Been here a lot today. Haven't seen the post were the gun owners posted their feeling of sorrow

[upaloopa]

and shock by what happened in Aurora.

[Scootaloo]

1. You haven't? They're all over the place!

You just haven't realized that guns are the real victims here!

[Zalatix]

80. I feel as much frustration at the failure to stop this idiot, as I feel sorrow.

This shit was bound to happen. The guy also had bombs which he probably would have used had guns been illegal. I don't think guns are the real victims here - he should have been caught while buying tons of ammo online PLUS buying explosives and all the other shit he had at his apartment.

This tragedy was bad enough without the fact that it could have been prevented, even without banning guns. Pity they're too busy chasing pot smoking blacks (but not meth-using whites), Muslims and Occupy activists to do their real job. Lives were lost because of not only that man's demonic acts, but also the incompetence and piss poor prioritization of law enforcement resources. We had plenty of means to stop him. Why did no one catch this guy ahead of time? Why are our politicians creating these civil liberty-killing surveillance and profiling systems and then not actually using them?

What an absolute fucking fuck-up.

[valerief]

101. Badda bing! It certainly seems it with all this gun spam in freakin' GD! nt

[movonne]

108. busy with defending the guns and nra....can't have a good killing

spree without defending our civil rights...and when the next mega shooting comes alone (and it will) we will all gather here and have the same discussions...

[babylonsister]

2. Why did you expect that? Their job is to sell guns, not to feel sorrow. nt

[azurnoir]

41. so anyone who owns a gun is attempting to sell them too

well I guess ya learn something new everyday

[babylonsister]

46. Sorry, I missed your original premise.

No need to be so snarky.

Good point. I 'know a guy' who works for a gun company in GA. I bet he's appalled. I bet they all are. It's interesting that no one here has expressed that, but I am not sure. I hope you know what you're talking about. Have you checked around?

[azurnoir]

48. The premise of the OP is that gun owners on DU haven't expressed their sorrow

you said they were too busy selling guns, I answered that however as I said down thread I have not seen the thread that is about expressing sorrow at what happened in Aurora, maybe there is one, but I have not seen it, what I have seen is a lot of pontificating about guns

[Tsiyu]

64. ....not hard to locate if you cared to....

http://www.democraticunderground.com/1002985981

[azurnoir]

81. Thank you I wasn't around at the time it run but thank you

it helps restore some faith in DU

[Tsiyu]

94. No problema, azurnoir

These threads are usually in the Gungeon, and I suppose that's why...gun control is a very socially polarizing - yet highly personal - issue.

It helped me to take a moment to remember those who have fallen.

[UnrepentantLiberal]

122. I only see two RKBA posters in that thread.

None of the staunch gun advocates of the last few days posted to it.

[malaise]

86. Ding ding we have a winner

[samsingh]

3. They sorrow is hidden under their love of guns

[GarroHorus]

4. Wow

That's sorta like the wingnuts demanding Muslims show their feelings of sorrow for 9/11.

[upaloopa]

9. No it's not but the Muslim community did express sorrow for 9/11.

[AtheistCrusader]

72. Since you brought it up

I come here to talk politics and political policy/law.

I do not come here to share my fucking feelings. How I express sorrow for injured or killed humans is none of your fucking business, and not something I will parade around here like a badge of honor or some shit.

[baldguy]

12. Well, the difference is most Muslims *DID* express sorrow over 9/11.

When tragedies occur, that's what normal, sympathetic & compassionate people do. What upaloopa is saying - accurately - is that no such expressions of feeling are coming from gun worshipers.

[GarroHorus]

14. Most gun owners DID expres sorrow over the events of July 20

Just because there wasn't a special thread on DU over it doesn't alter that fact.

[baldguy]

21. And yet with this perfect opportunity to do so, we still don't see any.

Just another place to promote the RW gun crusade.

[GarroHorus]

22. That is PRECISELY what the wingnuts said about Muslims after 9/11

Both extremes are just that, EXTREME.

[Fridays Child]

17. The OP didn't demand that anyone do anything.

nt

[GarroHorus]

20. The OP has impled it multiple times in multiple threads

Which is why I now have the OP on ignore.

THE NRA and the anti-gun extremists are both wrong.

[baldguy]

24. You have the OP on ignore? Oh, you precious, fragile little thing, you!

[GarroHorus]

28. Life is short

Why waste it on extremists on either side?

[baldguy]

32. Seems like you're ignoring the moderates on one side & playing with the extremists on the other.

[azurnoir]

40. so making sweeping statemnets about DUers is moderate in your view?

well okay then but IMO how does anyone know whether any DUer is a gun owner or not?

[alittlelark]

54. uh, yeah......

extremists? Me thinks thou does protest too much.....



I have no one on ignore..... yet.

[Puglover]

87. Uh if you have the OP on ignore.

Then how exactly are you posting in the OPs thread?

[DainBramaged]

38. Aren't hey just precious?

when the wind blows, they are right there.

[morningfog]

114. How are you posting in this thread with the OP on ignore?

[azurnoir]

44. someone alerted your post here are bthe jury results

At Sat Jul 21, 2012, 11:57 PM an alert was sent on the following post:

Wow
http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=996373

REASON FOR ALERT:

This post is disruptive, hurtful, rude, insensitive, over-the-top, or otherwise inappropriate. (See <a href="http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=aboutus#communitystandards" target="_blank">Community Standards</a>.)

ALERTER'S COMMENTS:

Asking gun fans to tone it down = RW religious nuts asking Muslims to apologize for 911.

You served on a randomly-selected Jury of DU members which reviewed this post. The review was completed at Sun Jul 22, 2012, 12:00 AM, and the Jury voted 3-3 to LEAVE IT.

Juror #1 voted to HIDE IT and said: No explanation given
Juror #2 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE and said: I am not unsympathetic to the alerter but there's no violation of any rules that I can see
Juror #3 voted to HIDE IT and said: No explanation given
Juror #4 voted to HIDE IT and said: No explanation given
Juror #5 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE and said: the alerter equates all gun owners to rightwingers really the OP it self is more offensive than the alerted comment
Juror #6 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE and said: Anti gunners are much more shrill in light of current events.

Regarding this post - there is nothing to tone down.

Thank you very much for participating in our Jury system, and we hope you will be able to participate again in the future.

I myself really haven't seen the thread asking for an expression of sorrow, what I have seen today is many getting up on their own soapbox and using this tragedy as a political vehicle for their own beliefs, that in itself is tragic for DU

[adigal]

97. Of course people are sorrowful! That is the reason I want gun laws strengthened!

I, for one, am sick of these killings every other week, damn it! Just my disgust shows how sick of it I am. And I live in the country where everyone has guns! There has to be a middle ground here somewhere.

I think the OP is bored, looking to stir up,trouble. Because the whole premise makes no sense.

[baldguy]

5. They have no sorrow, or remorse for what happened, or compassion for those killed & injured.

But they have found a need to try to defend the shooter's right to purchase his weapons - and they've tried to score rhetorical points against those who have expressed sorrow, shock & outrage over the ease with which he got them.

[krispos42]

71. And of course you immediately expressed compassion and sorrow...

...without using it to push your anti-gun agenda, right?

[AtheistCrusader]

74. Oh yes, that's it.

:rolleyes:

[Marengo]

93. And how do you KNOW this? Are you a mentalist?

[Reasonable_Argument]

6. You should read more posts then

Everyone here trying to protect their rights has been saying what a tragedy this is, but they're not going to roll over when you use it as in excuse to expand gun control.

[upaloopa]

11. Well maybe you can express sorrow over the idea that more mass killings will bring on more gun

control.

[Reasonable_Argument]

25. I resent

the implication that I don't grieve for this senseless loss of life simply because I won't accept it as an excuse for a further restriction on my rights.

[baldguy]

35. "I'll cry for the dead, just as long as I can keep my guns."

Doesn't wash. It screams of insincerity.

[Reasonable_Argument]

37. Only

due to the fact that you're pushing an agenda I don't agree with.

[cyclezealot]

45. Good point. Insincerity hits the mark.

[Reasonable_Argument]

47. Ok

Let's say we're having a discussion about someone saying something truly heinous. Person X says we need to put further restrictions on the 1st Amendment, person Y says "no what he said was horrible but we can't give up our 1st Amendment protection just because you hate what he said". Person X replies by saying Person Y doesn't "really" hate what was said because he doesn't want the additional restrictions of his rights. That's exactly what you two are saying here in regards to the 2nd Amendment.

[cyclezealot]

51. Does not matter to us..

3/4's of the year we live abroad.. We've escaped the Second Amendment and we do not miss it.. Ah, the joy of leaving one's front door open all night and just the screen letting in fresh air.. What a freedom that is...

[Reasonable_Argument]

55. Interesting

but doesn't address my point at all.

[cyclezealot]

60. A freedom lost that you don't miss

is not a loss.

[Reasonable_Argument]

63. Well

while you may not miss it, though I bet you would, your decedents may miss it dearly.

[cyclezealot]

65. Enjoy your night out at the movies..

We do..

[Reasonable_Argument]

66. I do also

I don't live in fear of random tragedies.

[cyclezealot]

68. Even though our US base has low crime rates.

@ 2.79 violent crimes per 1000 , we've missed armed robberies at restaurants and 7-11's by less than a half hour.. So, media reports tell us.. I'd watch my back as I enter 7-11's at night never the less.

[handmade34]

104. interesting...

as I am someone who often likes to point out the tremendous negative impact factory farming of animals has on our environment and that it would be reasonable to cut our consumption... the response if all too often "you can't tell me what to eat!!" even though that person may claim to care about global climate change and/or the environment...

too often all of us say "I care, as long as I don't have to change my habits" NIMBY

hence, one of my reasons for believing that we desperately need a strong gov't 'of and by the (collective) people' a group can be more objective and rational, whereas individuals can often be very irrational

[freshwest]

26. Good point. And accept not policing/regulating their fellows will rightly bring trouble on them.

There is a time to listen and stop defending a point so much and being offended, and working for solutions. Doing nothing is not a solution, nor is leaving it to God to sort it out. It's up to us to determine what the problem really is, not hide from it.

[Reasonable_Argument]

30. I agree

I strongly support a vastly expanded mental health system, tied to the instant check when buying a firearm, to help prevent future tragedies. While it may not have prevented these deaths it would go a long way in preventing future deaths.

[freshwest]

34. Which will require investing in healthcare and mental health parity for the good of all, not profit.

The money that has been made, the money that has been 'saved' in an insane form of reckoning, is not worth the cost of the lives and the misery of the individuals affected, and the loss of things more important than money.

[Reasonable_Argument]

42. We really should move as quickly as possible to a single payer system.

[freshwest]

53. Can't happen with the current house, but we have out foot in the door now, and that is where we need

To get to, and I think with some relief and some people seeing that it is in the long run good for them, it'll happen. It can be done, just requires the votes. Thanks.

[Scootaloo]

23. Yes, exactly

The primary concern on DU, from just twenty minutes after the news broke has been this;

"DON'T TOUCH MY GUNS! THEY'RE MINE! YOU GOTS NO RIGHT WITH YOUR BIG GUBBERMINT TO OUCH MY GUNS! HALABJA! POLICE STATE! FREEEEEEDOOOOOOOOOOOOM! oh yeah and it's sad some people died or whatever DON'T TALK ABOUT GUNS!"

But what can I expect from our local contingent of right-wing sociopaths who view their property as more valuable than other peoples' lives?

[Ruby the Liberal]

7. As soon as the NRA tells them to quit shitting their beds

over the idea that someone may be coming for their guns, they will relax and have a moment of silence for the victims in Aurora.

Until then, they are in a collective moment of "silence" (read: panic) for what may, in 20-30 years, be regulations on the size of their BFF accessory round accessories.

Give them time.

[Wait Wut]

16. The majority of gun owners...

...are not members of the NRA. I don't give a flying fuck what the NRA says.

[baldguy]

36. But the NRA plays the tune they all dance to.

[Wait Wut]

43. Oh, that's right.

I forgot to turn up the music.

All dog owners own dogs so they're all guilty of vicious dog attacks.
Skinheads shave their heads so all bald guys are skinheads.
Some kid killed himself after listening to Ozzy so all metal is Satanic.

Thanks, but no thanks. I'll continue to judge the individual and not the stereotype.

[Reasonable_Argument]

59. Interesting

but I don't support the NRA because they seem to exclusive support republican candidates. You are interested in hearing form liberal gun owners right?

[Ruby the Liberal]

49. Then my comments don't apply to you.

[abolugi]

8. not all gun owners

are against gun control. I own a gun. My husband has 3. I live in California and I am grateful for the tight gun laws we have in our state.
My heart BLEEDS for the victims.
If the people of Colorado don't care enough to do something about it, after Columbine and now this, what can you do. They have more right to shoot you then you have not to get shot...

[lumberjack_jeff]

10. How do you expect that sorrow to manifest itself?

Last edited Sun Jul 22, 2012, 11:56 AM - Edit history (1)

Were you expecting; "Oh crap, this is terrible! I feel so terrible for the families."
Or were you expecting "Please excuse me while I immolate myself on the bonfire I started to burn my grandpa's hunting rifle."

[ohheckyeah]

52. Thank you.

Why do I need to prove to anyone on D.U. how I feel about the shooting?

I see a lot of people using the tragedy to talk about how upset they personally are - look at them and how upset they are, poor them. It's not about them and their feelings or me and mine. What difference to the victims and their families are condolences from a stranger on a message board they will never read ? Oh, yes, to prove to some people on D.U. that I'm not a heartless witch.

[upaloopa]

19. Well everyone has one you to. Where is the demand buy gun owners to find solutions to mass murder?

Tomorrow you'll be back intimidating people who want to try and do something about it. No wait, you just did that!

[Wait Wut]

15. No. What you haven't seen is...

...everyone expressing remorse saying they're gun owners. I didn't think it was necessary. I also play video games. Does this mean I'm guilty of something?

Something else you haven't seen. Most gun owners not putting the deaths of people...real human beings...up for a political debate.

I cried when I heard the news and I cried again when I saw the faces of some of the victims. I didn't pick up a banner for the 2nd Amendment and run around the block with it.

I support strict regulations. The more the better. I don't support broad-brush attacks on any group of people. Not even DU members that happen to be gun owners.

[upaloopa]

27. How about something like this. "What a tragedy, Gun owners and non gun owners should come together

and try to do something about the proliferation of guns, gun culture an killings in this country?"

[Wait Wut]

39. Yeah...that's called being a voter.

Just a little heads up, people who go to extremes and use broad-brush attacks turn me off. I'm not about to join up with any group of people that will consider me an evil, heartless human being because I do, say, worship or own something they don't like. On the other hand, I will vote for Democrats that call for stricter regulations and control.

I'm not ready to turn this into a political event. You go right ahead. I'm still picturing the faces in my mind. You feel free to run around with that banner of yours while the rest of us (gun owners and not) mourn the loss of innocent lives at the hands of someone who was probably mentally ill.

Your argument sickens me just as much as the teapers and Cons that are blaming this on the lack of Christian teachings and gay rights. If you want "gun owners and non-gun owners" to come together, you might want to start seeing us all as people first.

[ohheckyeah]

56. Why, so you will feel better?

How about we let the families bury and grieve for their dead before making it a political football? Of course some people can't pass up the opportunity to use a tragedy to slam other people and stir up shit.

[UnrepentantLiberal]

123. If you support strict regulations than your not the problem.

The OP was poorly worded.

[mahina]

18. Posting statements like 'it's such a shame' about the loss of life.

Wrecking a manicure, rain on a newly washed car, or missing an appointment might qualify as a shame. Aurora? Doesn't really come close.

[Tsiyu]

29. Some gun owners have

but the gun psychos have been strangely silent. None of the anti-gun control folks I read even wasted a word of sympathy here except for themselves. Pretty telling how they view human life. It's trumped by their warm fuzzy bullet fetish I suspect.

Or possibly it's because they've been to those conspiracy sites that are foaming at the mouth that this was all a staged event, nobody died, and Obama is using this staged psy-ops to take their guns away and replace them with government cheese.

Nobody died! It was all made up! Gotta love the nuts...


Thanks for pointing this out OP

Tsiyu

[chknltl]

31. fwiw, haven't seen a lot of posts....

....where gun-nuts/anti-gun-nuts have expressed their shock/horror and most importantly sorrow over what happened in Aurora. Have seen lots of anger and ....anger.

[IADEMO2004]

33. Well you should have been in a Democratic Party County Fair Booth with me today

face to face with Obama is going to take away women's right to vote. Obama is a Communist. Obama is a Muslim. Obama wants force women to have abortions. Go get 10 people registered to vote. Get early voting cards signed and turned in. Hit the streets there are way too many voters with no idea what they are talking about.

[SoDesuKa]

78. Face to Face

Thank you for your service to the Democratic party. You came face to face with some ignorant people today.

[Lizzie Poppet]

50. Not surprising, really.

I have no doubt that virtually all of us gun owners are having those feeling...but this certainly isn't any place I'd choose to express them. Not with all the hysteria, vicious attacks and insults on our character and mental health, etc. that have been filling the board. The forum is an nasty, contentious place right now, more so than usual. I imagine most gun owners that post here are like me: no way are they going to let themselves in for the inevitable shitstorm of vituperation if they tried posting something expressive of their sorrow and sympathy. I think we both know how that would turn out...

[ohheckyeah]

57. Thank you -

I couldn't have said it as well.

[Ruby the Liberal]

58. Try it.

I think you might be pleasantly surprised as to the number of members here who would support you as opposed to fighting you to defend their rights to be armed without consequence.

[Tsiyu]

62. You're no psychic

I'm a gun owner,

I've expressed my sympathy.

It turned out fine.

Delicate anti-gun control flowers are more numerous here today than nasty contentious people, from what I've seen.

Here's a thread expressly for that purpose:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/1002985981

It's amazing how few people showed their feelings there. Just saving the passion for their guns, I suppose, since they upped the post count on the gun threads like crazy.

Edit to add: you've only been here a year and you know what's "usual?" Get used to contentious argument here. We aren't like Republicans. We can agree to disagree and get in very heated arguments, but that's how change and understanding happen.

Better get a thicker skin on DU if you think THIS is bad.... just sayin'

[Union Scribe]

76. Agreed.

With DU gun owners being told they are "crazies" and "have blood on their hands," it's hardly surprising that the majority of posts from them are defending themselves. It started right after the shooting, there wasn't any TIME for people to express anything before the first volleys of "ban the gun nuts" were being lobbed.

[Tuesday Afternoon]

89. I considered posting a Silent thread in Memoriam but, rejected it upon further reflection.

Last edited Sun Jul 22, 2012, 12:51 PM - Edit history (1)

Did not think I could deal with it IF someone came in with snide comments and emotional snark based on my Profile. I have a question: could someone please link me to any thread where any DUer has started some type of condolence thread. Thank you.

[Tsiyu]

95. Sure thing

The link is posted up thread, but I'll post it again:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/1002985981

[Tuesday Afternoon]

96. already replied. find it odd that so few DUers replied. thanks.

[Tsiyu]

98. Yeah, I saw that after I posted the link again

Thank you, and yes, it is sad and odd that that thread got very little attention.

That's why this OP was started, I imagine.

[Tuesday Afternoon]

99. really? somehow I doubt that. ---

I find this OP to be in extremely poor taste and I think it is sad commentary on the state of DU that this thread has more replies and attention than the other one. ymmv.

[Tsiyu]

100. We'll have to disagree on taste

having the gun psychos gloating all over the place yesterday was the tackiest, most cruel thing I've seen on DU in a while. It takes nothing to spend a moment to show your sympathy, yet I saw none do so. THAT is a sad commentary on the state of DU, but I fault only the gun psychos and not the average DUer. The truth is sad.

There's definitely a reason we have normally confined these arguments to the Gungeon.

The OP's pointing that out may be in poor taste to you, but the poster is correct in what they are saying IMO

[Tuesday Afternoon]

103. the OP could have started his own memorial thread

instead he started a thread that on DU2 would have been locked as flamebait.

most definitely we are in total disagreement.

Have a Nice Day. Peace Out.

[Tsiyu]

105. WEll, the OP's question was one I myself asked on several threads

because it struck me that the gun psychos did not pass go or collect their $200 or express even a modicum of sympathy before launching their anti-gun control screeching. And frankly, it pissed me off. So I am glad the OP called attention to that.

Nothing wrong with checking ourselves from time to time.

And to be honest, most of the threads yesterday would be considered flamebait on DU2, but this is a new DU day

Peace out yourself, there. It's been a rough weekend for everybody.

[Tuesday Afternoon]

107. the thing is I don't come to DU looking for gun psychos. so how would I expect a thread to be

started by one? trolls should be alerted and let Mirt or the Admin handle them. Mental Illness needs to be addressed regarding this issue but, this is not the way. The Gun Psycho is in custody, thank god.

it has been rough weekend but, nothing compared to what those families are going through. Perspective.

[Tsiyu]

110. Don't quite get what you're saying about that

but I agree that perspective is key.

That's why I hoped to see a little more restraint rather than the "Give up, you fools! Bwa-ha-ha-ha!!" attitude of many posters yesterday when others tried to discuss regulating firearms to perhaps forestall this type of tragedy in the future.

[Tuesday Afternoon]

111. point is only ONE thread was started and I don't know if that person is a gun owner or not. --

What difference does it make WHO started the thread. that DU, as a whole, let that thread fall off is very sad.

[permatex]

61. I already said my prayers for the victims and families

I don't need to express them here to prove to you or anyone else my anguish and sorrow for the tragic loss of life.
Frankly, your OP offends me.

[dtom67]

67. Understand where you are coming from but.....

winning the next election is the most important thing for us to concentrate on right now.

This incident is a goldmine for the repubs; The liberal blogs will blaze with gun-control ravings and the NRA will not have to stir up its base.

We will do it for them.

You will never get rid of guns in America.

The only result of posts like this is to rouse NRA members for election time.

Besides, I doubt that anyone on this site is happy about the massacre .

[aikoaiko]

69. Then you haven't been looking very hard.

Some people are angry, some people are sorrowful, some people are shocked, and some people are just being assholes.

[Waiting For Everyman]

70. Jury results on your OP.

At Sun Jul 22, 2012, 02:38 AM an alert was sent on the following post:

Been here a lot today. Haven't seen the post were the gun owners posted their feeling of sorrow
http://www.democraticunderground.com/1002996344

REASON FOR ALERT:

This post is disruptive, hurtful, rude, insensitive, over-the-top, or otherwise inappropriate. (See <a href="http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=aboutus#communitystandards" target="_blank">Community Standards</a>.)

ALERTER'S COMMENTS:

This is pure flame bait. The assumption is that Democrats who own guns are somehow guilty by association and must atone for not being anti-gun. This is an intolerant and hate-filled argument and the purpose of this post was to throw fuel on a fire and start more fights , not to discuss a tragedy.

You served on a randomly-selected Jury of DU members which reviewed this post. The review was completed at Sun Jul 22, 2012, 02:46 AM, and the Jury voted 1-5 to LEAVE IT.

Juror #1 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE and said: a mere statement of having not seen something is hardly reason to hide it.
Juror #2 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE and said: No explanation given
Juror #3 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE and said: No explanation given
Juror #4 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE and said: I've seen a lot of bullshit alerts on here, but this one takes the prize. There is nothing at all wrong with this post.
Juror #5 voted to HIDE IT and said: No explanation given
Juror #6 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE and said: No explanation given

Thank you very much for participating in our Jury system, and we hope you will be able to participate again in the future.

[jillan]

73. I have seen gun owners on DU and other forums express the need for stricter gun laws.

And I think that has been a breath of fresh air.


What I am waiting for, is a statement from these enablers...

[img][/img]

Have they put out a statement yet? Or are they too busy doing fundraising because people want to take away their 2nd amendment remedies?
eta - look at that proud momma!

[Hoyt]

128. Promotion and glamorization of guns is like tobacco. Reducing that

helped a bit.

[Crunchy Frog]

75. But just think of all the people who didn't get shot that day.

And anyway, statistically, the number of shootings has never been lower. Or so I get told on here repeatedly.

[rppper]

77. You're painting people with broad strokes

The kind of reaction your seeking is over at free republic, brietbart or a thousand other right wing NRA nut job websites...I've responsibly owned firearms all my life...was saddened when the Brady bill expired with a whimper...I support responsible ownership and I have worked in the mental health/addictions field....if you want to pick a fight go to those wing nut sites and start throwing blows....you assume we are all cut from some NRA cloth....you know what they say about assuming.

[clayton72]

79. I'm a progressive and a gun owner

I am a progressive and a strong supporter of gun rights. People who want to do harm to a large number of people will find a way. Bombs, poison, etc. Guns aren't the problem and neither are our gun laws. Give people jobs, education, and hope. Violence goes down when people are successful. So does drug and alcohol abuse and domestic violence. Conversely, when industry goes overseas and the economies of states suffer people who are scared and desperate get a bit nuts. See also, Michigan Militia. The auto industry collapsed and the emotional pain of parents not being able to provide a better future for their children led to some crazy stuff. The poorest places in the world have the highest violence. The pirates of Somalia were fishermen before the Brits dumped their toxic waste there and killed off the fish. The world is suffering and destabilizing. The future is uncertain and all peoples have the right to defend themselves. My heart goes out to the families of those who were harmed, I am truly sorry for their loss. I support any effort to make the world a better place and I will work against any effort to restrict gun rights. How about we increase funding for mental health. So many homeless folks wound up that way because of mental health issues. Most of them are not dangerous, they are vulnerable. They are victimized. And they deserve so much better. In a first class country all persons should get the healthcare they need without penalty or stigma. Gun control is a losing issue and will hand the GOP the election this fall if it's not dropped.

[B Calm]

82. Great post! I especially

agree with your last sentence about gun control being a losing issue!

What I'm seeing around here over the last day make me ill. The reactions from many of the posters on DU are exactly what the NRA is wanting!!

[clayton72]

119. It is a losing issue!

And Obama knows it. They're not going to touch it. Ever since Obama took office he's known better than to go there, but that hasn't stopped the GOP for making wild claims about the administrations "secret plans" for the country.

[baldguy]

83. This has been here almost 8 hrs, and what do we see? Still no expressions of sorrow from gun owners.

A lot of defensiveness. A lot of excuses. A lot of finger-pointing. And a whole lot of RW extremist talking points. No sorrow or remorse, though.

Proves to OP's point, doesn't it?

[SickOfTheOnePct]

106. I'm sorry that some nut decided to decided to shoot up a theater full of people

I'm sorry that people died, and that their families will suffer that loss forever.

I'm not sorry that I own firearms, and I'm not sorry that I support the 2nd Amendment.

[Tsiyu]

113. And, of course, in the end, it IS all about YOU n/t

[SickOfTheOnePct]

116. Nope, not at all

The OP was wondering where the posts were from gun owners expressing sorrow.

That was mine.

[Tsiyu]

117. I see n/t

[Pholus]

84. Typical response: "If you think I feel any guilt, you don't know me very well!"

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=994297

In a thread started by this same guy that said, in effect, to give up advocating for ANY gun restrictions because it's futile.

Though he magnanimously gave permission for us to whine if it made us feel better.

[baldguy]

85. Think of every other human endeavor when tragedies happen and deaths occur.

Always, the very first & most prominent people who work to make that endeavor safer & ensure no more accidental deaths occur are THOSE WHO ARE ENGAGED IN THAT ENDEAVOR. Not so with gun owners.

[Union Scribe]

121. What the hell are you talking about?

"engaged in that endeavor," what does that even mean? DU gun owners engaged in what? Buying a gun? That doesn't connect them to this murderer. Am I supposed to wear burlap and ashes when another Ford driver kills someone? Your entire approach to this issue is so irrational and insult-based that I can't take really anything you say seriously, but this "feel more bad!" thing is a real apex moment.

[baldguy]

124. And here is the cluelessness of gun worshipers is on full display.

Or is it just the normal RW arrogant & deliberate ignorance?

When several tragic deaths occur involving motorcycles, "Responsible" motorcycle owners & enthusiasts will do everything they can & follow every law which makes their motorcycles safer & less dangerous to themselves, other motorcycle owners & the general public.

If they involve airplanes, "Responsible" aircraft pilots will do everything they can & follow every law which makes their aircraft safer & less dangerous to themselves, other aircraft pilots & the general public.

If they involve skydiving, "Responsible" skydivers will do everything they can & follow every law which makes their skydiving safer & less dangerous to themselves, other skydivers & the general public.

If they involve dogs, "Responsible" dog owners will do everything they can & follow every law which makes their dogs safer & less dangerous to themselves, other dogs, other dog owners & the general public.

But if they involve guns, so-called "Responsible" gun owners will fight every measure - proposed or imagined - and do everything they can to prevent laws which make their guns safer & less dangerous to themselves, other gun owners & the general public. If this wasn't true, the massacre in Aurora would never have happened.

[Union Scribe]

125. I don't own a gun, much less worship them

but thanks for proving that your argument only has two ingredients: insults and irrelevance. By the way, this ISN'T the argument you originally made, but it's not like that one made any more sense so that's fine. What you're saying now is simply that individuals should obey the law. Well no shit. Most gun owners obey the law, so where is their imperative to feel guilt for what happened more than a law-abiding individual in any of those other groups? There isn't any.

[baldguy]

127. And now you double-down.....

What I'm saying is that when people die, other people - other rational people - try to find ways of preventing similar deaths from occurring again. Not so with gun worshipers.

[Union Scribe]

129. No, they don't. None of the groups you describe

have any reason to "find ways of preventing similar deaths from occurring." Back to my car. I'm not an auto engineer or involved in the fatal crash, so beyond feeling bad for the victims I don't have any moral duty to "find ways" to stop it from happening. All I can and ought to do is obey the law and mind what I'm doing.

A lot of this stinks of the "moderate Muslims are to blame too" baloney from post-9/11 hysterics.

[Tuesday Afternoon]

88. too shocked too post. waiting for more information so that one can make an intelligent post rather

than the emotional snark that is this OP. Have fun at the expense of the victims all by yourself. Disgusting OP, imo. ymmv. Have a Nice Day. peace out.

[pintobean]

90. Sorrow? Are gun owners guilty of something?

If Holmes had used his car to plow through the ticket line and killed and injured the same number of people, would you expect car owners to express "sorrow"?
I think most people's emotional response to this tragedy is based on the actions of a mad man,not the tools he chose. Responsible owners of the same tools are not guilty of anything.

[Logical]

91. WTF is wrong with you? So you want 1000s of individual posts of sorrow? How about this Einstein,

show me one post from a gun owner where they said they were glad it happened.

This place is insane over this topis.

[HopeHoops]

92. I'm a gun owner. I'm shocked. I feel sorrow. That was just wrong on every level.

[valerief]

102. The metal phallus has no feelings. nt

[Skittles]

109. mmmmm------you should say gun nuts

plenty of gun owners are shocked and disgusted with what happened in Aurora

[soccer1]

115. I'm NOT a gun owner......

and I don't believe I've openly expressed my gut wrenching sorrow over the murders in Colorado.

[UTUSN]

118. R#30 & K for, love to this O.P. & g'night I'm gone. n/t

[Zorra]

120. Come to think of it, I haven't seen yours either.

Not saying there isn't one, I just haven't seen it.

And how about all the non-gun owners here that have not expressed sorrow in a post?

[gopiscrap]

126. Agreed most seem to parrot the nra bullshit

gotta prtect our guns