I've been working at a new job for 9 weeks and tonight

[Seedersandleechers]

I've just witnessed a third person getting fired. These were nurses with small children and families to take care of. For each firing it happened all the same - they came into work their shift and before they could clock in the Admin Nurse said I need to talk to you and the next thing you see is her walking them out the door. And for what? I do not know - no one talks about it. I have never seen so much incivility from a nurse admin in all my years, and I'm 59. I come home from work and I can't open the wine bottle fast enough. (No I'm not a heavy drinker). I took off a year and half and moved to England after my partner died and this is what I came back to. Is this a precedent?

[Seedersandleechers]

4. I think I know what it feels like to be

cattle and waiting in line to be slaughtered.

[BlueToTheBone]

28. Don't stand in line! Run to

the back of the herd! Escape! Good luck!

[physioex]

2. How horrible....

Health care providers, teachers, and public service employees should be some of the most cherished members of society.

[SoDesuKa]

3. Is There a Buyout in the Works?

Unusually draconian personnel measures may mean they're trying to get rid of people to lighten the payroll and make the deal more attractive to potential buyers. You wouldn't be told what's going on, but if senior people are being replaced by people with lighter paychecks, it could also mean there's a new controller.

Is the business making money?

[Seedersandleechers]

6. No buyout. I am a nurse in a county jail working for a nurse admin

who could be cast as a jail matron in a 1940's movie.

[msongs]

8. privatized or civil service type employment? nt

[Seedersandleechers]

13. Privatized managed healthcare.

[southernyankeebelle]

52. The day this country goes to a single payer plan that will be the day this country will move

forward. I know people who live and are from these countries of Italy, Canada and Germany that would not trade their health care for ours. I even had my Italian cousin who was a nurse and I have seen her at work. I don't see any differences in their health care.

[FarPoint]

10. Do you work for the Naphcare Corporation?

That company manages many jail-medical department in the USA. They are run by an bunch of good olde boys from Alabama....awful reputation.

[Seedersandleechers]

12. No not Naphcare. The company I work for came after Naphcare.

I never think in terms of color but it has just dawned on me. All the nurses were African American except for one and he was African from Ethiopia. I think I need another drink or another job. This is sick in so many ways.

[rfranklin]

25. If this is the pattern, then there is a discrimination suit possible...

A lot of Africans have an attitude about black Americans.

[Seedersandleechers]

7. And yes the business is making money!

[underseasurveyor]

9. This is what I'm seeing where I work.

There seems to be this new era of young people that have been turned into unquestioning corporate drones. Yes Master, yes Master, what ever you say Master, your wish is my privilege.
And those of us that are a bit older that do not subscribe to unquestionably bending over for the almighty corporation are the ones being fired for petty reasons. I have also seen 3 long time co-workers get fired in as many months.

They've been working real hard to get me out the door by trying to get me to quit by making my work life miserable with impossible work loads and that hasn't been working so they suspended me for a week (pending termination) for some trumped up BS reasons but I think they know that I KNOW my rights, the discrimination laws and the labor laws and they know they're wrong and now they have done pissed off the wrong bitch. I'm still there, barely, but there. Document, Document, Document everything.

The ass-kissing drones get very much favorable treatment and hours. And for every person that's fired there are plenty of applicants waiting to fill the void.

[Seedersandleechers]

11. I hear you. This

is what I am experiencing for the first time in all my years of being a nurse. Only the Admin Nurse is not a young one and being there are a lot of nursing schools in my city the new ones are hungry to get hired.

[Selatius]

14. UNION

[Seedersandleechers]

15. I work 5 minutes from home.

I live in Missouri but work in KANSAS! Maybe that was my first mistake.

[cecilfirefox]

53. Hey- I live in Lawrence, KS! Where do you work at? O/ nt

[Dyedinthewoolliberal]

16. Are you organized?

Or in a union?

[Seedersandleechers]

18. Sadly, none of the above.

Not in Kansas.

[Dyedinthewoolliberal]

41. Try this....

go to this website and see if they can give you any ideas.....
http://www.seiu.org/seiuhealthcare/

[FarPoint]

26. If nurses would only bond together and unionize.....

Then, Nurses would be the most powerful group in America.

Nursing should be a union target nationally. That is where I would put my money today. The Nurse unions are our future.

[Spitfire of ATJ]

17. Things have gotten so bad

Every employer acts like they just tolerate even having a work force. There's absolutely no respect for the time you have been there and everyone let go is treated like they are a trespasser even if it's been their home away from home for 30 years. Some places won't even let them go back to their desk/workzone to get their coat when it's raining. They say they'll mail you your things and they will call security if someone begs for an explanation over what they did wrong. (It's nothing they did, it's just business)

And America wonders why we have people showing up at former employers with guns....

The latest trend is Right Wing bosses purging Liberals.

Got an Obama bumper sticker?

Goodbye.

[Skip Intro]

19. Possible they were let go for some type of infraction?

Some type of rule-breaking that would justify the firings?

[Seedersandleechers]

20. Working while being black?

Maybe they didn't kiss ass? They were good nurses.

[Skip Intro]

21. I don't know, do you?

From the OP it seemed the reason they were dismissed was a mystery.

Was some evil admin just getting its kicks, or was there a valid reason?

Seems like a logical question to me.

But I don't pretend to know what happened.

I evidently missed that they were black, but, unless you're alleging they were fired because they're black, I don't see the relevance.

[Seedersandleechers]

23. I don't know why they were fired as no one takes about it.

Something just doesn't smell right but it's only speculation on my part.

[Nay]

29. I'd bet they were fired to sweeten the bottom line. For a sale, or a loan, or something. nt

[Major Nikon]

22. I can see a lot of different possibilities

It's certainly possible that something nefarious is going on, but there are other possibilities as well. If you don't have a union, management can fire you for any reason that doesn't violate labor laws. However, firing people in skilled positions for no good reason is generally not a good business practice as it costs money to replace them.

People are generally fired for one of two reasons. Either they are fired for performance, or they are fired for disciplinary reasons. If they were good nurses like you say, that means they probably weren't fired for performance, which leaves disciplinary reasons. They might have been stealing drugs or other items. They might have been violating attendance or other policies. It sounds like there is some type of investigation or crackdown that is running its course. I wouldn't expect management to say much about it if it's for disciplinary reasons. There could also be criminal charges involved.

[IamK]

24. I know attendance policies for Nurses are normally very strict... n/t

[Enrique]

40. or it could be the reason that our unemployment is so high

lots of people getting fired.

The OP didn't say whether they are hiring replacements, maybe they will ask the OP pick up the slack. For no extra money of course.

[Warpy]

27. I hate to break it to you, but there's also a push to get older nurses out

It's what that asinine "customer service model" that hospital administration is currently in love with is all about. Those young, pretty, peppy new nurses are always going to be rated more highly than the older nurse who's been in the trenches for 30 years and knows what's really going on. It's transparent and it's sickening. Instead of looking at patient outcomes, they're turning the job into a beauty contest.

They used to try to retain experienced nurses but no more. They get a new grad in through the door, an older nurse gets the axe because her ratings aren't high enough.

The new grads are thrown to the wolves without the more experienced nurses around to show them the ropes and transition them into the real world so they can do the job without killing themselves or the patients.

Your job environment sounds incredibly toxic but I know how hard it is for a 59 year old nurse who's holding on by her fingernails, been there and done that. It becomes an endurance contest, trying to hold out so you won't outlive your savings before you qualify for Social Security.

[riverwalker]

33. warpy is right

hospitals want perky/smiley/nurses, who are evaluated by their best Walmart-greeter imitations, unfortunately clinical skills and experience are low on the list. I see it happening everyday. When my loved one is ill, I want the old, crabby, limping nurse with 30 years under her belt, who can smell a crisis before it happens, whose instincts alone can alert an MD and save someone from a life threatening event. Who has the confidence to tell a non-responsive doc "I think his kidneys are failing and if you don't do anything I will call someone who will".
I want perky/smiley when I go to Starbucks for a latte.

[XanaDUer]

34. I wish I could vote your post as today's best

Yes, (not a nurse, but a former medical librarian working closely with nurses, esp older ones who tend to not put up with shyte)- and I see this "customer service" model making its way into hospitals, well, into all facets of working life. Which is hilarious to me, since customer service in the United States is, pretty much, a frigging joke. I think it IS just a way to get rid of older workers.

[LiberalEsto]

65. I suspect the young new nurses have fewer benefits

and lower starting salaries.

They get rid of the older ones because they have too many benefits and are accustomed to earning a decent wage.

[Warpy]

71. That's exactly it these days

It's all money. Never mind a green new nurse is not going to be making good decisions. Never mind there will be occasional lawsuits, it's easier to budget for those than pay a seasoned nurse.

It happens in the corporate world, too. If there's no place to move up into management, you're out at 55. You're making too much money and starting to cost the insurance plan a few bucks, better to get a green kid right out of college and lose money on him for a few years while he learns the job. It saves money in the long run.

However, the way they're getting rid of older nurses is obscene.

[meaculpa2011]

30. Getting "walked to the door" without notice usually...

implies some sort of serious infraction. I've never been let go, but I've been laid off several times. I always got my notice and worked the next two weeks before heading to the unemployment office. On every occasion I was called back, once after nearly a year. That last time I declined the re-invitation.

When I went from a union job to Fortune 500 Land, people that were let go would usually be given plenty of notice. In one instance a co-worker was kept on for eight months until she found another position.

The exceptions: Serious infractions. That's when they got perp walked to the door by security carrying their personal effects.

[XanaDUer]

36. I worked for years at a nonprofit hospital that perp walked

*everyone* , who got laid off, to the door. Older workers, loyal, who had been there for years and years, during one of the personnel-purges the million-dollar-a-year new CEO implemented to improve the bottom line.

Minus me. I got up and walked out so fast when I got the news that I, a female with a master's was being unloaded, that they didn't have time. It was fine if they did- the security guards knew a lot of dirt on the place and knew what an Evil Empire the hospital was.

I didn't do anything more than be a middle-aged female making a decent salary in a red state, and in a very sexist and racist hospital.

[coalition_unwilling]

39. Oh, puh-leeze. I'll see your anecdotes and raise you the two times I've been

RIFFed, once by Fortune 500 company, once by a start-up. In neither case had I committed a serious infraction or even a minor one. In both cases, I was 'perp-walked' to the door and handed a box with my shit already boxed up.

So when's the last time you got laid off? Obviously not in this millennium.

[meaculpa2011]

44. True. I left my last job in 1981...

and have been free-lancing since. My experiences are most probably ancient history. My last lay-off was in 1975.

[coalition_unwilling]

45. My latest was in 2010. Previous was 2004. In both cases, was not even allowed to say

'farewell' to colleagues (although in the 2004 Fortune 500 case, everyone in my unit got the axe at the same time).

[XanaDUer]

50. My RIF was 2010

I was not the only one. I was there, mostly, for the salary, so, while PO'd, I knew I could get another job, and I did, though at less money. I got another one a year after that one, for a better salary, still in my field.

Greetings, fellow 2010 RIFer!

I didn't worry too much about "saying goodbye" to anyone, since the place was a RW nutfarm.

[coalition_unwilling]

54. I'm still unemployed after some 20 months. I've made a bunch of bad

decisions from a white-collar career perspective and I suspect fate does not have a pretty future in store for me.

[XanaDUer]

58. I'm so sorry

I rent wherever I move. It may sound counterintuitive but, even when I thought on hospital job was for forever, I got a hinky feeling and didn't buy a place. I'm too much of a gypsy.

[coalition_unwilling]

64. The building where my condo is located has seen values of its units drop by some 65% from the

height of the bubble. My wife and I thought we were being so smart because we bought when prices had dropped by 50%. Little did we know that they had another 15% to drop (from 2009-12). Result is that I'm in an underwater mortgage and firmly yoked to the LA job market. All well and good, except that California's unemployment rate is roughly 11%, high enough to make finding a new job very difficult for the over-50 cohort but not so high that it continues to qualify for the FED-ED UI extension which ended suddenly without much advance warning on May 12.

My wife and I have lived very frugally and we have some money set aside in retirement accounts and various other places, but I've learned a couple lessons: 1) don't buy a house when you're working for a shitty employer and 2) place hands over ears and go "La-La-La" when realtors tell you it's cheaper to buy than to rent. Still, I blame myself as much as I blame anyone else - I've never really paid much attention to capitalism nor had much use for it, so it's little wonder that capitalism isn't paying much attention to me nor showing much use for me.

[XanaDUer]

67. Don't blame your wife or yourself

It's NOT your fault. It's time we took care of each other, and that starts with ending the blame game towards average prople. I hope things improve for both of you soon.

[coalition_unwilling]

68. Oh, I definitely don't blame my wife. She's an artist and doesn't work

outside the home and basically entrusts all the fianncial shit to me. But I do blame myself for thinking I could outsmart the titans of capitalism at their own game. Pride goeth before a fall and I am living proof thereto.

But thank you for your empathy. It really means a lot.

[XanaDUer]

70. The game is rigged against average folks

And the US has no safety net really, for us. I was lucky to get my big 227 a week in Georgia. And I had to pay TAX on that pissant amount! God bless America.

[dmallind]

60. Back atcha. 2009 and 2011 RIFFs both had plenty of time and notice. nt

[coalition_unwilling]

63. Consider yourself lucky that you seem to have worked for humane employers. Me, not so much. But I

did obtain some measure of satisfaction watching the Tribune Corp crash and burn a couple times since my 2004 layoff and the LA Times (a subsidiary of which I worked for) paid daily circulation drop well below 1,000,000. Couldn't happen to a nicer bunch of bean counters, imo.

[etherealtruth]

48. Sorry, this is often a corporate SOP ... regardless of ...

... how or why a person is leaving their employment.

[FarCenter]

31. A jail medical department is probably run on a quasi-military style of management

And there are probably a long list of rules about interactions with prisoners.

[dembotoz]

32. reminds me of a place i used to work

longer you were there more expensive you became

earn vacation
sick days
up from the bottom pay scale

dump and rehire
save money

nurses, teachers, prob most workers
unplug one plug in another.

[FarCenter]

42. That's the fundamental problem with using seniority as the basis for pay and benefits

In most jobs, you are as good as you are going to get after 5 to 10 years. Adding pay and benefits beyond that just increases the probability that the employer will figure out how to get rid of the employee, especially those whose performance deteriorates after 5 to 10 years on the job.

[dembotoz]

61. still of the generation that thought loyalty should be rewarded

long time at the same place should count for something

[FarCenter]

62. Staying in the same job at the same organization for over 10 years isn't loyalty, it's inertia.

[XanaDUer]

69. Sometimes a hospital or gov job is the

Only game in some towns to get benefits, pensions etc at all. And I leave my jobs at three to five years. Cannot always say the person is inert. Rural areas don't always have tons of jobs. Hell, cities sometimes don't, either.

[Faygo Kid]

35. Terrible. Nurse Ratched?

We are fortunate to be in our later years, my friend. The USA is finished. Go back to England if you can.

[XanaDUer]

37. Amen. nt

[SammyWinstonJack]

43. Go back to England if you can. Before it too is finished. Headed in that direction, is it not?

I agree, the USA IS finished and....go back.

[Romulox]

38. Mandatory private health insurance will solve this problem. For-profit care is the law! nt

[GoCubsGo]

46. It's not just in your field.

My sister works for a major grocery store chain. Management has been using every little excuse they can to get rid of employees throughout the chain.

[SoCalDem]

47. Call me paranoid, but

You have given some pretty identifiable info in this thread, and you might want to consider removing it.

There ARE vindictive people who could probably figure out who you work for and it might end up harming you

[etherealtruth]

49. I can't believe what has happened within nursing/ the healthcare industry

I am 50, my first career was a nurse (prior to raising kids ...).

As you are well aware, in the 80's and 90's it was almost impossible to remain fully staffed .... layoffs or "trivial" firings were unheard of.

I hear stories like yours from so many friends that remained in healthcare. I often miss nursing (frequently regretting my decision to change careers when I re-entered the work force) .... ?

[Historic NY]

56. My niece works in a new county trauma center....

Critical Care & now Ped's ICU...she was recruited from another center. I know she wants to go back to school so she can land a nursing teaching position....right now she is hauling in a boatload of money. I think its beginning to grind at her.

[etherealtruth]

57. Though extremely rewarding ....

... nursing is an extremely wearing/ draining profession.

After working ~10 years (gero psych and Hospice) I took a decade + off to raise my children. when I got divorced I opted to get an entirely different degree (as a single mother of three I just couldn't face the very emotionally draining demands of nursing/ demanding nursing schedules) ... now that my youngest is 16 ... I am considering going back to nursing

[Historic NY]

59. Well she is a busy 30 something...

heads the local (volunteer) Level 1 ALS ambulance & EMS, they employ 5 ft and 10 pt paramedics along with fly car service to some surround communities.

[pinto]

51. Fiscal cuts? I know many county services / staff are getting cut in my area.

Sounds like it's cast a pall of sorts in your workplace, as well. Hope there's some resolution for all. I hate to see cut backs hit health care.

[tawadi]

55. With fewer labor laws to protect workers and fewer unions

An employer can fire an employee at will in many states these days. A labor attorney told me he handles discrimination or sexual harassment cases only. Other labor law cases are apparently too difficult to win.

[Zalatix]

66. The nurses should go on strike. Betcha they can't find replacements.