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TheWraith

(24,331 posts)
Wed Jul 11, 2012, 06:36 PM Jul 2012

About Obamacare... has anyone here ever seen the movie "Amazing Grace?"

It's a 2006 film, not very well known, about William Wilburforce and his lifelong campaign to end the slave trade in the British Empire. Over and over again, he tries: demonstrations, petitions, spectacles, public pressure, education... and every time comes up short, because the slave trade is so profitable that every member of parliament in every port city in Britain depends on it. For their own wealth, for favors, and for producing trade. So over and over he loses the votes in Parliament, no matter what he does.

In the end, someone comes up with an idea: creating a legal loophole that allows privateers to prey on British slave ships, knowing that this would make the slave trade unprofitable. Once the money is gone, the slave traders will no longer have their pull in parliament, and within a few years abolition will pass easily.

This is what I think many people here don't appreciate about Obamacare. It's not simply a matter of "bill passes, healthcare is now cheap." It's a matter of squeezing the influence out of the system.

Take the Medical Loss Ratio, which under Obamacare dictates that between 80 and 85% of all insurance revenues go to paying for actual healthcare, leaving 15 to 20 percent for other things, depending on the company. Mind you, that's not 15-20% profit--that's 15-20% of all revenue which can be spent on things like paying the employees, maintaining facilities, advertising, etcetera. At most, 20% goes to the folder marked "everything that's not paying your doctor's bill." And that includes lobbying.

For a point of comparison, Microsoft spends 68% of all its revenue on expenses. General Motors spends a whopping 95% of its revenue on expenses. Netflix spends 93%. A 20% maximum limit on expenses represents an unprecedented emphasis on shrinking overhead, an emphasis which is going to make insurance industry lobbying effectively a thing of the past.

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Jackpine Radical

(45,274 posts)
1. The difference between Microsoft or GM and the insurance industry
Wed Jul 11, 2012, 06:42 PM
Jul 2012

is that the former 2 develop & produce products, while the ins. cos. have a totally parasitic role. Medicare does it for 3%, not 15 or 20%.

Edited to add--Yes, I saw the movie & thought it was very powerful.

TheWraith

(24,331 posts)
9. I think your perspective is limited.
Wed Jul 11, 2012, 07:09 PM
Jul 2012

Not to mention I dare say you'll find more hard work being done at an insurance company than you will at Microsoft on any given day.

That said, there's a world of difference between a functionally static "one size fits all" system like Medicare, and private insurance, largely because of the variability in coverage. Whereas an insurer might have a basic plan that offers Medicare-like service with a 5% overhead, the same company might also have extremely premium plans with an overhead of 30 or 40%, plans that offer a regular contact person, easier billing, more comprehensive personalized coverage, etcetera. The MLR doesn't say that every plan has to meet the exact same 80 or 85% ratio, just that OVERALL the insurer has to meet that ratio. In effect you end up with a situation where an insurer would be motivated to offer a large number of basic-but-efficient plans on the low end of the scale to offset the more profitable premium plans on the other end of the spectrum. In fact, with that being the case insurers would eventually have reason to welcome something like single-payer healthcare, as they could hand over the unprofitable customers to the government and concentrate exclusively on "premium" customers who prefer to opt out and buy their own insurance.

Jackpine Radical

(45,274 posts)
13. Right. The insurance cos. employ large numbers of people in their various schemes
Sat Jul 14, 2012, 02:01 PM
Jul 2012

to deny payment for services. I have been involved with a number of small OP mental health clinics, and they all have to employ people to fight the claims denials, "lost" claims, slow payments, partial payments etc. that the insurance cos. routinely employ to hang onto their money.

I would never deny that people employed by insurance companies engage in work; I would merely question whether that work is socially useful.

 

Woody Woodpecker

(562 posts)
2. Well, the Amazing Grace movie I remember
Wed Jul 11, 2012, 06:45 PM
Jul 2012

starred Alex English (former Denver Nuggets superstar)

it was called Amazing Grace and Chuck

 

Lionessa

(3,894 posts)
3. I don't see how giving insurance companies guaranteed customers squeezes the influence out.
Wed Jul 11, 2012, 06:55 PM
Jul 2012

Particularly when one considers the controversy over the insurance industry actually writing most of the bill.

TheWraith

(24,331 posts)
5. Given that they didn't write the bill, and fought it tooth and nail...
Wed Jul 11, 2012, 06:57 PM
Jul 2012

I'm not sure how much I can explain if we can't agree to start with the basic facts. But I'd advise re-reading my OP and going through the numbers.

Mimosa

(9,131 posts)
4. LOVE that movie!
Wed Jul 11, 2012, 06:56 PM
Jul 2012

Amazing Grace is an underrated movie.

I'd written about in the past, here:

http://vincentandmorticiasspeakeasy14846.yuku.com/reply/18087/Amazing-Grace-opening-soon-Don-t-wait-for-DVD-#reply-18087

Wraith, you're a genius. I never would have linked the strategy. The film also showed that abolishing the British slave trade took at least 20 years.

Edited to include links. BTW, some people on D.U. who frequently deride Christians' might want to read up on William Wilberforce.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/William_Wilberforce

IMDB listing for Amazing Grace:

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0454776/

limpyhobbler

(8,244 posts)
8. 'At most, 20% goes to the folder marked "everything that's not paying your doctor's bill."'
Wed Jul 11, 2012, 07:08 PM
Jul 2012

Really?

So if my premiums are $5000 and my doctor's bills total $Zero?

Do I get all the money back except for 20% ?

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