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Tue Apr 23, 2019, 11:56 AM

Court Says Using Chalk On Tires For Parking Enforcement Violates Constitution

Source: NPR

LAW
Court Says Using Chalk On Tires For Parking Enforcement Violates Constitution
April 23, 201910:20 AM ET

The next time parking enforcement officers use chalk to mark your tires, they might be acting unconstitutionally. ... A federal appeals court ruled Monday that "chalking" is a violation of the Fourth Amendment.

The case was brought by Alison Taylor, a Michigan woman whom the court describes as a "frequent recipient of parking tickets." The city of Saginaw, Mich., like countless other cities around the country, uses chalk to mark the tires of cars to enforce time limits on parking. ... By the time Taylor received her 15th citation in just a few years, she decided to go after the city -- and specifically after parking enforcement officer Tabitha Hoskins.

Hoskins, Taylor alleged in her lawsuit, was a "prolific" chalker. Every single one of Taylor's 15 tickets was issued by Hoskins after she marked a tire with chalk, and then circled back to see if Taylor's car had moved. That chalking, Taylor argued, was unconstitutional. ... "Trespassing upon a privately-owned vehicle parked on a public street to place a chalk mark to begin gathering information to ultimately impose a government sanction is unconstitutional under the Fourth Amendment," Taylor's lawyer, Philip Ellison, wrote in a court filing.

A three-judge panel of the U.S. Court of Appeals for the 6th Circuit unanimously agreed. Chalking tires is a kind of trespass, Judge Bernice Donald wrote for the panel, and it requires a warrant. The decision affects the 6th Circuit, which includes Michigan, Ohio, Kentucky and Tennessee.
....

Read more: https://www.npr.org/2019/04/23/716248823/court-says-using-chalk-on-tires-for-parking-enforcement-violates-constitution

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Arrow 30 replies Author Time Post
Reply Court Says Using Chalk On Tires For Parking Enforcement Violates Constitution (Original post)
mahatmakanejeeves Apr 2019 OP
appal_jack Apr 2019 #1
groundloop Apr 2019 #3
dixiegrrrrl Apr 2019 #7
groundloop Apr 2019 #13
Bernardo de La Paz Apr 2019 #15
onenote Apr 2019 #6
zipplewrath Apr 2019 #2
onenote Apr 2019 #11
zipplewrath Apr 2019 #26
Doitnow Apr 2019 #4
okaawhatever Apr 2019 #30
csziggy Apr 2019 #5
mwooldri Apr 2019 #21
keithbvadu2 Apr 2019 #22
LiberalFighter Apr 2019 #8
PoliticAverse Apr 2019 #10
onenote Apr 2019 #12
Bernardo de La Paz Apr 2019 #16
gopiscrap Apr 2019 #9
cannabis_flower Apr 2019 #14
Bernardo de La Paz Apr 2019 #17
cannabis_flower Apr 2019 #18
Blue_Tires Apr 2019 #19
KayF Apr 2019 #20
onenote Apr 2019 #24
keithbvadu2 Apr 2019 #23
onenote Apr 2019 #25
zipplewrath Apr 2019 #27
Karadeniz Apr 2019 #28
Haggis for Breakfast Apr 2019 #29

Response to mahatmakanejeeves (Original post)

Tue Apr 23, 2019, 12:00 PM

1. I'd like to see this argument expanded.

 

How, exactly, does the government have the right to boot or tow a car unless it is an imminent safety hazard?

k&r,

-app

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Response to appal_jack (Reply #1)

Tue Apr 23, 2019, 12:13 PM

3. It's often not even the 'government' that does this but rather private contractors

In Atlanta, for instance, a parking contractor pays the city $7 MILLION per year for the right to issue tickets, boot cars, and collect fines. The parking contractor keeps the fines they collect, which I believe is unconstitutional.

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Response to groundloop (Reply #3)

Tue Apr 23, 2019, 12:48 PM

7. But...the privae contractors are acting as an arm of the Gov. which is same thing.



I have seen that argument successfully used.

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Response to dixiegrrrrl (Reply #7)

Tue Apr 23, 2019, 01:51 PM

13. Probably true.... but it's the profit motive that worries me

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Response to groundloop (Reply #13)

Tue Apr 23, 2019, 02:57 PM

15. Profit motive same problem with private prisons. . . . nt

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Response to appal_jack (Reply #1)

Tue Apr 23, 2019, 12:44 PM

6. The difference is that cars that are booted/towed are parking illegally

Cars that are chalked are not illegally parked at the time they're chalked.

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Response to mahatmakanejeeves (Original post)

Tue Apr 23, 2019, 12:05 PM

2. Suspect it will be overturned

Since these marks aren't used for criminal charges, I suspect the courts will ultimately view them differently. Especially the current Supreme Court. They haven't been the friendliest to 4th amendment over the years.

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Response to zipplewrath (Reply #2)

Tue Apr 23, 2019, 01:49 PM

11. I wouldn't be so sure about that. The unanimous three judge court included

one Obama appointee, one GW Bush appointee, and one Jimmy Carter appointee. The GW Bush appointee is a judge who reportedly was on Trump's "short list" to replace Justice Kennedy.

I wouldn't be surprised if the Supreme Court refused to hear the case.

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Response to onenote (Reply #11)

Tue Apr 23, 2019, 07:51 PM

26. Nothing is sure

But the current SC is very hostile to the 4th.

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Response to mahatmakanejeeves (Original post)

Tue Apr 23, 2019, 12:17 PM

4. My mother could remember when some people complained their rights were violated when

traffic lights started being installed!!

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Response to Doitnow (Reply #4)

Tue Apr 23, 2019, 11:04 PM

30. Lol. I can see it now. "Big government telling me when to stop and when to go" LOL nt

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Response to mahatmakanejeeves (Original post)

Tue Apr 23, 2019, 12:28 PM

5. Give parking enforcement officers cell phones with camera

They can take photos of illegally or over time parked vehicles in public spaces. With GPS the photos will be proof with location and times attached to the images.

Tow truck drivers do this already as proof of illegal parking and that the cars were not damaged by towing.

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Response to csziggy (Reply #5)

Tue Apr 23, 2019, 06:18 PM

21. That and one can still write on the road with chalk.

All tyres have markings on them, brand name, tyre size etc. A picture with a chalk marking by it as a reference point can be useful.

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Response to mwooldri (Reply #21)

Tue Apr 23, 2019, 07:08 PM

22. Good one! The ground can be marked and the chalk will be disturbed if the car has moved.

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Response to mahatmakanejeeves (Original post)

Tue Apr 23, 2019, 12:53 PM

8. Wouldn't that also mean police can't place tickets under wipers?

Or drivers don't have to accept ticket while inside vehicle?

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Response to LiberalFighter (Reply #8)

Tue Apr 23, 2019, 01:17 PM

10. You don't have to accept a ticket. You don't have to sign one. There may...

be consequences to that decision that the government/officer is legally allowed to take.

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Response to LiberalFighter (Reply #8)

Tue Apr 23, 2019, 01:50 PM

12. Again, the difference is taking an action when there is probable cause the law has been broken

and taking an action before there is any reason to think a law has been broken.

The chalking occurs while the car is legally parked. Tickets are placed on cars after they are illegally parking.

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Response to onenote (Reply #12)

Tue Apr 23, 2019, 02:59 PM

16. Excellent. Thanks for pinpointing the distinction. . . . nt

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Response to mahatmakanejeeves (Original post)

Tue Apr 23, 2019, 12:54 PM

9. YES!!!!!!!!

I want my money back plus interest for all the parking tickets I paid out. Specially those while in college.

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Response to mahatmakanejeeves (Original post)

Tue Apr 23, 2019, 02:40 PM

14. The end result..

Of not allowing the chalk will be parking meters that will require you to put in money to park and will prove without a doubt that you were parked there longer than allowed. Of course, if you keep feeding the meter, you will be able to stay.

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Response to cannabis_flower (Reply #14)

Tue Apr 23, 2019, 03:01 PM

17. The end result will be time-stamped before & after photos taken by the parking warden. No meter


... and if there are meters, no feeding the meter.

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Response to Bernardo de La Paz (Reply #17)

Tue Apr 23, 2019, 03:42 PM

18. The actual end result..

Will be whatever each individual municipality decides. If won't be up to either of us unless you are an official there.

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Response to mahatmakanejeeves (Original post)

Tue Apr 23, 2019, 05:31 PM

19. Really? Seriously?

White folks can sue the city over parking tickets and win and meanwhile cops wantonly shooting unarmed black folks can't even be fired...?

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Response to Blue_Tires (Reply #19)

Tue Apr 23, 2019, 05:36 PM

20. funny I pictured her being black

without thinking about it, that's just the picture I had, I have no idea why.

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Response to Blue_Tires (Reply #19)

Tue Apr 23, 2019, 07:39 PM

24. Two of the three judges in the case (including the author) are African-American

For whatever that's worth

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Response to mahatmakanejeeves (Original post)

Tue Apr 23, 2019, 07:11 PM

23. Illegal search does not apply if the evidence is in the open?

Illegal search does not apply if the evidence is in the open?

Surely that goes along with the 'trespass'.

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Response to keithbvadu2 (Reply #23)

Tue Apr 23, 2019, 07:47 PM

25. The plain view doctrine still requires probable cause

to believe the item is evidence of a crime or is contraband.

When the car is chalked, it is legally parked and there is no probable cause for believing that it will be involved in a criminal violation.

So, no.

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Response to onenote (Reply #25)

Tue Apr 23, 2019, 07:54 PM

27. It's not a criminal offense

There is some ambiguity here because it is pursuit of a civil violation.

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Response to mahatmakanejeeves (Original post)

Tue Apr 23, 2019, 07:55 PM

28. I think it's just stupid and petty. A meter maid's job entails cars. S/he has to get to the

car, even to put a ticket on it. Just stupid.

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Response to mahatmakanejeeves (Original post)

Tue Apr 23, 2019, 09:54 PM

29. I've read the Constitution backwards and forwards, could recite it in my sleep.

NOWHERE is there any mention of cars/tires/chalk marks. Driving is a privilege, not a right. If you fail to obey the traffic laws - and that included parking laws - that's on you.

Meanwhile, invoking the Fourth Amendment frosts my freckles. How many times have young Black men been pulled over in bogus traffic stops by cops, detained without cause and had their vehicles searched illegally (or been intimidated by cops) without their consent ? How many young people have been forced by everything from teachers to "safety resource officers" to empty their pockets/back packs/purses without probably cause ? How many of us have been forced to submit to searches at the airports, while our Fourth Amendment rights were completely disregarded ? [I stood in line at the airport recently, while some sadistic TSA thug roughed up a frail, elderly woman, demanding to search her and proceeded to put their hands on this woman's body. Of course, there was no contraband on her. By the end of this, the poor woman was sobbing and physically-ill. I have never been so disgusted in my life at the over-reach of these people.]

Pay your freaking fines and shut up.

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