Rogue electors brief Clinton camp on anti-Trump plan
Source: Politico
Advocates of the long-shot bid to turn the Electoral College against Donald Trump have been in contact with close allies of Hillary Clinton, according to multiple sources familiar with the discussions, but the Clinton camp and Clinton herself have declined to weigh in on the merits of the plan.
...snip...
The electors leading the anti-Trump push say theyre operating without regard to the Clinton campaigns views and without its assistance. To some leaders of the anti-Trump effort, the lack of formal Democratic Party engagement is an asset as they attempt to woo Republicans.
Were really doing this on our own, said Polly Baca, a Democratic elector from Colorado and organizer of Hamilton Electors, the group encouraging Republican defections from Trump. This is something we have to do as electors. This is our responsibility.
...snip...
The Democratic electors have already revealed that theyre close to a consensus pick for whom they will vote: Ohio Gov. John Kasich.
Read more: http://www.politico.com/story/2016/12/electoral-college-rogues-trump-clinton-232195
LisaM
(27,846 posts)How he's contrived to pull the wool over everybody's eyes is beyond me, but he's as much as a menace as the rest of them.
Are they nuts?
TwilightZone
(25,505 posts)I realize that it's all relative and it's a matter of degrees, but I think Kasich would be better than batshit crazy.
That being said, the end result would probably be similar. The GOP is still going to be running Congress, and Kasich is really conservative. He might not get us into a war over Twitter, though. Then again....
robbedvoter
(28,290 posts)of distraction. Vote for her or the madman gets the nuclear codes. It's that simple.
robbedvoter
(28,290 posts)of the system when the world depends on their sense of reason
bigmonkey
(1,798 posts)It's a function of the Electoral College never exercised, but it's constitutional as hell.
LisaM
(27,846 posts)As a woman, I feel compelled to add that he might be worse on women's issues than Trump or almost anyone except Pence, and this paradigm wouldn't get rid of Pence.
TwilightZone
(25,505 posts)But you could certainly be right. Kasich's record is abysmal on women's issues.
It might get rid of Pence. It sounds like it depends on what the Senate would do, though I don't fully understand the process.
InAbLuEsTaTe
(24,123 posts)DK504
(3,847 posts)Kasich knows how to work the system. Herr Gropenfurher has no clue what he's doing is illegal and the press is letting him get away with it.
wordpix
(18,652 posts)Maybe it's explained further on. I just read the lead in.
lapucelle
(18,369 posts)Choosing a Democrat (including Hillary) would be seen as a partisan move, rather than a vote of conscience.
I don't think that Hillary would want or accept the office under these circumstances.
wordpix
(18,652 posts)LOTS of them.
and all the other GOP candidates would probably be worse than the present one.
William Seger
(10,788 posts)trueblue2007
(17,243 posts)She could still win this thing if they were not acting like they had their head up their butt.
Achilleaze
(15,543 posts)But do not - under any circumstances - vote for Kasich (R). Yuck a poo.
robbedvoter
(28,290 posts)We have idiots everywhere!
William Seger
(10,788 posts)... the House only gets to decide between the top three from the electoral vote. The hope is that given an actual choice, enough Republicans might bail on what's shaping up to be a disastrous administration.
stevenleser
(32,886 posts)Democratic electors have to vote for Hillary and they need to convince two dozen or so Republican electors to do so as well.
Democratic electors voting for Kasich or anyone else will not help.
Hestia
(3,818 posts)TexasBushwhacker
(20,228 posts)that Trump won, but I agree, 38 need to vote for Clinton. Voting for Kasich would, at best, send it to the House, who would choose a Republican, probably Trump.
stevenleser
(32,886 posts)You vote for your candidates slate of electors in your state. If your candidate does not win your state, their electors do not vote in the electoral college.
Laura PourMeADrink
(42,770 posts)so, the dem electors in the states Hillary won.....if they switch and vote for a republican....not trump....all that would do would be to deprive him of enough electors. thought originally the task was to get trump electors to switch to Hillary
wordpix
(18,652 posts)and other arcane, anachronistic slave-speak from the 1700's.
FBaggins
(26,775 posts)They're hoping to convince republican electors to vote for a different republican... Allowing the House to pick someone other than Trump OR Clinton.
So it has to be a Republican.
stevenleser
(32,886 posts)Kasich would gladly go along with privatization of Medicare and the rest of the Ryan domestic policy plan.
Trump at least campaigned against some of that so there is some hope that he might not go along with all of it.
Gore1FL
(21,160 posts)In all likelihood, if it went to the House, the net result is a GOP president. That would simply take Trump getting less than 270 and the candidate with the third most electors being the option.
If Democratic electors voting for Kasich encourages GOP electors to follow suit and put Trump at less than 270, more power to them.
treestar
(82,383 posts)Orange Disaster is not really preferred by most long term congress persons. They might prefer Hillary. They were expecting it to be her. Even Republicans.
wordpix
(18,652 posts)not just on Congress' pres. preference but also so many other things---Medicare, ACA, uncontrolled rampant development/no pollution controls, privatizing everything, etc. Will moderate R's join Dems or the Tee Party?
treestar
(82,383 posts)they all seem batshit insane!
wordpix
(18,652 posts)At least Paul Ryan has a moderate temperament and might follow protocol, especially if he were a novice like Trump. Our Novice President (ONT).
wordpix
(18,652 posts)Glad I won't be at the next RNC convention
progressoid
(50,001 posts)A Republican Congress will never certify rogue Electors for Hillary.
stevenleser
(32,886 posts)I don't think we can do ourselves a whole lot of good here.
treestar
(82,383 posts)and it would seem they would have to make objections on some ground and then resolve them.
Renew Deal
(81,885 posts)The House would pick from the top 3 choices. So if Kasich is in the top 3, the House could select him. It's a long shot.
treestar
(82,383 posts)they have to pick from the 3 top electoral vote getters.
Even Republicans in Congress could prefer Hillary to the Orange Disaster. They would certainly be under pressure.
Laura PourMeADrink
(42,770 posts)treestar
(82,383 posts)At the beginning of the republic, there might have been some instances.
wordpix
(18,652 posts)treestar
(82,383 posts)that would figure heavily in the choices made by electors or house representatives. Going against the will of the majority of the people should have some consequences.
wordpix
(18,652 posts)And that is Hillary
brooklynite
(94,808 posts)treestar
(82,383 posts)one of the reasons I thought he could never win. They have some sense of government and that he has no experience. Maybe they think they can use him as a puppet, but a lot of them might have the sense to see that is not going to happen and that he is going to be a big disaster and that might affect them. Heck it will, they will lose their seats if things go really wrong.
LisaL
(44,974 posts)Seems like a half baked plan to me.
wordpix
(18,652 posts)Kasich has no more right to the presidency than I do. He wasn't the R nominee by a long shot. geesh. Are they crazy?
lapucelle
(18,369 posts)The electoral college is a winner take all system in 48 states.
The electors would have to get enough Hamilton electors to give the consensus candidate 270 votes. You need Republican electors on board to reach that number.
Anything less than that would put the choice into the hands of the House, and their selection would be limited to the three candidates with the most electoral college votes. They would pick Trump.
rzemanfl
(29,575 posts)katsy
(4,246 posts)& causes him embarrassment is fine by me. Anything.
LisaL
(44,974 posts)Those are democratic electors, not republican.
and anything that upsets him and makes him twitter out his outrageous garbage and makes him look even worse.
treestar
(82,383 posts)is dealing with the popular vote loss!
CincyDem
(6,410 posts)Cryptoad
(8,254 posts)is that why the orange?
wordpix
(18,652 posts)I have been thru a lot myself and pulled through with medical treatment, a plant-based organic diet, exercise and now I'm healthy except for lasting effects of chemo. I can pretty much spot an unhealthy person and Kasich is one. Either that, or he was overly tired and drained from campaigning. I do not think he can go the distance.
Devil Child
(2,728 posts)Why would a Democratic elector EVER vote for Kasich of all people. I understand what they are trying to do in theory but they should be trying to convince Republican electors to stand in opposition to Trump.
lonestarnot
(77,097 posts)WhiteTara
(29,729 posts)Dopers_Greed
(2,640 posts)...at least just go for next-in-line, i.e. Speaker Ryan. Even though I don't agree with him on a single issue, he'd be vastly preferable to Herr Dump.
Generator
(7,770 posts)Yes I know Kasich's beliefs. Or Pence's. I don't want to lose the right to abortion. HOWEVER. I don't want a nuclear war or any mass war. I don't want to lose our civil rights. I don't want a police state. I don't want neo-Nazi's in the White House. So YES, anybody but Trump. I fear him. I dislike the others but I don't think they want to be dictators.
wordpix
(18,652 posts)Kasich is not as prepared as Hillary. Let's get the best pres we can get
brooklynite
(94,808 posts)...for those wondering how Democrats could vote for Kasich, consider the following options:
1. Democrats vote for Clinton. Republicans vote for Trump. Trump wins.
2. Democrats vote for Clinton. Most Republicans vote for Trump. SOME Republicans vote for Kasich or other candidate. Trump wins.
3. Democrats vote for Clinton. Some Republicans vote for Trump. ENOUGH Republicans vote for Kasich or other candidate to deny an EC win. Decision goes to House. Trump wins.
If the most important thing is denying Trump the Presidency, you can't build your plan around Clinton getting elected. It won't happen. You'll need to come to agreement with Republican Electors on another candidate.
LisaL
(44,974 posts)And I don't see it happening.
wordpix
(18,652 posts)I disagree, brooklyn. You're ignoring the popular vote.
brooklynite
(94,808 posts)Fiendish Thingy
(15,689 posts)If enough rogue electors deny Trump 270 EV's, one can't assume congress will automatically approve Trump as president. Each state delegation only gets one vote, so wheeling and dealing is possible to sway votes to Kasich or whoever is the third place vote getter. I believe this is what happened in the early 1800's when 4 candidates split the EV's- the winner convinced enough to vote for him with promises of pork barrel projects, etc.
While Kasich or Romney would enact abhorrent policies, they would govern competently, as opposed to Trump and his Kleptocrats. Of course they might be harder to beat in 2020, and more difficult to obstruct politically than Trump, but Trump would likely create a far bigger mess that America might never recover from.
brooklynite
(94,808 posts)I see no opposition to Trump in the House GOP delegation. No basis for assuming they'd vote for anyone else.
roamer65
(36,747 posts)He would govern as more of a moderate Republican until 2020. I think the agreement should be to have Tim Kaine as VP.
ancianita
(36,161 posts)Motley13
(3,867 posts)and I hate to think of the uproar if the maggot's election is overturned. They don't have voter's remorse yet
red dog 1
(27,883 posts)But Kasiich?
Jake Stern
(3,145 posts)We can handle Kasich but we CANNOT accept even one second of Der Trumpenfuhrer's overt Neo-Fascism and Pence's hyper-fundamentalist Christian bullshit.
Go ahead and alert and hide for violating TOS but if saving the USA from this very real threat means putting John Kasich in the WH then so be it.
treestar
(82,383 posts)anybody but the Orange Toxin.
wordpix
(18,652 posts)to the end of the US as we know or knew it. No one person can stop the clown car---only all of us together can stop it. Hillary won the popular vote and she is the rightful president. That's all we need to say if we want to UNITE behind the one who without question won the greatest popular vote.
roamer65
(36,747 posts)This isn't about party anymore, it's about saving the republic.
turbinetree
(24,735 posts)let there conscience be there guide----------------and I hope they sleep well on 12/20/2016
robbedvoter
(28,290 posts)and if they fail to get it - useless!
turbinetree
(24,735 posts)why not?
If he can do it, why can't we all do it ?
Let them smell the coffee
olddad56
(5,732 posts)turbinetree
(24,735 posts)robbedvoter
(28,290 posts)or any other futile gesture. Like the guy who left to make room for a loyalist. EC proves itself futile with those gestures.
Sunlei
(22,651 posts)wordpix
(18,652 posts)wordpix
(18,652 posts)2.5 million in late November. Seems the numbers are frozen due to #Recount2016
Sunlei
(22,651 posts)wordpix
(18,652 posts)bucolic_frolic
(43,393 posts)all they do is throw the EC into the House, we haven't made much progress.
We're as likely to get Pence, Kasich, Ryan, Cruz
iow, we'd still need to get to 270
Coyotl
(15,262 posts)Just a few more reporting counties, and Hillary will leads by 2 and 2/3 million.
Clinton Dec. 5 margin = 2,645,046
12 state Trump votes = 2,651,861
Almost time to update this graph, CA reporting deadline is tomorrow.
With the current 12 states and DC totals, Trump is under 2 and 2/3 million at 2,664,584. Clinton may pass that total tomorrow.
Laura PourMeADrink
(42,770 posts)of the popular vote. period. paragraph.
This chart supports that effort.
In case you haven't signed...
https://www.change.org/p/electoral-college-make-hillary-clinton-president-on-december-19-4a78160a-023c-4ff0-9069-53cee2a095a8?recruiter=8280332&utm_source=share_petition&utm_medium=twitter&utm_campaign=share_twitter_responsive
Coyotl
(15,262 posts)roamer65
(36,747 posts)Do whatever it takes to stop it....PLEASE.
Laura PourMeADrink
(42,770 posts)away so much from her. He branded her a crooked liar that deserved to be locked up - all without any substantiation whatsoever, and trust me, it took with the low-infos. All the while, HE is the crooked liar ! And then, the phony magnanimity, "she doesn't deserve more punishment". It is really so horrible and so unfair when you really think about it.
inwiththenew
(972 posts)You thought all that wheeling and dealing he was doing was for a contested convention? He's got all the pieces in place to swoop in take the presidency!
NewJeffCT
(56,829 posts)who is left? Huntsman? Romney? Jeb Bush?
roamer65
(36,747 posts)It may be as many as 15 trump electors right now. It's growing.
I predict this thing will go to the House of Reps.