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Mon Apr 12, 2021, 07:50 AM

France moves to ban short-haul domestic flights

Source: BBC


French lawmakers have moved to ban short-haul internal flights where train alternatives exist, in a bid to reduce carbon emissions. Over the weekend, lawmakers voted in favour of a bill to end routes where the same journey could be made by train in under two-and-a-half hours. Connecting flights will not be affected, however. The planned measures will face a further vote in the Senate before becoming law.

Airlines around the world have been severely impacted by the coronavirus pandemic, with website Flightradar24 reporting that the number of flights last year were down almost 42% from 2019. The measures could affect travel between Paris and cities including Nantes, Lyon and Bordeaux. But the French government had faced calls to introduce for even stricter rules on domestic flights.

France's Citizens' Convention on Climate, which was created by President Emmanuel Macron in 2019 and included 150 members of the public, had proposed scrapping plane journeys where train journeys of under four hours existed.

Saturday's vote came days after the French government more than doubled its stake in Air France. The government had previously offered €7bn ($8.3bn, £6bn) in loans to help the airline weather the pandemic, although France's economy minister said at the time the funding was dependent on the airline scrapping some of its domestic flights.

Read more: https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-56716708

22 replies, 1579 views

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Arrow 22 replies Author Time Post
Reply France moves to ban short-haul domestic flights (Original post)
Mr. Sparkle Apr 12 OP
3Hotdogs Apr 12 #1
underpants Apr 12 #4
Klaralven Apr 12 #11
ZonkerHarris Apr 12 #12
brooklynite Apr 12 #14
ZonkerHarris Apr 12 #16
Diamond_Dog Apr 12 #2
Wolf Frankula Apr 12 #3
mnhtnbb Apr 12 #5
GoneOffShore Apr 13 #22
DFW Apr 12 #6
PoindexterOglethorpe Apr 12 #7
iluvtennis Apr 12 #8
Tikki Apr 12 #9
IronLionZion Apr 12 #10
bucolic_frolic Apr 12 #13
Dial H For Hero Apr 12 #17
brooklynite Apr 12 #15
amcgrath Apr 12 #18
róisín_dubh Apr 13 #19
royable Apr 13 #20
Raine Apr 13 #21

Response to Mr. Sparkle (Original post)

Mon Apr 12, 2021, 08:03 AM

1. With the agita at airports, why would I take a plane from Newark N.J. (where I live)

to D.C. ?

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Response to 3Hotdogs (Reply #1)

Mon Apr 12, 2021, 08:47 AM

4. Amtrak ridership ha increased a lot because of that.

Why try to fly with TSA and delays from DC to NYC or elsewhere when you know how long a trim takes and it always on time? Plus with free wifi you can work or just pass the time as you like.

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Response to 3Hotdogs (Reply #1)

Mon Apr 12, 2021, 01:03 PM

11. Usually driving to DC is the better option

Door to Door, driving from NJ to DC is quicker than rail or air.

Rail works only if the DC destination is on the Metro. Otherwise, the rental car facilities at train stations are far inferior to those at the airport. Renting a car at Union Station is expensive. Doesn't look like it's practical at New Carrollton, MD.

An airport style upgrade to car rentals at stations like New Carrollton, MD, MetroPark, NJ and Route 128, MA would be a good improvement to Acela service.

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Response to Klaralven (Reply #11)

Mon Apr 12, 2021, 01:34 PM

12. Rent a car? It's called Uber or Lyft.

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Response to ZonkerHarris (Reply #12)

Mon Apr 12, 2021, 07:17 PM

14. Want to guess what the cost of an Uber is from Philadelphia to Washington?

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Response to brooklynite (Reply #14)

Mon Apr 12, 2021, 07:22 PM

16. i meant for when you arrive in DC.

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Response to Mr. Sparkle (Original post)

Mon Apr 12, 2021, 08:10 AM

2. I wonder

Will this rule apply to the wealthy small private plane owners, too, or just to the masses who fly commercial?

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Response to Diamond_Dog (Reply #2)

Mon Apr 12, 2021, 08:42 AM

3. No. Just to the ordinary people

The private jets will now be able to land and take off faster. And everyone will be the 'Flyover People'.

Wolf

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Response to Mr. Sparkle (Original post)

Mon Apr 12, 2021, 09:53 AM

5. The TGV in France are terrific

I quite happily ride the train when in France. Last trip we flew into Paris and took the train to Strasbourg, then Lyon, then Bordeaux, and back to Paris to fly home.

The TGV between Aix-en-Provence and Paris is a delightful ride.

Why would anyone fly those distances when such pleasant train transportation is available on a frequent schedule?

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Response to mnhtnbb (Reply #5)

Tue Apr 13, 2021, 03:45 AM

22. And the TGV service and network continues to improve.

I'm looking forward to going to Paris again when we (France) opens up again and we can go further than 10Km from our front doors.

Plus it will be nice to go to Italy and Spain by train. Doubtful that we'll be flying much until there's a second round of booster vaccines.

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Response to Mr. Sparkle (Original post)

Mon Apr 12, 2021, 10:07 AM

6. My wife and I took a train down to the Frankfurt airport last Saturday

What used to be a 2 hour 40 minute trip was shortened to an hour and 20 minutes by building a new direct route and hi-speed trains to travel it. We wheeled our luggage from the train platform to the elevator to the skyway, and then down an escalator (that was tricky) to the departure hall. we got to the check-in counter about 2 hours before departure, and even with the heightened document checks and security checks, we were in the departure area 45 minutes before they started boarding.

For longer hauls or for connections to early intercontinental flights, it still makes sense to have one or two connection flights, but other than that, the trains are adequate--IF they are on time (German trains are often late), an involve no cumbersome security lines or long hauls from an airport into the town center.

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Response to Mr. Sparkle (Original post)

Mon Apr 12, 2021, 11:26 AM

7. I hope this country improves its rail infrastructure.

People often try to compare out train system to that in Europe, which is rather unfair simply because we are a whole lot larger. Although we could do a lot better, especially in the places where decent sized cities are not too far apart.

Here's a map, with Western Europe laid over the U.S.

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Response to Mr. Sparkle (Original post)

Mon Apr 12, 2021, 11:35 AM

8. Nice - love it. nt

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Response to Mr. Sparkle (Original post)

Mon Apr 12, 2021, 11:55 AM

9. I wish the airlines would let us use our unused COVID 19 related monies on AMTRAK.

It has been difficult planning trip(s) to use all the money held by the airline.
The airline doesn't always fly to the places we would like to visit.

The Tikkis

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Response to Mr. Sparkle (Original post)

Mon Apr 12, 2021, 12:16 PM

10. It's worth investing in intercity rail for short distances

we should do that more in the US in strategic areas. The northeast gets plenty of Amtrak use DC-NY-Boston and could use some upgrades. It could be expanded more in areas that are likely to use it.

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Response to Mr. Sparkle (Original post)

Mon Apr 12, 2021, 02:06 PM

13. There was a time

maybe pre 1980, when air travel was infrequent for most people because it was expensive. It was not exactly rationing. But then I never did adjust to jaunting all over for a weekend, just because you feel like it. With Zoom and home gigs, maybe we'll be a little less mobile.

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Response to bucolic_frolic (Reply #13)

Mon Apr 12, 2021, 09:29 PM

17. I'm a credit card points hacker (nothing illegal, just gaming the system), so at any given time I

can pretty much fly anywhere in the world on impulse for virtually no cash (Covid aside since last year). I remember an acquaintance kind of freaking out when I told her I was flying to London just to see a couple of shows.


With Zoom and home gigs, maybe we'll be a little less mobile.


That may well be the case on the whole. Not for me, though. I have 3 international trips planned by January.

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Response to Mr. Sparkle (Original post)

Mon Apr 12, 2021, 07:21 PM

15. France has the infrastructure to substitute for medium range flights...

...we do not.

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Response to Mr. Sparkle (Original post)

Mon Apr 12, 2021, 11:40 PM

18. Rail is fantastically flexible

With tracks maintained properly, trains are faster than planes. Most cities have existing stations, and all of them downtown. Neither passengers nor freight have to drive to an airport on the outskirts of a town or city. They don’t have to deal with check in or security. They don’t get delayed or rerouted by fog or wind.
They don’t have to be loaded with tugs and scissor lifts through small tight doors. A shipping container, loaded at the shippers leisure can simply be put onto a rail car.
A plane whether half or fully loaded must fly to its destination whole. To avoid space shortages, air freight carriers need enough planes with enough capacity for the busiest days. On the days a train may have less freight, it simply takes less cars. On busy days it adds extra cars rather than add a whole new train as planes must.

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Response to Mr. Sparkle (Original post)

Tue Apr 13, 2021, 01:07 AM

19. Good. I never fly within Europe.

What’s the point? The train is easy, but it can be pricey in some places (I’m looking at you, England). I’m going to Scotland in May and we are debating between a flight and the train. It’s much longer, but less stressful.
I once took a train from Madrid to R’dam. That was an experience.

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Response to Mr. Sparkle (Original post)

Tue Apr 13, 2021, 02:54 AM

20. Before the end of my days, I hope to see left-coast to right-coast ultra-high-speed rail.

L.A. to Boston in 15 hours, with a few stops along the way? I would SO much prefer that over flying.

I once rode Paris to London through the Chunnel, my only experience on Europe's high-speed rail and France's "TGV." Granted, the train speeds in the UK were slower than in France, but what a delightful trip!

I'd like to see a nationwide network of high-speed rail in the infrastructure plan.

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Response to Mr. Sparkle (Original post)

Tue Apr 13, 2021, 03:23 AM

21. GREAT idea 👍

I wish it could be done here but I know that's not going to happen.

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