packing government with right-wing extremists who don't represent what people want. We have far more in common than than not. The great rift was created out of lies by enemies intent on dividing us.

So we do what we can to undo it. We can use news events as excuses to chat up our common ground and our lack of horns, to gently expose them to information from news sources they're avoiding, and definitely to let them know what they are in danger of losing. Like Social Security, the VA, the USPS, universal public education, etc.

Maybe join them in a little useful worrying about the future. Like, if Medicare is "privatized," who supports Grandma? And she's okay alone now, but will the day come when you have to quit your job to provide the 24/7 care she needs?

The lunch room is just one of the places in daily life where we can loosen the clutch of the likes of the Koch brothers and start reconnecting corrupted minds to reality.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Bettie (Reply #13)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 11:25 AM

39. Wow! I'm so sorry.

That must have been impossible to explain to a young kindergarten child.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Bettie (Reply #13)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 11:37 AM

43. "...she didn't want to see any black or brown faces! "

Really? Holy crap. Did your son tell you about this?

A few years ago, I was doing a post-hospitalization followup visit on one of our asthma patients. His mom said they'd had a choice as to which hospital to go to, and she'd decided against Chicago Children's " because it''s too colored there." For a moment, I thougtht she meant that the cheerful color schemes were too bright.

When I realized what she was actually saying, I had a hard time keepiing a neutral expression on my face. I was horrified. To this day, whenever I see her, or one of her kids, that is the first thing I think of. I'm sure she has no idea of the permanent damage she caused to my opinion of her.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to 3catwoman3 (Reply #43)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 01:28 PM

98. My son did tell me this because he was confused

because he knows faces come in lots of colors.

I talked to her and she said it was about following directions, not race. I pointed out that if that was the case, she could have said "no green or blue faces". Never got an answer, but I do know she never put it quite that way again. My second son had her the next year and they didn't have the same exercise at all.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to 3catwoman3 (Reply #43)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 09:26 PM

150. About three years ago . .

 

I'm an Advanced Life Support EMT in a rural, republican Virginia county.

We responded to a single-vehicle wreck one Sunday morning . . . wife driving, husband passenger, got to arguing then fighting, lost control rolled the car. We extricated them and put 'em in separate ambulances. The EMT assisting me was a black guy - - - the husband shouted "I don't want that n***** to touch me." I resisted the urge to smack him in the head with an oxygen bottle, instead, I told the cops what he said.

Cops asked me if he was hurt badly enough to go to the ER . . . told them No . . . they slapped the cuffs on him, hauled him out of the ambulance, took him off to regional jail overnight, charged him . . . among other things . . . with interfering with emergency services personnel.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to OldRedneck (Reply #150)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 10:28 PM

160. I LOVE a good, good-cop story, especially a good red-state good-cop story.

Cheers to the officer for doing the right thing and sticking that A-hole in his place!

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Bettie (Reply #13)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 12:10 PM

58. A lot of the hate--comes also from Hate radio in these rural areas. I had to move

to a small town rural WI--caring for very elderly mom. Barely a place I do where the radio is not blaring out Conservative hate radio.

I am ready to scream.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to riversedge (Reply #58)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 10:17 PM

159. You are exactly right!

We ignore hate radio at our peril. The race baiting, dog whistles, fear mongering and incitement to violence go on every day. The tone is far worse in backwaters where station managers don't fear the FCC and they can play the worst of the worst or use a home grown loon. Liberals and Dems are portrayed in that media in almost demonic terms. And that rural demographic is often wildly over armed because they were sure Obama was coming for their guns.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Bettie (Reply #13)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 12:12 PM

61. Jesus said: Love thy neighbor as they self... as long as he's the same color.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Horse with no Name (Reply #5)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 11:17 AM

38. Where do you live? I live in a very red county and I do not see this.

I'm in Lancaster county PA, and I don't see this level of hate. Yes, there are a few nutjobs, but they are by far the exception.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Amishman (Reply #38)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 11:31 AM

41. I live in deep red east texas.

One of the most ultra religious conservative chokeholds in the country.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Horse with no Name (Reply #41)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 09:44 PM

154. KKKlan country too n/t

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Horse with no Name (Reply #41)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 11:30 PM

163. Me too

Hi neighbor...I live in East TX too. I feel like I'm the only even moderate person around....much less a liberal.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Amishman (Reply #38)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 12:59 PM

81. I live in Westmoreland Co...

Southwestern PA....used to be very blue but is now very red. I hate it so much and now these hillbillies are so emboldened by the piece of crap they voted for. I used to be very active in the area but now I barely leave the house

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Freedomofspeech (Reply #81)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 04:11 PM

119. Howdy neighbor!

Just north of you in Butler. Same here, maybe worse.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Freedomofspeech (Reply #81)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 08:46 PM

148. Just a little south of you, in Monongalia Co., WV...

One would ~think~ that a county dominated by a vibrant University (WVU) and college-town would have stayed 'blue' through this last election mess...
One would be very, very wrong...
~Even Mon. Co.~ went red this last cycle, though by a lesser margin than anywhere else in the state (which doesn't say much)

So sick of these people, already...

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Amishman (Reply #38)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 01:39 PM

100. I'm in rural Iowa

a very small town. Came here for husband's job.

Since I had my kids when I was in my 30's, I'm minimum 10 years older than the moms of my teenage boys (closer to 15 in most cases) and people think I'm my 8 year old's grandma!

Us they don't hate, but we're well known as "big city liberals" even though we've lived here for 15 years. They are dumbfounded that we don't go to church. Most of them can not even fathom why someone wouldn't go.

We do have a few friends, also "outsiders" who have lived here a decade or more and are much more liberal than the natives.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Bettie (Reply #100)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 03:17 PM

112. I was born and raised in small town IA.

When I go home to visit my parents, I'm appalled. They are life-long Democrats in a sea of red. It has always been republican but now it's off the chart crazy. This election has been very hard for them. It has been very distressing for them to see their hometown change into Trumpland.

In the past they could have reasonable relationships with their neighbors etc. Now there is an open hostility and anger everywhere.

But it's not limited to small towns. My wife and I moved back here 25 years ago. We're in a town of 50K and it's the same thing. We are thinking of leaving in a couple years. This state no longer seems like home.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to progressoid (Reply #112)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 04:52 PM

126. Husband and I are from Wisconsin

it certainly isn't the same place we both grew up in anymore. The Wisconsin that re-elected William Proxmire year after year has become the place that prefers Scott Walker.

People have become small and mean as my great-grandmother would say.

They care only for themselves, which is why they have become Republicans, for the "I've got mine, screw you" mentality.

I figured I was just an outsider, weirdly good to know it isn't just me, as sucky as it is.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Amishman (Reply #38)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 04:19 PM

121. I live in OK

and while there are those that hold their tongue in person, all you need to do is read an OK newspapers editorial page to see the hate seething beneath the surface. All they need is a nudge in the right direction to take it to the next level and they believe they elected the nudge.
I am retired but occasionally work in retail. It amazing what people assume. They assume because I look white and have a job, I am a Trump supporter. Then they proceed to tell me how Trump will untie "our" hands to save the US from the evil, godless liberals. I even had one man place his hand on his open carry when he stated that.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Horse with no Name (Reply #5)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 11:44 AM

44. Frombthe story their work ethic is sound

 

Now if we could just get them to have empathy for others would be a start. How to do that? Tough one.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to yeoman6987 (Reply #44)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 01:25 PM

97. Who questioned their work ethic? Answer: No one.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to yeoman6987 (Reply #44)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 01:42 PM

101. To start it might be wise for Democrats to avoid calling such people ...

"deplorable" or "irredeemable" It might also be wise for Democrats to avoid appearing to consider themselves to be better than such people because they have achieved a higher level of education.

Perhaps we start by having empathy for those who voted for Trump and trying to understand why our party is not viewed by far too many as the party of the people or the working man.

Robert Reich: Why the White Working Class Abandoned the Democratic Party
A key turning point in American politics.

By Robert Reich / Robert Reich's Blog January 21, 2016

***snip***

Democrats have occupied the White House for sixteen of the last 24 years, and in that time scored some important victories for working families – the Affordable Care Act, an expanded Earned Income Tax Credit, and the Family and Medical Leave Act, for example.

But they’ve done nothing to change the vicious cycle of wealth and power that has rigged the economy for the benefit of those at the top, and undermined the working class. In some respects, Democrats have been complicit in it.

Both Bill Clinton and Barack Obama ardently pushed for free trade agreements, for example, without providing the millions of blue-collar workers who thereby lost their jobs any means of getting new ones that paid at least as well.

***snip***

Nothing in politics is ever final. Democrats could still win back the white working class – putting together a huge coalition of the working class and poor, of whites, blacks, and Latinos, of everyone who has been shafted by the shift in wealth and power to the top.

This would give Democrats the political clout to restructure the economy – rather than merely enact palliatives that papered over the increasing concentration of wealth and power in America.

But to do this Democrats would have to stop obsessing over upper-income suburban swing voters, and end their financial dependence on big corporations, Wall Street, and the wealthy.
http://www.alternet.org/economy/robert-reich-why-white-working-class-abandoned-democratic-http://www.alternet.org/economy/robert-reich-why-white-working-class-abandoned-democratic-party

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Horse with no Name (Reply #5)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 12:06 PM

56. We don't need to change them all

Just 1, 2 or 3 out of every 100. If 1 vote in 100 swung in the last election, Clinton wins in an electoral landslide (FL, NC, MI, WI and PA) and narrowly loses GA and AZ. The story would be "Is the GOP dead at the presidential level for the next generation?"

If Democrats return to a 50 state strategy and build up state parties in all 50 states, they'll have people that can be boots on the ground in these rural areas to show them what Democrats can do to help. Right now, there are no Democrats to counter-act the 24/7 propaganda they get from the media, churches and other RW organizations.

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2017/01/01/1616174/-Updated:-Why-are-people-surprised-when-a-dysfunctional-community-votes-against-their-self-interests

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Horse with no Name (Reply #5)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 12:29 PM

70. I agree. That's why we have to change the EC to nullify their undue influence on elections.

Their votes should not outweigh votes in more populated areas.

I don't want the Dem party going after these haters.

We have to figure out how to outflank them by also working against repug cheating and hacking like Crosscheck, which discards black, Latino and Asian names off voting rolls, and foisting off provisional ballots onto POCs which are then not counted.

Those are just a couple of repug dirty tricks that we have to concentrate on nullifying.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Horse with no Name (Reply #5)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 03:26 PM

116. It's like where I live, too.

It wasn't always like this, it used to be a handful of nuts, but still a majority conservative Republicans. Over the past 15 years the hate filled nuts have taken over the majority. It's like it was a contagious mental illness that swept through the region.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to DemocratSinceBirth (Original post)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 10:10 AM

6. I don't care much for them either, but I still want them to have health insurance,

Social Security, and food stamps if they need them. They, on the other hand, are happily getting ready to cut off their own noses in order to spite us.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to tanyev (Reply #6)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 10:12 AM

7. As do I reluctantly but we can't hide from inconvenient truths.

"Forewarned is forearmed."

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to DemocratSinceBirth (Original post)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 10:14 AM

8. These facts should NOT be ignored; this is one of the main reasons we lost the election

It will be very difficult to change the thinking of Rural America, but somehow it must be done.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to democratisphere (Reply #8)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 10:16 AM

10. We can mitigate our losses by doing slightly better in other areas.

These people are beyond reach and thankfully represent a small part of the population, less than twenty percent.

I will not hate them in return but I will oppose them with every fiber of my being.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to DemocratSinceBirth (Reply #10)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 10:45 AM

24. Agreed. They are beyond reach. Our time is better spent increasing urban and suburban turnout.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to democratisphere (Reply #8)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 10:46 AM

26. I don't think we'll change all of it but just enough

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to democratisphere (Reply #8)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 05:56 PM

135. Not sure it was rural America

As much as it was the rust belt states like Pennsylvania, Michigan and Wisconsin. These were traditionally Democratic states.

Small towns like the Knoxville Iowa are dying. The population was 7,313 at the time of 2010 census, a decrease from 7,731 in the 2000 census.

One can feel sorry for them even try to help them but numerically I don't think they make much difference.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Yo_Mama_Been_Loggin (Reply #135)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 08:41 PM

147. I traveled through many rural areas and the visual support for

drumpf was widespread, staggering and astounding. There is a real problem and even if rural drumpf supporters represent less than 20% of the voters, it could still be close to 1 in 5 voters support drumpf.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to DemocratSinceBirth (Original post)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 10:15 AM

9. We need to start a new campaign: "I'm liberal and I work".

The fact that the GOP has allowed this flat out lie to go on for as long as it has is something that needs to be dealt with. It's such fucking horseshit that they get to claim the working class as their own and say that we don't work. The truth is we want to make things better for the working class, the republicans want all the money to go to the bosses who make our lives miserable.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Initech (Reply #9)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 11:47 AM

46. Agreed...It amazes me that this lie has gone on as long as it has..

After expressing some liberal view on a blog somewhere, this idiot told me that I was a democrat "because I depended on 'government handouts'"...I responded that since my household income was well into six figures, I didn't need "handouts" from anyone, but I had no problem helping the less fortunate....This is an automatic response in some quarters.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to whathehell (Reply #46)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 06:03 PM

136. I know

And it keeps cracking me up how much more these rural counties depend on the federal government as compared to the urban ones.

The central part of my state, Washington, is not only heavily dependent on farm subsidies but also depends on irrigation from the Columbia Basin Reclamation project. The place would be largely desert without it.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Yo_Mama_Been_Loggin (Reply #136)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 07:51 PM

142. Farm subsidies, yes...

Somehow they fail to see it as "big gubmint".

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Initech (Reply #9)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 03:05 PM

111. Thanksgiving a few years ago

at my sisters in Arizona.

Everyone at the table (sister, her husband, her adult kids, me) with the EXCEPTION of myself were complaining about liberals and how much the government spends on its employees (make work jobs) and the usual crap about liberals (and they know I am a liberal) being on government support, blah, blah, blah.

The kicker... I was the only person NOT taking government money (My brother-in-law is on full disability and works part time off the books, my two nieces work for the county government, my nephew and his wife both work for the state government).

I make the most money of any of them (senior technical person at a large high tech company) and I paid for the entire dinner (my sister and her kids did cook it). I pay more in taxes than any of them make in a year. I'm happy to pay taxes but I get so f'king tired of listening to this crap.

I almost got up and left.

Years later, I have cut off contact with most of them. I'm sure they all voted for Trump.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to lapfog_1 (Reply #111)

Fri Jan 6, 2017, 02:59 AM

174. Sounds like my family!

I am the only one living in AZ (well, in 60 days) and one of my brothers and one sister are right wing NUTS. I mean, listen to Rush everyday and watch Fox news every night. It's brainwashing. And they hate liberals. Absolutely blame us for everything. We rarely speak.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to DemocratSinceBirth (Original post)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 10:24 AM

11. I'm sure that deplorables spend a lot of time trying to understand Liberals

Every day I see a new article urging Liberals to "understand" or "reach out to" deplorables. Where are the blessed peacemakers on their side of the spectrum, given their famous (and endlessly, ostentatiously professed) love of Jesus Christ?

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Orrex (Reply #11)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 10:33 AM

14. I know, I know!

They don't exist.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Orrex (Reply #11)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 10:36 AM

15. Yep!

I have posted this MANY times here.

Does anyone think even ONE as shat conservative has spent even a single moment of his or her life trying to understand or appeal to us?

These people fucking LOATHE us, they literally want to see us die.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Cosmocat (Reply #15)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 10:40 AM

19. I don't want them to die in return... Repeat... I don't want them to die in return.

But I become apoplectic when folks here just say they are misunderstood.

We wouldn't give Americans who voted for Jefferson Davis a pass so why should we give Americans who voted for Trump a pass. That seems like the "soft bigotry of lowered expectations."

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Cosmocat (Reply #15)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 12:00 PM

52. And that rhetoric is repeated ad nauseum.

The hate and lies being spread about us has created a false narrative. Every time I see some jackass trying to hawk a "liberal tears" coffee mug on Twitter and Facebook it makes me just cringe. They just don't get how hateful they are. And the GOP thinks we're out of touch. They want us to understand them, but they don't want to understand us. It's sickening. It works both ways. No I don't want to understand your bigotry and white supremacism. Fuck that shit. I think they're the ones who are out of touch. The people they elect have done nothing but loot and pillage and pass the blame onto us. It's time this ends.

Bill Maher was right - small towns are small for a reason - nobody wants to live there! I mean why should the vote of a person who lives in a town of 500 get more of a say than a person who lives in a city like LA, New York, Chicago, Miami, Portland, Seattle, Dallas, or Denver? I just don't get it.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Initech (Reply #52)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 01:07 PM

83. Nobody wants to live there.

This is an important point. I grew up in an isolated rural area and I left because I wanted to see the world. The other people I grew up with who were intellectually curious, open, engaged, and ambitious also left.

Most of those who stayed are terrified of their own shadows. They are afraid of cities because they fear anybody who is different. These folks are deeply racist and xenophobic. They want to be told how to live by authoritarian figures. They are resentful of everything in the outside world but afraid and unwilling to go out into the world themselves.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to yardwork (Reply #83)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 01:20 PM

92. Depends on How We Define "Rural"

I live in small town and no doubt more people voted for the idiot than HRC.

To the east is corn and soybeans for the next 100 miles. To the west is some industry, then corn and soybeans to Ottawa, then corn and soybeans all the way to Iowa. To the south, same thing.

But 65 miles to the north there is a little 'burg called Chicago. About a third of the way there is a city of 175k with surrounding communities another 200k and the county has 800,000 people.

Now there are folks in nearly every area of the country who would consider that rural by the description of the first three directions. But, Chicago is pretty significant.

So, whether we're rural or not is a matter of perspective. We moved there in 1980 so my wife would be closer to the school where she worked. I know we don't consider ourselves rural, nor would i consider most of the people with whom we associate that way. Are there yahoos? Yep.

So, are we rural or not? I suppose it depends on who we ask.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to yardwork (Reply #83)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 01:23 PM

95. Yeah that's the really sad thing.

People who live in big cities don't understand people who live in small towns and vice versa. I live in Los Angeles. I travel to other big cities like Boston, New York, DC, Seattle, Denver, Detroit - those are great cities. Would I travel to Billings, Montana, or Plains, Georgia, or Crawford, Texas? Not on a bet! Rural America needs to understand that nobody wants to attack them. Pretty much they attack each other. We in the big cities do recognize that rural America needs to exist, but rural America needs to understand that not everybody is like them, and there's other people besides white males who should be in charge. The hate and white supremacy that has come out of everybody since the election is sick.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Initech (Reply #52)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 03:29 PM

117. I have had my absolutely fill of white vagina aching

and I am white ...

You hit the nail on the head, they just don't get even one bit how caustic and hateful they are AT THE SAME TIME they have themselves so ginned up as to how big of victims they are ...

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Cosmocat (Reply #117)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 04:50 PM

125. And they're also unaware they're the root cause of 150% of the divisiveness in this country.

And said divisiveness is the root cause of one thing and one thing only - the fucking 2nd amendment. Do they care that the Constitution guarantees that pesky "liberal media" that they have as much right to speak their mind as the conservative business run media does? No. Do they care that Colin Kaepernick has a 1st amendment guaranteed right to protest? No. Do they care that Islam is protected under freedom of religion? No. Do they care that black people being murdered by police is a direct violation of the 4th amendment (illegal search and seizure) and the 5th amendment (right to a fair trial)? Absolutely not. But just the mere mention of gun control and they go fucking apeshit. Like the government is coming to take their guns away. Give me a fucking break. But they're happy (not) and they work hard. So that's all that matters, right?

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Initech (Reply #125)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 05:07 PM

127. Yep

We couldn't have it, because they would end up getting slaughtered, but imagine if non whites walked around open carrying to exercise their "second amendment rights!"

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Cosmocat (Reply #127)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 08:28 PM

146. You don't have to "imagine" that; it already happened

During Reagan's reign of error as governor of California, the Black Panthers open carried to protect the African-American community. Those fine gentlemen had a perfect right to: white racists were killing black people with impunity. But when "the wrong" people started exercising their 2nd Amendment rights, Reagan got a bunch of gun restrictions passed and signed.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Orrex (Reply #11)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 12:05 PM

55. Bingo!

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Orrex (Reply #11)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 02:30 PM

107. Unicorns. n/t

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to DemocratSinceBirth (Original post)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 10:24 AM

12. This is why I say we tell them to go fuck themselfs.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink



Response to treestar (Reply #16)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 12:14 PM

62. "Conservatism has, over the decades, curdled into an ideology of hatefulness and destruction...".

Curdled seems a perfect word for this.

It must be very draining to be so consumed by hatred and negativity all the time.

A childhood thru high school close friend (probably former close friend now, sad to say) has gone hard right and religiously fundie. I remember being shocked and somewhat hurt when I discovered this via Facebook, when she was ranting about "libtards." I am guessing she has no idea she is talking about me. To my distress, many former classmates hold similar views, based on their supportive responses to her.

She remained in my hometown, and works for her church. I moved away 40 years ago, have traveled a lot, had a variety of jobs in various pediatric health care settings, and am a happily questioning agnostic who has found a good spiritual fit in a Unitarian Universalist community.

We have seen each other only at high school reunion, which has been fun, so far. The 50th will be in 2019. I am not sure how I will feel when I see her and others. Will I just keep my mouth shut? Will I even go?

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to 3catwoman3 (Reply #62)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 02:44 PM

108. ...

A childhood thru high school close friend (probably former close friend now, sad to say) has gone hard right and religiously fundie. I remember being shocked and somewhat hurt when I discovered this via Facebook, when she was ranting about "libtards." I am guessing she has no idea she is talking about me. To my distress, many former classmates hold similar views, based on their supportive responses to her.


The same thing has happened to me.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to DemocratSinceBirth (Original post)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 10:40 AM

18. That article is chilling.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to DemocratSinceBirth (Original post)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 10:41 AM

20. Their world is under siege. White American dominance is being challenged.

And the more they rely on racism and antiquated social mores to support their unfair social system, the more likely they will get blind-sided by the future.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to DemocratSinceBirth (Original post)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 10:42 AM

21. If you want to "reach out" to these voters

I suggest going to the nearest brick wall and trying to dislodge it with your head instead.

You have a greater chance of success, and the headache won’t be nearly as severe!

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to DemocratSinceBirth (Original post)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 10:42 AM

22. Propaganda is largely responsible for this

It is the same attitude spewed daily on AM Hate radio. And Fox. They have few entertainment and 'news' sources out there in Rural America. When I drive through Rural Georgia, My only radio choices are country, some preacher, maybe sports radio if I am close enough to a big city, and always AM (and FM) hate radio. Gun fetish shows on the weekends.

People who have never listened to Savidge, or Wiener, or Carson, are in for a shock.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to n2doc (Reply #22)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 10:46 AM

25. Yes... Then they try gaslighting when it's turn around on them

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to DemocratSinceBirth (Original post)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 10:45 AM

23. lol "misinformed"... 55% of em believed in pizza gate !!!!

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to DemocratSinceBirth (Original post)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 10:52 AM

28. They still are a minority

Numerous polls have shown that the right-wing base is at best about 25% of the country.
The problem is propaganda. These people have been indoctrinated with nonsense, all the time while benefitting from a liberal society.
It's one hot mess for the rest of us, particularly those of us who are getting old. No wonder leaving is a popular option these days.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to DemocratSinceBirth (Original post)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 10:53 AM

29. I welcome the uninformed hatred of such dimwits.

Let them and their jobs and their farms be subject to Trump and his band of goons for a while. Some people just have to learn the hard way.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Paladin (Reply #29)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 12:19 PM

65. I wonder what they think about farm subsidies ? Iowa is the second highest.

https://farm.ewg.org/region.php?fips=19000

These are the we did everything on our own people not

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to lunasun (Reply #65)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 12:26 PM

67. Good point.

No reason to waste our resources on these willfully ignorant people at this point. Let them suffer some time under a Trump regime and the best of them will come back to our side; the worst of them aren't worth our time and efforts.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to lunasun (Reply #65)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 03:22 PM

115. As an Iowan, I can tell you that they openly embrace that hypocrisy.

I grew up in a small farming community. Yes, the same people that take in tens of thousands from farm subsidies are bitching about high taxes and handouts to lazy people.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to DemocratSinceBirth (Original post)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 10:55 AM

31. So they eat out every morning, but think WE are overprivileged?

I'll tell you what, when I was 18, and in fact ever after, I worked an awful lot harder than that. And I ate an awful lot cheaper than that, all my life.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to DemocratSinceBirth (Original post)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 10:58 AM

32. well

 

I'm neither misinformed, loathsome or weak, yes I can be as dangerous times 2 as these republican racists are in celebrating their fascism with the threats of their fuhrer and their actions toward usually AA protestors at their Nuremberg rallies. No reconciliation, so what? This is the start of the 2nd Civil War in ameriKKKa, and I'll be damned if I let a country I fought for diminish my humanity based on something as superficial as skin color, religion or culture. Fuck a conservative trumpfuhrer voter. I damn them to hell...... They have fired the first shot at Fort Sumpter 2.....

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to DemocratSinceBirth (Original post)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 10:59 AM

33. If we can regain power again and find the guts to outlaw their religion

we'd be 80% of the way there...

Remove them from their religion and they'll accept our way of life in a heartbeat.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to ileus (Reply #33)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 12:25 PM

66. "Outlaw their religion?"

Seriously?

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to ileus (Reply #33)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 12:37 PM

74. That wouldn't stop anything, and would probably make things worse.

First of all, there's the issue of the 1st amendment. It's not legal to ban any religion, especially for political reasons.
Secondly, the Christian church has a long history of defying authorities in even existing. It'll be like the pre-Constantine Rome church in the 4th century. You'll never stop them. Even if you were to ban them, they would either have secret meetings like the early church, or (most likely), they would show up at meetings heavily armed, and dare authorities to do anything.

And even though I'm not a Christian, I would support them.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to ileus (Reply #33)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 01:14 PM

89. Outlaw religion?

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to ileus (Reply #33)

Fri Jan 6, 2017, 02:43 AM

172. Yeah, that'd be great.

What?

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to DemocratSinceBirth (Original post)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 11:09 AM

35. Trump'll learn 'em, real good.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to DemocratSinceBirth (Original post)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 11:12 AM

36. Liberals mean people of color to these folks.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Kingofalldems (Reply #36)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 07:53 PM

143. Also means non correct Christians (Mormons, Catholics need not apply), non Christians like Joos and

 

Mooslims. . .immigrants who just got here like my wife (Well, I'm Jewish so I'm shit to begin with) and anyone from "dem scary big cities of university lurnin."

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to DemocratSinceBirth (Original post)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 11:17 AM

37. religion is indeed under siege

By science, by reality.

IMHO, people are welcome to maintain their own religious perspectives, beliefs, and customs. However, those customs must not be inserted into the government. The Founders were big on separation of church and state and it should remain that way.

Believe all you want, just don't expect everyone else to believe like you do. That's the nature of a pluralistic society, and if today's conservatives cannot handle that, well, too bad.

We need some persuasive, forceful Dems (and Republicans) to insist on the separation.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to RussBLib (Reply #37)

Fri Jan 6, 2017, 12:02 AM

167. Yes religion is under siege

But it's under siege by conservatives. These are people who twist the teachings of Jesus Christ for their own hateful ends. These are the people who twist religion into a tool of oppression and violence against others.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to DemocratSinceBirth (Original post)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 11:30 AM

40. Half the kids in those little towns can't wait to get the fuck out

and get to a city. I have friends who farmed, their kids left the minute they could. It's very stifling.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to CanonRay (Reply #40)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 11:49 AM

47. Pretty much

I grew up there, me and three sisters left (Miami, Chicago, Portland and Minneapolis), all liberal. Three brothers still there, all conservative. But Iowa did go for Obama twice, so maybe not a total loss.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to CanonRay (Reply #40)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 12:11 PM

59. Exactly. So those that stay tend lean conservative and some become alt-right. Those that leave.....

Go back to visit, maybe for holidays and birthdays. There is opportunity during these return visits to explain why they left and the opportunities that exist with more liberal thinking and policies and that the rest of the world is not full of evil and heathens. That might help? While there are definitely differences between urban and rural life, there is a lot of common ground that needs to be addressed.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Freethinker65 (Reply #59)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 02:10 PM

105. what about those who return (if any)?

?

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to pstokely (Reply #105)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 03:20 PM

114. Those that return, return. They have had the experience of living elsewhere.

Some will return because they prefer the rural way of life, housing can be far less expensive, friends and family may still be there, perhaps they found employment there or decide to start a business "back home". Hell, I live in a suburb of Chicago, coming from a suburb of Detroit, and am seriously considering moving to a smaller town in the future for many reasons. My main concern, as I age, is proximity to medical care.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to CanonRay (Reply #40)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 09:45 PM

155. I know of several young ones who left small towns

as there is little opportunity.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to DemocratSinceBirth (Original post)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 11:35 AM

42. The way to pay

for medicare and infrastructural improvement is by dipping into farm subsidies. In fact, just how much of my tax money goes to paying these bums? Rural America is all about government handouts. There is truth to my

How much money is it going to take to bail these people out when the Ogallala aquifer runs dry in a few years?

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to DemocratSinceBirth (Original post)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 11:45 AM

45. You're just learning this?

Seriously?

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to DemocratSinceBirth (Original post)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 11:52 AM

48. "Wir mussen die Liberalen ausrotten."

They're getting there.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to DemocratSinceBirth (Original post)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 11:54 AM

49. Wait until these jerks get drafted to fight a stupid war their idiot starts to protect one

Of his overseas properties. Plus what do you bet they were homeschooled?

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to DemocratSinceBirth (Original post)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 11:57 AM

50. "Misinformed."

What a bunch of fucking idiots.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to DemocratSinceBirth (Original post)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 11:58 AM

51. Well I'd be glad to give them something to be afraid of.

Of course they are in a constant state of fear which is why they are so easily manipulated...

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to DemocratSinceBirth (Original post)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 12:02 PM

53. It's homogenius

There's no diversity, so these people only know their own world, nothing else.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to DemocratSinceBirth (Original post)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 12:06 PM

57. Aren't these the same people progressives are supposed to reach out to?

eom

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to DemocratSinceBirth (Original post)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 12:12 PM

60. We live in a college town with a wide mix of nationalities, skin color and religions.

Once, in a retail store, I wished I could have photographed the Amish woman and the woman in a burka exchanging new babies to hold and coo over. My daughter went to a Montessori school for her first four years of schooling. Several months into her first year, she finally asked why there were "so many different skin colors" among her friends. When she talked about her various classmates, we only knew their names. Later she learned a great deal about different ethnicities and religions. Certainly there are some very prejudiced and bigoted residents in the area, and as a teacher, I know that many unenlightened and bigoted conversations and attitudes go on at the homes of some. Most " non-natives" do maintain ties with their cultures as part of their lifestyles. This community is far from a liberal paradise. However, the overall tone of the community is embarrassment at displaying such attitudes in public or at school. It is a start, at least: mixing of cultures among those who have wider world experience and education--- to begin with.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to maddiemom (Reply #60)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 12:15 PM

63. Curiousity, love, affection, compassion...

...these are all human traits ingrained from birth. You actually have to TEACH HATE, encourage bigotry and foster misunderstanding.

It goes back to the old Native American truism... There's a good wolf and a bad wolf inside each of us. Which one survives and rules? The one that you feed.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to DemocratSinceBirth (Original post)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 12:17 PM

64. Cut to the chase: They don't like fags or 'blacks'.

..and I am only using the term 'blacks' as a euphemism; deplorables know what they mean.

Mind you, the deplorables have "lots of friends" who are gay and/or black (and they will
ALWAYS remind you of it), and they are outwardly 'nice' to the gays and/or blacks they happen to know, but in general, they have no use for either communities- and they will eagerly vote in the direction that seems the most inclined to disenfranchise either group. But they are totally not prejudiced - and they resent anyone suggesting that they are. After all, they are Republicans... the party that freed the slaves, so how on earth could they be prejudiced?

Sure, there are other variables: Military & law enforcement hagiography; gun fetishism; religion, abortion, etc. But the deplorables' revulsion towards non-white communities and the LGBTQ community is the heart and soul of modern conservatism.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to LeftinOH (Reply #64)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 12:45 PM

79. +1000 - I wrote pretty much the same downthread

before I read this post. I know it and you know it, but the MSM is afraid to say it out loud.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to DemocratSinceBirth (Original post)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 12:26 PM

68. I kind of get that.

 

"Let him who will not work, not eat" was a refrain I heard many a time.

Everyone in my family, even my liberal mom, had and has utter contempt for anyone who isn't either working or trying to find a job, unless they are literally a quadriplegic.

It is a frame of mind that I fight, but that rises up strongly whenever I see a beggar.

Being a union guy, an environmentalist, having lots of GLBT friends and not caring for an imperialist foreign policy, I vote Democratic in any partisan election. But I understand where that mindset comes from

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Ghost OF Trotsky (Reply #68)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 03:02 PM

110. And yet they conveniently ignore

 

That people like Trump haven't done an hour of honest labor in decades.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to forjusticethunders (Reply #110)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 05:52 PM

133. Maybe so.

 

Maybe people should be paid according to the calories they burn. I'd think that more fair than someone inheriting a few million and being praised because they managed to turn that into billions in debt.

Just saying that I understand that mindset- "If you aren't working, you should be looking for work and willing to take any job offered", what I grew up with. Can't conceive of not applying for 10-20 jobs a day and being willing to move anywhere and clean toilets or scoop gutters if I were unemployed again. This is a mindset of a lot of people, not all of them have developed the quasi Marxist viewpoint I've come to as seeing it being a problem of the capitalist system. Am I brainwashed by academia, or are my friends and acquaintances victims of Stockholm Syndrome?

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Ghost OF Trotsky (Reply #133)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 11:58 PM

166. That's not what they were saying. They were saying that Liberals are lazy. That has

nothing to do with people being unemployed or looking for work.

It has only to do with the fact that they believe they are more virtuous than Liberals, and they are superior to Liberals.

They feel this way while Liberals are financing their lifestyles.

Fuck 'em.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Squinch (Reply #166)

Fri Jan 6, 2017, 10:19 AM

179. Well, THEY have Gawd on their side

 

so of course they are more superior and virtuous.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to DemocratSinceBirth (Original post)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 12:28 PM

69. They can thank those blue states for the Federal tax dollars that fund their state college and unive

universities and probably that academic scholarship, too. amirite?

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to SammyWinstonJack (Reply #69)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 12:31 PM

72. Yeah, his friend is one of those MOOCHERS

Too stupid to even realize how much he's being helped...

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to DemocratSinceBirth (Original post)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 12:30 PM

71. We will never win places like this, but if you pull 40% or close to it

We Win Every Time...

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to DemocratSinceBirth (Original post)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 12:34 PM

73. and, i must add a small point to all the wonderful comments upthread

the kid is on SCHOLARSHIP at the state university--taking HANDOUTS from the school--who does he think is paying his tuition?

"let's go to work, let the liberals sleep in"

really?

there is some irony here.


Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to DemocratSinceBirth (Original post)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 12:40 PM

75. Honestly, they have been brainwashed by

O'Reilly, Limbaugh, Alex Jones etc. and all their super conservative preachers.

I used to go out of my way to be nice to these people because I realized they are just really uneducated. But now I just stay clear away from them.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to DemocratSinceBirth (Original post)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 12:42 PM

76. Like others in this thread, I know these people

Not so much in Tulsa, but other places in Oklahoma. They are not Trumpers because of economic reasons. It's all cultural.
They think Hillary/Obama are too favorable to blacks, gays and anything else they consider liberal. They sure don't think Bernie was the answer either. They call him a commie.

We do not need to cater to these people or try to understand them or win them over. Our only hope is to energize those in our tent.
Get them to vote. Also be smart. The hard left needs to shut the fuck up and vote against the right. A moderate Democrat who votes 70% our way in Congress is prefered to a tea-party person who votes 0%.

Support the Democrats in 2018 and onward. Fuck the greens and the others who give us Trump/Pense creeps.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to OKNancy (Reply #76)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 01:08 PM

85. Right on.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to OKNancy (Reply #76)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 11:57 PM

165. I'd rather have the hard, pipe hitting liberals in charge....

....not the milquetoast set we have in charge now that will sell us out first chance they get.

And we need to be hard against the reich. Thomas Jefferson once said, "For I have sworn upon the altar of God eternal hostility against every form of tyranny over the mind of man." We need to do the same.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to DemocratSinceBirth (Original post)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 12:45 PM

78. Most of these people wouldn't know a liberal if one came up and punched them in the face.

The ironic thing is that they are in line to get a massive figurative punch in the face from their Dear Leader, along with a big kick in the nuts, and a dozen gut punches. But, they'll still blame it on their mythological liberal boogeymen until their dying days. It would take a mass cult deprogramming to help them recognize who their real enemy is.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to DemocratSinceBirth (Original post)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 12:57 PM

80. If rural conservatives think they're under siege now,

wait until they have to learn Russian because their Don sold out to Putin.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to DemocratSinceBirth (Original post)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 01:01 PM

82. One is at a state and federally subsidized school and the other worked and lives...

... on a farm that is state and federally subsidized from tax dollars earned by evil libruls in evil big cities.

They most likely went to a sate and federally subsidized grade school on a federally subsidized bus system subsidized by evil libruls.

My father in law was a retired commercial pilot who worked part time as a school bus driver. The company he worked for was a 100% federally subsidized bus company whose job was to pick up poor rural children. He used to shake his head at the Romney signs in the front yard during the 2012 election.


There is a theory economic catastrophe repeats itself every 80 years when the previous generation who remembers dies out. I believe it. I'm beginning to subscribe to the idea these people will never understand until they see it first hand.

They just assume their farm subsidies, rural farm mortgages, crop subsidies, rural power companies, subsidized rural roads all came from baby Jesus and all are their god given right and not the result of liberal policies and liberal tax dollars.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to DemocratSinceBirth (Original post)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 01:08 PM

84. smoke screen .....

the whole liberal/conservative / deporables debate is (as it always is) a SMOKE SCREEN.

The hate and bigotry (sometime on both sides), the out of touchness (definitely both sides) - are all results of one thing:

the MASSIVE redistribution and consolidation / HOARDING of wealth and GREED of the small percentage of people at the top - in turn the result of laws and benefits RIGGED to reinforce this.

There is TONS or room for common ground - if we can all start to show the reality behind the curtain.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Locrian (Reply #84)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 01:18 PM

91. wrong. read this thread

Certainly this is a problem but it doesn't explain Trump voters in any way. This is just some worn-out ... well, I won't finish my thought.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to OKNancy (Reply #91)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 02:57 PM

109. well I think is does explain them...

i certainly agree they ARE misogynist, racist, etc. It's that I believe we need to understand the root cause. Yes, some is religion, culture etc. But it all eventually goes back to being manipulated by people to distract from the fact that the many outnumber the few. By divide and conquer (which is what racism, etc IS) they are able to maintain control.

There will be some of them beyond hope. Brainwashed into a fixed mental state. But we (as we claim to be more compassionate) need to do better than the traditional us vs them which inevitably leads to more and more conflict.


It's the same old thing..... and it's manufactured for a reason..

http://sandiegofreepress.org/2015/02/the-origins-of-institutionalized-racism-a-system-to-control-blacks-and-whites/


On the top of the colonial societies, stood an elite made up of the wealthy plantation owners, rich merchants, manufacturers, traders and their governors. Not only did this colonial elite have to fear a hostile Indian population nearby, they had – in the southern colonies – the strongest and most populated colonies at first – the fear of slave revolt which seems to have been a permanent facet of plantation life. Plus they had to contend with the poor whites’ class anger – servants, tenants, city poor, the propertyless, the soldier, taxpayer, sailor.
Bacon Rebellion Jameton burn

The burning of Jamestown by Bacon rebels, 1676.

Detailed research on slave resistance in North America has found about 250 instances where at least 10 slaves joined in revolt or in a conspiracy to rebel. And time to time, whites were involved in the slave resistance. For instance, there is a record of a Virginia conspiracy in 1663, where indentured white servants and black slaves plotted to rebel and gain their freedom. Yet, the plot betrayed, all the conspirators were executed.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Locrian (Reply #84)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 01:51 PM

102. What are liberals out of touch about? We get they also have unemployment and are just rejecting

 

Their xenophobia. It's a false equivalence to say we should accept their bigotry.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to DemocratSinceBirth (Original post)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 01:17 PM

90. Those on the Right don't like those on the Left and vice versa. I'm shocked!

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to WillowTree (Reply #90)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 01:20 PM

93. Up until this election...

Up until this election there was a large swath of my fellow Americans whom I disagreed with. I didn't think they "were an enemy to be feared and loathed."

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to DemocratSinceBirth (Reply #93)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 06:05 PM

137. Me too

Now, I know that they are not just nice people with whom I disagree.

They are people who hate. They hate gays, blacks, Muslims, liberals, and oh, it is so much easier to list who they don't hate: anyone who is exactly like them.

The mask is gone and I can now see who they are, very clearly. It is disturbing.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Bettie (Reply #137)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 06:10 PM

138. Prior to this election I questioned their judgment, not their character.

Now I am compelled to question both.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to WillowTree (Reply #90)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 04:24 PM

122. The differnce is... We don't want to take away their rights.

Or force our religious views or lack there of on them.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to DemocratSinceBirth (Original post)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 01:21 PM

94. THE STUPID is also the most damaging and threatening to the liberty of ALL

Of us...including themselves.

Hardest minds to reach. Hardest fight to win. They'll wear you down with easy and deep hate.

I know I am weary to the bone. The frustration is numbing.

But it is THE most important battle facing our nation. I am running out of legitimate years to fight, but maybe the urgency will give me the stubborn stamina to stay defiant to their ugly agenda.

I'll cling to that thought and battle on.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to DemocratSinceBirth (Original post)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 01:24 PM

96. I can't even count the number of people I've met from these red state dystopias...

...really bright people, LGBT people, atheists, evolutionary biologists... this is a very positive thing for us living here in solidly Democratic California, but red state "conservative" U.S.A. has a severe problem with "brain drain."

The way to solve this problem is to make it safe for the best and brightest of red state U.S.A. to speak out, and to give them options and opportunities other than leaving.

Entire nations have been able to change.

Ireland is a nation that used to be very similar to red state U.S.A, with a Catholicism that was little different than our oppressive red state Protestantism. A right-wing pedophile priest exiled from the U.S.A., just ahead of a warrant being served, had a higher social status than even a liberal Catholic kid, let alone an atheist or queer kid.

Overall, Ireland is not like that anymore. When it connected socially and economically to the more liberal social democracies of Europe its people, especially younger people, began to feel safe questioning the traditional social order.

"Conservatives" do everything they can to intimidate and silence their opposition, even when their opposition is a thirteen year old kid muttering about yet another Sunday Mass where the creepy priest lights off in another tirade against abortion or ordinary civil rights for LGBT people.

I'm only using the Catholic examples because that's most of my experience. "Conservative" Protestants and Mormons in the U.S.A. can be equally awful. I greatly respect anyone who can express their dissent while living in some red state hell, but I also understand silence, having experienced that pressure myself, knowing I was in a situation where speaking out would be dangerous.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to hunter (Reply #96)

Fri Jan 6, 2017, 12:21 AM

168. This reminded me of a story about former Irish President Mary McAleese

And how that idiot Bernard Law decided to be a jerk towards President Mary McAleese when she was here for a state visit, and how his fellow Bishops in Ireland were none too happy with him over his actions.

FORMER President Mary McAleese has revealed how an American cardinal -- later disgraced for his involvement in covering up child sex abuse -- berated her for her support of the ordination of women priests.

According to Ms McAleese, he told her he was "sorry for Catholic Ireland to have you as President" and went on to insult a junior minister who was accompanying the then president.

On her return to Ireland, she confronted the Irish hierarchy to find out if they had been briefing Cardinal Law. Cardinal Desmond Connell was "visibly upset", she recalled, and found it "unacceptable" and was "morally certain there was no input from the Irish bishops".

Cardinal Cahal Daly went as far as inviting her to lunch to apologise and told the President that an invitation by the Irish bishops to Cardinal Law to come to Ireland "had been rescinded".

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to DemocratSinceBirth (Original post)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 01:37 PM

99. They put people in categories according to their beliefs.

I own a small business and for 18 years deplorables or right wing-nuts, as I like to call them, have walked into my office and assumed that since I own a business, ergo I am one of them.

They rail against taxes and business regulations....when I ask should the County not have a health department...well that's ok. When I suggest that taxes are the price we pay for a civilized society--they agree, but then welfare and food stamps come out of their mouths.

They rant about immigrants and I say, reasonably, yes but who will pick the apples and peaches and tomatoes? And after they have left my office, I look at the receipt and see that their last name is Rodriguez or Martinez and I have to laugh out loud. (WTF--how far back is that Mexican heritage?)

People will always have prejudices. My son once explained a bad grade in a class was because his teacher was prejudiced against him. I laughed and asked if it was a thing about red hair! When I have a bad customer experience--I have found that I have taken that experience and used it as a basis for other interactions with people that were the same. Example: Young adults creating havoc at my tourist destination does NOT mean that ALL young adults will do the same....but the temptation is to ban everyone under a certain age to protect yourself.

Democrats and Progressives must get our own talk radio shows. And we need to be as sensationalist as the right wing has been. With all the media and noise available in today's world--only the loudest and most outrageous noises will be heard (i.e. Trump).
Democrats and Progressives love facts and will debate the context of one word for hours....but the people we want to join us in a coalition are young and have the attention span of a TV commercial (my personal experience as a Scout Leader and Sunday School Teacher.) Thus the success of the Tweet.

Church influence is another problem...one that we cannot fix without lots of government intervention denying tax exempt status for political activity. Who are you going to call? and who is going to call. We can console ourselves with the fact that Americans aren't going to church any more in large numbers. Church membership is falling and church participation is falling and as a result churches will have less money. Politicians will still pay lip service and tout their faith (2 Corinthians).

I have heard us called Snow Flakes...Libturds or Libtards....Baby Killers....Communists. We do the same. We can only continue to fight and call their crap out for what it is.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to DemocratSinceBirth (Original post)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 01:56 PM

103. This reminds me of the people in Germany who praised Hitler

before and after he was elected. Godwin's rule is out the window when it comes to Trump's followers and Trump. He is the modern equivalent of the methods used that raised the Nazis to power.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to DemocratSinceBirth (Original post)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 01:59 PM

104. The feeling is mutual...

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to DemocratSinceBirth (Original post)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 02:13 PM

106. Trump supporting co-workers at work think I'm cool

and it's gotten really strange. If they're talking politics, and I disagree, it's like I'm a ghost. I might get a baffeled look like I'm speaking another language, then just ignored. The rest of the time, most everyone loves me, asks me for advice on things, etc. I've never experienced anything like it.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to DemocratSinceBirth (Original post)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 03:47 PM

118. These are the same type of people that supported Hitler,

and blamed and hated the jews.

I loathe these ignorant buffoons and am glad that the repeal of ACA will hurt them the most, since they truly deserve 100% of the hurt as they caused it. I ache for the people (including possibly me in a year or so) who didn't support Drumpf, recognized his true
criminality, treachery with Russia, racism and misogyny and are still going to get severely hurt by drumpf and the R's policies.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to DemocratSinceBirth (Original post)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 04:16 PM

120. Good

I wouldn't want to be liked by people like that.

I want them to feel challenged and stressed all the time.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to DemocratSinceBirth (Original post)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 04:46 PM

124. god, this really breaks my heart.

I can see the truth of it. So fresh-washed, cornbread and milkin the cows good heartland values.

Well, whst do we do, in terms of introducing more complex thinking?


Oh geeezzzzz, I don't know. I don't have any answers, except that changing hearts requires one-to-one dialogue, for starters.

It's not a quick protection against the big changes coming.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to DemocratSinceBirth (Original post)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 05:13 PM

129. Dude in the Bearcats sweatshirt looks like the next Timothy McVeigh

Scary as fuck...

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to DemocratSinceBirth (Original post)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 05:16 PM

130. These people can't think

They enjoy their fundamentalist lives. They don't believe in science,
rational causation, or accountability.

If they get cancer from the local chemical plant or food they eat, or
health problems from bad diet, it's not their fault, or the food, the company,
the cholesterol. It just happens. God is there to help them. In fact, I would
argue they enjoy their plight because it provides them salvation through
suffering. They just go blindly onward, and accept what happens. Everything
is off the cuff, a gut feeling. Trump connected with that.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to DemocratSinceBirth (Original post)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 05:19 PM

131. My father worked part time starting when he was 10.

HIS father likewise.

I started part time at 14, worked through University, and worked full time from 22-62. My family has voted Democratic in this country since 1968.

SO what values are they talking about?

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to guillaumeb (Reply #131)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 08:12 PM

145. Judgement and Strength. Their answers to confusion and fear.

Conservatives, especially those who stayed in rural areas when given the opportunity to leave, just want things to stay the same. They are in small and obscure enough communities that if there's a job there, they can "work hard" and still have enough to go out with their friends and have a good time on the weekend. And they're isolated enough they can settle down into a comfortable routine and rarely get surprised or have to face something that may challenge their personal. The rest of the world pretty much leaves them alone for the most part; so their primary interaction with anything they're not familiar with or anyone they don't personally know is either through TV or through something the government brings to their county because something needs to be addressed.
Their chosen church gives them comfort, tells them it's never their fault when things go wrong, because their real reward is in heaven and everything in this world is a test of their faith. That the very human and most likely sinful man (or woman) who stands behind the pulpit somehow mystically "knows" the mind, words and judgment of a being that supposedly created the universe in its entirety, a universe more diverse and extending far, far beyond the small communities the parishioners inhabit.

And this "mouthpiece of the Lord" that tells them they're God's Special Warriors supposedly knows more and is more holy than that other preacher in that other church two miles down the main drag...who's a straight up hypocritical blasphemer going to hell, don't-cha-know...

Personally, I have always felt that the greatest blasphemy any person can make of a supposedly Omnipotent Creator God is to pretend to be that God's chosen mouthpiece, protector, and enforcer.
Doesn't matter who you claim to follow; if you put yourself up in God's chair to tell people what to do and how to live their lives, that's stealing Divinity from your God.

These Conservatives choose to have a life that's "simple". That doesn't require them to be curious or have to consider a larger reality. They want to be able to get the level of tools and technology to be comfortable, then shut the rest of the world out so they can claim to be real people - American frontiersmen - even though they really don't know what it means to truly be on one's own without the rest of the world available to provide support, and most wouldn't be able to survive scavenging on their own in the wild more than a couple months.

They'd rather be slaves of the big family on the big hill throwing them a few crumbs and the protection from consequences as long as they do what "s/he" tells them, than to be out on their own and take responsibility for their own thoughts and actions.

And I'm saying this a born in tie-dye hippy liberal, who grew up learning enough about living in the wild, I'm still pretty sure that if you dropped me in the typical North American wild 100 miles from nowhere buck nekkid, I can survive a winter and wildlife with rocks, branches, vines/plant fiber, clay and whatever else is out there -
That is, of course, so long as you dropped me off in that state around May during temperate summer-like weather to gather food and make tools from whatever is around, a sturdy shelter, and some articles of coverings that can be used as shoes and clothes.
It takes curiosity and the courageous willingness to examine options and be open and flexible to survive with nothing but your wits.

I doubt most of these "Hard Working, Real American" corn-fed country boys so proud of being rural could last more than a couple weeks in the wild in the summer without bringing along tools to begin with - their guns, knives, lighters, modern clothing - and whatever else is in the precious he-man prepper "bug out" kits their Conservative con men are telling them they need to buy to protect themselves and their comfortable, white bread lifestyle against the nasty Liberals who will turn them Gay, Atheist-Muslim-Buddhist, and take away their Guns and give all their stuff to those dark people who live in the Ghettos, driving Cadillacs and pimping their kids.

Haele


Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to haele (Reply #145)

Fri Jan 6, 2017, 12:25 PM

180. I understand the rural area mindset.

My family is from a very rural area of eastern Canada, many of my uncles were farmers. And yes, there is the us vs. the outsiders mentality. But people also have to recognize that even in a small rural area, one is surrounded by the products of an industrialized society.

The house where my father was raised had an outside back house, no indoor plumbing except for a hand pump at the sink. There were 2 wood stoves for heat. A small 3 bedroom house for 15 children and 2 adults. But even there, there was a store for buying canned goods, and newspapers from outside, and other evidence that they were not alone. In other words, civilization and big government.

I feel that too many of these GOP types really think that Mayberry was real.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to DemocratSinceBirth (Original post)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 07:45 PM

140. We do have 'things' they want, and we need to keep those things just out of reach and make

them work for those things that Blue States excel at.

Right now they don't care if an A lister comes or goes from trump's parade.

But when they lose conventions and sporting events, entertainment and future business in trade, resources and tourism
they will eventually feel the pinch.

Stand up for your BLUE STATE, your Blue community, buy Blue, travel Blue and be proactive. Write companies, and, also, international companies and sports teams and tell them your concerns with red state laws and their 'moral values' that allow sexist, racist and homophobic leaders in their government.

Make sure the line between the red state values(trump)and Blue State values is very clear.

Tikki

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to DemocratSinceBirth (Original post)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 07:50 PM

141. Yet I'm supposed to give these people creedence and respect them? Fuck rural America

 

And I grew up in rural America! Northern Sullivan, almost Delaware County, NY.

Fuck these people. I hope they enjoy the anal probing the GOP gives them. God, Gays, Gun. That's all that matters to these people. And again, remember, I grew up around these assholes.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to DemocratSinceBirth (Original post)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 08:06 PM

144. Can we please dispense the notion of "reaching out"?

And start thinking of our own two-state solution?

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to DemocratSinceBirth (Original post)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 09:21 PM

149. Not losing any sleep over it.

Thy don't like a lot of people.

Women, immigrants, people of color, gay people, poor people, sick people, educated people, young people, old people....

Yeah, so they don't like liberals. Fuck 'em.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to DemocratSinceBirth (Original post)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 09:37 PM

151. The "real Americans" strike again.

Fuck them, fuck country "music", fuck NASCAR. They really admire that lose Earnhardt who clearly should never have been behind a wheel to start with. Go drink and take orders from your born again pastors.

I am a liberal and a business owner. Fuck these inbred losers.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to DemocratSinceBirth (Original post)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 09:40 PM

152. Why isn't "The Art Of The Deal" the new "Mein Kampf"?

 

Because Hitler actually wrote "Mein Kampf" himself.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to DemocratSinceBirth (Original post)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 09:43 PM

153. Until their girlfriend gets knocked up and they need Fi-Aid money for beer & premium porns

Then abortion and socialism frick'n RULE. Jesus is a super-cool white dude who knows those rules are for dirty brown people, and Donald Trump is going to put them all in their place. MAKE AMURKA WHITE AGAIN! YEEOOAH!

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to DemocratSinceBirth (Original post)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 09:52 PM

156. Those two boys are misinformed about Trump..

Trump doesn't go to church and as far as i know and Jesus never boasted about grabbing women by their vagina's.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to DemocratSinceBirth (Original post)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 10:10 PM

157. Republicans learned long ago that perception and not reality is what's important.

That's why they can be successful at the ballot box despite a track record of complete failure. It's like some late night TV product- put all of the money and effort into hype and advertising, don't worry about the fact that the product is complete garbage.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to DemocratSinceBirth (Original post)

Thu Jan 5, 2017, 11:44 PM

164. And I don't like them.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to DemocratSinceBirth (Original post)

Fri Jan 6, 2017, 01:05 AM

169. 80 years ago, their grandparents were the same far right scum

who wanted the US to ally with the Nazis.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to DemocratSinceBirth (Original post)

Fri Jan 6, 2017, 02:39 AM

171. The Party is very Proud of These "hardworking" Stakhanovites. eom

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to DemocratSinceBirth (Original post)

Fri Jan 6, 2017, 02:48 AM

173. "now about 18"

gawd, I have shoes older than them

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to DemocratSinceBirth (Original post)

Fri Jan 6, 2017, 08:11 AM

177. This premise was laid out in the Eighties by John Mellencamp

&list=RDfk3XUy0JCqM

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to DemocratSinceBirth (Original post)

Fri Jan 6, 2017, 08:34 AM

178. They rely on the social programs Democrats created.

If their lord and savior, Donald J. Trump, takes them away they'll be sending us flowers and chocolates.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to DemocratSinceBirth (Original post)

Fri Jan 6, 2017, 12:33 PM

181. Do they hate FDR?

These people don't follow history too closely, do they?

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to DemocratSinceBirth (Original post)

Sat Jan 7, 2017, 02:46 PM

182. Really resent that white working class are the only hard workers...

...I am on a train here in the Bay area with 100s of folks on their way to work. To get on this train, we all got up somewhere around 5:00/6:00 am and we won't get home until about 6/7pm tonight.

We work hard TOO! How many people do you know who live off of their investments. I don't know any. Yes, I know many with investments, but it not enough to live and support your family - they all work 9 to 5 jobs.

Although my family lived in metro area, my mom and dad went to work everyday and my dad had a second job he did on the weekends. And we were poor living paycheck to paycheck.

The difference between the current rural American folks and my family was that my parents didn't complain. It was what it was, and they did what they needed to do to survive and raise their children.

PLEASE, ENOUGH of this stuff that rural Americans are the oly ones who work in this country - that is pure BS.

p.s. On my train ride, we were blowing by an area in San Mateo, CA and to my surprise I saw big painted (nicely colored) backside of a building with "Fuck Donald Trump" on it...made my dat

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to DemocratSinceBirth (Original post)

Sat Jan 7, 2017, 03:21 PM

183. Cannon fodder for DFT.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink

Reply to this thread